78 réponses à ce sujet

[ObserverStatus]

LPPrince wrote...
Until Hasbro gets a major developer to create a Friendship is Magic RPG in the same vein as a DAO or Skyrim, I will continue to mention how sad I am about Bioware's fall from RPG grace.
Hell, Bioware should make that RPG.

I'm sure that if they did, it would be even better than Sonic Chronicles.

[Zjarcal]

LPPrince wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

Some people take things way too seriously.

If you don't like their products, don't buy them, it's as simple as that. No need to "forgive" or "excuse" or any of that overdramatic crap. Just move on to someone who makes games that appeal to you.

Until Hasbro gets a major developer to create a Friendship is Magic RPG in the same vein as a DAO or Skyrim, I will continue to mention how sad I am about Bioware's fall from RPG grace.

Hell, Bioware should make that RPG.

Sure, keep expressing your sadness (you're probably gonna get depressed eventually).

I will at least join you in eagerly awaiting a MLP RPG. 

Modifié par Zjarcal, 09 août 2012 - 08:04 .

[mousestalker]

They're all adults. They may go to the bathroom whenever they wish. They do not have to ask permission or have third parties ask for them.

{Thought upon reading the topic headline}

[Gotholhorakh]

Depends what you mean by "excused".

If you mean in the cold Darwinian sense of whether we buy another product and help them survive after disappointment, yes they can if they make another product that warrants a purchase.

In the sense of trashing the more significant relationships with longstanding fans, excused is probably the wrong word because the only party that really hurt was BioWare.

I don't think what passes for BioWare these days cares, and I think spurned fans have all moved on from being bothered.

Modifié par Gotholhorakh, 09 août 2012 - 08:16 .

[Ridwan]

They can be excused if they just come out and apologise. Perhaps DA 3 will be that apology, but we have to wait and see. DA3 is do or die for me. If that game fails, Bioware will be lumped in the buy when very cheap category.

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

Anaeme wrote...

Forbes asks if Bioware can be forgiven below...

http://www.forbes.co...nse-of-bioware/

Pretty good read

The follow-up post is good too.

http://www.forbes.co...ut-video-games/

[Heather Cline]

Nope I won't be buying anymore BioWare games. They are dead to me as a company. ME2, DA2, ME3, SWTOR... the list goes on and on. It's getting worse with each game they produce. Fact is the day EA bought BioWare, the games started to suffer. ME2 became a mishmash of short stories instead of a game like ME1's story. The RPG elements were stripped out of combat in favor of streamlined shooter game. ME3 completely destroyed with auto-dialogue, the ending of the game, the lack of ability to talk to quest givers. Tons of run and fetch quests... I could go on and on and on about the debacle that is ME3. DA2 completely rushed, final boss battles that made no real sense... Yeah... extremely bad decisions there too.

SWTOR gone the MMO route... bad way to go there because it's not making them money like they thought. Hell it's going F2P here soon which tells you how bad it is.

So no... BioWare has dropped the ball 4 times not 3 and so 4 strikes is more than enough for me to write them off.

[horacethegrey]

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

Anaeme wrote...

Forbes asks if Bioware can be forgiven below...

http://www.forbes.co...nse-of-bioware/

Pretty good read

The follow-up post is good too.

http://www.forbes.co...ut-video-games/

I'm really saddened that some commentprs said they won't read his blog anymore just cause he dared to disagree with them. Must some gamers be so rigid in their thinking that they won't consider an opposing viewpoint?

For my part, I'll continue reading this guy's blog. He brings a balanced and intelligent voice to videogame journalism that I feel has been unfairly biased towards gamers (especially during the ME3 debacle).

[addiction21]

Did they do something wrong?

[Tonymac]

Belive it or not - I love Bioware. They have made some great games. I had some issues with ME2 - alas they were minor. Planet scanning was pure misery - especially in later play throughs. The Termi-Reaper-Fetus was some trash. When I saw it I balked. You have GOT to be kidding I thought.

ME3 was - all in all - a good game. Not great. Not Stellar. Surely not as good as ME1, and a far cry from ME2. But it was good in my eyes. There were moments in it that were incredible, and some fights that were a lof of fun.

ME3 had some terrible writing in it. Crucibles and Catalysts and all of that was pure trash. The whole direction of the game was bad. Lore was ruined. The MP is subject to constant nerfing and tweaking that is pointless. Its like they lost what made ME1 and 2 so amazing. Frankly, I think they lost the good writers - and many others. I miss them. I wish they had stayed on. I wanted to defeat the Reapers. I wanted to win! I wanted to do it on MY terms - not the terms of a Starbrat. I honestly thought that the Protheans would help us win with left behind tech or answers, info - something. Alas, it did not happen that way.

So yes - In my eyes Bioware dropped the ball. But they made the EC. I liked the EC. It was not what I wanted, but hey - it was a good gesture. Given what they had to work with - they did a stellar job. That goes a long long way in my book.

So, all in all, I am leery of Bioware. I might not pre-order anything ever again from them, but I am not writing them off. They are not the great giant they were in my eyes - but they are not so bad as we make them out to be. They took a bad step. Trying to get the WHOLE crowd of video game players (MP, etc.) hurt them. But its just a mis-step. Heck, we all do that from time to time. They are, after all, a gaming company.

I think they can recover. I think they can still make wonderful games. I will be there to play those games when they make them. I hope that most of you will join me in the fun.

[MerinTB]

Brockololly wrote...

I'll just take their games on a game by game basis. With DA2 they dried up any lingering goodwill they'd built up with me from games like BG2, KotOR or DA:O. As far as I'm concerned that BioWare has ceased to exist. So no preorders no matter how good some new game might look, cause I just don't trust them to put together a satisfying final product. That was reinforced by how awful ME3's ending was.

Mostly this.

Though I will tend to look askew at new BioWare offerings.  Whereas typically, with a few notable exceptions, a game company's name (publisher or developer) rarely matters to peak my interest, the name BioWare attached to a game will now generate the kind of "oh, it's from them" aversion that "Obsidian games are all buggy" people feel.

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

For me, buying future Bioware titles will depend on the titles themselves. I don't think I'll pre-order again, but that's only because DA2 was released with a DRM bug that wouldn't allow me to (legitimately) play the game until a patch was released over a month later.

As for the game quality...meh. I haven't played the ME series yet, and never played KotOR, so DA2 has been the only release so far that didn't meet my expectations. While I'm admittedly disappointed about certain design directions, it's not enough for me to swear off Bioware. Like the author of the article, I think it'd be a terrible blow to the RPGs genre if the company ceased to be, and I want Bioware to make games I like. I think they can. What I'm dubious about is if they will.

So I'll wait and see, and while I'm waiting I'll throw money at promising Kickstarter game devs.

[addiction21]

MerinTB wrote...

The name BioWare attached to a game will now generate the kind of "oh, it's from them" aversion that "Obsidian games are all buggy" people feel.

You know me and I might be a little bit off base.

I could assume what you expect from a BioWare game but for some people (myself included and I am in no way declaring people that think like me a majority) expect to enjoy the game. Not what mechanics or features are included. Not it being a voiced of non-voiced PC.

I have had fun playing the games. FUN. I could rattle of a laundry list of everything I found wrong withy them. DA2's reuse of enviroments, ME3's ending, ME2s whole story, DA:O and how origins were the PR's love child but did nothing, DA:Os whole pre-release big marketing. Have people forgotten about the whole blood, sex, and violence trailers?

I have had fun and have continued to have fun playing these games.

*ramle rant off*

[Rockworm503]

addiction21 wrote...

MerinTB wrote...

The name BioWare attached to a game will now generate the kind of "oh, it's from them" aversion that "Obsidian games are all buggy" people feel.

You know me and I might be a little bit off base.

I could assume what you expect from a BioWare game but for some people (myself included and I am in no way declaring people that think like me a majority) expect to enjoy the game. Not what mechanics or features are included. Not it being a voiced of non-voiced PC.

I have had fun playing the games. FUN. I could rattle of a laundry list of everything I found wrong withy them. DA2's reuse of enviroments, ME3's ending, ME2s whole story, DA:O and how origins were the PR's love child but did nothing, DA:Os whole pre-release big marketing. Have people forgotten about the whole blood, sex, and violence trailers?

I have had fun and have continued to have fun playing these games.

*ramle rant off*

I had fun watching The Room... Doesn't make it a good movie 

[spirosz]

I will probably continue to joke about their "artistic integrity" for years, but honestly, what's done is done, they're not the same Bioware that I loved, but hey - it's not like everyone from the KOTOR series is still working for Bioware and gaming trends affect developers all the time. I learned from my mistake of setting up my expectations too high, but I'm to blame for that. Do I take all the blame? Hell no, their PR bull**** and certain ways of treating fans doesn't sit well with me. A lot of people will continue to buy their games, regardless of the "minority" complaining about their direction and influence from certain sources, but as long as they continue to make people happy, then that's all that matters IMO, even though I'd like to be in that group, I just can't see it happening anytime soon.

[Rockworm503]

Logan Cloud wrote...

Yes, no matter what crappy game a company releases, they should be forgiven. Because a company has multiple teams, and the devs learn from mistakes.

If you hate KOTOR, why would you put the Mass Effect team out of business? If you hate Mass Effect, why condemn the Dragon Age team? It doesn't make sense to hate an entire company because you don't like one game.

Also, a game dev usually learns from his/her mistakes after the first game is criticized heavily. Many games have been hated when they first came around, but then turned into incredible franchises.

Just think of how extreme and ridiculous it is. It's actually the same thing with EA. EA publishes a lot of games that I despise, but that doesn't mean I'm not going to purchase anything EA publishes. They have some really amazing games under their belt.

I play and purchase games based on what I think of them. It has nothing to do with the company.

Their not learning anything.
What possible lesson should someone such high artistic integerity learn?
Why should they learn anything when those complaining are just whiny entilted brats who just don't get it?
Their not learning their lesson unless the lesson is how to be more arrogant and alienate your customers even more.  I I don't hate the Dragon Age team for Mass Effect 3.  I hate the Dragon Age team for Dragon Age 2.  Their entire company is full of it.  Each one of the has given me reason enough to hate the lot of them.

[Andarthiel_Demigod]

Logan Cloud wrote...

Yes, no matter what crappy game a company releases, they should be forgiven. Because a company has multiple teams, and the devs learn from mistakes.

If you hate KOTOR, why would you put the Mass Effect team out of business? If you hate Mass Effect, why condemn the Dragon Age team? It doesn't make sense to hate an entire company because you don't like one game.

Also, a game dev usually learns from his/her mistakes after the first game is criticized heavily. Many games have been hated when they first came around, but then turned into incredible franchises.

Just think of how extreme and ridiculous it is. It's actually the same thing with EA. EA publishes a lot of games that I despise, but that doesn't mean I'm not going to purchase anything EA publishes. They have some really amazing games under their belt.

I play and purchase games based on what I think of them. It has nothing to do with the company.

Pretty much this, you are wise Logan Cloud.

[DukeOfNukes]

All BioWare has to start doing to get peoples trust back is to start making good, unique games again...which is something they haven't seem particularly interested in for the past 5 years.

It's funny how when people count their "missteps", they seem to forget a lot. A bunch of the DAO DLC was garbage. The ME2 DLC was better story telling than the actual game. Sonic Chronicles was the best Sonic game since the 90's, but still not very good. Oh...and Pinnacle Station.

The only truly great game released since EA took over was DAO...which was produced mostly outside of EA's influence.

[Zeroth Angel]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Nope.

Forgiven for selling out to EA knowing what it would bring?
For cutting corners, time, and effort on their games?
For insulting fans who dare to question them?
For LYING to fans again and again just to get some more sales?
For using that BS ARTISTIC INTEGRITY claim?

For having writing that is so ****** poor its become the laughing stock of the RPG world?
For watering down anything deep in favor of hack-slash. turd person shooting and MP?

No.
That is why I dont have any Bioware games installed on my computer anymore, and dont plan on getting their DLC or games.

Amen. My heart now belongs to CD Projekt .
Hell even if DA3 turns out to be the best thing ever i will probably grab it from the bargin bin.

[Addai]

horacethegrey wrote...
I'm really saddened that some commentprs said they won't read his blog anymore just cause he dared to disagree with them. Must some gamers be so rigid in their thinking that they won't consider an opposing viewpoint?

For my part, I'll continue reading this guy's blog. He brings a balanced and intelligent voice to videogame journalism that I feel has been unfairly biased towards gamers (especially during the ME3 debacle).

I don't even know who this dude is, but the fact that he hadn't even finished one of the games that is a cause for the controversy means he shouldn't be writing about it.  In fact I'd say that anyone who starts off an essay in a magazine with "So," and another paragraph with "Anyways," shouldn't be writing for a well-known magazine at all.

I imagine this was a cause for ire to those who care more than I do.  He was telling them they were wrong to react a certain way, without himself being well informed.

Modifié par Addai67, 10 août 2012 - 03:56 .

[MerinTB]

addiction21 wrote...

MerinTB wrote...

The name BioWare attached to a game will now generate the kind of "oh, it's from them" aversion that "Obsidian games are all buggy" people feel.

You know me and I might be a little bit off base.

I could assume what you expect from a BioWare game but for some people (myself included and I am in no way declaring people that think like me a majority) expect to enjoy the game. Not what mechanics or features are included. Not it being a voiced of non-voiced PC.

I have had fun playing the games. FUN. I could rattle of a laundry list of everything I found wrong withy them. DA2's reuse of enviroments, ME3's ending, ME2s whole story, DA:O and how origins were the PR's love child but did nothing, DA:Os whole pre-release big marketing. Have people forgotten about the whole blood, sex, and violence trailers?

I have had fun and have continued to have fun playing these games.

*ramle rant off*

Playing games is about having fun for me, too.

Certain things I don't find fun, some things I do.

DA2, had it not followed DA:O, would have been a fun but forgettable time passer.  That I cannot divorce my disappointment based on my experiences from DA:O and excitement for DA2 from the actual playing of the game is not something I feel is off-base or in need of defending.  It is how it is.  If people cannot watch the new Spider-man movie because they loved the Sam Raimi films too much, more power to them - I did watch the new one and enjoyed it, but if other people cannot bring themselves to enjoy it because it's not Sam Raimi's version I'm not telling them they are wrong.

ME3 was like Inception for me - loved it until an ending that destroyed my previous fun.  As I've said elsewhere in a different parable, an enjoyable vacation from start to near finish is still made horrible if on the last day as you ready to head back you are robbed and your car is stolen.  If you can seperate the previous day's amusement park antics from the next day's resulting loss, more power to you - I'd chalk that up as a very bad vacation.

Modifié par MerinTB, 10 août 2012 - 06:27 .

[Kaiser Shepard]

No.

I only really have DA and ME to remember BW by, though; I didn't become a fan until I got the first ME a couple of years ago. I did get Kotor at some point, but quit halfway through became the game barely runs on the 360 and no game is worth that much trouble. I'm expecting to receive Jade Empire next week, though, so hopefully I can still enjoy that game for what it is.

I guess I might still be around in some form or another for the next trainwreck, though; the ME3 debacle was quite enjoyable when standing on the sideline, knowing exactly what was to come. While I don't think DA3 will be as big a disappointment to many, if only because most are probably already anticiptating the the worst, it should still be an interesting event to see unfold.

And perhaps, if said game turns out to be not so bad after all, and it somehow manages to allow the player to completely ignore the game before it (both in-game and when it comes to the title), I might actually get around to giving it a try myself...