338 réponses à ce sujet

[Father Superior]

LeandroBraz wrote...

RasenRebirth wrote...

Nissun wrote...

RasenRebirth wrote...

To those that say no I ask why and not just a no.

Because Javik is The Last Prothean.

If more protheans were brought in, he would become Javik That Prothean Guy That Hangs Out With Shepard. All his character story would go to hell, become completely meaningless, a waste of time and money (since I had to pay 10€ extra on release day just for him)

Javik would be the last true Prothean because the rest are clones.

It's not that easy to clone a sapient being, we know that from ME2, on the facility where grunt was made. Plus, there's nothing compelling to justify clonning protheans to help on the war, it's complete nonsense. It would make some MP players happy, but would make the entire fanbase freak out, ME can't handle that, there's enough people dissapointed e disinterested on the franchise, bioware can't just give any excuse to bring protheans to MP.
 The most important is what I said before, it will break the entire from ashes argument, it would require to change completely the DLC.

conclusion: Adding protheans on ME3 MP is impossible, don't matter how hard you want that, or how much you don't care about lore. Bioware can do whatever they want on the next one, but ME3 don't have a way to have protheans on MP...

Okeer wasn't exactly working in the best location and he wasn't any normal scientist looking to cure the genophage for his fellow Krogan. Okeer was convinced that the genophage wasn't only making the Krogan dwindle in numbers, but also strength. Due to the low rate of successful births, all Krogan newborns survived, including the weak who Okeer believed should've been stamped out by natural selection, the way it was before the Rebellions and genophage. His goal was to create an army of Rebellion-era Krogan warriors to bring the galaxy to its knees, not create genophage-free Krogan. If they resisted the genophage as a side-effect, great, but his goal wasn't to clone a normal fertile Krogan, it was to create a ruthless army of true warriors (imagine thousands of Grunts, but less friendly). His goals and setup were less than preferable and a team of Salarians working in an STG lab with their technology and expertise are capable of much more than a single Krogan in a Blue Suns merc base.

There is certainly a compelling reason for experimentation in cloning. The war effort could be helped tremendously by expendable biotic shock troopers. And they wouldn't take any effort to train, assuming they retain the Prothean sensory ability that allows them to learn through touch. Being able to mass produce soldiers would be a very useful practice when faced with an enemy that never seems to stop coming. Biotics are needed everywhere, whether they're modding ammo or serving on the front lines.

Just because you're too narrow-minded to realize that lore is meant to change and alter as the story is told doesn't mean Bioware is too. There are PLENTY of ways they can write in Protheans and to say that they are impossible to add to MP is a complete lie. If you're too stubborn to accept any change in the ME universe, you're being a detriment to the fanbase and you shouldn't call yourself a fan.

[Geakker]

I don't care about the lore in MP too much. I want to have fun in MP and Protheans are fun!

Also, Protheans and Collectors are story wise still a realistic addition. Single player DLC needed before the MP DLC though.

[RasenRebirth]

Geakker wrote...

I don't care about the lore in MP too much. I want to have fun in MP and Protheans are fun!

Also, Protheans and Collectors are story wise still a realistic addition. Single player DLC needed before the MP DLC though.

True 

[KnightsArm15]

Not wanting Protheans in mp because it doesnt lore is the same as not watching a porno because the story wasn't good enough.

[ryanshowseason3]

If you can clone why not clone krogan? Protheans aren't anything special over basically any race...

Also the krogan cloning program had training regimens developed over YEARS for krogan by a battlemaster of the race with collector technology.

Explain to me how salarians would develop the same kind of tech for a species they've never worked with until now? Also the kakliosaur was a fossil preserved in sedimentary rocks. Show me a prothean preserved in sedimentary rock!

Your explanation still sucks.

[ryanshowseason3]

Father Superior wrote...

If you're too stubborn to accept any change in the ME universe, you're being a detriment to the fanbase and you shouldn't call yourself a fan.

Too stubborn or concerned with Dragon Ball z esque plot shenanigans?

Also Elitist much? "You're not a true fan I am!"

[ryanshowseason3]

KnightsArm15 wrote...
Not wanting Protheans in mp because it doesnt lore is the same as not watching a porno because the story
wasn't good enough.

KnightsArm15 wrote...
Not wanting Protheans in mp because it doesnt lore is the same as not watching a porno .

KnightsArm15 wrote...
Not wanting Protheans in mp because it doesnt lore is the same as

KnightsArm15 wrote...
Not wanting Protheans in mp because it doesnt lore

KnightsArm15 wrote...
because it doesnt lore

KnightsArm15 wrote...
it doesnt lore

Also poor comparison. If I have the option to watch porn with a good storyline as opposed to one without which will I choose? Also if I have the ability to ask for porn with a good storyline to not be screwed up with Dragon Ball Z type plot shenanigans perhaps I will ask.

Modifié par ryanshowseason3, 13 août 2012 - 05:25 .

[Descy_]

Biotic_Warlock wrote...

No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No.

[aarnold1]

RasenRebirth wrote...

really thought people would like the idea guess not.

You get extra credit for really thinking this out.  Most people just don't like to read more than a few sentences.  It's the day in age we're in with mobile gadgets... scrolling is a pain.

Maybe Bioware could do a "back in time" DLC that lets you play the Protheans when they were fighting the Reapers from their time period?  Would probably be single player first due to new artwork and needing compensation for it, but after that it could go into multiplayer.

Don't stop thinking.  We need more entrepreneurs.

[Invellous]

One of the better thought out DLC ideas to introduce Protheans, I give you credit for that. Honestly though I am just against the idea. Javik is driven by the fact that he is the last living, breathing Prothean. Also I can not see him agreeing to help Salarians clone his people, as they would need his DNA. I would imagine he would have the same opinion of them as the Krogan initially had of Grunt, only he would likely kill them himself. One last thing, Cluster Grenade is technically a Biotic Power, Infiltrators are Combat and Tech Power users.

[svocke2]

i dont like the idea of protheans having the same tech powers as citadel races. If they are going to add protheans with tech classes, make their tech prothean tech. Also defense drone is possibly the worst tech power in the game.

[Father Superior]

ryanshowseason3 wrote...

If you can clone why not clone krogan? Protheans aren't anything special over basically any race...

Also the krogan cloning program had training regimens developed over YEARS for krogan by a battlemaster of the race with collector technology.

Explain to me how salarians would develop the same kind of tech for a species they've never worked with until now? Also the kakliosaur was a fossil preserved in sedimentary rocks. Show me a prothean preserved in sedimentary rock!

Your explanation still sucks.

ryanshowseason3 wrote...

Father Superior wrote...

If you're too stubborn to accept any change in the ME universe, you're being a detriment to the fanbase and you shouldn't call yourself a fan.

Too stubborn or concerned with Dragon Ball z esque plot shenanigans?

Also Elitist much? "You're not a true fan I am!"

 

Not anything special? They're a race of biotics that were so successful in the arts of war and gaining territory, they created an empire that likely stretched across the galaxy. Biotics are rare and they are needed everywhere in the war, modding ammo and grenades and serving in special operations or the front lines. Cloning a biotic race that could be trained by simply high-fiving the nearest soldier would be far better than cloning more Krogan, regardless of your choice for the genophage (cured, you have a sh*t-ton already, sabotaged/didn't cure, you wouldn't want any new ones).

Okeer was a single Krogan working in a Blue Suns merc base. A team of Salarian STG scientists in an STG laboratory with all of their knowledge and equipment would be capable of far more than Okeer. And once again, training regimens aren't an issue when you can train your soldiers through their sensory ability to gain knowledge/memories from their touch.

At about the third section, it became clear that you have no idea what you're talking about. The point that you're refusing to acknowledge is that no one knows exactly what is going on everywhere at all times. No one on the outside knew that the Hegemony had found a Reaper, nor did anyone besides Cerberus know that Sanctuary was an indoctrination research facility. How can anyone say with certainty that STG or even the Alliance hasn't been working on a top secret project to develop easily trained, expendable biotic shock troopers? You can't, just like you can't say that there hasn't been any research into cloning Protheans. For all we know, there has been research going for years now and the last thing needed to finalize the research and perfect the process is some fresh DNA, DNA that could be taken from Javik. If it is possible for scientists of this era to clone a living sheep (and, if I recall correctly, work is being done for the wooly mammoth as well), why would they NEED a specimen preserved in sedimentary rock? I'm not saying that it couldn't be useful, but it is clear that they do not NEED it.

There is not a final explanation to give on how Protheans will be added, that is Bioware's job. My job is to show you that you do not have any solid evidence against Protheans, you are not able to debunk them entirely and you have no reason to go around telling people that they don't care about lore by wanting Protheans when it is incredibly clear that you don't even understand what makes lore special: change. Lore is dynamic, it constantly changes with new information and to consider it static is pure madness. Look at ME and ME2; I was told that all of the Protheans are gone. Now a new one has been found. If the "truth" that they instilled in us for two games was shown to be wrong in the third game, what makes this updated information the "ultimate truth"? Science constantly changes with new facts and theories, and lore acts in the same manner. If you can't realize that, then you are being stubborn and telling someone that they don't care about lore and are not a true fan is hypocrisy of the highest degree. As a fan, I want the story of Mass Effect to continue and grow, and if you are against that for reasons you can't even justify, then you're not being a good fan and to criticize others wrongly for being bad fans is absurd.

[RasenRebirth]

Claps

[Gneisenau 19]

RasenRebirth wrote...

really thought people would like the idea guess not.

I like it, but i think just ONE prothean class would be good, not a bunch of them

[SapientesGladio]

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Yes please, I would like this to happen..simply because I and many others will be leaving earth to return to Pandora next month. 

[Deadlysyns]

SapientesGladio wrote...

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Yes please, I would like this to happen..simply because I and many others will be leaving earth to return to Pandora next month. 

Going to the Underworld and places on Wedsnday but i might come back after i Revive the human race

[Seifer006]

Biotic_Warlock wrote...

No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No.

[Deadlysyns]

Seifer006 wrote...

Biotic_Warlock wrote...

No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No.

Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.Yes.

[ryanshowseason3]

Father Superior wrote...

Not anything special? They're a race of biotics that were so successful in the arts of war and gaining territory, they created an empire that likely stretched across the galaxy. Biotics are rare and they are needed everywhere in the war, modding ammo and grenades and serving in special operations or the front lines. Cloning a biotic race that could be trained by simply high-fiving the nearest soldier would be far better than cloning more Krogan, regardless of your choice for the genophage (cured, you have a sh*t-ton already, sabotaged/didn't cure, you wouldn't want any new ones).

Okeer was a single Krogan working in a Blue Suns merc base. A team of Salarian STG scientists in an STG laboratory with all of their knowledge and equipment would be capable of far more than Okeer. And once again, training regimens aren't an issue when you can train your soldiers through their sensory ability to gain knowledge/memories from their touch.

At about the third section, it became clear that you have no idea what you're talking about. The point that you're refusing to acknowledge is that no one knows exactly what is going on everywhere at all times. No one on the outside knew that the Hegemony had found a Reaper, nor did anyone besides Cerberus know that Sanctuary was an indoctrination research facility. How can anyone say with certainty that STG or even the Alliance hasn't been working on a top secret project to develop easily trained, expendable biotic shock troopers? You can't, just like you can't say that there hasn't been any research into cloning Protheans. For all we know, there has been research going for years now and the last thing needed to finalize the research and perfect the process is some fresh DNA, DNA that could be taken from Javik. If it is possible for scientists of this era to clone a living sheep (and, if I recall correctly, work is being done for the wooly mammoth as well), why would they NEED a specimen preserved in sedimentary rock? I'm not saying that it couldn't be useful, but it is clear that they do not NEED it.

There is not a final explanation to give on how Protheans will be added, that is Bioware's job. My job is to show you that you do not have any solid evidence against Protheans, you are not able to debunk them entirely and you have no reason to go around telling people that they don't care about lore by wanting Protheans when it is incredibly clear that you don't even understand what makes lore special: change. Lore is dynamic, it constantly changes with new information and to consider it static is pure madness. Look at ME and ME2; I was told that all of the Protheans are gone. Now a new one has been found. If the "truth" that they instilled in us for two games was shown to be wrong in the third game, what makes this updated information the "ultimate truth"? Science constantly changes with new facts and theories, and lore acts in the same manner. If you can't realize that, then you are being stubborn and telling someone that they don't care about lore and are not a true fan is hypocrisy of the highest degree. As a fan, I want the story of Mass Effect to continue and grow, and if you are against that for reasons you can't even justify, then you're not being a good fan and to criticize others wrongly for being bad fans is absurd.

You're still on your milk box. Why don't you get down. I like how you justify your own explanations as valid and others as completely invalid by telling them "they know nothing" "you don't understand lore". What are you the authority on ME and "how it should be" please step down father superior, geeze even that handle reeks of elitism rhetoric, quite fitting.

Well you've found me out, this is the first time I've ever even heard of mass effect! I never played the games or read the books at all! Good show watson!

Also you conveniently ignore my other points to refute yours so I'll make them again.

Knowledge =/= skill. Javik was already a soldier with trained skills. Just because they can pass the knowledge of how to shoot a gun or advanced tactics doesn't mean they can execute them with any regularity. After reading a playbook or about any strategy in a game can you then effortlessly execute it on the spot flawlessly? No. Even if it did work like that and skill was space magically imbued no one ABSOLUTELY NO ONE even knew of this ability the protheans had before javik said anything, without knowledge of it how would salarians or anyone have assumed they would train any clones? They would have seen it as a huge hole in the plans and abandoned it. Without that or knowledge of their physiology to create a training regimen they'd be dead in the water.

I do concede the point that there are things going on in the universe you don't know about and that is part of the lore. But it is almost always within some modicum of reason. What reason would salarians have to begin a project of cloning a dead race for a combat purpose that they have never seen in combat nor know if they can even find the genetic material to do so? There are plenty of other races and species prime for the cloning, why would they go through the trouble of spending time and resources on a longshot like that when other more reliable and predictable solutions exist? The explanation of "because they were once a powerful race" doesn't work either. The protheans were just the first to get the Atom bomb in a respect and wielded it to beat other races into submission before they gained the ability to resist. They still got mopped up by the reapers.

What I'm saying here is no one has a reason to try and clone protheans. If you wanted biotic shock troopers why not clone asari? If soldiers why not humans, turians, or krogan? Before javik no one even knew what protheans excelled at so why would anyone assume they were omgwtfbbq amazing soldiers enough to spend years finding genetic material or simply hoping for genetic material in order to clone them.

Sure things are going on in the universe we don't know about, but this explanation doesn't make any sense. That is all I'm saying.

[RasenRebirth]

Reason to understand them to advance tech, understand Prothean devices, ect

[Rib0flavin]

RasenRebirth wrote...

Reason to understand them to advance tech, understand Prothean devices, ect

They can do this by shooting Javik an email

[Red Panda]

Unless SP DLC retcons Javik's being the very last, then no. If so, then sure.

[RasenRebirth]

Rib0flavin wrote...

RasenRebirth wrote...

Reason to understand them to advance tech, understand Prothean devices, ect

They can do this by shooting Javik an email

Yeah message the guy in the middle of the fight getting used to his surroundings sure message him.

[Rib0flavin]

RasenRebirth wrote...

Rib0flavin wrote...

RasenRebirth wrote...

Reason to understand them to advance tech, understand Prothean devices, ect

They can do this by shooting Javik an email

Yeah message the guy in the middle of the fight getting used to his surroundings sure message him.

If shepard has time to get laid and get hate mail from kai lang. Then yes, he has time for an email

[RasenRebirth]

Rib0flavin wrote...

RasenRebirth wrote...

Rib0flavin wrote...

RasenRebirth wrote...

Reason to understand them to advance tech, understand Prothean devices, ect

They can do this by shooting Javik an email

Yeah message the guy in the middle of the fight getting used to his surroundings sure message him.

If shepard has time to get laid and get hate mail from kai lang. Then yes, he has time for an email

To explain the working on there tech through messages would take alot of time and most Prothean tech requires Prothean DNA and before you say Shepard can he had the Cipher