204 réponses à ce sujet

[megabeast37215]

jahaa wrote...

I unlocked this thing today and after a game i'm trying to find a reason for using it if you have the Harrier or even the Revenant.

I think the Alliance is using recycled LMG stuff from the WWII.

WWII era weapons were better than the Typhoon. I'd rather have an M2 or an MG42 over that thing.

[Rifneno]

BuckshotSamurai wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

BuckshotSamurai wrote...

Justicar w/weight reduction @ 4 and 6 of training + Typhoon 1
Reave w/Recharge Speed evo rank 5 - 3.81 seconds
with power efficiency mods its 3.64, 3.48 and 3.33 @ 60, 70 and 80% CDT

That said, without efficiency mods the synergy between weapon and powers is perfect.  Shoot Typhoon to strip shields, Pull, reload then Reave. The Pull CDT & Typhoon reload times synergize perfectly.

I was actually very surprised at how effective this setup was but I've always used the Saber with the Justicar so I knew heavy ARs worked with her, I just didn't expect it to work well @ 50% CDT.

Reave
Typhoon crap mode 1.5s
Typhoon good dps mode 2s
Reave

Typhoon crap mode 1.5s
Typhoon good dps mode 2s


Seems like a great tradeoff!  </sarcasm>

OK then, yet another elitist who completely dismisses setups without even trying them.  You can keep whining while I'm wrecking Gold with my crappy setup.

Ad hominem.  Beautiful.  You use the opposite of synergy and when someone points it out, "b-b-b-b-but you're an ELITIST!!!1111 :("

And do realize no one cares what you claim you're doing.  And considering how much you're waving that epeen around, chances are saying is all you really are doing.

[Rifneno]

ryoldschool wrote...

@buckshot- that is actually a great idea, she has that wt reduction for assault rifles. But I'm going to try it with the particle rifle- more accurate and it weighs less. I had great success vs phantoms with the particle rifle, but that's another thread

Actually, like the rest of his post it's godawful.  The AR weight reduction is a 6th level evolution.  The 5th level evolution is 20% headshot damage, which is almost universally laughed at now that bosses have no weak points, and power damage, which sounds good until you realize it's broken for the justicar and does nothing.  So you're paying eleven points for that 30% weight reduction.  ...  Which isn't a 30% weight reduction!  The description is grossly misleading.  It gives you -30 from the cooldown penalty you see in the weapon screen.  So it would generally take less than a second off reave's recast.  For 11 points.

Godawful.

Modifié par Rifneno, 11 août 2012 - 07:18 .

[Atheosis]

Dudeskio wrote...

The fact that the debate here seems to be between the Harrier, Typhoon, and PPR tells us all we need to know. We now have 3 viable, BALANCED ARs. How awesome is that?

What debate?  People who really know the ins and outs of these weapons know full well that the Typhoon is blown away by the Harrier.  There might be a debate between the PPR and the Typhoon, but even then I feel the people arguing for the Typhoon aren't really getting how big a deal the extra weight is.

[ryoldschool]

@rifeno yikes, a shame the 5th evolution does not work, its been a long time since I played the justicar

@atheosis I agree with you, but you need to let people find out for themselves. My guess that people wont know how much fun it used to be.

[JakobBloch]

Is the Typhoon a good gun?

Yes

At everything?

No

Are there other weapons better?

Well it depends. Better at what?

As is the case with a lot of weapons both real and imagined, they have roles and optimum usage. In the case of the typhoon it is not a good gun on all classes or with all builds. A class that relies on cooldowns will not like it. Glass cannon classes will not like them either. On the right classes it is an excellent weapon. On others it is a liability.
Beyond the class there is also how you build the weapon (and what level you have it at). Slap a bigger clip on it and a stabiliser and its range is dramatically increased, as well as making it able to pump out more bullets before you have to rev it up again, ultimately increasing its effectiveness.
It is less effective against troopers (of all kinds) but when you move to mid tier enemies and bosses it shines (except for phantoms unless you get them at long range... this could just be me though).

Ultimately the typhoon is as good as the player using it and if someone has found a way to make it work for them, no amount of snide comments, veiled insults, allusions to inferiority or cocky superiority complexes will change that. Just because it does not work for you does not mean it does not work for them. Even if the best players in the world and the most exhaustive math tells us that the GI with a Claymore is the best combo in the world (whether it is so is irrelevant for my point), I still can't make it work. That makes the combo crap, but only for me. I use other comboes, because they work for me.

So if you don't like the typhoon that is fine. If you don't like it since the nerfs that is also fine. Just remember that others may not think so.

[Biotic Wolf]

i don't have it but i would think it is pretty good thanks to its hidden multiplier against armor, shields, and barriers

[Rifneno]

JakobBloch wrote...

So if you don't like the typhoon that is fine. If you don't like it since the nerfs that is also fine. Just remember that others may not think so.

And?  I certainly hope you're not suggesting those of us that want it to be as good as it should be should just smile and nod.  Regardless of what some mod says, public opinion obviously does sway what gets changed and how.  If we ever want to see this gun worth its rarity, risk, and weight then we'd damn well better defend our points for it.

Once again... it's insanely heavy, insanely rare, and requires prolonged exposure which is very dangerous on gold/plat.  It shouldn't have "good" dps, it should have awesome dps.  It doesn't.

[RamsenC]

The PPR and Typhoon need to be at level X to shine. Something the Harrier does not need. If the PPR and Typhoon were Gold rarity that would be fine.

[JakobBloch]

Rifneno wrote...

JakobBloch wrote...

So if you don't like the typhoon that is fine. If you don't like it since the nerfs that is also fine. Just remember that others may not think so.

And?  I certainly hope you're not suggesting those of us that want it to be as good as it should be should just smile and nod.  Regardless of what some mod says, public opinion obviously does sway what gets changed and how.  If we ever want to see this gun worth its rarity, risk, and weight then we'd damn well better defend our points for it.

Certainly not. If you want it rebuffed that is a perfectly valid ambition, however being snide and dismissive to people, that think it is fine, is not the way to do it. If you want to have it be better, explain why. It is however imperetive that you do not dismis the opinion of others if their opinion contradicts your own. I mean if you can't accept the opinions of others why should they care about yours?

Once again... it's insanely heavy, insanely rare, and requires prolonged exposure which is very dangerous on gold/plat.  It shouldn't have "good" dps, it should have awesome dps.  It doesn't.

This assumes a lot of things. Firstly it assumes that UR weapons by definition are suppose to have higher damage output than other weapons. Granted a lot of them have but stricly speaking they just need to be overall superior to less rare weapons (and even that is debatable). Nothing however stops them from being situational, specialised or even quirky to make up for their increased power. It can be seen in the weapons that are direct upgrades how this works. Both the Wraith and the Paladin have higher damage but are also heavier and have less ammo than their rare counterparts. These are obvious drawbacks because there is something to directly compare them to. The Typhoon has no such luxury (and neither does most of the other weapons). The closest similar weapon is the Revenant (stop the presses) but even this weapon can not be compaired directly as the two weapons are just too similar.

Let me see if I can explain the reason for the typhoons "place" in the powercurve. you mention rarity: I think I covered this but let me say it again. Rarity is a minor issue when exploring the power of a weapon (I direct you to the buff of the Mattock for an example of this). Of course you are going to see the most powerful weapons at the highest rarities but you will also find the most restrictive drawbacks (for a prime example of this compare a mantis to a javelin or a widow). Typhoon has a lot of these drawbacks, but it its case they are also used to push the typhoon into the hands of specific classes while restricting it to others.
The rediculous weight makes it less useful to power reliant classes. The rev up makes it necesary to be able to take a pounding to use it. These drawbacks push it into a role that is reinforced by its bonuses. The typhoon gets bonus damage against shields, bariers and armor, it reduces the effectiveness of armor (I think) and it pierces cover. All these bonuses make it specialised against mid tier enemies and bosses. It is much less effective against troopers. This is what the typhoon does and it does it well. It did it better before the second nerf but having a weapon able to take out the most resilient enemy in the game in less than 10 seconds, even under ideal conditions, is too powerful (if the enemy had been debuffed we could talk).

The typhoon is a weapon that does its job and it does it well. It is just that its job is not to be a universal death dealer or a go to gun for every class or every situation. Its job (I think) is to take out mid tier enemies at mid to long range (depending on your setup).  Its ability to take out bosses is more of a bonus that flows from its main job.

Could it use a rebuff? I am not sure and more importantly I am not sure how to do it. Getting the revved damage back up to x2 would be excessive. Perhaps increase it in increments x1.5 -> x1.6 ->x1.7 ->x1.75. I wouldn't expect it though. I may be wrong but something tells me that bioware feels that the Typhoon is where it needs to be right now. I wish you luck though.

[SavagelyEpic]

In terms of performance between an Indra VIII and a Typhoon I-Typhoon III, which is the superior weapon?

Just so I know what to outfit my soldiers with whenever the Harrier I's capacity starts driving me insane.

Modifié par SavagelyEpic, 12 août 2012 - 09:38 .

[DHKany]

IndigoVitare wrote...

Gamemako wrote...

IndigoVitare wrote...

How long does the Harrier take to bring down an Atlas?

This.

It takes around 30 seconds and twice your spare ammo capacity.

Clearly the Harrier needs a buff. If 13 seconds is considered bad, then 30 seconds is downright awful. The Harrier must be a useless trash weapon.

edited 

Modifié par DHKany, 12 août 2012 - 09:46 .

[AscendantWyvern]

1.5 bonus against shields, barriers, and armor gives it bonuses over the particle rifle and harrier against bosses. Yes, it is still very useful, it just isnt a be all kill all weapon.

[SavagelyEpic]

SavagelyEpic wrote...

In terms of performance between an Indra VIII and a Typhoon I-Typhoon III, which is the superior weapon?

Just so I know what to outfit my soldiers with whenever the Harrier I's capacity starts driving me insane.

Quoting my own post here, but can anyone give me a link to whatever http://i.imgur.com/XdQ6u.png happens to be? I don't know how to interpret all those weird google docs weapons chart spreadsheet things.

[Ashen One]

SavagelyEpic wrote...

In terms of performance between an Indra VIII and a Typhoon I-Typhoon III, which is the superior weapon?

Just so I know what to outfit my soldiers with whenever the Harrier I's capacity starts driving me insane.

Those weapons fill completely different niches. Any class you would reasonably use a Indra on shouldn't even be considering a Typhoon.

[SavagelyEpic]

Ashen Earth wrote...

SavagelyEpic wrote...

In terms of performance between an Indra VIII and a Typhoon I-Typhoon III, which is the superior weapon?

Just so I know what to outfit my soldiers with whenever the Harrier I's capacity starts driving me insane.

Those weapons fill completely different niches. Any class you would reasonably use a Indra on shouldn't even be considering a Typhoon.

I've heard quite a few people saying that an Indra works incredibly well on a Destroyer.

[Ashen One]

SavagelyEpic wrote...

Ashen Earth wrote...

SavagelyEpic wrote...

In terms of performance between an Indra VIII and a Typhoon I-Typhoon III, which is the superior weapon?

Just so I know what to outfit my soldiers with whenever the Harrier I's capacity starts driving me insane.

Those weapons fill completely different niches. Any class you would reasonably use a Indra on shouldn't even be considering a Typhoon.

I've heard quite a few people saying that an Indra works incredibly well on a Destroyer.

The Indra is inferior to the Harrier, and the Particle Rifle.

Indra is better used as a lightweight primary weapon, or sidearm for power reliant classes. A Destroyer benefits more from heavier, more damaging weaponry.

[Colonel Sheppard]

The question isn't whether the typhoon is still a good gun. The real question is whether it was ever a FUN gun to use? Seriously, harrier, hurricane, Indra have nearly the same RoF without the ridiculous spin up time. In my book, the typhoon is just plain garbage in terms of fun factor. All the guns in the game will do well, but only a handful are actually fun to use.

[Barge6000]

I want to love it cos it looks and feels awesome, I still dont have a destroyer but i give it a run on my krentinel with the claymore sometimes but it doesnt rock my world, I only have it at 2 but im sure it isnt the gun its supposed to be

[Ogrinash]

It still puts out over 1000 damage per second after a little over 1 second against armor/shields/barriers. Harrier is the only one with comparable damage.

[Ashen One]

Ogrinash wrote...

It still puts out over 1000 damage per second after a little over 1 second against armor/shields/barriers. Harrier is the only one with comparable damage.

You're forgetting the Particle Rifle, which does more damage than the Harrier when it's at full power.

[SavagelyEpic]

Ashen Earth wrote...

SavagelyEpic wrote...

Ashen Earth wrote...

SavagelyEpic wrote...

In terms of performance between an Indra VIII and a Typhoon I-Typhoon III, which is the superior weapon?

Just so I know what to outfit my soldiers with whenever the Harrier I's capacity starts driving me insane.

Those weapons fill completely different niches. Any class you would reasonably use a Indra on shouldn't even be considering a Typhoon.

I've heard quite a few people saying that an Indra works incredibly well on a Destroyer.

The Indra is inferior to the Harrier, and the Particle Rifle.

Indra is better used as a lightweight primary weapon, or sidearm for power reliant classes. A Destroyer benefits more from heavier, more damaging weaponry.

Is this still the case for a rank 8 Indra versus a rank 1 Harrier? The main problem I have with the Harrier is that at rank one I basically have to be chained to an ammo box, whereas the Indra on my Destroyer allows me greater freedom.

[SGsunny]

The warm-up does seem to take forever, esp. when under heavy fire. Since I don't have the harrier, it's the best AR I've got atm. Not sure if Revenant with stabilization module would out-gun it or not.

[Rifneno]

JakobBloch wrote...

This assumes a lot of things. Firstly it assumes that UR weapons by definition are suppose to have higher damage output than other weapons. Granted a lot of them have but stricly speaking they just need to be overall superior to less rare weapons (and even that is debatable). Nothing however stops them from being situational, specialised or even quirky to make up for their increased power. It can be seen in the weapons that are direct upgrades how this works. Both the Wraith and the Paladin have higher damage but are also heavier and have less ammo than their rare counterparts. These are obvious drawbacks because there is something to directly compare them to. The Typhoon has no such luxury (and neither does most of the other weapons). The closest similar weapon is the Revenant (stop the presses) but even this weapon can not be compaired directly as the two weapons are just too similar.

I'm not going to get into a debate with anyone who thinks URs shouldn't kick rare's asses. I'm not here to educate pure shooter fans on the basics of RPGs.

Let me see if I can explain the reason for the typhoons "place" in the powercurve. you mention rarity: I think I covered this but let me say it again. Rarity is a minor issue when exploring the power of a weapon (I direct you to the buff of the Mattock for an example of this). Of course you are going to see the most powerful weapons at the highest rarities but you will also find the most restrictive drawbacks (for a prime example of this compare a mantis to a javelin or a widow). Typhoon has a lot of these drawbacks, but it its case they are also used to push the typhoon into the hands of specific classes while restricting it to others.
The rediculous weight makes it less useful to power reliant classes. The rev up makes it necesary to be able to take a pounding to use it. These drawbacks push it into a role that is reinforced by its bonuses. The typhoon gets bonus damage against shields, bariers and armor, it reduces the effectiveness of armor (I think) and it pierces cover. All these bonuses make it specialised against mid tier enemies and bosses. It is much less effective against troopers. This is what the typhoon does and it does it well. It did it better before the second nerf but having a weapon able to take out the most resilient enemy in the game in less than 10 seconds, even under ideal conditions, is too powerful (if the enemy had been debuffed we could talk).

Bull****. Flat out bull***. This is a borderline strawman. I'm sick and tired of hearing people using a tiny clip of Sp3c7eR's solo video as their sole argument. He had the best consumables possible, a maxed out gun, and it was in the hilariously rare scenario of being able to freely fire at a defenseless atlas without having to worry about anything attacking you and forcing you into cover and thus bringing the weapon's warm-up period, a major negative in its power, into significant play. Even then, hilariously even then, we get people crying "that video's like, rigged or something, 'cuz you shouldn't count the reloading! that's not fair, onyl count the time I want to count and only in the circumstances that benefit me teh most!" Jesus Christ. You want to know why I'm snarky? Because I'm sick of dealing with this crap, that's why. Do you hear me talking about how much it sucks when a phantom takes you by surprise and you can't warm it up before you're dead, or when something keeps staggering you and forcing you to fire it in Locust mode? No.

Argue the realistic scenarios for the average player, not absurdly one-sided ones you'll only ever see on Youtube. If you can't do that, don't get into the debate. I'm sick of talking to people who seem to be playing Youtube Effect 3 instead of Mass Effect 3.

AscendantWyvern wrote...

1.5 bonus against shields, barriers, and armor gives it bonuses over the particle rifle and harrier against bosses. Yes, it is still very useful, it just isnt a be all kill all weapon.

I like how everyone mentions the great bonuses without mentioning that without them, the typhoon's base damage is only slightly higher than the locust. Harrier's base damage is 106-129, typhoon's is 44-55. I wonder why it has all those bonuses...

Ogrinash wrote...

It still puts out over 1000 damage per second after a little over 1 second against armor/shields/barriers. Harrier is the only one with comparable damage.

I assume you're only including the harrier and the avenger, because there's no way you missed all the weapons that have 1000+ dps. The mattock reaches high 900's and it's a lightweight uncommon ffs.

[Leisure Muffin]

Gockey wrote...

inb4ImmoratalStrifeandotherscomedefendit.

I agree. We know from the math what the damage should be. We can see on paper that it sounds like a solid gun. However, somewhere between the values listed and the actual in game performance, something seems off.

I certainly am not doing 1K dps a lot of the time. I had the Phoon day 1 of the DLC, and I can understand why they wanted to tweak it, I guess. It didn't feel gamebreaking then.

Now it's just too heavy, and I'm better off with the Harrier or the PPR.

The sustained DPS is only 900.  That's why