105 réponses à ce sujet

[Legion of 1337]

Mass Effect has always had bugs - every game in the trilogy has had them. The most memorable one for me was the one in ME2 where Shepard would glitch up on top of objects if they walked next to a corner in a certain way. Since there's no jump button and objects have invisible barriers around them, you would be permanently stuck up there and would have to reload.

[ebevan91]

legion999 wrote...

<cough> the journal <cough> face import <cough>

If you're upset about Mass Effect's QA then for the love of god avoid Bethesda games.

So true. ME3 pretty much runs flawlessly compared to Beth games.

Skyrim freezes half the time when fast traveling or loading an autosave.

Fallout 3 crashes to desktop fairly often and crashes when you minimize the game.

I haven't noticed Fallout: NV crashing much, but every day I've played it, the game gets hung on the loading screen.

[yukon fire]

Sylvf wrote...

I'm sorry that happened to you Acid Mars, but I'd like to say that our QA department worked incredibly hard and long on this project. None of them deserve to be fired. A game like ME3 is incredibly complicated to test. (Most of us in writing were testing ME3 by the end ourselves, just so we could have more people looking at it. I'm not trying to excuse any bugs, but making a game problem-free isn't as straightforward as we'd like)

In hindsight I wish you "writers" had paid more attention to your own work, there was plenty of problems in the writing that could have used more attention.

Such as
Mordin dies and immediately all I can talk about is whoever died on Virmire?<_< 

Though I got to give you credit for coming out of your spider-hole (most seemed to drop off the map), the only people who can hold their head up high on this would be some of the graphic artists, because at times this game looked so amazing you almost forgot about how almost everything was only a half effort on Bioware's part.

Still its nice to know you people still exist, not that you'll put that much effort into that little slide show, but hey why start trying now?   

[Gruntburner]

Being a game tester is an awful job. They get no respect, the pay is terrible, the hours are atrocious, and often they play test a single aspect of the game for weeks. If anything they should be payed more.

[Terror_K]

When it comes to the likes of the ME3 face import and CC issues, I don't so much blame the testers as I do whoever made it and whoever rubber-stamped it as being fine.

I mean... it's actually pretty much impossible for any testers to have missed something like that. Did it even get tested at all? The fact that is so utterly broken and there seems no indication that BioWare are even attempting to fix it just illustrates to me even more that they don't care about players who have been with them since ME1 and earlier. It's all about the new casual gamers now.

[samftrmdfhl]

Meh, they have not even fix ME2 corner bug until this day.
The 'behind Joker ram' bug, still not fix.

[Degs29]

Am I the only one who gets this glitch? When talking to EDI, she brings up the story about the Reaper prisoners not betraying their fellow prisoners (by informing the Reapers of escape attempts) and 9 times out of 10 I end up on EDI's head in the cockpit after the conversation, with my Shepard's head through the ceiling, unable to move.

[ManUnderMask]

I had this happen once, during the Chronos Station mission. One of the geth who were supposed to drop down didn't, and glitched at the top of the ladder and became unkillable. Luckily I just had to reload the checkpoint which was right outside of the room.

[Haldameer]

I still get stuck in the Normandy when talking to EDI... come on Bioware, you have stolen enough money from us now. Make fix

[Haldameer]

Nope. I got stuck last night.

[Terror_K]

simfamSP wrote...

I've heard people who have never experienced game breaking bugs in FO:NV ffs.

I have yet to actually experience any game-breaking bugs in Fallout: New Vegas myself actually, though I have the PC version, which was never anywhere near as buggy as the console ones. Still, I've put in dozens and dozens of hours and even have some mods added to complicate things, and the worst I've had is the odd merchant and his brahmin stuck in the terrain.

[Haldameer]

Terror_K wrote...

simfamSP wrote...

I've heard people who have never experienced game breaking bugs in FO:NV ffs.

I have yet to actually experience any game-breaking bugs in Fallout: New Vegas myself actually, though I have the PC version, which was never anywhere near as buggy as the console ones. Still, I've put in dozens and dozens of hours and even have some mods added to complicate things, and the worst I've had is the odd merchant and his brahmin stuck in the terrain.

I personally have never experienced a game breaking bug in FO:NV either. I have got stuck and kicked out, but nothing serious.

[Mylia Stenetch]

Terror_K wrote...

When it comes to the likes of the ME3 face import and CC issues, I don't so much blame the testers as I do whoever made it and whoever rubber-stamped it as being fine.

I mean... it's actually pretty much impossible for any testers to have missed something like that. Did it even get tested at all? The fact that is so utterly broken and there seems no indication that BioWare are even attempting to fix it just illustrates to me even more that they don't care about players who have been with them since ME1 and earlier. It's all about the new casual gamers now.

If you ever work in the realm of IT, then you know some issues you would never see coming no matter how many times it could be tested. I been a beta tester in MMOs before, and trying to find glitches and make them reproduce can be a real challenge.

In my job, as a network administrator, it is hard to saw what could happen in a live production enviroment when you tested something in your lab for X amount of time. Bugs you never saw can come up all the time that at the time of testing looked clear.

Unless you are there in the building and have the QA notes on this issue, then you cannot know what the production plans are for it, or how complex it would be. Calling for someone to get fired for something you have off-hand knowledge of is petty.

[Terror_K]

Mylia Stenetch wrote...

Terror_K wrote...

When it comes to the likes of the ME3 face import and CC issues, I don't so much blame the testers as I do whoever made it and whoever rubber-stamped it as being fine.

I mean... it's actually pretty much impossible for any testers to have missed something like that. Did it even get tested at all? The fact that is so utterly broken and there seems no indication that BioWare are even attempting to fix it just illustrates to me even more that they don't care about players who have been with them since ME1 and earlier. It's all about the new casual gamers now.

If you ever work in the realm of IT, then you know some issues you would never see coming no matter how many times it could be tested. I been a beta tester in MMOs before, and trying to find glitches and make them reproduce can be a real challenge.

In my job, as a network administrator, it is hard to saw what could happen in a live production enviroment when you tested something in your lab for X amount of time. Bugs you never saw can come up all the time that at the time of testing looked clear.

Unless you are there in the building and have the QA notes on this issue, then you cannot know what the production plans are for it, or how complex it would be. Calling for someone to get fired for something you have off-hand knowledge of is petty.

I have a degree in I.T. actually. And as such I know that bugs are one thing, but when a core feature of the game simply doesn't work, that's another matter entirely. And that's what the import feature was: one of the core features of the game.

When the Character Creator and import system in a game fails as utterly as ME3's where it recognises the faces of almost no Shepard's taken through from an ME1 game, considering that the whole import system was a major selling point and core feature, that's screwed up. We're not talking about a small percentage of people and Shepards not importing: we're talking about almost all of them having the issue if a player has taken their character through both prior games. The only way that a bug that colossal could be missed is either if it was never tested.

Add to that the fact that the Character Creator is outright missing several facial options to the point where many faces can't be reconstructed even manually in the CC, forcing modders to use several external tools to literally alter the models and vertices of their characters' faces to get them even remotely close.

Finally, there's the fact that we were told by BioWare there was going to be a fix for it. We waited for a month and then it came, but didn't work at all. Then when we kicked up a fuss, we were lied to about why it didn't work and told that the problem was something that a small handful of fans with some programming experience had proven wasn't the case, before BioWare just went silent on the issue, unstickied the topic and have avoided it ever since.

They got it right in ME2, so there's no excuse for the major fubar that is ME3's character creator, which was just poorly designed and insufficient even without the major import issues. If they could get ME1 faces to import into ME2 and even give them a slight graphical upgrade, surely they could have done the same from ME2 to ME3. It isn't rocket science to work out that "if Character Creator A has X number of facial options, then Character Creator B needs X number of facial options that match up to replicate the face." What BioWare did with ME3's CC is the equivalent of building a clock that's supposed to be a slightly better looking version of another one, but deciding to remove the Number 10 entirely and expecting it to still work the same.

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

Tell you what bothers me, it is the amount of things that don't flag when you import a save.

[obZen DF]

@OP: I'm still waiting for a game without any bugs/glitches/misses/errors. That will probably never happen. So, saying that 'All game testers should be fired" is redicilous.

Maybe you should try to become a QA. Let's see if you shouldn't be fired

[Wowky]

yukon fire wrote...

Sylvf wrote...

I'm sorry that happened to you Acid Mars, but I'd like to say that our QA department worked incredibly hard and long on this project. None of them deserve to be fired. A game like ME3 is incredibly complicated to test. (Most of us in writing were testing ME3 by the end ourselves, just so we could have more people looking at it. I'm not trying to excuse any bugs, but making a game problem-free isn't as straightforward as we'd like)

In hindsight I wish you "writers" had paid more attention to your own work, there was plenty of problems in the writing that could have used more attention.

Such as
Mordin dies and immediately all I can talk about is whoever died on Virmire?<_< 

Though I got to give you credit for coming out of your spider-hole (most seemed to drop off the map), the only people who can hold their head up high on this would be some of the graphic artists, because at times this game looked so amazing you almost forgot about how almost everything was only a half effort on Bioware's part.

Still its nice to know you people still exist, not that you'll put that much effort into that little slide show, but hey why start trying now?   

Sylvia wrote Liara, the Geth Consensus mission, and some other stuff in the game (I wish I could remember what she said at Comic Con on that panel) - all the stuff she did was really good IMO. Great even. It's not fair to single her out as an "example" for your soap box.

[Mylia Stenetch]

Terror_K wrote...
I have a degree in I.T. actually. And as such I know that bugs are one thing, but when a core feature of the game simply doesn't work, that's another matter entirely. And that's what the import feature was: one of the core features of the game.

When the Character Creator and import system in a game fails as utterly as ME3's where it recognises the faces of almost no Shepard's taken through from an ME1 game, considering that the whole import system was a major selling point and core feature, that's screwed up. We're not talking about a small percentage of people and Shepards not importing: we're talking about almost all of them having the issue if a player has taken their character through both prior games. The only way that a bug that colossal could be missed is either if it was never tested.

Add to that the fact that the Character Creator is outright missing several facial options to the point where many faces can't be reconstructed even manually in the CC, forcing modders to use several external tools to literally alter the models and vertices of their characters' faces to get them even remotely close.

Finally, there's the fact that we were told by BioWare there was going to be a fix for it. We waited for a month and then it came, but didn't work at all. Then when we kicked up a fuss, we were lied to about why it didn't work and told that the problem was something that a small handful of fans with some programming experience had proven wasn't the case, before BioWare just went silent on the issue, unstickied the topic and have avoided it ever since.

They got it right in ME2, so there's no excuse for the major fubar that is ME3's character creator, which was just poorly designed and insufficient even without the major import issues. If they could get ME1 faces to import into ME2 and even give them a slight graphical upgrade, surely they could have done the same from ME2 to ME3. It isn't rocket science to work out that "if Character Creator A has X number of facial options, then Character Creator B needs X number of facial options that match up to replicate the face." What BioWare did with ME3's CC is the equivalent of building a clock that's supposed to be a slightly better looking version of another one, but deciding to remove the Number 10 entirely and expecting it to still work the same.

Once again, as I said we do not have the production notes for this. Maybe it worked perfectly in their enviroment? There could be a million and one things that could of been put in which caused issues last minute which could not be fixed properly. The game was rushed, and it did not give the proper polish it should of had, but to say that everyone ignored it and they found every bug is fallicious.

The import is a core feature in the means of what your did in the previous games and how the story arcs for you. Character visuals while important to us it is still a cosmetic issue. Since there is still a lot of people out there who might use the generic look for shepard but did everything else in a game. There was a fix, and it did fix some of the issues people saw in the game, I know my imports worked better than the first time I imported.

Stil for the people who are programmers, who found one, issue it all counts on what the programers who are working on the game are doing. Just because we "solved" it does not mean it would be an easy fix. We do not know what they are doing in house which could cause issues with something else designing or if they are working on other bugs that are being reported which are game breaking since they did the patch on this.

Also no matter what what happened in any other game cannot fully compare to what was done in a new game. There will be always vairances in what happens, and unexpected issues that could come which no one saw. It would be like someone telling me since I built a network in X city, it should work just as easy in the next city. This is never the case, there is always something different to throw a wrench in the plans.

Still it all comes down to we do not what the production notes and what was done by their Q&A and their testers. Without that information, calling them out saying they did nothing on this, or anything else is running on thin ice of fallacy.

[BDelacroix]

That's a bit draconian but all testers need not be fired. They work rediculous hours for little pay and when the project is done, they get laid off. When they do report bugs, those reports aren't always taken seriously. They have a category of "known shippable" which just means we are going to ship it anyway because it isn't a game breaker. I've seen it.

[samftrmdfhl]

Tester might miss a few bugs sure...
How about those that we already know like ME2's corner bug and ME3's Joker's ramp?
What reason that they give to not fix it?

[Grubas]

samftrmdfhl wrote...

Tester might miss a few bugs sure...
How about those that we already know like ME2's corner bug and ME3's Joker's ramp?
What reason that they give to not fix it?

To complicated, to expensive, people will play the game nevertheless... 
Its cheaper to fix all occasional bugs with more "autosave points". No Pun intended.