432 réponses à ce sujet

[Grundle47]

mrcanada wrote...

Skullheart wrote...

Javik, the last prothean.

That he knows of. He's a soldier that admittedly lost all contact with the empire. Each Prothean world had almost no knowledge of what the other was doing due to the nature of the Reaper attack. It is highly likely there are more pods in existence just like Javik.

But how do you insert that discovery into the middle of the story without altering the existing narrative. I was on board with all of this, but I don't know how to get past that. At the end of ME3 the war's over. All MP play and new SP DLC still has to take place before the game ends. While a room full of Protheans may exist somewhere in the ME universe, they didn't think to write in it's discovery before the end of the game. It's a little late to shoehorn it into the middle of everything now.

So, rather than lore, how about this.

BW devs: "We already have the character model done....here MP, you can have it."

No worse than a "Battlefield 3" soldier. If ME's MP was in ANY way story driven I'd agree with keeping Protheans out. But come on, people. I really think this is just another Volus outcry ("If they add Volus I'm done!.....OOH Sniper Mastery challenge...").  The lore won't work, but no one's fun would be ruined by adding them into MP anyway.

[Dark Tlaloc]

Grundle47 wrote...

mrcanada wrote...

Skullheart wrote...

Javik, the last prothean.

That he knows of. He's a soldier that admittedly lost all contact with the empire. Each Prothean world had almost no knowledge of what the other was doing due to the nature of the Reaper attack. It is highly likely there are more pods in existence just like Javik.

But how do you insert that discovery into the middle of the story without altering the existing narrative. I was on board with all of this, but I don't know how to get past that. At the end of ME3 the war's over. All MP play and new SP DLC still has to take place before the game ends. While a room full of Protheans may exist somewhere in the ME universe, they didn't think to write in it's discovery before the end of the game. It's a little late to shoehorn it into the middle of everything now.

So, rather than lore, how about this.

BW devs: "We already have the character model done....here MP, you can have it."

No worse than a "Battlefield 3" soldier. If ME's MP was in ANY way story driven I'd agree with keeping Protheans out. But come on, people. I really think this is just another Volus outcry ("If they add Volus I'm done!.....OOH Sniper Mastery challenge...").  The lore won't work, but no one's fun would be ruined by adding them into MP anyway.

Technically the claim can always be that Shepard just wasn't made aware of Protheans fighting on the outskirts of the galaxy; since this is Shepard's narrative, news is filtered through him/her. I'm not saying that's the best excuse in the world (because you WOULD expect news of other Protheans to get to him), but it's possible for him to not know everything, and thus we, the players, would also not know.

[Clayless]

Liara would know, so would Hackett.

Therefore Shepard would.

[xSNPx ZoDiaC]

Grundle47 wrote...

mrcanada wrote...

Skullheart wrote...

Javik, the last prothean.

That he knows of. He's a soldier that admittedly lost all contact with the empire. Each Prothean world had almost no knowledge of what the other was doing due to the nature of the Reaper attack. It is highly likely there are more pods in existence just like Javik.

But how do you insert that discovery into the middle of the story without altering the existing narrative. I was on board with all of this, but I don't know how to get past that. At the end of ME3 the war's over. All MP play and new SP DLC still has to take place before the game ends. While a room full of Protheans may exist somewhere in the ME universe, they didn't think to write in it's discovery before the end of the game. It's a little late to shoehorn it into the middle of everything now.

So, rather than lore, how about this.

BW devs: "We already have the character model done....here MP, you can have it."

No worse than a "Battlefield 3" soldier. If ME's MP was in ANY way story driven I'd agree with keeping Protheans out. But come on, people. I really think this is just another Volus outcry ("If they add Volus I'm done!.....OOH Sniper Mastery challenge...").  The lore won't work, but no one's fun would be ruined by adding them into MP anyway.

Quarians and Geth fighting Geth on Earth?

[xSNPx ZoDiaC]

Robosexual wrote...

Dark Tlaloc wrote...

oO Stryfe Oo wrote...

But...whether or not lore is pointless is kind of your opinion. Personally, I don't think so. More importantly, neither does BW.

Well sure, I’m just giving my opinion
like everyone else in this thread. I have no issue with people who think
Protheans aren’t lore friendly-I simply completely disagree, on the same
grounds as the reason they may not make it into MP: If Bioware decides they’re
lore-friendly, they can quickly write them into lore, and suddenly everyone who
says they’re not lore-friendly becomes incorrect. Whether or not Bioware
decides this isn’t my issue; I’m just pointing out that it wouldn’t be the
first time they disregard what many consider “lore.”

People have a problem with the way it nullifies a lot of the game and Javik.

There's no way hundreds or thousands of Protheans fighting all over the galaxy wouldn't be mentioned during the war, and it'd be equally as stupid to suggest that none of them were scientists capable of working on the Crucible.

But you have no problem that playable Quarians and Geth nullifies the entire chapter of Tali and Legion's story arc in ME3?


How convenient we can chose what breaks lore or not.

Modifié par xSNPx ZoDiaC, 23 janvier 2013 - 08:40 .

[xSNPx ZoDiaC]

oO Stryfe Oo wrote...

xSNPx ZoDiaC wrote...

Why you think otherwise is also beyond me. Unless you have an actual source that I'm unaware of? N7 operations are clearly not front-line operations. They are covert, hence we only see 1-4 operatives at a time.

Protheans can get their supplies and "kits" from the Alliance. What's the problem exactly?

Ok, think of it this way;

Each and every single kit we can currently play is an unimportant individual from a large group whose number we don't know. Were they to die, not much would change. The group they come from would simply be one short, which isn't saying much when that group could number in the millions. The same cannot be said of story relevant characters.

Were we only to get four Prothean kits, they'd instantly become story-relevant, as long as MP retains its connection to SP's lore. Besides, what if multiple players wanted to play the same Prothean? What if there were a female Prothean (people have asked) and all four wanted to use her? How would you explain her being cloned four times? With the current kits, this isn't a problem; again, they are extremely unimportant.

tl;dr - Were we to ever get Protheans, we'd definitely need a lot more than 4. It'd be best if we didn't know the exact number. Otherwise, there'd be problems similar to why we can't use characters like Samarra, Grunt, or Zaeed.

There is a war going on, entire planets are being destroyed.  I don't think everyone has time to check in on twitter. And if they do, they deserve to die. And this is all assuming the extra-net is still functioning properly when Reaper ai's are constantly hacking into every nation isp's.

NO ONE can possibly know all the details of a nation's resources during war times. It's understandable that not even Shepard would know of such a secret Salarian/Hanar project at the moment.

Modifié par xSNPx ZoDiaC, 23 janvier 2013 - 08:45 .

[oO Stryfe Oo]

xSNPx ZoDiaC wrote...

But you have no problem that playable Quarians and Geth nullifies the entire chapter of Tali and Legion's story arc in ME3?


How convenient we can chose what breaks lore or not.

It is possible to get both to cooperate. That possibility is what I'm guessing allows for both species to be playable.

Modifié par oO Stryfe Oo, 24 janvier 2013 - 02:02 .

[oO Stryfe Oo]

xSNPx ZoDiaC wrote...

NO ONE can possibly know all the details of a nation's resources during war times. It's understandable that not even Shepard would know of such a secret Salarian/Hanar project at the moment.

"No one can possibly know all the details of a nation's resources during wartimes". I agree with that statement. So why should we know how many Protheans were brought back to aid in the war, when we're not given the specifics of any other group/race? If they're going to give us Protheans, don't tell us how many were brought back/found/unfrozen/downloaded/created.

That's it. That's all I'm saying.

[TODD 5184]

Javik clearly states in the single player campaign that when it is all over, he wants to rejoin his people, almost like in some sort of ritualistic suicide. This makes me think he would be against cloning.

Let him be the last. Let the Protheans rest in peace.

[Triscuitable]

TODD 5184 wrote...

Javik clearly states in the single player campaign that when it is all over, he wants to rejoin his people, almost like in some sort of ritualistic suicide. This makes me think he would be against cloning.

Let him be the last. Let the Protheans rest in peace.

It's not like the Salarians would consider the thoughts of just one member of a long-lost race to be a viable reason not to clone them, right?

Purely hyperbole. Pay no heed.

[xSNPx ZoDiaC]

TODD 5184 wrote...

Javik clearly states in the single player campaign that when it is all over, he wants to rejoin his people, almost like in some sort of ritualistic suicide. This makes me think he would be against cloning.

Let him be the last. Let the Protheans rest in peace.

What Javik wanted, was to lead his Prothean army to victory against these reaper monsters. He'll have to settle for a small fighting force or covert operatives at the least. 


For the Empire!

[darkpassenger2342]

dinosaurs for MP.

[xSNPx ZoDiaC]

oO Stryfe Oo wrote...

xSNPx ZoDiaC wrote...

NO ONE can possibly know all the details of a nation's resources during war times. It's understandable that not even Shepard would know of such a secret Salarian/Hanar project at the moment.

"No one can possibly know all the details of a nation's resources during wartimes". I agree with that statement. So why should we know how many Protheans were brought back to aid in the war, when we're not given the specifics of any other group/race? If they're going to give us Protheans, don't tell us how many were brought back/found/unfrozen/downloaded/created.

That's it. That's all I'm saying.

So then keep the numbers anonymous. This is still not breaking any lore.

[Zerker]

Why would they want to clone Protheans for combat? Krogans, Humans, Turians, these three are the "soldier" species of Mass Effect universe, and they already have experience fighting the current tactics Reapers tend to use for this cycle.

It is a much better investment to outfit these guys with the best genetic upgrades and military technology available, than spending your resources on cloning an already failed species with an unknown military skill level, not to mention they will have to spend valuable time to teach them to communicate, to think what salarians want them to think, and to fight effectively, as it's standard procedure for tank-bred soldiers.

I'm sorry, I just don't see it.

Modifié par Maddok900, 24 janvier 2013 - 01:11 .

[ErrantPilot34]

 Nah...I want to be able to play as the Inusannon...

[FeralJester616]

I couldn't care less what you've modified in the OP.

Read it last time and still, the answer has to be NO!

Adding Prothean's to MP would trivialize Javik. He is the last, the one and only. Deal with it.

[Herbasaurusrex]

I support finding other prothean bunkers, but do not support cloning.

Reasons: finding other bunkers is fine b/c supposedly on ilos, vigil tells you there likely aren't anymore bunkers. A few years later, you find javik.

Cloning isn't acceptable because the whole glaxy would think it unethical and it would in part make the galaxy like the reapers. What are collectors? Protheans that have been cloned for generations.

[NavySEALCommand]

Grundle47 wrote...

But how do you insert that discovery into the middle of the story without altering the existing narrative. I was on board with all of this, but I don't know how to get past that. At the end of ME3 the war's over. All MP play and new SP DLC still has to take place before the game ends. While a room full of Protheans may exist somewhere in the ME universe, they didn't think to write in it's discovery before the end of the game. It's a little late to shoehorn it into the middle of everything now.

So, rather than lore, how about this.

BW devs: "We already have the character model done....here MP, you can have it."

No worse than a "Battlefield 3" soldier. If ME's MP was in ANY way story driven I'd agree with keeping Protheans out. But come on, people. I really think this is just another Volus outcry ("If they add Volus I'm done!.....OOH Sniper Mastery challenge...").  The lore won't work, but no one's fun would be ruined by adding them into MP anyway.

This.

ME3 MP is not story driven in the slightest, so why ruin the fun for others with your unneeded bias and dislike of others opinions. 

Simply don't play them.

[ThelLastTruePatriot]

Not sure why people want space jamaicans. However I would be totally into the idea if the MP prothean was voiced by the same guy who did Hermes Conrad.

[Asebstos]

ThelLastTruePatriot wrote...

Not sure why people want space jamaicans. However I would be totally into the idea if the MP prothean was voiced by the same guy who did Hermes Conrad.

Javik is space Nigerian. His accent isn't Jamacian or Carribean.

Anyway, the addition of any new living Protheans cheapens Javik's character immensly. Even if it could be made 'lore' friendly, it isn't remotely friendly to the narrative. New protheans = terrible storytelling (not that this game doesn't already have that, but 'I want a new MP character skin' isn't enough reason to make it even worse)

Modifié par Asebstos, 24 janvier 2013 - 02:51 .

[ThelLastTruePatriot]

Asebstos wrote...

ThelLastTruePatriot wrote...

Not sure why people want space jamaicans. However I would be totally into the idea if the MP prothean was voiced by the same guy who did Hermes Conrad.

Javik is space Nigerian. His accent isn't Jamacian or Carribean.

Anyway, the addition of any new living Protheans cheapens Javik's character immensly. Even if it could be made 'lore' friendly, it isn't remotely friendly to the narrative. New protheans = terrible storytelling (not that this game doesn't already have that, but 'I want a new MP character skin' isn't enough reason to make it even worse)

 You're really going to dissect what I said, considering none of it was intended to be serious or factual

 

[RB26D3TT]

TODD 5184 wrote...

Let the Protheans rest in peace.

This.

Modifié par RB26D3TT, 24 janvier 2013 - 03:02 .

[mrcanada]

Maddok900 wrote...

Why would they want to clone Protheans for combat? Krogans, Humans, Turians, these three are the "soldier" species of Mass Effect universe, and they already have experience fighting the current tactics Reapers tend to use for this cycle.

It is a much better investment to outfit these guys with the best genetic upgrades and military technology available, than spending your resources on cloning an already failed species with an unknown military skill level, not to mention they will have to spend valuable time to teach them to communicate, to think what salarians want them to think, and to fight effectively, as it's standard procedure for tank-bred soldiers.

I'm sorry, I just don't see it.

The Protheans conquered everything in their time, they didn't share. Arguably they were the best soldiers. Also, they were calcuating and had mental capacity/communication beyond anything seen in the current galaxy. That's reason enough and they may have answers to winning the war.

In addition,the Protheans lasted hundreds of years against the Reapers and this was AFTER the Reapers had the jump on them and cut the planet off. Javik would have no clue if there more Ilos's out there. His assumption that he is the last holds really no merit. He doesn't know.

Modifié par mrcanada, 24 janvier 2013 - 03:05 .

[mrcanada]

Herbasaurusrex wrote...

I support finding other prothean bunkers, but do not support cloning.

Reasons: finding other bunkers is fine b/c supposedly on ilos, vigil tells you there likely aren't anymore bunkers. A few years later, you find javik.

Cloning isn't acceptable because the whole glaxy would think it unethical and it would in part make the galaxy like the reapers. What are collectors? Protheans that have been cloned for generations.

Yes, I'm more for this as well. Cloning reasoning is lazy and would be the equivilant to MGS4's nanomachines arguement. It's highly likely that there are more facilities like Ilos out there with straggling pods. 

Just a note, the Collectors aren't cloned Protheans, they're Reaper genetically modified versions of Protheans.

[DullahansXMark]

No one is arguing how possible Protheans are to add. Of course it's possible. Anything is possible in fiction. And to be perfectly honest, I would enjoy playing as one.

What we are arguing, is the artistic value. The Protheans serve the narrative as the losers from the last cycle. They failed, and they paid the ultimate price. That's what they represent.

You can argue all you want that none of this matters, but it matters to BioWare, and that's all that matters.