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[saMoorai]

BrotherWarth wrote...

syllogi wrote...

BrotherWarth wrote...

The discussion started when people were saying Sheploo was crap compared to FemSHep. It wasn't just "Sheploo sucks!" "Oh yeah? Well Femshep sucks too!"

I know, but can you imagine how bad this is going to get when/if Mark Meer is revealed to have a large role?  I'd be disappointed if every thread about his character devolved into another MaleShep v. FemShep fight.  Blech.  I'm hoping most people can just cut it off as soon as someone starts to take the thread off topic.

Of course, that could be avoided if both Meer and Hale play large roles.

BSN would still find a way. 

[ElitePinecone]

Josh123914 wrote...

You should probably add that it will have a multiplayer component of some sort *preps flame-shield*

Before I get attacked: http://www.escapistm...er-Games?page=1

In an interview Frank Gibeau basically said that no games being developed or published from now on will be a sole single-player experience because they aren't financially viable, now, I would simply point him towards the Witcher 2, Mass Effects 1 and 2, Dragon Age: Origins and Skyrim to show how wrong he is, but then again I don't want EA's games anymore and apparently they don't want my money or opinion either so win-win I guess.

It's not just multiplayer that constitutes online content/digital services, that headline is a bit.. incendiary. 

It could just be DLC content, or an app that ties in with the game (Mass Effect 3's Datapad, DA: Legends, etc), or a service that tracks the player's accomplishments on a map of Thedas (for example). The idea is to make one brand available across half a dozen services so players are constantly able to engage with it.

That doesn't rule out some sort of co-op/multiplayer for DA, of course, but considering what the reaction to that would be I highly doubt they'd go anywhere near it. I think it's important to see his comments in context (talking about FIFA available across 12 different platforms) as referring to expanded digital services, rather than actually confirming abandoning singleplayer modes entirely.

Then again, I could be totally wrong and blown away when they announce mages vs Templars competitive deathmatch mode in a few months. Who knows?

[SirGladiator]

If they can make it fun like ME3 did, they'd be crazy 'not' to have multiplayer in DA3. To me the multiplayer is kind've the best part of ME3, what with the crappy endings and all. No crappy endings in multiplayer, just good, clean, bad-guy-blasting fun . Something like that in DA3 is something I would strongly favor.

As for the VAs, nobody's perfect, and no doubt everybody's had good and bad moments. FemShep was a million times better than maleshep, but maybe doing a different character the guy who did maleshep can do well. To be honest, as awesome as Jennifer Hale is, I actually enjoyed certain other female main characters voices even more than hers in SWTOR, so its not like she's automaticly going to be super duper awesome best in the world playing every single type of character. I do hope that whatever role they give the maleshep guy, they give Hale as big or bigger, since she's so much better, but that doesn't mean that I necessarily think she should have the leading role, honestly the Female Jedi Knight voice from SWTOR was maybe the best 'good girl' voice I've ever heard in a game, its all just warmth and sweetness and sunshine and it makes you really feel like you're playing a 'good' character unlike any other voice I've heard, but of course Hale's strength is that she's awesome as a good or bad character, or in between. I'd sure like to have her either as the main character's voice, or the voice of one of the 'good' teammates. In any event, I definitely am looking forward to hearing more about the game, as well as the VAs in it!

[Blackrising]

Man, this topic is dead. In fact, I think I can feel it slowly decaying. (Let's face it, Bioware not giving in and giving us a teaser is probably the best thing they could have done. They've sat back and watched us analyse this thing to death and now nobody is really still talking about it.)

Oh well. Let's discuss something else: According to some folks, the romances in DA 2 sucked. If there was just one thing you could change about that in DA 3, what would it be?
Personally, I'd like to see the jealousy dialouges from DA:O return. My Warden used to flirt with everything on two legs just to get Morrigan's feathers ruffled. It was glorious. And it lends a certain depth to the romances. I thought it was weird in DA 2 that Hawke could flirt with everyone, sleep with Isabela and then romance someone else...and nobody cares. I would have expected some kind of reaction.

And if that doesn't happen, there's just one thing I'd want: The LIs actually caring about the PC. For once, I'd like one of the LIs to sit down for a moment and ask the PC if they're alright. The only time they ever seem to go see the PC is if they have a problem they need solved.
That was one of the thing that always really annoyed me about DA and ME.
DA:O -> The protagonist loses everything they've known (one way or another) and are forcibly thrust into a life they never wanted. Despite having no real experience, they are forced to save the world and possibly sacrifice themselves in the end. Not one of the companions is ever interested in how the PC is feeling.
DA 2 - > It's worse. Protagonist loses everything they've known thanks to the Darkspawn, watches their brother/sister get smashed by an ogre AND gets blames for it by their own mother. The whole responsibility of getting their family out of Lowtown rests on their shoulders. Then their other sibling gets killed/joins the Wardens/joins the Templars/gets taken to the circle and whatever Hawke does, it's still somehow their fault. Hawke basically loses their whole family and other than that pathetic little scene after All That Remains, all the companions seem to care about is their own problems.

And don't even get me started on Mass Effect. I'm still not over that.

[BrookerT]

personally, I loved the DA2 romances, as none of the DAO characters were very interseting. To say its intricate in Origins tto get a romance compared to DA2 is kind of unfair, due to the super easy to raise approval bar. I was romancing Morrigan by Loathering, wheras all the DA2 charcters take time to romance. You can effectively romance Zevran, Morrigan and Alistair within 5 mins by spamming gifts. The Relationship with isabella is complicated also, with "friensds with benefits", "one night stand", "changed by love" and "run away together".

[Acolchack]

My speculation about DA3 final

[Ianamus]

Acolchack wrote...

My speculation about DA3 final

Bioware wouldn't be foolish enough to make the same mistake twice.

In Dragon Age 3 we choose between Yellow, Purple and Brown.

Modifié par EJ107, 07 septembre 2012 - 09:52 .

[Uhh.. Jonah]

I must agree that the Dragon Age 2 romances weren't all that great in comparison to Dragon Age: Origins. They just lacked... everything that made DA:O romances so great and powerful.

In DA:O, when I romanced Alistair, I took my time with the romance- I didn't let it occur until after the third main mission. I got to know him and his awkwardness. As Leliana said, it was endearing. Getting to know him on that level and then finally romancing him, was completely satisfying. It made the relationship more... real, and not forced.
When I romanced Anders, it was completely different. I felt like it was abruptly forced upon me, especially the way Hawke was speaking to him. I think the second conversation I had with him is him stating that he would drown us in blood to keep us safe. Uh, what? The second conversation I had with Alistair was with him describing his childhood with Arl Reamond. If I got to know Anders a bit more, got to know some of his little quirks, have a few flirt lines here and there (nothing official), then I would have been a lot more satisfied with the romance. Instead, I hated it, because I felt like I was forced into a romance just for the sake of it. I sincerely hope the devs think long and hard about how to handle the romance aspect of the Dragon Age 3.

[Renmiri1]

BrookerT wrote...

personally, I loved the DA2 romances, as none of the DAO characters were very interseting. To say its intricate in Origins tto get a romance compared to DA2 is kind of unfair, due to the super easy to raise approval bar. I was romancing Morrigan by Loathering, wheras all the DA2 charcters take time to romance. You can effectively romance Zevran, Morrigan and Alistair within 5 mins by spamming gifts. The Relationship with isabella is complicated also, with "friensds with benefits", "one night stand", "changed by love" and "run away together".

This

I loved that no DA2 romanceable character is perfect.
Romancing Zevran, Alistair, Leliana, Morrigan is just a matter of deciding if you are in the mood for blonde / redhead / brunnette, boy or girl. On DA2 they actually have personalities and make you suffer sometimes. Feels more real

PS: I adore Anders romance. But is not for everyone. He is pretty needy for you. He falls head over heels for your Hawke, the minute you finish the mission with Karl and the Templars. After that you can completely ignore him, treat him like sh*t, romance Isabella / Merril / Fenris, etc.. and he is still carrying a torch for you. He will gladly romance you on the rebound from Fenris or Isabella. I adore his over the top neediness for my Hawke but a lot of people find that a bit offputting.

Yet, even loving you to the point of "drowning us in blood to keep you safe", he still hurts you. To keep you safe, as he said, but he neglected to say he'd do the same to keep mages safe. He keeps you completely out of his mad plan, and offers himself for punishment, without ever bothering to discuss things with you. Was a big shock in my first playthrough, but also made him seem a lot more real than perpetually nice DAO people.

Modifié par Renmiri1, 08 septembre 2012 - 12:00 .

[RobRam10]

I want no teasing romance no Samara/Aveline treatments! Gief me full romance Bioware!

Modifié par RobRam10, 08 septembre 2012 - 06:27 .

[Blackrising]

Renmiri1 wrote...

BrookerT wrote...

personally, I loved the DA2 romances, as none of the DAO characters were very interseting. To say its intricate in Origins tto get a romance compared to DA2 is kind of unfair, due to the super easy to raise approval bar. I was romancing Morrigan by Loathering, wheras all the DA2 charcters take time to romance. You can effectively romance Zevran, Morrigan and Alistair within 5 mins by spamming gifts. The Relationship with isabella is complicated also, with "friensds with benefits", "one night stand", "changed by love" and "run away together".

This

I loved that no DA2 romanceable character is perfect.
Romancing Zevran, Alistair, Leliana, Morrigan is just a matter of deciding if you are in the mood for blonde / redhead / brunnette, boy or girl. On DA2 they actually have personalities and make you suffer sometimes. Feels more real

PS: I adore Anders romance. But is not for everyone. He is pretty needy for you. He falls head over heels for your Hawke, the minute you finish the mission with Karl and the Templars. After that you can completely ignore him, treat him like sh*t, romance Isabella / Merril / Fenris, etc.. and he is still carrying a torch for you. He will gladly romance you on the rebound from Fenris or Isabella. I adore his over the top neediness for my Hawke but a lot of people find that a bit offputting.

Yet, even loving you to the point of "drowning us in blood to keep you safe", he still hurts you. To keep you safe, as he said, but he neglected to say he'd do the same to keep mages safe. He keeps you completely out of his mad plan, and offers himself for punishment, without ever bothering to discuss things with you. Was a big shock in my first playthrough, but also made him seem a lot more real than perpetually nice DAO people.

Are you actually claiming the LIs in DA:O had less personality than the ones in DA 2? O.o
Oh well, it's a matter of preference I guess.
I'm with BrotherWarth on this one. I played DA 2 first, so no one can claim I'm biased. I mean, I loved the romances then and I still ADORE Merrill, but...DA:O was just something entirely different. It took me a while to get used to not having it all laid out before me in the dialouge wheel, but I learned to love it. It was so easy to mess up, especially with Morrigan. I have no idea how often I had to go back to a previous saved game just because I said all the wrong things. And the fact that you can aggravate them so badly is fun. I spent hours just exploring their reactions to what I said and getting to know them.
And it made me feel like I accompished something when I got Morrigan to love me, just as it broke my heart when she left. That was never the case in DA 2.

[Spicen]

Did someone here claim that da2's romance was actually better than DAO's???!!!

[Dagr88]

RobRam10 wrote...

I want no teasing romance no Samara/Aveline treatments! Gief me full romance Bioware!

I don't have anything against your proposal, but every time I hear such suggestions I realize more and more that DA series are actually DateSim.

And about differences between DA:O and DA2:

- If I'm not mistaken those unlimited +5 and one +50 gifts weren't in vanilla version of DA:O. So using them as a cheat and destroying romance pacing is player's choice.

- In DA:O we could talk to characters. Wherever or whenever you want. At camp, in the city or after slaughtering another group of bandits/monsters.
I can't say that DA2 has lesser amount of dialogs but the whole "we can talk only if you have a Check up on Merrill quest or a gift for me" thing is a bit broken.

- (I don't make harems so correct me if I'm wrong) In DA:O after possible romance option has a certain amount of affection towards you s/he like any other human being (which is not doomed to be forever alone because s/he is to shy to ask someone out) will tell you "I like you. Do you like me?"
In DA2 romances are started by "heart" option a.k.a. "would you like to have sex sometime in the near future" or "I give you permission to love me". (I totally forgot that sometimes they do give Hawk some hints "wink-wink" so I take this argument partially back)

- One more reason why I like DA:O's romances over DA2's. It's... trolling:

Morrigan: 'Tis cold in my tent, all alone...
Warden: Then get a thicker blanket.


Leliana: But now it's getting late. I think I might... turn in early. I can't help thinking about how soft and warm my bedroll is.
Warden: You don't want to talk to me anymore?
Leliana: Of course I do. You know I enjoy your company. But... it's getting a little chilly, and I prefer to be in my bedroll.
Warden: Well, I shan't keep you.
Leliana: You know, it'd be nice if you came with me.
Warden: What for?
Leliana: So I can show you my collection of pressed flowers... obviously.
Warden: I didn't know you collected pressed flowers.
Leliana: I... don't. Stop pretending you don't know what I want!
Warden: I have no idea what's going on.
Leliana: Ah, the games you play. Listen, I want to spend the night with you. There. I said it.

Modifié par Dagr88, 08 septembre 2012 - 12:42 .

[Shevy]

DA II romances were pretty boring, only click the heart icon and there you go. And there wasn't any interaction with your LI.
Origins did this much better, like nearly everything else too.
The interesting companions in DA II were those you couldn't romance, Varric and Aveline.

[Cirram55]

Dagr88 wrote...
Morrigan: 'Tis cold in my tent, all alone...
Warden: Then get a thicker blanket.


Leliana: But now it's getting late. I think I might... turn in early. I can't help thinking about how soft and warm my bedroll is.
Warden: You don't want to talk to me anymore?
Leliana: Of course I do. You know I enjoy your company. But... it's getting a little chilly, and I prefer to be in my bedroll.
Warden: Well, I shan't keep you.
Leliana: You know, it'd be nice if you came with me.
Warden: What for?
Leliana: So I can show you my collection of pressed flowers... obviously.
Warden: I didn't know you collected pressed flowers.
Leliana: I... don't. Stop pretending you don't know what I want!
Warden: I have no idea what's going on.
Leliana: Ah, the games you play. Listen, I want to spend the night with you. There. I said it.

Goodness I loved those. With DA2's dialogue system it's nearly impossible to replicate such scenes.

Ah, I miss insulting Alistair. The poor guy just wanted to flirt!

Modifié par Cirram55, 08 septembre 2012 - 02:07 .

[LinksOcarina]

BrotherWarth wrote...

Renmiri1 wrote...

Romancing Zevran, Alistair, Leliana, Morrigan is just a matter of deciding if you are in the mood for blonde / redhead / brunnette, boy or girl. On DA2 they actually have personalities and make you suffer sometimes. Feels more real

That seems more like a complaint of DA2's romances since nothing besides clicking the heart icon is required.
The romance system in DA2 is objectively less complex. There's just less required. But I'm sure a lot of people prefer that. And I'm sure a lot of people agree with you that the romanceable characters in DA2 are more interesting. I disagree, but I like pretty much everything about Origins more.

The problem is you can say the same thing for Origins as well, because the romances were objectively broken due to the way they were set up. There was no subtlety to the complexity when it was a system based on approval only that can be artificially manipulated in five minutes. The only romance that took some doing was Leliana, and even then that was more due to a bug over it being complex (missing a conversation with her) 

Complex or not, the content of the romance is what should matter, and honestly, all nine of the romances are pretty good based on the content and how they can go. 

[jaikss]

I too enjoyed DAO romances quite a bit more than those of DA2.There wasn't really any single big thing in DA2 that didn't work for me,but rather a combination of little things,such as the tone icons which unfortunately felt like "press heart to romance" at times,several year timegaps where social relationships seemed to be on pause (Isabella:Wanna hook up?You do?Great,I'll see you in three years!),aswell as the "conversation quest" system,all of which contributed to the romance arcs feeling a bit ..."gimmicky" compared to DAO.

[Renmiri1]

Weird!

I saw the "heart" icons on DA2 as flirts, not "sex me up NAO" commands. It worked well for me. I flirted pretty much with anyone, even Aveline. She wasn't offended , she thought it was "sweet".

My comment about DAO is that all romances are bland and essentially the same. Alistair ? sweet, loves you, no conflict. Leliana ? sweet, loves you, no conflict. Zevran ? Sweet, loves you, no conflict. Morrigan is the only one that gives you a bit of heartache with her leaving.
Getting them to love you takes a bit more effort than DA2 because you have to pick dialogs blindly.. or just buy them a  gift. But after you get them to love you ? No challenge in there.

True, the opportunity to use those sex mods and kiss mods or even the vanilla "click to kiss" was fun but I didn't really need it. I can headcanon steamy scenes just fine.( And Anders kiss is one of the most romantic VG kisses ever!). I would have liked more dialog on DA2 so I concede this point. The interaction with your LI was much easier and faster on DAO. But.. so bland.. I still prefer less dialog, more intensity on DA2. Is just my opinion of course.

DA2 romanced LI leave you, betray you, tug at your heartstrings. They feel a lot more real to me. Alistair is my LI on DAO and is a very sweet romance but it is so Mary & Gary Sue it is painful! Gives me diabetes!

Modifié par Renmiri1, 08 septembre 2012 - 05:39 .

[Dagr88]

Yes, I know it's from Aprill, but maybe some new members on the forum (like myself) might like to see it.

Contains some DA2 spoilers.



(Bioware's Dragon Age team answers all your questions in Part 2 of this PAX East 2012 Panel)


Some hints that were given:

- DA:O Warden if s/he alive is unlikeable cameo since it's very difficult to implement her/him (Voice, Looks, Par/Reg nature). Nothing beats 5 years of headcanoning.

- Choosing your specialization will somewhat effect the story. My guess is that it will be like choosing an origin for your Warden. If the specialization is unlocked only halfway through the game it'll somewhat diminishes its importance. So my guess: one race, but many (somewhat) different backgrounds.

Modifié par Dagr88, 09 septembre 2012 - 08:57 .

[Jerrybnsn]

The heart icon in the DA2 dialogue did make the romancing just a click of a button like the Sims. Selecting certain responses in Origins without icons made romancing more natural.