182 réponses à ce sujet

[CivvieWarrior20]

KalilKareem wrote...

The question is easily reversed: Why do you care if a weapon or power is nerfed?

Because this is a co-operative game, not a game against your fellow players.

The teams success is your success.

If you applied the same logic to other activities, such as a 4 man relay race, are you going to ask for the number 3 runner to carry a breeze block because he can run faster than you?

[ME3 Fury]

classes/Weapons etc need to be balanced between 4 difficulty levels, which I disagree with, but that's the way it is. Most people play Silver/Bronze difficulties AND don't frequent ths board.

With that said, let's take the Pirahna for example. Would I, as a Bronze only player, appreciate or have fun when some level 20 Inf and his Pirahna X comes in and decimates everything?? No. Then I'm not having fun. Easy credits and XP you say? Sure, but I didn't buy the game to have someone else play for me. I bought it for MY enjoyment too.

So now to fix that, it gets nerfed so it not as OP (yeah right) on Bronze, but yet still useable on Platinum. As far as I'm concerned, platinum and gold, weapons should BARELY be viable so you get the challenge of the higher difficulties. Not some OP weapon to score an easy victory.

[Spirit Keeper]

CivvieWarrior20 wrote...

KalilKareem wrote...

The question is easily reversed: Why do you care if a weapon or power is nerfed?

Because this is a co-operative game, not a game against your fellow players.

The teams success is your success.

If you applied the same logic to other activities, such as a 4 man relay race, are you going to ask for the number 3 runner to carry a breeze block because he can run faster than you?

Exactly, some people just don't seem to get that.

[Lunaticsmith]

CivvieWarrior20 wrote...

KalilKareem wrote...

The question is easily reversed: Why do you care if a weapon or power is nerfed?

Because this is a co-operative game, not a game against your fellow players.

The teams success is your success.

If you applied the same logic to other activities, such as a 4 man relay race, are you going to ask for the number 3 runner to carry a breeze block because he can run faster than you?

However this is a game, games are meant to be fun. If your team can achieve success with 100% certainty its not fun, also knowing that there is easy win button makes playing with not so great setups frustrating and takes away enjoyment for unlocking and achieving.  

[CivvieWarrior20]

ME3 Fury wrote...

classes/Weapons etc need to be balanced between 4 difficulty levels, which I disagree with, but that's the way it is. Most people play Silver/Bronze difficulties AND don't frequent ths board.

With that said, let's take the Pirahna for example. Would I, as a Bronze only player, appreciate or have fun when some level 20 Inf and his Pirahna X comes in and decimates everything?? No. Then I'm not having fun. Easy credits and XP you say? Sure, but I didn't buy the game to have someone else play for me. I bought it for MY enjoyment too.

So now to fix that, it gets nerfed so it not as OP (yeah right) on Bronze, but yet still useable on Platinum. As far as I'm concerned, platinum and gold, weapons should BARELY be viable so you get the challenge of the higher difficulties. Not some OP weapon to score an easy victory.

Blame the level 20 Inf with his Pirahana X for farming Bronze.

[Imp of the Perverse]

L-train32 wrote...

KalilKareem wrote...

L-train32 wrote...

Lathrim wrote...

<_

Yes, logical and clear arguments can be annoying at times, in particuar when you have none of your own. 

I'm not gonna even try to explain because u people will just come up with more unreasonable arguments. All I'll say is that nerfing takes away fun from the game. It's definitely more fun succeeding than failing. That should be obvious.

If all you care about is succeeding and being powerful, play bronze.

[CivvieWarrior20]

Lunaticsmith wrote...

CivvieWarrior20 wrote...

KalilKareem wrote...

The question is easily reversed: Why do you care if a weapon or power is nerfed?

Because this is a co-operative game, not a game against your fellow players.

The teams success is your success.

If you applied the same logic to other activities, such as a 4 man relay race, are you going to ask for the number 3 runner to carry a breeze block because he can run faster than you?

However this is a game, games are meant to be fun. If your team can achieve success with 100% certainty its not fun, also knowing that there is easy win button makes playing with not so great setups frustrating and takes away enjoyment for unlocking and achieving.  

Name one weapon that is 100% guarnteed to win 100% of games....Maybe if you're a world class player using a tried and tested build with a maxed gun and maxed on mods.....on Bronze, then yeah you have a point.

[jakenou]

MoirDing wrote...

Also, using the kryase as an example, what if it was buffed moar? People with that abomination of a gun would have 95% of the kills, leaving those without it standing there, just waiting for extraction because it's no use at all to even draw a gun, leeching until the 700th PSP will give them Kryase I.

Or they just quit.

This is what I think is the most valid reason for nerfing, but at the same time I think that the algorithym of the random items given in packs from the store was poorly engineered. If anything, they should be spending just as much time "balancing" the store as they do with powers and weapons. If we have feedback data turned on, it should be telling the store things about what weapons and powers we use, so after my 700th PSP I don't end up with all the heavy pistols in the game maxxed to lvl X, when I never, not once, have equipped a pistol on any of my characters (example). Was I jealous of people with a Pirhana X? Heck yes! Sure, nerf it a little, but at the same time give it some sort of higher rate of being distributed to people who buy PSPs so more people have it, and more people have it leveled up.

[LiarasShield]

Imp of the Perverse wrote...

L-train32 wrote...

KalilKareem wrote...

L-train32 wrote...

Lathrim wrote...

<_

Yes, logical and clear arguments can be annoying at times, in particuar when you have none of your own. 

I'm not gonna even try to explain because u people will just come up with more unreasonable arguments. All I'll say is that nerfing takes away fun from the game. It's definitely more fun succeeding than failing. That should be obvious.

If all you care about is succeeding and being powerful, play bronze.

You keep proving that you haven't played any co op games other then this one and that the goal of a co op team if for the players or the items they use to get better with progression to increase their chance of survival mass effect is not call of duty so please don't apply that logic here

Also certain weapons or abilities shouldn't be nerfed or rebalanced into the ground or the dirt not if the players have played for weeks on end working hard to earn them in the first place it keeps destroying the whole point of earning them in the first place

Modifié par LiarasShield, 16 août 2012 - 02:22 .

[Spirit Keeper]

Lunaticsmith wrote...

CivvieWarrior20 wrote...

KalilKareem wrote...

The question is easily reversed: Why do you care if a weapon or power is nerfed?

Because this is a co-operative game, not a game against your fellow players.

The teams success is your success.

If you applied the same logic to other activities, such as a 4 man relay race, are you going to ask for the number 3 runner to carry a breeze block because he can run faster than you?

However this is a game, games are meant to be fun. If your team can achieve success with 100% certainty its not fun, also knowing that there is easy win button makes playing with not so great setups frustrating and takes away enjoyment for unlocking and achieving.  

'Easy win button' is going waaay to far. It's only easy on bronze and a lesser extent on silver. Gold and Platinum are challanging. If you can finish it no problem then good for you.

Besides fun is objective. What one person finds fun may not be fun to someone else.

[Lunaticsmith]

CivvieWarrior20 wrote...

Lunaticsmith wrote...

CivvieWarrior20 wrote...

KalilKareem wrote...

The question is easily reversed: Why do you care if a weapon or power is nerfed?

Because this is a co-operative game, not a game against your fellow players.

The teams success is your success.

If you applied the same logic to other activities, such as a 4 man relay race, are you going to ask for the number 3 runner to carry a breeze block because he can run faster than you?

However this is a game, games are meant to be fun. If your team can achieve success with 100% certainty its not fun, also knowing that there is easy win button makes playing with not so great setups frustrating and takes away enjoyment for unlocking and achieving.  

Name one weapon that is 100% guarnteed to win 100% of games....Maybe if you're a world class player using a tried and tested build with a maxed gun and maxed on mods.....on Bronze, then yeah you have a point.

Well it is clear that 100% was an overstatement but still certain weapons like krysae and piranha did make the game success rate too high even if used by me. You don't have to be world class player with best setup to achieve good success rate even on gold/plat with prenerf kryasae / piranha. The constant success takes away the true feeling of success in my opinion.

[Imp of the Perverse]

LiarasShield wrote...

Imp of the Perverse wrote...

L-train32 wrote...

KalilKareem wrote...

L-train32 wrote...

Lathrim wrote...

<_

Yes, logical and clear arguments can be annoying at times, in particuar when you have none of your own. 

I'm not gonna even try to explain because u people will just come up with more unreasonable arguments. All I'll say is that nerfing takes away fun from the game. It's definitely more fun succeeding than failing. That should be obvious.

If all you care about is succeeding and being powerful, play bronze.

You keep proving that you haven't played any co op games other then this one and that the goal of a co op team if for the players or the items they use to get better with progression to increase their chance of survival mass effect is not call of duty so please don't apply that logic here

That seems to be one long, largely incomprehensible sentence so I'm not sure how to argue with it. Maybe I'm just tired. I have never played call of duty though, and as far as coop games go two that come to mind are Halo and Borderlands.  

[WizeMan305]

Because rocket glitching would be fine if there was no restriction on power that can be put in players hands. I played a silver match with a friend, and a couple of her friends and well I had made on of the players annoyed to the point they stopped playing for the day. I was an N7 Fury against cerb first place with double the score of anyone else. It made him feel useless. If a good weapon and good class is put in the hands of a good player it makes the game feel stale for other players.

Nerfs aren't the only side to the balance coin. There are buffs as well, making weaker class and skills more useful. Hurricane, Incinerate, Arc Pistol, Viper, Krogan defensive abilities, Pull, and the Human engineer all received huge buffs.

Having the same class and same gun making it into every game gets old fast. Before the Infiltrator nerf in every silver or gold match there was atleast two infiltrators. Before the Typhoon change anyone that had the destroyer brought that into the match. What helps the team now hurts the game in the long run because playing the same class with the same weapon gets old, and even though people could switch it up the majority of players won't like playing anything else but the most powerful classes.

[UKStory135]

PC Claymore users get butthurt anytime that there is a slight chance that a player with any skill can out DPS their precious claymore in any specific situation. I agree there needs to be balance in video games, but I find the nerfers to be disingenuous.

[L-train32]

Actually I've discovered something. PC players are really the only ones who call for nerfs. They probably get bored not because weapons are op but because playing on pc is just so boring. They think making the game harder will make it more fun but it doesn't and they just can't see it. That why they keep calling for nerfs hoping it will make the game more fun.

[IscariotsAngel]

Balanced games have more variety. If there's one way to do it that is obviously better than all others, everyone gravitates to it and you don't see the same type of creativity in the player base. It's also not much fun to walk around staying true to the playstyle you like whilst others stomp around like untouchable gods.

The most boring match I ever had was with a geth infiltrator with krysae. It didn't even feel like a game. It wasn't us against incredible odds forced to work as a team. It was me witnessing how much someone could work the stats if they put their head to it.

I don't want any build to be so powerful that it takes away the thrill of the challenge from everyone else.

[ME3 Fury]

SovereignSRV wrote...

Lunaticsmith wrote...

CivvieWarrior20 wrote...

KalilKareem wrote...

The question is easily reversed: Why do you care if a weapon or power is nerfed?

Because this is a co-operative game, not a game against your fellow players.

The teams success is your success.

If you applied the same logic to other activities, such as a 4 man relay race, are you going to ask for the number 3 runner to carry a breeze block because he can run faster than you?

However this is a game, games are meant to be fun. If your team can achieve success with 100% certainty its not fun, also knowing that there is easy win button makes playing with not so great setups frustrating and takes away enjoyment for unlocking and achieving.  

'Easy win button' is going waaay to far. It's only easy on bronze and a lesser extent on silver. Gold and Platinum are challanging. If you can finish it no problem then good for you.

Besides fun is objective. What one person finds fun may not be fun to someone else.

Right. Fun is subjective. But you and the OP seem to think you should push the way you have fun on the rest of us. IE, STFU and take your easy credits and XP and victory.

Sorry, but my kind of fun is 'trying' to achieve victory as a team. If I won everytime, this game would just suck wind.

[CapnManx]

Imagine, for a moment, that you could have an equal amount of fun with every gun or class; not just the favourite of the month. Picture it.

That's why.

Personally, I'd rather they spent less time nerfing the best guns, and more time buffing the others; then buff the enemies a bit if it's sucked out all the challenge. The end result would be exactly the same; but at least people would complain about it less.

[LiarasShield]

Imp of the Perverse wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

Imp of the Perverse wrote...

L-train32 wrote...

KalilKareem wrote...

L-train32 wrote...

Lathrim wrote...

<_

Yes, logical and clear arguments can be annoying at times, in particuar when you have none of your own. 

I'm not gonna even try to explain because u people will just come up with more unreasonable arguments. All I'll say is that nerfing takes away fun from the game. It's definitely more fun succeeding than failing. That should be obvious.

If all you care about is succeeding and being powerful, play bronze.

You keep proving that you haven't played any co op games other then this one and that the goal of a co op team if for the players or the items they use to get better with progression to increase their chance of survival mass effect is not call of duty so please don't apply that logic here

That seems to be one long, largely incomprehensible sentence so I'm not sure how to argue with it. Maybe I'm just tired. I have never played call of duty though, and as far as coop games go two that come to mind are Halo and Borderlands.  

And out of those two games that you mentioned did they do endless rebalances or nerf abilities or powers from long term players gaining them from level progression?

[skiadopsendow]

Balancing is necessary, nerfing to death is not.

[tetsutsuru]

SovereignSRV wrote...

Lunaticsmith wrote...

CivvieWarrior20 wrote...

KalilKareem wrote...

The question is easily reversed: Why do you care if a weapon or power is nerfed?

Because this is a co-operative game, not a game against your fellow players.

The teams success is your success.

If you applied the same logic to other activities, such as a 4 man relay race, are you going to ask for the number 3 runner to carry a breeze block because he can run faster than you?

However this is a game, games are meant to be fun. If your team can achieve success with 100% certainty its not fun, also knowing that there is easy win button makes playing with not so great setups frustrating and takes away enjoyment for unlocking and achieving.  

'Easy win button' is going waaay to far. It's only easy on bronze and a lesser extent on silver. Gold and Platinum are challanging. If you can finish it no problem then good for you.

Besides fun is objective. What one person finds fun may not be fun to someone else.

You mean, "subjective".

[Spirit Keeper]

Lunaticsmith wrote...

CivvieWarrior20 wrote...

Lunaticsmith wrote...

CivvieWarrior20 wrote...

KalilKareem wrote...

The question is easily reversed: Why do you care if a weapon or power is nerfed?

Because this is a co-operative game, not a game against your fellow players.

The teams success is your success.

If you applied the same logic to other activities, such as a 4 man relay race, are you going to ask for the number 3 runner to carry a breeze block because he can run faster than you?

However this is a game, games are meant to be fun. If your team can achieve success with 100% certainty its not fun, also knowing that there is easy win button makes playing with not so great setups frustrating and takes away enjoyment for unlocking and achieving.  

Name one weapon that is 100% guarnteed to win 100% of games....Maybe if you're a world class player using a tried and tested build with a maxed gun and maxed on mods.....on Bronze, then yeah you have a point.

Well it is clear that 100% was an overstatement but still certain weapons like krysae and piranha did make the game success rate too high even if used by me. You don't have to be world class player with best setup to achieve good success rate even on gold/plat with prenerf kryasae / piranha. The constant success takes away the true feeling of success in my opinion.

It's not like carrying the Piranha grants you invincibility, you are no less resistant fron being downed or killed. The piranha is a close range weapon that takes serveral reloads before killing tougher enemies like the banshees. Honestly it seems like the people calling for nerfs won't be happy unless everything only does 0.000000000001 points of damage.

If you don't like things the way they are then leave matches when people use those weapons or let together a list of people who feel the same way as you and play with them. Everyone wins.