503 réponses à ce sujet

[AresKeith]

Everything in Mass Effect has be explained into its lore, while the endings completely shatters Suspension of disbelief and goes into Fantasy world

[Tealjaker94]

JC_aka_fps_john wrote...

o Ventus wrote...

JC_aka_fps_john wrote...

"Element zero is a material that, when subjected to an electrical current, releases dark energy which can raise or lower the mass of matter. A positive current increases mass, a negative current decreases it"


That isn't an explanation. It's a black box of science designed to allow something inexplicable that defies the laws of science as we know them (i.e. space magic).



Which I'm fine with, that's why I like science fiction. What annoys me is how selective people are being about this. It's all space magic, accept it.

You know eezo is based on actual theoretical physics, right?

The idea of dark energy is, albeit with a lot of creative license. Eezo is purely fictional

The graviton is a theoretical particle which applies the property of mass to all objects. Theoretically, influencing gravitons would allow you to increase or reduce the mass of objects. 

[Xellith]

While Eezo is fictional - it DOES have a pseudoscientific explanation for the way it works. Synthesis is a green wave of energy that SOMEHOW can transform organic material into something Biosynthetic while at the same time being able to distinguish from synthetics and simple objects like ship bulkheads. Not to mention the catalysts description of it which is to say "magic". "Your escence. The thing that makes you who and what you are. Will be absorbed and then sent out" among other drivel.

Take EDI for example. EDI controls the EDI bot remotely. How is the EDI bot now "alive?" Did this green wave also transfer her mind to this new bot? As far as Im aware her servers are all green yet she is still in the servers and is in no way the EDI bot. Its silly.

I personally can suspend my disbelief in Eezo. I cannot suspend my disbelief with some green magic wave.

Thats the difference. Pseudo scientific explanations are enough for people to suspend their disbelief and just roll with it. Synthesis offers NOTHING that falls in line with the rest of the lore and fails to give any pseudo scientific explanation for the capabilities of synthesis itself.

Modifié par Xellith, 16 août 2012 - 09:38 .

[Reorte]

It's been explained in enough posts but I'll chip in anway.

Every fictional universe, be it sci-fi or fantasy, has to establish its rules fairly early on and live with them. Any work of fiction that resorts to "anything at all is possible" has failed. Obviously when we're moving into fantasy and everything beyond the hardest science fiction there has to be some departure from reality - ideally it should be the minimum possible to get the fictional universe running and from then on the author should do his best to stick rigidly to what's possible within known reality, his new exceptions, and whatever logical conclusions can be drawn from those. Straying beyond that chucks us into "anything is possible" which is a huge disaster for storytelling and demonstrates a massive lack of imagination and ability in the author (and anyone who accepts it).

How far beyond reality you can get away with in your initial exceptions is largely a matter of personal taste (and to a fairly large degree conventions that we're used to, e.g. FTL travel and weird asari mind powers).

[Bill Casey]

JC_aka_fps_john wrote...

It's science fiction. Science fiction is space magic.

Get over it.

"From very early on we wanted the science of the universe to be plausible. Obviously it's set in the future so you have to make some leaps of faith but we didn't want it to be just magic in space."

- Mac Walters

Modifié par Bill Casey, 16 août 2012 - 09:50 .

[ZajoE38]

Trolls play/watch/read sci-fi on their own risk. No one was trolling like this when a Star Wars lightsabers could physically parry. Jedi powers seems like magic compared to biotics and yet you are still complaining. To me, synthesis isn't so big space magic. Brain neurons have it's own unique algorythms, it can process, learn and analyze. So does the AI. You "can" combine those algorythms and processes to create unique pattern. Hardware (body) is irrelevant.. doesn't matter what molecular stucture or shape it has, as long as the software can run on it. In ME1 and 2, no one was upset about this, yet they knew that this is how Reapers live.

[o Ventus]

ZajoE38 wrote...

Trolls play/watch/read sci-fi on their own risk. No one was trolling like this when a Star Wars lightsabers could physically parry. Jedi powers seems like magic compared to biotics and yet you are still complaining. To me, synthesis isn't so big space magic. Brain neurons have it's own unique algorythms, it can process, learn and analyze. So does the AI. You "can" combine those algorythms and processes to create unique pattern. Hardware (body) is irrelevant.. doesn't matter what molecular stucture or shape it has, as long as the software can run on it. In ME1 and 2, no one was upset about this, yet they knew that this is how Reapers live.

You're missing the point.

By a very large margin, I might add.

[Mazebook]

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Arthur C. Clarke, "Profiles of The Future", 1961 (Clarke's third law)
English physicist & science fiction author

[ZajoE38]

Correct me. I am open to constructive opinions.

[blueumi]

it was the fact that they put this really important and lame charector in the game in the very last part on top of that the last moments of the game are nothing like the rest of the entire series and that is why

star child is the reason he is out of place and just sucks

[o Ventus]

maaaze wrote...

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Arthur C. Clarke, "Profiles of The Future", 1961 (Clarke's third law)
English physicist & science fiction author

Don't worry. Clarke is wrong too.

http://www.merriam-w...ictionary/magic

Modifié par o Ventus, 16 août 2012 - 10:42 .

[Tealjaker94]

ZajoE38 wrote...

Trolls play/watch/read sci-fi on their own risk. No one was trolling like this when a Star Wars lightsabers could physically parry. Jedi powers seems like magic compared to biotics and yet you are still complaining. To me, synthesis isn't so big space magic. Brain neurons have it's own unique algorythms, it can process, learn and analyze. So does the AI. You "can" combine those algorythms and processes to create unique pattern. Hardware (body) is irrelevant.. doesn't matter what molecular stucture or shape it has, as long as the software can run on it. In ME1 and 2, no one was upset about this, yet they knew that this is how Reapers live.

George Lucas didn't have scientific plausibility as a goal. The one time he did try to explain the force, it was absolutely terrible. Mass Effect has always tried to stick with more grounded science. See the quote below.

Bill Casey wrote...

"From very early on we wanted the science of the universe to be plausible. Obviously it's set in the future so you have to make some leaps of faith but we didn't want it to be just magic in space."

- Mac Walters

[UniqueName001]

JC_aka_fps_john wrote...

It's science fiction. Science fiction is space magic.

Get over it.

So what you are saying is, that you would have no problem with any of the following endings:

The Normandy was secretly a transformer and turns into a giant robot with a laser sword and kills all of the Reapers

Liara finds an ancient tiara which turns her into Sailor Thessia and she defeats the Reapers with the power of "love"

The entire series turns out to be a dream by the last existing human in his suspended animation sleeper pod launched from Earth during the green goo cataclysm

[Tealjaker94]

UniqueName001 wrote...

JC_aka_fps_john wrote...

It's science fiction. Science fiction is space magic.

Get over it.

So what you are saying is, that you would have no problem with any of the following endings:

The Normandy was secretly a transformer and turns into a giant robot with a laser sword and kills all of the Reapers

Liara finds an ancient tiara which turns her into Sailor Thessia and she defeats the Reapers with the power of "love"

The entire series turns out to be a dream by the last existing human in his suspended animation sleeper pod launched from Earth during the green goo cataclysm

Shepard is Keyser Soze. 

[UniqueName001]

maaaze wrote...

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Arthur C. Clarke, "Profiles of The Future", 1961 (Clarke's third law)
English physicist & science fiction author

OK, ignoring the fact this this quote is not the argument-ending weapon so many people seem to think it is, I'll play devil's advocate and assume that the Reapers do have some "sufficiently advanced technology" that allows for the synthesis ending.

If they have that unexplainable level of technological advancement: 

Why wasn't it used earlier
Why have a cycle at all, when they could wipe out all advanced organics with a "black" energy explosion

[UniqueName001]

Tealjaker94 wrote...

Shepard is Keyser Soze.

Heheh, perfect.

Modifié par UniqueName001, 16 août 2012 - 10:45 .

[Mazebook]

o Ventus wrote...

maaaze wrote...

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Arthur C. Clarke, "Profiles of The Future", 1961 (Clarke's third law)
English physicist & science fiction author

Don't worry. Clarke is wrong too.

http://www.merriam-w...ictionary/magic

:huh:How does the definition and the statement contradict each other?

Modifié par maaaze, 16 août 2012 - 10:49 .

[Father_Jerusalem]

UniqueName001 wrote...

JC_aka_fps_john wrote...

It's science fiction. Science fiction is space magic.

Get over it.

So what you are saying is, that you would have no problem with any of the following endings:

The Normandy was secretly a transformer and turns into a giant robot with a laser sword and kills all of the Reapers

Liara finds an ancient tiara which turns her into Sailor Thessia and she defeats the Reapers with the power of "love"

The entire series turns out to be a dream by the last existing human in his suspended animation sleeper pod launched from Earth during the green goo cataclysm

Well the first two would be copyright infringement, so...

[o Ventus]

maaaze wrote...

o Ventus wrote...

maaaze wrote...

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Arthur C. Clarke, "Profiles of The Future", 1961 (Clarke's third law)
English physicist & science fiction author

Don't worry. Clarke is wrong too.

http://www.merriam-w...ictionary/magic

:huh:How does the definition and the statement contradict each other?

Because technology, by definition, cannot be magic, or likened to magic (in a traditional sense).

[Father_Jerusalem]

o Ventus wrote...

maaaze wrote...

o Ventus wrote...

maaaze wrote...

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Arthur C. Clarke, "Profiles of The Future", 1961 (Clarke's third law)
English physicist & science fiction author

Don't worry. Clarke is wrong too.

http://www.merriam-w...ictionary/magic

:huh:How does the definition and the statement contradict each other?

Because technology, by definition, cannot be magic, or likened to magic (in a traditional sense).

If you took a zippo lighter back to the stone age, they'd think you were a sorcerer. And zippos aren't all that advanced.

[Tealjaker94]

maaaze wrote...

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Arthur C. Clarke, "Profiles of The Future", 1961 (Clarke's third law)
English physicist & science fiction author

Ah yes. This quote again. You can always say we're just too primitive to understand it. That is absolutely terrible storytelling. I don't recall finding anything in 2001 anywhere near as ridiculous as synthesis.

[Mazebook]

o Ventus wrote...

maaaze wrote...

o Ventus wrote...

maaaze wrote...

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Arthur C. Clarke, "Profiles of The Future", 1961 (Clarke's third law)
English physicist & science fiction author

Don't worry. Clarke is wrong too.

http://www.merriam-w...ictionary/magic

:huh:How does the definition and the statement contradict each other?

Because technology, by definition, cannot be magic, or likened to magic (in a traditional sense).

he says 
indistinguishable...meaning you can not attribute the effects of the Technologie to it´s source.
The more advanced something is the more it becomes unrelated to your known world.
It seems like magic to you because the concept on which the Technologie is based of is completely alien to you.

[Mazebook]

Tealjaker94 wrote...

maaaze wrote...

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Arthur C. Clarke, "Profiles of The Future", 1961 (Clarke's third law)
English physicist & science fiction author

Ah yes. This quote again. You can always say we're just too primitive to understand it. That is absolutely terrible storytelling. I don't recall finding anything in 2001 anywhere near as ridiculous as synthesis.

opinions...opinions...

I have also one...Techno babble is the least interessting part of Sci-Fi. The less the better. Good Sci-Fi was always about "what if we could do this...?" and not about "how we could do this...!"

[o Ventus]

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

o Ventus wrote...

maaaze wrote...

o Ventus wrote...

maaaze wrote...

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Arthur C. Clarke, "Profiles of The Future", 1961 (Clarke's third law)
English physicist & science fiction author

Don't worry. Clarke is wrong too.

http://www.merriam-w...ictionary/magic

:huh:How does the definition and the statement contradict each other?

Because technology, by definition, cannot be magic, or likened to magic (in a traditional sense).

If you took a zippo lighter back to the stone age, they'd think you were a sorcerer. And zippos aren't all that advanced.

Yeah, and if you told people how it worked, they would go "Oh, I think I understand now".