215 réponses à ce sujet

[Javo2357]

Gamemako wrote...

I can post video of it dealing considerable damage against a Gold Atlas (all shields and half armor in one clip). The observed DPS out of that is pretty damn impressive: it delivers over 4000 DPS to that Atlas. A Revenant in the same situation will put out around 2000 DPS.

I can also post video of it leaving 2 bars of shield on a Silver Atlas after all 180 rounds. I observe a 140% difference in per-round damage where a 50% difference should have been observed (difference in additive bonuses). So yeah, it's really, really broken. I can also produce video of the gun with an AP mod getting awful damage against armor on Silver. Through all the testing, it's damn hard to figure out even what's supposed to happen.

Gamemako, when have you observed that there are huge discrepancies in the intended DPS for the Typhoon? Do you know atm if it's a different class that causes it to bug out? Or when ammo powers are just applied, or does the DPS just randomly change from match to match?

[Gamemako]

Javo2357 wrote...

Gamemako, when have you observed that there are huge discrepancies in the intended DPS for the Typhoon? Do you know atm if it's a different class that causes it to bug out? Or when ammo powers are just applied, or does the DPS just randomly change from match to match?

I have tried several different classes along with a bunch of mods. Here's what I know:

-The gun starts off at 250RPM (not sure about ROF bonuses, but they should be included)
-After 0.75s (base time -- game is sped up by 7.5% on Gold and Plat), the gun switches over to rapid-fire mode.
-Rapid-fire mode is supposed to fire 650 rounds per minute. This is an immediate switch-over, not a gradual ramp-up.
-In reality, your ROF is keyed to frame updates. As a result, you'll likely get only 600RPM (as observed in 30FPS video). The same thing happens with the Revenant.
-If you have over a 38% higher ROF than base (including the 5% gamespeed increase for Silver or 7.5% for Gold/Plat), the gun will effectively switch over to 900 RPM.
-Once in rapid-fire mode, it is supposed to get a 1.5x damage multiplier. I have been using the assumption that it works that way in my calculations, but it is essentially impossible to know how it switches over.
-Once in rapid-fire mode, 2 ammo are consumed per "shot". I do not know whether this is firing 2 shots, getting damage for both, or firing 1 shot at double cost, though I am leaning toward double cost at this point. Eric didn't answer my PM on the matter.

I originally started by counting every bullet. If the gun is firing at double cost, that is incorrect. However, the damage in some cases is much higher than should be seen if the gun is firing that way. Similarly, if it's firing 2 shots, then the total damage is too high for what is observed in other cases. It's a no-win situation. That's why I'm currently persuing the hypothesis that it is double-applying weapon bonus. That seems like the most plausible way forward at this point because it allows for the existence of the lower damage numbers as well as the higher damage numbers. Figuring it out either way is not exactly easy.

PKTracer wrote...

All of them, if possible? I know that's asking a lot, and for a game too, so emphasis on the *if possible.* While you're probably right that BW doesn't care, these videos would be very informative. Since BW refuses to create a site with all known bugs, players who can document them at least let us, the player base, know about them.

I'll upload a few, but it will take a while.

//EDIT: Krogan Sentinel vs. Silver Atlas. Will add more later.

Modifié par Gamemako, 19 août 2012 - 12:48 .

[Javo2357]

Gamemako wrote...

Javo2357 wrote...

Gamemako, when have you observed that there are huge discrepancies in the intended DPS for the Typhoon? Do you know atm if it's a different class that causes it to bug out? Or when ammo powers are just applied, or does the DPS just randomly change from match to match?

I have tried several different classes along with a bunch of mods. Here's what I know:

-The gun starts off at 250RPM (not sure about ROF bonuses, but they should be included)
-After 0.75s (base time -- game is sped up by 7.5% on Gold and Plat), the gun switches over to rapid-fire mode.
-Rapid-fire mode is supposed to fire 650 rounds per minute. This is an immediate switch-over, not a gradual ramp-up.
-In reality, your ROF is keyed to frame updates. As a result, you'll likely get only 600RPM (as observed in 30FPS video). The same thing happens with the Revenant.
-If you have over a 38% higher ROF than base (including the 5% gamespeed increase for Silver or 7.5% for Gold/Plat), the gun will effectively switch over to 900 RPM.
-Once in rapid-fire mode, it is supposed to get a 1.5x damage multiplier. I have been using the assumption that it works that way in my calculations, but it is essentially impossible to know how it switches over.
-Once in rapid-fire mode, 2 ammo are consumed per "shot". I do not know whether this is firing 2 shots, getting damage for both, or firing 1 shot at double cost, though I am leaning toward double cost at this point. Eric didn't answer my PM on the matter.

I originally started by counting every bullet. If the gun is firing at double cost, that is incorrect. However, the damage in some cases is much higher than should be seen if the gun is firing that way. Similarly, if it's firing 2 shots, then the total damage is too high for what is observed in other cases. It's a no-win situation. That's why I'm currently persuing the hypothesis that it is double-applying weapon bonus. That seems like the most plausible way forward at this point because it allows for the existence of the lower damage numbers as well as the higher damage numbers. Figuring it out either way is not exactly easy.

PKTracer wrote...

All of them, if possible? I know that's asking a lot, and for a game too, so emphasis on the *if possible.* While you're probably right that BW doesn't care, these videos would be very informative. Since BW refuses to create a site with all known bugs, players who can document them at least let us, the player base, know about them.

I'll upload a few, but it will take a while.

//EDIT: Krogan Sentinel vs. Silver Atlas. Will add more later.

Wow, I really hope BW decides to shed some light on the mechanics or at least acknowlede that it's bugged later on. Thanks for all the info. 

[ryoldschool]

Javo2357 wrote...

Gamemako wrote...

Javo2357 wrote...

Gamemako, when have you observed that there are huge discrepancies in the intended DPS for the Typhoon? Do you know atm if it's a different class that causes it to bug out? Or when ammo powers are just applied, or does the DPS just randomly change from match to match?

I have tried several different classes along with a bunch of mods. Here's what I know:

-The gun starts off at 250RPM (not sure about ROF bonuses, but they should be included)
-After 0.75s (base time -- game is sped up by 7.5% on Gold and Plat), the gun switches over to rapid-fire mode.
-Rapid-fire mode is supposed to fire 650 rounds per minute. This is an immediate switch-over, not a gradual ramp-up.
-In reality, your ROF is keyed to frame updates. As a result, you'll likely get only 600RPM (as observed in 30FPS video). The same thing happens with the Revenant.
-If you have over a 38% higher ROF than base (including the 5% gamespeed increase for Silver or 7.5% for Gold/Plat), the gun will effectively switch over to 900 RPM.
-Once in rapid-fire mode, it is supposed to get a 1.5x damage multiplier. I have been using the assumption that it works that way in my calculations, but it is essentially impossible to know how it switches over.
-Once in rapid-fire mode, 2 ammo are consumed per "shot". I do not know whether this is firing 2 shots, getting damage for both, or firing 1 shot at double cost, though I am leaning toward double cost at this point. Eric didn't answer my PM on the matter.

I originally started by counting every bullet. If the gun is firing at double cost, that is incorrect. However, the damage in some cases is much higher than should be seen if the gun is firing that way. Similarly, if it's firing 2 shots, then the total damage is too high for what is observed in other cases. It's a no-win situation. That's why I'm currently persuing the hypothesis that it is double-applying weapon bonus. That seems like the most plausible way forward at this point because it allows for the existence of the lower damage numbers as well as the higher damage numbers. Figuring it out either way is not exactly easy.

PKTracer wrote...

All of them, if possible? I know that's asking a lot, and for a game too, so emphasis on the *if possible.* While you're probably right that BW doesn't care, these videos would be very informative. Since BW refuses to create a site with all known bugs, players who can document them at least let us, the player base, know about them.

I'll upload a few, but it will take a while.

//EDIT: Krogan Sentinel vs. Silver Atlas. Will add more later.

Wow, I really hope BW decides to shed some light on the mechanics or at least acknowlede that it's bugged later on. Thanks for all the info. 

I also say wow!  What the Hell.  You fired an entire clip and did not even take out the shields.  wtf.:innocent:

Thanks for posting.  We should make a thread and anyone who has videos can post them so bioware can have an idea of the range of performance of their code as it relates to this weapon.

[Gamemako]

Uploaded video of Typhoon dealing appropriate damage.

[Kenadian]

So...basically you have to use the strongest mods possible to get the modifiers to actually work properly. Great.

[Gamemako]

Kenadian wrote...

So...basically you have to use the strongest mods possible to get the modifiers to actually work properly. Great.

Possibly, yes. That isn't necessarily even "working right" since the best fit I have for it right now is a 25% modifier instead of a 50% one and is using per-ammo (which may or may not actually be the case). That's why I've been looking for alternative damage models. Something has to fit the data reasonably...

Modifié par Gamemako, 19 août 2012 - 02:32 .

[Kenadian]

I'm wondering then if the modifiers were always wonky like this, or if the nerf changed it.

[Sp3c7eR]

Gamemako wrote...

You've ignored every other opponent, just like Sp3c7eR ignored that you can kill every other enemy in in the game on the highest difficulty in one clip. Instead, he gave the most meaningless video he could: TTK on the only enemy that withstands one clip and the only enemy on which he could include reload and warm-up times just to skew things as much as possible. The only way he could have done better is by killing with the first round after the second warm-up.

You know, I was going to respond to each and every paragraph of your post but I see no point in trying to convince a a clown like you of anything so I'll just comment on this quote, cause you obviously know so much about the game.

Based on your claim that Atlas is the only enemy that can withstand a single Typhoon clip, please show video proof of Typhoon killing Banshee and/or Prime with a single clip on Platinum. You called me ignorant, remember? Joke's on you, by the way. 

[Ashen One]

How this thread has not been locked yet due to the excessive flaming, and trolling is beyond me.

Keep the lulz coming guys, this thread is a real laugh riot.

5 stars.

[Ashen One]

Lord_Sirian wrote...
Calm down a bit, huh? It's just a game.

What is this?

A voice of reason, on my internet?

[ToaOrka]

It's not worth it's UR status, and is barely usable on anything other than a Destroyer, Demolisher, or Krogan Sentinel (No cooldowns).

[Cole Jones]

Kenadian wrote...

So...basically you have to use the strongest mods possible to get the modifiers to actually work properly. Great.

I really see no problem with it. Hell i bet i could run my Avenger 10 on my Destroyer with the right mods and get #1 on a gold.

[thegamefreek78648]

PKTracer wrote...

Ashen Earth wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...
Calm down a bit, huh? It's just a game.

What is this?

A voice of reason, on my internet?

 People respond to reason.

Ah "Reason"

We have dismissed that claim.

[thegamefreek78648]

Gamemako wrote...

Uploaded video of Typhoon dealing appropriate damage.

How do you ONLY have 214 rounds for your Ty?  On my destroyer ive got 240

[ripper000]

yo

[soldo9149]

thegamefreek78648 wrote...

Gamemako wrote...

Uploaded video of Typhoon dealing appropriate damage.

How do you ONLY have 214 rounds for your Ty?  On my destroyer ive got 240

Why does the gun only work appropriate sometimes, what cause's it to not work correctly in the first place? Also if it doesnt work the correct way all the time whats the point in using it when we have the Rev which works fine all the time?

[Kenadian]

soldo9149 wrote...

thegamefreek78648 wrote...

Gamemako wrote...

Uploaded video of Typhoon dealing appropriate damage.

How do you ONLY have 214 rounds for your Ty?  On my destroyer ive got 240

Why does the gun only work appropriate sometimes, what cause's it to not work correctly in the first place? Also if it doesnt work the correct way all the time whats the point in using it when we have the Rev which works fine all the time?

Probably a RoF build instead of a magazine build.

[Guglio08]

modok8 wrote...

The seriousness with which some people take this stuff is quite disturbing

[GroverA125]

If the typhoon is "fine", then clearly it's not working as well as it should be doing.

Also, regardless of your belief, a weapon is not "fine" if it requires and form of modification that is expendable and temproary. As such, saying that it works when you put Warp ammo on is not a valid point. Saying that it works well with an ammo mod and a barrel, however, is perfectly fine. That's the laws of the land. A weapon should not require said equipment to function, and should be capable of functioning anywhere without the need of expendable equipment. They're only supposed to speed up the "making enemies melt" cycle.

So, if I may continue, it is not such a good weapon. Considering that it weighs nearly twice as much as its competitors and is all-but limited to a few classes whom do not require powers (much or at all), and that it requires a constant hosing on the enemy, it's not as good as it should be. What it should actually do is something along the lines of this:
http://www.youtube.c...h?v=DO5LC9sv9ms ' class='bbc_url' title='External link' rel='nofollow external'>

That is what the Typhoon should be like, an endless stream of destruction. As a machine gun, it requires you to keep it very well-held on your enemy to get any effectiveness out of it, something you don't need to do with any of the other contending weapons (even the revenant can get a good DPS while going in and out of cover). The typhoon just doesn't reward the player for fufilling the requirements. The Reegar will decimate anything that gets too close when the requirements are fufilled. As will the Pirahna, as will many other weapons, but the Typhoon just doesn't have enough oomph to make up for all the problems it gives its user.

PS: Yes, the weapon in the video plays that whenever you fire it. Yes, the Typhoon should play the same music when you fire it.