13 réponses à ce sujet

[NRieh]

 I know it is not really that gamebreaking, but still... What were BW thinking when they gathered DA2 party? 

I'm an archer rogue. And because I'm rogue (and no one cared about my spec and asked me first) I had Bethany instead of Carver. 

Melees in party - Aveline, Fenris, Isabela. - 3 total
Ranged ones: Bethany, Varric, Merrilll, Anders, ArcherHawke, (Sebastian if I had DLC) - 5(6) total

Now as Isabela's gone - only Fenris and Aveline are left for me - 2 total. And note that theoretically Fenris could also leave the party at some point while on his quest. Which would leave only Aveline. 

Let's look at my DAO party: 
Melee: Dog, Alistair, Sten, Oghren, (Shale - if I had DLC) - 4(5) total
Ranged: Wynne, Morrigan, ArcherWarden  - 3 total
Can be used in both melee and ranged ways - Zev (more like melee) and Leliana(more like ranged). 

As I said - it's not gamebreaking, but party flexibility suffers a lot, imo. Because if we don't take "no healer" party - Anders is in 100%, and the only two melees are Aveline and Fenris. If I enjoy 2m+2r party (which I do, and which worked perfect for me in DAO) I have no party choice at all.            

[Amirit]

First of all, Bethany is with you for a very short time. Means - 4 range.
Sebastian, as you said, only if you have DLC .

Means 3 vs 3

Isabella might come back, and why on earth would you want to loose Fenris?! Just for a sake of being a douche-bag?

We just have less companions in general. But less quests and less everything too Balance!

[cJohnOne]

I think you want to carry only one Warrior unless your having fun with two of them. You only need one tank. I think of Isabela as DPS who is hard to keep alive.



I use Merril a lot so I don't have a healer.  I seem to get along fine.

Modifié par cJohnOne, 20 août 2012 - 03:45 .

[Wulfram]

You're probably best off with only 1 melee anyway. Most because you need to manually move melee characters out of the way of boss attacks, and it's a pain to do that with multiple characters.

[Sylvanpyxie]

As Amirit pointed out. Without DLC and the Sibling you're 3 for 3.

The only real imbalance is how easy it is to lose Isabela out of sheer ignorance.. I didn't use Isabela a whole lot on my first run cause i was a DW Rogue, i had planned to build up her friendship in Act2, only it was too late by that point and she'd buggered off never to return.

Isabela is really the only one that will sneak that up on you and shaft you when you least expect it....

Other than that, pretty balanced tbh.

[NRieh]

I think you want to carry only one Warrior unless your having fun with two of them. You only need one tank.

I don't know. Even 2 melees in "tank" tactics preset tend to lose some aggro. I did not have same issues in DAO (with Alistiar+dog or Alistair+Oghren). It gets slightly better if you play turn-base and tank manually, but something is not quite right here. Aveline alone is decent, Fenris as solo-tank...did not work quite well for me.

And party flexibility suffers anyway. One needs to pick RP vs tactics. I ended up with Aveline+Varric+Anders. Mostly because Anders and Fenris in same party...may be fun for first few hours.

The only real imbalance is how easy it is to lose Isabela out of sheer ignorance..

Well, looks like my case - being on first play I usually do not metagame much.

and why on earth would you want to loose Fenris?! Just for a sake of being a douche-bag?

Well, not all Hawkes are lawfull-good, there must be few chaotic-evils as well. Game mechanics interfere with RP here, heavily, imo. You need to be "good" if you need full party or "proper" results. You need to metagame to keep party balance.

[thats1evildude]

Y'know, I actually have Merrill in my party a lot more than Anders. She's such a heavy damager that you don't really need to worry about healing because she's killing baddies left, right and centre. And unlike Anders, you want to build up her Constitution, which makes her a lot more durable.

[Fiacre]

Unless you want to use vengeance instead of speccing him as a healer. Or at least that was what it felt like on my first playthrough, where I... hadn't even looked at his specialization and noticed that Vengeance works better with more constitution a bit late.

And there's nothing wron with playing and evil Hawke or a douchebag who just doesn't care enough to help during A Bitter Pill. It's an RPG. And not only can Fenris be lost, he's optional in the first place. If you don't do a Bait and Switch, you only have Isabela, Aveline and for Act 1 potentially Carver. And as everyone said, Isabela can be really easy to lose, leaving you with only Aveline.

[Sylvanpyxie]

Well, looks like my case

Yup, suffered the same.

That's the only real imbalance of the Ranged/Melee thing though.

I mean, DLC only added a single ranged DPS. The Siblings depend entirely on what class you end up going so that's a 50/50 really. Technically speaking you could lose everyone bar Merrill, Varric and Aveline i think, and that's your basic War/Mage/Rogue combo left open.

[Amirit]

Nrieh wrote...
Well, not all Hawkes are lawfull-good, there must be few chaotic-evils as well. Game mechanics interfere with RP here, heavily, imo. You need to be "good" if you need full party or "proper" results. You need to metagame to keep party balance.
 

Game mechanics always interferes with RP. I think should you sell one of your friend in slavery IRL others would stay away from you, or others all would be chaotic-evel to begin with, ready to betray each other. Here your obviously lawful-good friends  just slitely disaprove your insane actions. 

But game-speaking there is one thing - DA2 mechanics is a bit specific. You do not really need a tank - only heavy DPS. I also prefer\\used to the "holy trinity" but that is what people say in every build topic on every forum: in DA2 all you need is high DPS. And this is mages. May be that is the reason you loose only melee companions.

[NRieh]

Game mechanics always interferes with RP.

Yes and no. "evil" players suffer some losses because they are evil - true. But is it correct to involve mandatory metagaming into in-game decisions? Like "I need to keep Fenris because I need extra melee"?

But game-speaking there is one thing - DA2 mechanics is a bit specific. You do not really need a tank - only heavy DPS.

Well, that's not so obvious, is it? I mean they don't write it on gameboxes or tutorials or something. 8) And simple fact that game starts with "classic" setup - siblings Hawke - melee, healer mage and...someone.

I'm and "oldschooler", to make me happy - I need shielded tank, archer and healer. Better - acompanied by some another melee, which makes sure that neither me nor healer got hit...And better - with advanced classes for archer, like bard or arcane archer...

But I already understood in progress that DA2 combat system is...not typical. It's first time when I did not like playing as archer, for example. Unlike all the previous d&d based games (I mean NWN, icewind dale etc, DAO included).

Because no - 4 shots total, of which 2 are AOE and all have long-long CD - it's not an archer spec its...something strange. It's diablo1 autoshooting, really... Probably, the point was to make system simple, but I did not feel like it was that good. May be -because I just love my "oldschool" and could not switch to this one.

But I finished today anyway. Combat design was not best part of this game, absolutely.
Now I will have in mind that "you can play what you wish by RP - it has nothing to do with what you knew before". But still..couple of extra melee units would do good.

[Amirit]

Then metagaming again and again As bad as it sounds. And you do get your melee party. Though, if you really want to play mean evil Hawk - you can without loosing anyone. Just be mean, they'll all appreciate it and stay as loyal as to good Hawk.

From my experience, it's not just DPS but AoE for the most part of the game that makes fighting efficient. Even with bosses. May be that is why archer feels like another mage.

[Rawgrim]

The problem is that you can`t equip different weapons on companions. Ends up with the player being forced to use certain companions, whether he\\she likes them or not. Its also hell on the replayability factor of the game.

[CuriousArtemis]

I think with DA2 you either play for the story or the tactics. So if you want to play evil!bastard!Hawke, meaning you sale back Fenris and what have you, then you lower the difficulty level so you can do that. But if you want to think about a balanced party and having to play with the skill trees and so on, then you have to set the RP aspect aside and just select the characters that will help you in battle the best....