476 réponses à ce sujet

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

NO!

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...


When did enlightenment = slavery?

It does not equal slavery.  If Synthesis is slavery in your head canon, I can see why you did not choose it.

Taking away a persons right to choose is taking away there free will, so yes it is slavery.

Wayning_Star wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Wayning_Star wrote...

Not entirely true, they did give the keys to the city to Shepard, who MUST decide the best case senerio. If he chooses synthesis, it's with the blessings of the entire MEU.

False. Everyone gave Shepard the implicit authority to defeat the Reapers. Not violate their genetic structure to please the Reapers.

Well that was a choice, not dependant on how you portray your distrust. It doesn't violate, so much as shares data. And I have to point out again, that it works both ways.

If anyone were to object to it in the MEU,it would be synthetics. They didn't ask to be created by organics, or, at the very least, engineered to be succeptable to organic inteligence, that is 'gain life', so they are the actual underdogs here.

He has implicit authority to do what ever he/she sees fit. Lookit up in the Codex.. rules of conduct for Shepard an officer and as a spectre adds punch to the issue.

http://masseffect.wi...m/wiki/Spectres

http://masseffect.wi...ar_Assets/Alien

Hackett orders you to Destroy the reaper, there is no confusion in that order, also all the other races join you with the understanding that you will destroy the reapers.

Modifié par DinoSteve, 21 août 2012 - 11:27 .

[Endorlf]

I'm seeing a lot of comments about people working with Reapers in synthesis. Here's a question. Why do some interpret it as people happily accepting the Reapers? What if people are only grudgingly accepting the Reaper's help? In a way, it can be seen as the relationship between the US/Britain and the Soviet Union during WW2. There are very few slides where Reapers and people are together, and in those few slides, I don't see people being all happy with the Reapers. They are only working with them to remove rubble and rebuild.

In addition, if Synthesis indoctrinated everyone to accept and love the Reapers, then why is it that after the soldiers get hit by the Synthesis wave, they weren't cheering? Instead, they were confused and surprised by the green circuitry over them. In fact, the really strange part would actually be Control, where the soldiers were instantly happy as the Reapers flew away.

Regarding Wreav, he doesn't restart the Krogan rebellions in Control either. Now, if you make the argument that Shepard-controlled Reapers threatened to crush Wreav if he tried, what's stopping us from believing that Reapers in Synthesis would do the same?

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

Endorlf wrote...

I'm seeing a lot of comments about people working with Reapers in synthesis. Here's a question. Why do some interpret it as people happily accepting the Reapers? What if people are only grudgingly accepting the Reaper's help? In a way, it can be seen as the relationship between the US/Britain and the Soviet Union during WW2. There are very few slides where Reapers and people are together, and in those few slides, I don't see people being all happy with the Reapers. They are only working with them to remove rubble and rebuild.

In addition, if Synthesis indoctrinated everyone to accept and love the Reapers, then why is it that after the soldiers get hit by the Synthesis wave, they weren't cheering? Instead, they were confused and surprised by the green circuitry over them. In fact, the really strange part would actually be Control, where the soldiers were instantly happy as the Reapers flew away.

Regarding Wreav, he doesn't restart the Krogan rebellions in Control either. Now, if you make the argument that Shepard-controlled Reapers threatened to crush Wreav if he tried, what's stopping us from believing that Reapers in Synthesis would do the same?

In Synthesis they are not cheering because they are now drones.

[Endorlf]

DinoSteve wrote...

Endorlf wrote...

I'm seeing a lot of comments about people working with Reapers in synthesis. Here's a question. Why do some interpret it as people happily accepting the Reapers? What if people are only grudgingly accepting the Reaper's help? In a way, it can be seen as the relationship between the US/Britain and the Soviet Union during WW2. There are very few slides where Reapers and people are together, and in those few slides, I don't see people being all happy with the Reapers. They are only working with them to remove rubble and rebuild.

In addition, if Synthesis indoctrinated everyone to accept and love the Reapers, then why is it that after the soldiers get hit by the Synthesis wave, they weren't cheering? Instead, they were confused and surprised by the green circuitry over them. In fact, the really strange part would actually be Control, where the soldiers were instantly happy as the Reapers flew away.

Regarding Wreav, he doesn't restart the Krogan rebellions in Control either. Now, if you make the argument that Shepard-controlled Reapers threatened to crush Wreav if he tried, what's stopping us from believing that Reapers in Synthesis would do the same?

In Synthesis they are not cheering because they are now drones.

If they are drones, then why do the Reapers help rebuild? In fact, they are even preserving architectural culture when they rebuild. Why do this for mere drones?

[zambot]

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...


When did enlightenment = slavery?

It does not equal slavery.  If Synthesis is slavery in your head canon, I can see why you did not choose it.

Taking away a persons right to choose is taking away there free will, so yes it is slavery.

Synthesis does not take away your "right to choose", nor does it remove anyone's free will.  But I am willing to accept that since it is mostly space magic, you can head canon your space magic to do those things.

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...


When did enlightenment = slavery?

It does not equal slavery.  If Synthesis is slavery in your head canon, I can see why you did not choose it.

Taking away a persons right to choose is taking away there free will, so yes it is slavery.

Synthesis does not take away your "right to choose", nor does it remove anyone's free will.  But I am willing to accept that since it is mostly space magic, you can head canon your space magic to do those things.

If Shepard makes that choice without asking anyone, he takes away there choice and in the process there free will.

Endorlf wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...

Endorlf wrote...

I'm seeing a lot of comments about people working with Reapers in synthesis. Here's a question. Why do some interpret it as people happily accepting the Reapers? What if people are only grudgingly accepting the Reaper's help? In a way, it can be seen as the relationship between the US/Britain and the Soviet Union during WW2. There are very few slides where Reapers and people are together, and in those few slides, I don't see people being all happy with the Reapers. They are only working with them to remove rubble and rebuild.

In addition, if Synthesis indoctrinated everyone to accept and love the Reapers, then why is it that after the soldiers get hit by the Synthesis wave, they weren't cheering? Instead, they were confused and surprised by the green circuitry over them. In fact, the really strange part would actually be Control, where the soldiers were instantly happy as the Reapers flew away.

Regarding Wreav, he doesn't restart the Krogan rebellions in Control either. Now, if you make the argument that Shepard-controlled Reapers threatened to crush Wreav if he tried, what's stopping us from believing that Reapers in Synthesis would do the same?

In Synthesis they are not cheering because they are now drones.

If they are drones, then why do the Reapers help rebuild? In fact, they are even preserving architectural culture when they rebuild. Why do this for mere drones?

Because its in the reapers best interest to keep all there drones busy.

Modifié par DinoSteve, 21 août 2012 - 11:35 .

[zambot]

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...


When did enlightenment = slavery?

It does not equal slavery.  If Synthesis is slavery in your head canon, I can see why you did not choose it.

Taking away a persons right to choose is taking away there free will, so yes it is slavery.

Synthesis does not take away your "right to choose", nor does it remove anyone's free will.  But I am willing to accept that since it is mostly space magic, you can head canon your space magic to do those things.

If Shepard makes that choice without asking anyone, he takes away there choice and in the process there free will.

No.  If you and I are at a restaraunt, and while you are away, I order the chicken, I chose something for you.  I did not take away your free will.  You are not a drone, and you have the right to tell me I'm an idiot and should have waited for you to get back.  The next time you have the "right to choose" to order your steak.

[Wayning_Star]

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...


When did enlightenment = slavery?

It does not equal slavery.  If Synthesis is slavery in your head canon, I can see why you did not choose it.

Taking away a persons right to choose is taking away there free will, so yes it is slavery.

Wayning_Star wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Wayning_Star wrote...

Not entirely true, they did give the keys to the city to Shepard, who MUST decide the best case senerio. If he chooses synthesis, it's with the blessings of the entire MEU.

False. Everyone gave Shepard the implicit authority to defeat the Reapers. Not violate their genetic structure to please the Reapers.

Well that was a choice, not dependant on how you portray your distrust. It doesn't violate, so much as shares data. And I have to point out again, that it works both ways.

If anyone were to object to it in the MEU,it would be synthetics. They didn't ask to be created by organics, or, at the very least, engineered to be succeptable to organic inteligence, that is 'gain life', so they are the actual underdogs here.

He has implicit authority to do what ever he/she sees fit. Lookit up in the Codex.. rules of conduct for Shepard an officer and as a spectre adds punch to the issue.

http://masseffect.wi...m/wiki/Spectres

http://masseffect.wi...ar_Assets/Alien

Hackett orders you to Destroy the reaper, there is no confusion in that order, also all the other races join you with the understanding that you will destroy the reapers.

Hackett never orders Shep to destroy the reapers, he does,however proclaim that if the possibility presented it's self, he wouldn't object to that if it stops the reaper threat. Destroying the reapers doesn't accomplish Hackett's goal or Sheps orders.
Hackett does like the idea of taking out the IM, but it's not a priority alpha.. just sugar'n cinnamon on his toast..as it were.

Modifié par Wayning_Star, 21 août 2012 - 11:38 .

[Endorlf]

DinoSteve wrote...

Endorlf wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...

In Synthesis they are not cheering because they are now drones.

If they are drones, then why do the Reapers help rebuild? In fact, they are even preserving architectural culture when they rebuild. Why do this for mere drones?

Because its in the reapers best interest to keep all there drones busy.

How does this forward the Reapers' agenda? If they want to keep their drones busy, then why help rebuild?

[MacNasty]

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...


When did enlightenment = slavery?

It does not equal slavery.  If Synthesis is slavery in your head canon, I can see why you did not choose it.

Taking away a persons right to choose is taking away there free will, so yes it is slavery.

Synthesis does not take away your "right to choose", nor does it remove anyone's free will.  But I am willing to accept that since it is mostly space magic, you can head canon your space magic to do those things.

If Shepard makes that choice without asking anyone, he takes away there choice and in the process there free will.

No.  If you and I are at a restaraunt, and while you are away, I order the chicken, I chose something for you.  I did not take away your free will.  You are not a drone, and you have the right to tell me I'm an idiot and should have waited for you to get back.  The next time you have the "right to choose" to order your steak.

No offense... But that's a horrible analogy. You're not "ordering chicken" for a friend, you're forcing all life in the galaxy to accept this "upgrade."

[Nauks]

Synthesis will always be the fake, pants-on-head-retarded bull**** ending to me (well, the most retarded one of the broken non-endings we got punched in the kidneys with twice.)
So a big NO.

Making it canon, well that's a final nail in their coffin if I ever saw one, or was the EC the final nail in the coffin? I forget...

[Vinchisters]

Im starting to hate the Mass Effect community more every day.
I mean, the only opinion that exists nowadays on these forums is the ''to hell with synthesis, Bioware, EDI and ME3''. If somebody has a different opinion than the major of the BSN network, then they are cast out and kicked in the face. This is really annoying, you people are acting like like wolves right now, if you don't like the series anymore just sell ME3 and play some other game. It's not that hard.

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...


When did enlightenment = slavery?

It does not equal slavery.  If Synthesis is slavery in your head canon, I can see why you did not choose it.

Taking away a persons right to choose is taking away there free will, so yes it is slavery.

Synthesis does not take away your "right to choose", nor does it remove anyone's free will.  But I am willing to accept that since it is mostly space magic, you can head canon your space magic to do those things.

If Shepard makes that choice without asking anyone, he takes away there choice and in the process there free will.

No.  If you and I are at a restaraunt, and while you are away, I order the chicken, I chose something for you.  I did not take away your free will.  You are not a drone, and you have the right to tell me I'm an idiot and should have waited for you to get back.  The next time you have the "right to choose" to order your steak.

Jesus Christ ordering food is a far cry from rewriting a galaxy's DNA


@Wayning_Star Hackett does say the Reapers have to be Destroyed.



@Endorlf Well the catalyst is a faulty AI, most of its logic doesn't make sense anyway.

Modifié par DinoSteve, 21 août 2012 - 11:52 .

[zambot]

MacNasty wrote...
No offense... But that's a horrible analogy. You're not "ordering chicken" for a friend, you're forcing all life in the galaxy to accept this "upgrade."

Anology quality is meh, but I was hungry and thinking about food.  Point still stands though...making a choice for someone one time does not make that person into a slave or a drone.

[zambot]

DinoSteve wrote...


Jesus Christ ordering food is a far cry from rewriting a galaxy's DNA

True, but it does illustrate why making a choice for someone does not make that person into a slave.

[RadicalDisconnect]

DinoSteve wrote...

Endorlf wrote...

I'm seeing a lot of comments about people working with Reapers in synthesis. Here's a question. Why do some interpret it as people happily accepting the Reapers? What if people are only grudgingly accepting the Reaper's help? In a way, it can be seen as the relationship between the US/Britain and the Soviet Union during WW2. There are very few slides where Reapers and people are together, and in those few slides, I don't see people being all happy with the Reapers. They are only working with them to remove rubble and rebuild.

In addition, if Synthesis indoctrinated everyone to accept and love the Reapers, then why is it that after the soldiers get hit by the Synthesis wave, they weren't cheering? Instead, they were confused and surprised by the green circuitry over them. In fact, the really strange part would actually be Control, where the soldiers were instantly happy as the Reapers flew away.

Regarding Wreav, he doesn't restart the Krogan rebellions in Control either. Now, if you make the argument that Shepard-controlled Reapers threatened to crush Wreav if he tried, what's stopping us from believing that Reapers in Synthesis would do the same?

In Synthesis they are not cheering because they are now drones.

Uh...

Why would soldiers cheer if Reapers are flying away instead of collapsing?

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...


Jesus Christ ordering food is a far cry from rewriting a galaxy's DNA

True, but it does illustrate why making a choice for someone does not make that person into a slave.

No it doesn't they are two totally on releated things, besides if someone ordered my food for me I'd punch them in the face.

[zambot]

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...


Jesus Christ ordering food is a far cry from rewriting a galaxy's DNA

True, but it does illustrate why making a choice for someone does not make that person into a slave.

No it doesn't they are two totally on releated things, besides if someone ordered my food for me I'd punch them in the face.

After Synthesis feel free to dedicate your life to villifying Shepard for turning you into a monster, or form a foundation to genetically re-engineer authentic human dna and download your brain into it.  At least feel free to do that in my  head canon, since in your head canon you would be a slave.

[Bill Casey]

zambot wrote...

MacNasty wrote...
No offense... But that's a horrible analogy. You're not "ordering chicken" for a friend, you're forcing all life in the galaxy to accept this "upgrade."

Anology quality is meh, but I was hungry and thinking about food.  Point still stands though...making a choice for someone one time does not make that person into a slave or a drone.

EDI: Do you think I should make modifications?

Paragon Shepard: Only you can answer that question. That's the point of free will.

Modifié par Bill Casey, 21 août 2012 - 11:51 .

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...


Jesus Christ ordering food is a far cry from rewriting a galaxy's DNA

True, but it does illustrate why making a choice for someone does not make that person into a slave.

No it doesn't they are two totally on releated things, besides if someone ordered my food for me I'd punch them in the face.

After Synthesis feel free to dedicate your life to villifying Shepard for turning you into a monster, or form a foundation to genetically re-engineer authentic human dna and download your brain into it.  At least feel free to do that in my  head canon, since in your head canon you would be a slave.

I would except I'd be a slave to the catalysts will then.

[zambot]

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...

zambot wrote...

DinoSteve wrote...


Jesus Christ ordering food is a far cry from rewriting a galaxy's DNA

True, but it does illustrate why making a choice for someone does not make that person into a slave.

No it doesn't they are two totally on releated things, besides if someone ordered my food for me I'd punch them in the face.

After Synthesis feel free to dedicate your life to villifying Shepard for turning you into a monster, or form a foundation to genetically re-engineer authentic human dna and download your brain into it.  At least feel free to do that in my  head canon, since in your head canon you would be a slave.

I would except I'd be a slave to the catalysts will then.

Like I said, you are free to head canon whatever you want after the synthesis wave.  You choose to believe it turns people into slaves.  I believe otherwise.  I believe the EC supports my view, but hey, it's space magic.  Anything goes!

[Wayning_Star]

[/quote]

@Wayning_Star Hackett does say the Reapers have to be Destroyed.

[/quote]

I've not seen it in the game,nor have I been able to find it on the vids. Really, I could be wrong, but ..

just to ease my whithered brain, I'd like to see some proof of it. Hackett was always quick to say stuff off the record, that is, what he'd like to see opposed to what he actually orders Shep to do. Destruction was never mentioned, other than if the possiblity was promotional to their strategy,not necessarily the first order of the day. Mostly left all the decisions up to Shepard.

[RadicalDisconnect]

Bill Casey wrote...

zambot wrote...

MacNasty wrote...
No offense... But that's a horrible analogy. You're not "ordering chicken" for a friend, you're forcing all life in the galaxy to accept this "upgrade."

Anology quality is meh, but I was hungry and thinking about food.  Point still stands though...making a choice for someone one time does not make that person into a slave or a drone.

EDI: Do you think I should make modifications?

Paragon Shepard: Only you can answer that question. That's the point of free will.

I agree that Synthesis violates free will by forcing it on everyone. However, the claim that Synthesis removes free will isn't fact.

Modifié par RadicalDisconnect, 22 août 2012 - 12:08 .

[NovaBlastMarketing]

agreed if anything should be based on the only "viable" ending Destroy.. personally though i don't like any of them ....