194 réponses à ce sujet

[OuterRim]

WandererRTF wrote...

Thank god. Maybe now I'll have time to line up my shots...

This, very much so.

It was kinda PITA to play with slash spammers.Escorts and hacking objectives very especially painful since you couldn't go to the other edge of the mission area.

LOL 

Now its time to complain about all those grenade tossers that shake the screen too...

[CitizenThom]

Lord Chun wrote...

I never used it anyway Im always too busy cutting stuff

Yeah, Shasdow Strike/Tactical Cloak is about 90% of the powers I use for Shadow, Electric Slash only gets used when facing a crowd, in other words, while doing objectives.

[Micah3sixty]

staindgrey wrote...

It's not useless. The nerf was needed so that the Shadow class could be used as something besides "stand behind this wall, shake screen the whole match".

ES is incredibly useful and turns the Shadow into a very viable class. Not having it would make her a very niche character. Having a long range option without the necessity of a scoped weapon leaves open the idea of a CQC Infiltrator, which was the whole point to begin with.

But a nerf was needed; any Shadow I played with just stayed behind a certain wall and spammed. Was otherwise useless.

ES recharge nerf does nothing to the viability of the class.  Hell, it might even promote people using her other talents appropriately.  The original build and guide I made for the Shadow only recommended 4 ranks max of ES, and now I prefer 3 or 0 ranks in it, pre-nerf.  It's just not that interesting of a power to spam with it's long animation and limit of hitting 3 targets max, and doing little noticeble damage to Armor.  If you were/are a ES spammer, please see my guide for a much more viable Shadow (link in signature).

Modifié par Micah3sixty, 21 août 2012 - 05:35 .

[CitizenThom]

Asebstos wrote...

CitizenThom wrote...

First they came for the Cerberus Smashers, Next the Biotic and Electric Slashers, Human and Batarian Shockwavers still have another week of farming though.

The lower damage makes shockwave less attractive to farmers.

If you take the biotic explosions over the range on Rank 5, the lower damage isn't as much of an issue, so long as someone can prime your detonations.

[Caephire]

Hmm, that can easily rectified with a Level 3 Power Efficiency Module though. I doubt a lot of people will care about the increased cooldown. In a short amount of time people will adapt to it. I'm pretty sure tonight people will be spamming it more in order to gauge how the new cooldown affects their fighting strategy.

[staindgrey]

Micah3sixty wrote...

staindgrey wrote...

It's not useless. The nerf was needed so that the Shadow class could be used as something besides "stand behind this wall, shake screen the whole match".

ES is incredibly useful and turns the Shadow into a very viable class. Not having it would make her a very niche character. Having a long range option without the necessity of a scoped weapon leaves open the idea of a CQC Infiltrator, which was the whole point to begin with.

But a nerf was needed; any Shadow I played with just stayed behind a certain wall and spammed. Was otherwise useless.

ES recharge nerf does nothing to the viability of the class.  Hell, it might even promote people using her other talents appropriately.  The original build and guide I made for the Shadow only recommended 4 ranks mas of ES and now I prefer 3 or 0 ranks in it, pre-nerf.  It's just not that interesting of a power to spam with it's long animation and limit of hitting 3 targets max, and doing little noticeble damage to Armor.  If you were/are a ES spammer, please see my guide for a much more viable Shadow (link in signature).

...

You just... agreed with my point, while sounding like you were debating against it.

Hu-whaaa...?

[Yosuke]

I specced out of it completely on my shadow and slayer anyways. Spamming slashes from behind walls really takes away from what makes the classes unique, IMO. Perhaps now people will learn to actually use the classes' other strengths instead of playing them like super smashguards.

Good balance changes.

[PsychoticBiotic]

OuterRim wrote...

WandererRTF wrote...

Thank god. Maybe now I'll have time to line up my shots...

This, very much so.

It was kinda PITA to play with slash spammers.Escorts and hacking objectives very especially painful since you couldn't go to the other edge of the mission area.

LOL 

Now its time to complain about all those grenade tossers that shake the screen too...

Grenades are actually helpful since many times they stagger enemies, which in turn makes headshots easier. 

[Cyonan]

It changes nothing.

The farmers who were spamming these abilities will just move to the next best thing, which might still even be the Slashes for them. People will still complain that whatever they're using is "OP".

I'm still not going to see a lot of Shadow or Slayers in my non farming games. Probably less now that they've been nerfed. Especially the Slayer since this hits him harder than it hits the Shadow for a non camping setup.

[Kalas Magnus]

  Poor slayer. 

[staindgrey]

Cyonan wrote...

It changes nothing.

The farmers who were spamming these abilities will just move to the next best thing, which might still even be the Slashes for them. People will still complain that whatever they're using is "OP".

I'm still not going to see a lot of Shadow or Slayers in my non farming games. Probably less now that they've been nerfed. Especially the Slayer since this hits him harder than it hits the Shadow for a non camping setup.

I think people are just using the term "OP" incorrectly. It's definitely a necessity to nerf the things that make the game horribly repetitive and easy for certain classes (such as the Shadow's ES or the Phoenix's Smash) in order to keep people from growing bored. But just because something is stupidly efficient doesn't make it OP. Forcing the player to use other options with a cooldown increase is just what the doctor ordered.

All of this, IMO, of course.

[cuzIMgood]

DHKany wrote...

oh noes 1 more second cooldown on a 1000+ damage dealing power that goes through walls and can hit multiple targets.
Seriously butthurt. Will you stop getting so riled up about such a puny nerf?

lol this.

[Micah3sixty]

staindgrey wrote...

Micah3sixty wrote...

staindgrey wrote...

It's not useless. The nerf was needed so that the Shadow class could be used as something besides "stand behind this wall, shake screen the whole match".

ES is incredibly useful and turns the Shadow into a very viable class. Not having it would make her a very niche character. Having a long range option without the necessity of a scoped weapon leaves open the idea of a CQC Infiltrator, which was the whole point to begin with.

But a nerf was needed; any Shadow I played with just stayed behind a certain wall and spammed. Was otherwise useless.

ES recharge nerf does nothing to the viability of the class.  Hell, it might even promote people using her other talents appropriately.  The original build and guide I made for the Shadow only recommended 4 ranks mas of ES and now I prefer 3 or 0 ranks in it, pre-nerf.  It's just not that interesting of a power to spam with it's long animation and limit of hitting 3 targets max, and doing little noticeble damage to Armor.  If you were/are a ES spammer, please see my guide for a much more viable Shadow (link in signature).

...

You just... agreed with my point, while sounding like you were debating against it.

Hu-whaaa...?

I probably misinterpreted your comments. :innocent:

[paperbook]

Yep. I am happy.

Modifié par paperbook, 21 août 2012 - 05:44 .

[Kalas Magnus]

PsychoticBiotic wrote...

OuterRim wrote...

WandererRTF wrote...

Thank god. Maybe now I'll have time to line up my shots...

This, very much so.

It was kinda PITA to play with slash spammers.Escorts and hacking objectives very especially painful since you couldn't go to the other edge of the mission area.

LOL 

Now its time to complain about all those grenade tossers that shake the screen too...

Grenades are actually helpful since many times they stagger enemies, which in turn makes headshots easier. 

You know there is a kick option right? If you hate the screen shaking effect why not kick them on sight? You would be happy and my slayer would still kick ass. At least he got that buff to BC.

[luciox]

This is not a matter of fact about the Nerf or how the Nerf will effect Shadow/slayer.
This is about the people who keep bring up ideas about nerf. Nerf this Nerf that, acting like they know everything. Now it seems that they got what they want for this time. And I am looking forward to seeing what will be the next.

[Halo Quea]

I stopped using ES for my Shadow builds anyway, animation always took to damned long to execute in the first place.

Unless Bioware has fixed the Vanguard glitches I wouldn't bother building for Charges at all.

Basically it's all a wash to me.

[Jayleia]

luciox wrote...

Just checked the post. ES/BS got nerfed, base CD increase from 5s to 8s.
Anyone who complains about spamming ES/BS is now HAPPY.
Anyone who crying for nerfing ES/BS is now HAPPY for a while and hunting for next victium.
And most important, now, Shadow will only have builds focuse on SS valuable as ES just got it dps about 1/3 down. This means ES is kind of useless.

No, ES is now more situational.  I use ES and BS, and I like them, and I'm fine with the nerf.  I would have preferred them making it so that solid walls blocked it, but "cover" didn't (if they could do that).

But I get what I got, not what I'd have given, and I work with it, work around it, or if it totally ruins the fun of the class, find a different kit.

[Beasty-Krogan]

im glad to see its nerfed somewhat i mean other characters and weapons i likebeen nerfed in the past why not nerf it . i mean if you ask me shockwave and every other power that goes arrrh or shakes the screen needs a debuff/nerf . and for those saying its 1second CHECK the stats screen again its 3 second s added to it not one . but either way who cares anymore i mean they done nerfed 75% if not 80% of the weapons given all the ****y weapons buffs but yet not buffed or defaulted/revert the original weapons back to normal and forgot to totallly nerf the pirahna i mean wtf kind of logic is that ? lol either way i dont care no more i still play but i expect that any and all things i like in mp could get nerfed at any moments notice like it has in past so as i dont get to comfortable with it so it dont Surprise me anymore . i say nerf any and all things

[LadyAlekto]

Now i can consider speccing my armordamage from fitness away for 3 ranks in es, maybe its now not a cheese noob option anymore, still believe the shadow could had been better with a sticky grenade instead of n00bbutton

[Bleachrude]

Actually, it kind of forced choice since for the slashes, the rank 5 decision was kind of easy...

It makes the evolution 5 choice harder since before, at 200% cooldown, the difference was 1.54s versus 1.37. The actual animation itself took as much time as the non-recharge speed option (biotic detonation/tech explosion) so many went with the detonation/burst...

Now, its a choice between 2.46s and 2.19s

[CitizenThom]

Cyonan wrote...

It changes nothing.

The farmers who were spamming these abilities will just move to the next best thing, which might still even be the Slashes for them. People will still complain that whatever they're using is "OP".

I'm still not going to see a lot of Shadow or Slayers in my non farming games. Probably less now that they've been nerfed. Especially the Slayer since this hits him harder than it hits the Shadow for a non camping setup.

I think the Slayer in the end, is still viable for farming because of the Range and Damage of Biotic Slash, the cooldown isn't as critical, as long as it's not 10 seconds... so long as there is some other class available to do rapid detonations short range... the Slayer's role is mostly to thin out the herd when farming.

[BlackDahlia424]

I am absolutely against nerfs for guns (the release day Krysae was the only exception to that), but people who spammed ES and BS bugged the crap out of me because they'd constantly shake the screen while I'm trying to shoot something. I get that they're a large source of damage, but the cooldown increase was justified in this IMO.

[Cyonan]

CitizenThom wrote...

I think the Slayer in the end, is still viable for farming because of the Range and Damage of Biotic Slash, the cooldown isn't as critical, as long as it's not 10 seconds... so long as there is some other class available to do rapid detonations short range... the Slayer's role is mostly to thin out the herd when farming.

To be fair, I'm more concerned about the Slayer in a non farm setup. I'm not going to make wild claims of "unviable on even silver!" or anything like that, but he certainly took a hit when he was already underperforming if not in a farm setup, in my opinion.

Smash and Slashes both have lengthy animations that leave you incredibly vulnerable if you don't have a wall to sit behind and spam. The Shadow can pretend she has a wall since she has Tactical Cloak, but the Slayer doesn't have anything, and he can't Charge to regenerate shields as quickly after a Biotic Slash now.

A skilled player is still going to be able to clear Platinum with a team of Slayers not using a camping strat, but I suspect that for the average player, I will see even less Slayers in my pugs as I don't  play White/Geth or camp that small room on Glacier. They were already pretty rare to see. 

[ryoldschool]

Micah3sixty wrote...

staindgrey wrote...

Micah3sixty wrote...

staindgrey wrote...

It's not useless. The nerf was needed so that the Shadow class could be used as something besides "stand behind this wall, shake screen the whole match".

ES is incredibly useful and turns the Shadow into a very viable class. Not having it would make her a very niche character. Having a long range option without the necessity of a scoped weapon leaves open the idea of a CQC Infiltrator, which was the whole point to begin with.

But a nerf was needed; any Shadow I played with just stayed behind a certain wall and spammed. Was otherwise useless.

ES recharge nerf does nothing to the viability of the class.  Hell, it might even promote people using her other talents appropriately.  The original build and guide I made for the Shadow only recommended 4 ranks mas of ES and now I prefer 3 or 0 ranks in it, pre-nerf.  It's just not that interesting of a power to spam with it's long animation and limit of hitting 3 targets max, and doing little noticeble damage to Armor.  If you were/are a ES spammer, please see my guide for a much more viable Shadow (link in signature).

...

You just... agreed with my point, while sounding like you were debating against it.

Hu-whaaa...?

I probably misinterpreted your comments. :innocent:

Actually the nerf (  cooldown difference ) is not going to stop people from spamming ES behind cover.   I have been using Micah3sixty's build for a while and it is a lot more fun.  Sometimes I never use ES in an entire match - it is useful to annoy some enemies if you have an escort task and you don't want to leave the drone.