37 réponses à ce sujet

[Doodle]

Kaidan...

Cause 3 longgg games....

and for me Steve is a Meh.... perfer Tali over him tbh

[Beep Il]

I prefer them both since I like them both equally.

[Sundance31us]

I lean more toward Kaidan since he and the Commander have known each other longer. It also didn't feel right perusing Steve while he was mourning the loss of his husband (that and he's a junior officer under Shepard's command).

[laikabaws]

leans more to Kaidan but...

[ottifant64]

STEVE

because I hate Kaidan

[thearbiter1337]

Hmm

I say Kaidan though Steve is good too.

[krukow]

Well, Kaidan is dead, so...

Actually, I hear the Kaidan one is sweet and features less husband mourning. Crying sex is just weird (See: Jack)

[ReveurIngenu]

Yes, this was a question I asked myself quite a few times.

At first, I thought I preferred Kaidan's romance simply because he's been there for all three games. That and his romance scene is more detailed and longer. However, I would say that now, I think Steve's romance is best for male Shepard.

Why? Because Kaidan's romance plays out too similarly whether you are male Shepard or female Shepard. Because he doesn't really say anything to acknowledge your gender (I don't consider the "handsome" line to be gender specific because people sometimes use handsome to qualify females). When you compare his romance with male Shepard with his romance with female Shepard, you just feel like he's talking to a blank wall and that Shepard is just whichever gender you are.

I don't feel like I see two people talking to each other.

Steve's romance is much better for male Shepard. It is gender specific so you know you can only access it with male Shepard (not counting hacks and stuff). And while I regret the fact that his "sex" scene isn't one, that he only kisses Shepard once (compared to Kaidan's three - before sex, after sex, last goodbye), and that his goodbye is pretty crappy (compared to Kaidan's), I still feel he is a more appropriate choice for male Shepard just because it feels much more real.

I guess it's in large part due to the fact that I don't see female Shepard having the EXACT same romance with him that I see him having with male Shepard. I can actually sort of understand all those homophobes who were against male Shepard being able to be gay. Even if it's not "your" game, just knowing that Kaidan can have the exact same romance with female Shepard really puts me off Kaidan and male Shepard's relationship.

It's sort of stupid, but I can't help myself. Comparing Kaidan's romance with both male and female Shepard, I just can't help but feel that he isn't really talking to my Shepard or to a male Shepard but rather that he is just reading lines (which I guess is true, but still...).

So, I think I would make my official romance with Steve rather than Kaidan. I think female Shepard can have Kaidan.

Modifié par ReveurIngenu, 22 août 2012 - 09:12 .

[Mimitochan]

ReveurIngenu wrote...
I think female Shepard can have Kaidan.

female Shepard is grateful

[Doodle]

ReveurIngenu wrote...

I think female Shepard can have Kaidan.

my shepard disagrees

also most of your post makes sense, i however don't like steve's romance.

i pretty much perfer jacks over steve

[Vigilant111]

ReveurIngenu wrote...

I think female Shepard can have Kaidan.

You cannot give Kaidan away like he is one of your toys:?, people had to petition to get mShep/Kaidan together

[bas_kon]

ReveurIngenu wrote...
Snip

I think you are wrong, just because Kaidan isn't reminding you, you are a man all the time doesn't mean his romance arc is not gender specific (Steve doesn't either, it's just you metagaming).

This is a trilogy, not a standalone game. Kaidan's romance with mshep begins in ME1 (against the devs intentions) because of the chemistry of the two caracters, which imo, is stronger than fshep/kaidan no matter how many times he repeats he likes her or how many easter eggs animations the add to it in ME3.
With that in mind, Kaidan's overall romance plays out differently across "ME-ME2-ME3", the classic "romance-fight-reconciliation" for f!shep and "building friendship-messed up feelings-romance" for m!shep.

I would agree with you with the non specific romance lines, but they were pretty different (if we take into acount their budget for s/s), two exclusive date variants for m!shep and in the sex scene he mentions shepard being too focused on the work in ME. Plus, in the first goddbye sceene, while he just smiles at f!shep, he says to m!shep they are "brothers in arms" besides lovers.
There's only two flirt lines and some of the goodbyes shared by both.

Also, Kaidan's s/s romance is more about the two of them being awkward around each other and not been able to say how they really feel without beating around the bush (Shep teases him in the date with the someone comment and they only say ILY directly, right before the end which makes it more powerful). With femshep, he's more confident and I lost the count of the times he says ILY, though I just can't see them together (well, yes...on youtube).

That said, I also like Cortez as both a friend and a romance, so I would say to the OP he should try both of them since they are different worrthy experiences and they are both very well done.

Modifié par bas_kon, 23 août 2012 - 11:28 .

[BatmanPWNS]

Take the renegade route.

"Can't I have you both?"

[shepskisaac]

BatmanPWNS wrote...

"Can't I have you both?"

[lillitheris]

I never seriously played either, really just to see, but I could never shake the feeling that I should give Steve a little more time…even 9 months is not that long for having lost a love.

(I’m not really advocating any specific ‘proper duration of mourning’, just personally thought it was a little too early.)

[Mimitochan]

bas_kon wrote...

ReveurIngenu wrote...
Snip

I think you are wrong, just because Kaidan isn't reminding you, you are a man all the time doesn't mean his romance arc is not gender specific (Steve doesn't either, it's just you metagaming).

This is a trilogy, not a standalone game. Kaidan's romance with mshep begins in ME1 (against the devs intentions) because of the chemistry of the two caracters, which imo, is stronger than fshep/kaidan no matter how many times he repeats he likes her or how many easter eggs animations the add to it in ME3.
With that in mind, Kaidan's overall romance plays out differently across "ME-ME2-ME3", the classic "romance-fight-reconciliation" for f!shep and "building friendship-messed up feelings-romance" for m!shep.

I would agree with you with the non specific romance lines, but they were pretty different (if we take into acount their budget for s/s), two exclusive date variants for m!shep and in the sex scene he mentions shepard being too focused on the work in ME. Plus, in the first goddbye sceene, while he just smiles at f!shep, he says to m!shep they are "brothers in arms" besides lovers.
There's only two flirt lines and some of the goodbyes shared by both.

Also, Kaidan's s/s romance is more about the two of them being awkward around each other and not been able to say how they really feel without beating around the bush (Shep teases him in the date with the someone comment and they only say ILY directly, right before the end which makes it more powerful). With femshep, he's more confident and I lost the count of the times he says ILY, though I just can't see them together (well, yes...on youtube).

That said, I also like Cortez as both a friend and a romance, so I would say to the OP he should try both of them since they are different worrthy experiences and they are both very well done.

It never crossed my mind to measure Kaidan's gender specificity nor to oppose straight Kaidan vs. gay Kaidan chemistry level. Looks like you gave this quite some amount of thought. Unlike you, i don't find Alenko's straight romance arc to be cliché and i can honestly say it summons quite a large amount of different sorts of chemistries from my femShep and I, but hey, guess what, i'm a straight woman.

To answer OP, even if i never played as gay broShep, i wouldn't probably ask that question as such for myself. Question is rather: does your Shep prefer Kaidan or Steve? I'd just pick whomever i like the most, and go ahead with him. They're both lovely characters, even though Steve's arc may be a bit rushed indeed imo.

From ME3 though, I always felt Kaidan was a bit of a Mr. Perfect type, while Steve felt more real.

Modifié par Mimitochan, 23 août 2012 - 03:13 .

[bas_kon]

Mimitochan wrote...
It never crossed my mind to measure Kaidan's gender specificity nor to oppose straight Kaidan vs. gay Kaidan chemistry level. Looks like you gave this quite some amount of thought. Unlike you, i don't find Alenko's straight romance arc to be cliché and i can honestly say it summons quite a large amount of different sorts of chemistries from my femShep and I, but hey, guess what, i'm a straight woman.

I think I never specifically said anything about fshep chemestry with him since I only played lesbian ones. But as I saw it in ME3, Kaidan was more confident with femshep and more awkward with maleshep (necessary to justify their decission of not letting mshep romance him in ME1). And technically, their tension in ME was because of the tension between his female counterpart as well, but to me, it was more palpable with maleshep because he didn't say anything about it.

I saw quite a few comments over BSN made by fshep players about the differences between the two romances, meaning Kaidan doesn't really like mshep but he's just settling for him becuse he doesn't have time to find a woman. There are plenty on the Normandy and the CItadel, and he even had two years without Shepard to find one. He wants Shepard not matter if male or female. And as a bisexual man myself, I can tell woman or man is not important at all.

People putting words in my mouth irks me...didn't say the word cliché, did I? I said it's the same romance I can see in movies and tv shows, but it's because I've being seeing straight romance arcs for 26 years, so I saw them all. I would also say it's a classic if either Kaidan or mshep had troubles getting out of the closet and they ended up flying alone after finding themselves.

PS: I didn't give that much thought to that, too bussy trying to not get me and my wife caught by the recession irl. I'm just annoed by some women trying to turn us bi men into something we're not, be that either gay or straight.

Modifié par bas_kon, 25 août 2012 - 02:41 .

[lillitheris]

It’s only bisexuality if you like both men and women (and inbetween) simultaneously, in the same universe (=same playthrough)

[bas_kon]

Flog61 wrote...
A lot of my bisexual friends say that it can be harder for them to find a relationship because the partner will think that he would not be satisfied with them, and that they will still want to have sex with both men and women.


They say that it's more they are capable of being in a relationship with either; it doesn't mean they want to be in a relationship with both.

However, i think it's unrealistic for femshep/kaidan to not acknowledge that he likes men too at all.

Agreed, that's why I find annoying people who don't understand our sexuality. I'm lucky, though, I found a real woman such as my wife. With Kaidan, I just feel related when some people say he's straight when, cannonically, he's not.

I also agree about Kaidan commenting on other men, but I think it's just to protect the "poor straight people". Males don't get the gay shoved down their throats (like they said about Steve, who pronounced the word husband twice in the whole game) and the insecure females (until recently I didn't know such beings existed) can headcannon them as straight, so they won't cheat on them with a man, because "straight man" Jacob didn't cheat...
Plus, he only lightly comments on a robot with boobs and a deadly shemale alien apart from you, so it doesn't count.

@Lillitheris: That's utterly ignorant and offensive. FYI, I don't like men and women simultaneously, I like one person and that person happens to be either a man or a woman or blond or dark haired.
Bisexuality is the potential to love and enjoy intimacy with someone no matter their gender. And by that definition, Kaidan is bisexual, since he has the potencial to love Shepard no mater their gender.

Anyways Flog, both romances are exceptionaly well done, I love them both, though I have a soft spot for Kaidan because he's like me. Did you decide who to romance first yet?

Modifié par bas_kon, 25 août 2012 - 07:09 .

[lillitheris]

@bas_kon: That’s not what I was saying at all, sorry, particularly since I identify that way too…

My view is simply that Kaidan is not (necessarily) the same person in different playthroughs. It’s a different view of the character.

If he expresses interest in both sexes (whether actually or in your headcanon) during the course of a single playthrough, with a single Shepard, then he is bisexual. If he is only interested in one (in that single playthrough, whether actually or in your headcanon), then he is not bisexual.

It’s not the same universe, it’s not (necessarily) the same character—just like Shepard isn’t.

Edit: and, anyway, this was just a side point regarding the silly “omg they made X bisex” arguments that, apparently, we need not dwell on.

Modifié par lillitheris, 25 août 2012 - 07:37 .

[IllusiveManJr]

I honestly didn't like Steve. It felt like every time I went to chat with him, he had to remind me that he's gay. It got annoying.
The Kaidan one I did by accident. We were chatting at the Apollo Cafe and next thing I knew Liara was telling me that I shacked up with him or something. It was well thought out though. Believable.

[bas_kon]

@lillitheris: Ok, I thought you meant bisexuals as a whole. This is a game in which we can all have different cannons, I just hate when people try to mess up with mine, like someone saying oh Kaidan is playing f'shep in the gay romance just to irk people.

@The illusiveman11: Did she? I had a straight modded romance with Liara to experiment (only played the lesbian one) but after I had the date with Kaidan she just went into the friendship path without mentioning him at all and I didn't even breakup with her before the coup. Did I do something wrong?

Modifié par bas_kon, 26 août 2012 - 06:08 .

[Mimitochan]

bas_kon wrote...

Mimitochan wrote...
It never crossed my mind to measure Kaidan's gender specificity nor to oppose straight Kaidan vs. gay Kaidan chemistry level. Looks like you gave this quite some amount of thought. Unlike you, i don't find Alenko's straight romance arc to be cliché and i can honestly say it summons quite a large amount of different sorts of chemistries from my femShep and I, but hey, guess what, i'm a straight woman.

I think I never specifically said anything about fshep chemestry with him since I only played lesbian ones. But as I saw it in ME3, Kaidan was more confident with femshep and more awkward with maleshep (necessary to justify their decission of not letting mshep romance him in ME1). And technically, their tension in ME was because of the tension between his female counterpart as well, but to me, it was more palpable with maleshep because he didn't say anything about it.

I saw quite a few comments over BSN made by fshep players about the differences between the two romances, meaning Kaidan doesn't really like mshep but he's just settling for him becuse he doesn't have time to find a woman. There are plenty on the Normandy and the CItadel, and he even had two years without Shepard to find one. He wants Shepard not matter if male or female. And as a bisexual man myself, I can tell woman or man is not important at all.

People putting words in my mouth irks me...didn't say the word cliché, did I? I said it's the same romance I can see in movies and tv shows, but it's because I've being seeing straight romance arcs for 26 years, so I saw them all. I would also say it's a classic if either Kaidan or mshep had troubles getting out of the closet and they ended up flying alone after finding themselves.

PS: I didn't give that much thought to that, too bussy trying to not get me and my wife caught by the recession irl. I'm just annoed by some women trying to turn us bi men into something we're not, be that either gay or straight.

Hi, since you took the time to answer, i'll write back, but i'll try to make this as short as possible since this is really OT.
Since OP is apparently trying to figure out with which romance to go between Steve and Kaidan (as gay or bi mShep I assume), I was really expecting people to discuss which character they prefered, not which is more "gay-fitting", sorry, for lack of better word.

First of all, I still have no idea about your sexual identity, and it's none of my business. I have the feeling that if you had stated somewhere that you were bi, i woudn't have bothered posting this. Maybe. I pointed out that I am a straight woman because there is a very simple fact i've learned from here: Kaidan is exactly who you want him to be, sexual identity included. As a straight woman, i love straight men and i love his straight romance arc throughout the series, although i'd whole-heartedly agree ME3 Shenko is really cliché (cliché is not a foul word, Cinderella invented it) and would have been really happy if ME1 had been the last ME game.

If we're talking about Kaidan's sexual identity as a video game item, Kaidan from ME1 is straight (= available only for femShep). Kaidan's sexual identity as a video game item from ME3 changed (= available for both fShep & mShep) which is breaking the character's consistency, as a video game item. And I value consistency. All the more so when it comes to Kaidan.

I'll repeat this, anybody wondering who one's Shep should romance, just try it, and decide for oneself.
Listing pros and cons is just pointless.
Unless somebody points out to me what is a good romance option and what criteria i should take into consideration to allocate points, this will remain my view on the subject.

Modifié par Mimitochan, 26 août 2012 - 10:31 .