Hawke just happens to be around in act 3
With my mage hawke silly, living three years in a city with growing mage templar tensions.
Oh and nobody wonders i run around with an staff in mage robes, only thing missing the pointy hat with stars on it..
joining Anders in blowing up some templar estate would be logical, the story ends the way it already does and make a good twist.
DA2 is the most reactive game ever done by BioWare...
Débuté par
Darth Death
, août 25 2012 08:34
Retour en haut
#152
Posté 31 août 2012 - 03:56
Darth Death
-
- Members
- 2 396 messages
What the? How did you come to that conclusion? Where have I undermined Anders other traits?Plaintiff wrote...
So when you talk about your friends and family, you consider whether or not they like cats do be a defining aspect of their personality.Darth Death wrote...
To me, those aspects of his character were important, but that's merely what I think. AmstradHero did a good job expressing what I felt about Anders fate.Plaintiff wrote...
He never stopped being friendly and he never stopped loving cats, and those were never the most important aspects of his personality.Darth Death wrote...
Anders in Awakening: A friendly cat lover that told jokes.:innocent:Renmiri1 wrote...
If you play Awakenings again, try defending Amarantine at first, then abandoning it and going back to Vigil's keep with Anders in the party. You will see DA2 Anders there.
DA2 Anders is all there on DAA, he just masks it very well with humor.
For the opposite experience, when Anders asks your help on act 3, try choosing the "What aren't you telling me prompt (right after you investigate his proposal). He goes back to DA Awakening Anders and jokes about a lurid dream with a naked Elthina and a glowing cheese wheel. He does that to use humor to prevent you from guessing what he is really up to.
Anders in DA2: A derange terrorist that told jokes.
You've grossly oversimplified Anders' character in both games, and completely disregarded the extensive development he undergoes in DA2, so I can only conclude that you don't want complex characters that grow, but would prefer shallow caricatures that don't challenge you in any way.
Anders friendly cat loving personality is what I like about him. Maybe you didn't find those characteristics significant, but I did. That doesn't mean I "grossly oversimplified Anders' character" at all, it means I've acknowledged Anders' character differently from your own perception, since you didn't find Anders "friendly cat loving" personality important in comparison to his of traits. I didn't like how grand cleric elthina (and any others that) had to die when Anders lost it. Yes, I understand it was apart of his character development & can appreciate a well written character despite a tragic outcome, but that doesn't mean I've to like it in some particular cases. I've that much power at least.
Edit: This thread developed faster than I thought. I won't be able to read all the comments thus far since I'll be gone for a few days. I apologize for derailing my own thread.
Modifié par Darth Death, 31 août 2012 - 04:17 .
#153
Posté 31 août 2012 - 06:49
Renmiri1
-
- Members
- 6 009 messages
Act 3 was rushed. Anders goes from friend / LI to terrorist too abruptly.
I understand why he didn't tell Hawke but I cling to one line of writing for that understanding: "You would have tried to stop me.. or worse you could have tried to help me and I couldn't allow that"
He loves Hawke - romanced or not Anders has a big crush on Hawke - so he doesn't want to get Hawke in danger. Also he knows what he is doing is bad (there is a dialog with Isabella where he says it). Anders does not want Hawke to "get his/her hands dirty" with the bombing. In his mind, he is protecting Hawke's physically and emotionally: Hawke will not be arrested and Hawke will not have to regret killing innocents. He has told a LI Hawke that he would "drown us in blood to keep you safe" and he meant every word. (*)
On "protecting Hawke physically" Anders is absolutely right. Hawke might get into hot water for being Anders friend or LI but people clearly see he/ she was not involved. Even Meredith says "it doesn't matter".
Ofc on the "protecting Hawke emotionally" Anders is full of sh*t. Hawke will get pretty pi$$ed and hurt by the surprise and Anders lack of trust (if he agrees with Anders) or lack of sense (if he disagrees with the bombing). And anyone, friend or LI will get pretty peeved at being railroaded into a standoff where you have to pick sides. I think this is where game players feel DA2 is not "reactive". Anders railroads Hawke, so they feel Bioware railroaded them into an ending they dislike.
After the initial shock, I could still finish the game and enjoy many replays but I admit to being a bit miffed at first. I blame the rushed writing on Act 3 for it.
I didn't feel any more "railroaded" by Bioware than I felt on DAO knowing the Archdemon had to die. Sure you can chose who kills the Archdemon but the Archdemon dies in 100% of gameplays. The Landsmeet happens in 100% of gameplays. Duncan dies in 100% of gameplays. Loghain betrays his king.. Need I go on ? All games have fixed plot events. The chantry bombing was just another one IMHO. The rushed writing made some people feel cheated out of the power to change it but those same people do not complain Duncan and Cailan die. Or that Loghain starts a civil war. They had no power into those events, yet players don't feel forced into it. Why ? Suberb writing.
On replays, picking other less "trust Anders" dialog options I found out that Anders pretty much tells you he will kill innocents to free mages and wants to keep you out of it
I also found out that if you let Anders go at first you meet him again at the gallows and get a much better LI goodbye if you sided with mages, or a much more bloody opportunity to kill him in battle if you sided with themplars (and you also break his heart). And you get to tell off Sebastian !
(*)
It gives me chills when he says that because reading his short story we can see that Anders + Justice unrestrained have the power to pretty much "drown in blood" anyone they want.
I understand why he didn't tell Hawke but I cling to one line of writing for that understanding: "You would have tried to stop me.. or worse you could have tried to help me and I couldn't allow that"
He loves Hawke - romanced or not Anders has a big crush on Hawke - so he doesn't want to get Hawke in danger. Also he knows what he is doing is bad (there is a dialog with Isabella where he says it). Anders does not want Hawke to "get his/her hands dirty" with the bombing. In his mind, he is protecting Hawke's physically and emotionally: Hawke will not be arrested and Hawke will not have to regret killing innocents. He has told a LI Hawke that he would "drown us in blood to keep you safe" and he meant every word. (*)
On "protecting Hawke physically" Anders is absolutely right. Hawke might get into hot water for being Anders friend or LI but people clearly see he/ she was not involved. Even Meredith says "it doesn't matter".
Ofc on the "protecting Hawke emotionally" Anders is full of sh*t. Hawke will get pretty pi$$ed and hurt by the surprise and Anders lack of trust (if he agrees with Anders) or lack of sense (if he disagrees with the bombing). And anyone, friend or LI will get pretty peeved at being railroaded into a standoff where you have to pick sides. I think this is where game players feel DA2 is not "reactive". Anders railroads Hawke, so they feel Bioware railroaded them into an ending they dislike.
After the initial shock, I could still finish the game and enjoy many replays but I admit to being a bit miffed at first. I blame the rushed writing on Act 3 for it.
I didn't feel any more "railroaded" by Bioware than I felt on DAO knowing the Archdemon had to die. Sure you can chose who kills the Archdemon but the Archdemon dies in 100% of gameplays. The Landsmeet happens in 100% of gameplays. Duncan dies in 100% of gameplays. Loghain betrays his king.. Need I go on ? All games have fixed plot events. The chantry bombing was just another one IMHO. The rushed writing made some people feel cheated out of the power to change it but those same people do not complain Duncan and Cailan die. Or that Loghain starts a civil war. They had no power into those events, yet players don't feel forced into it. Why ? Suberb writing.
On replays, picking other less "trust Anders" dialog options I found out that Anders pretty much tells you he will kill innocents to free mages and wants to keep you out of it
I also found out that if you let Anders go at first you meet him again at the gallows and get a much better LI goodbye if you sided with mages, or a much more bloody opportunity to kill him in battle if you sided with themplars (and you also break his heart). And you get to tell off Sebastian !
(*)
It gives me chills when he says that because reading his short story we can see that Anders + Justice unrestrained have the power to pretty much "drown in blood" anyone they want.
Modifié par Renmiri1, 31 août 2012 - 07:20 .
#154
Posté 31 août 2012 - 07:19
PounceTeazle
-
- Members
- 33 messages
What irks me is that anders does something and thats it.
Ir does not matter how you interact with him and he is default pro mage.
I do not mind that he is 100% pro mage and an lunatic but it feels as if it does not matter if you interact with him or not beside some different audio.
An npc does his thing in game, with an companion i expect some sort of meaningful interaction (and not just another romance option), not that i am able to change what the character does but an slightly different outcome depending on what i do (how hawke decides and acts) otherwise why bother.
Ir does not matter how you interact with him and he is default pro mage.
I do not mind that he is 100% pro mage and an lunatic but it feels as if it does not matter if you interact with him or not beside some different audio.
An npc does his thing in game, with an companion i expect some sort of meaningful interaction (and not just another romance option), not that i am able to change what the character does but an slightly different outcome depending on what i do (how hawke decides and acts) otherwise why bother.
#155
Posté 31 août 2012 - 07:23
Renmiri1
-
- Members
- 6 009 messages
PounceTeazle wrote...
What irks me is that anders does something and thats it.
Ir does not matter how you interact with him and he is default pro mage.
I do not mind that he is 100% pro mage and an lunatic but it feels as if it does not matter if you interact with him or not beside some different audio.
An npc does his thing in game, with an companion i expect some sort of meaningful interaction (and not just another romance option), not that i am able to change what the character does but an slightly different outcome depending on what i do (how hawke decides and acts) otherwise why bother.
You actually decide whether he lives or dies. Can't have more influence than that.
Anders is suicidal but if you ask for his help or if you side with templars he will stay alive to help mages and you. Or help mages and tell you you broke his heart (pot meet kettle, black). He might even help Templars (but then he SPOILER:().
PS: Is like Alistair and making Loghain a Warden. There is no middle ground, you either agree with Alibear or you lose him forever. Same here, with the addition of you actually being able to kill Anders yourself.
Modifié par Renmiri1, 01 septembre 2012 - 05:26 .
#156
Posté 31 août 2012 - 07:25
PounceTeazle
-
- Members
- 33 messages
Regarding BIG plot stuff i do not mind, it is history bigger than the PC can change, when the player enters the scene calin will die and the archdemon is on the move, things to big to change for the player, the deceit was decided already.
Theese things happen out of the sphere of the player and can not be changed, if the player solves the werewolf plague or just kills of the elves and has the weres as allies is an decision player based.
You can be the warden who selfish only saves his own hide killing the archdemon or the shiney knight who does it "because it is the right thing to do"
options!
In DA2 you decide if you join the mages or templars and that is it. how your character actet before does not matter much.
Theese things happen out of the sphere of the player and can not be changed, if the player solves the werewolf plague or just kills of the elves and has the weres as allies is an decision player based.
You can be the warden who selfish only saves his own hide killing the archdemon or the shiney knight who does it "because it is the right thing to do"
options!
In DA2 you decide if you join the mages or templars and that is it. how your character actet before does not matter much.
#157
Posté 31 août 2012 - 07:31
Renmiri1
-
- Members
- 6 009 messages
But the Mage x Templar war is a very big decision. Bigger than Cailan's life actually. DA2 had to end with the war starting.
Ferelden still beat the Blight even after Cailan's death so his living or dying just made things harder but had no lasting impact. The Mage / Templar war will cause the entire planet to be at war. And is fundamental for DA3 to have a story, according to Bioware's Mike Laidlaw and others. They say Dragon Age is essentially a political story of a world in the brink of civil war.
Ferelden still beat the Blight even after Cailan's death so his living or dying just made things harder but had no lasting impact. The Mage / Templar war will cause the entire planet to be at war. And is fundamental for DA3 to have a story, according to Bioware's Mike Laidlaw and others. They say Dragon Age is essentially a political story of a world in the brink of civil war.
Modifié par Renmiri1, 31 août 2012 - 07:32 .
#158
Posté 31 août 2012 - 07:34
PounceTeazle
-
- Members
- 33 messages
So you can not steer him lets say to bomb the templar HQ (that would ****** off the KC too enough who only looks for an reason to off the mages but you can steer him to violate pretty much all he believes in to the point of suicide helping you against the mages...Renmiri1 wrote...
You actually decide whether he lives or dies. Can't have more influence than that.
Anders is suicidal but if you ask for his help or if you side with templars he will stay alive to help mages and you. Or help mages and tell you you broke his heart (pot meet kettle, black). He might even help Templars (but then he commits suicide).
PS: Is like Alistair and making Loghain a Warden. There is no middle ground, you either agree with Alibear or you lose him forever. Same here, with the addition of you actually being able to kill /anders yourself.
That is why i have an problem with DA2, companions do stupid things (like merrill helping you against the mages when the templars BBQ an elf alive to get to an mage they house.
(or even accepting an mage Hawk helping them when they are out to kill every mage in kirkwall and the circle because hawk is the "champion")
If you play an mage in DA2 he outcome should be mage side (or you play an char with suicidal tendencies), or does anyone really think the KC would thank hawk for the help and they all live happy and in peace together?
An Hawk with an bloodmage elven romance in kirkwall with an KC who desires to off any mage at the slightest transgression.
My suspension of disbelief meter went pop !
#159
Posté 31 août 2012 - 07:38
PounceTeazle
-
- Members
- 33 messages
As said, i do not mind that it has to end with an mage templar war, I just feel that inside the sphere of influence hawk has things are too railroaded.
The KC is nuts and then the Lyrium sword topples her completly over, Hawk sees that only in the last moment before the big stand off so it is logical hawk can do nothing against it, perfect logical.
But the interaction with the companions is in hawks sphere of influence and there you can hire mages into helping the templars who want to kill EVERY mage, including an mage Hawk, that is where is just think it is off.
The KC makes it very clear ALL mages have to die.
The KC is nuts and then the Lyrium sword topples her completly over, Hawk sees that only in the last moment before the big stand off so it is logical hawk can do nothing against it, perfect logical.
But the interaction with the companions is in hawks sphere of influence and there you can hire mages into helping the templars who want to kill EVERY mage, including an mage Hawk, that is where is just think it is off.
The KC makes it very clear ALL mages have to die.
#160
Posté 31 août 2012 - 07:38
Renmiri1
-
- Members
- 6 009 messages
PounceTeazle wrote...
So you can not steer him lets say to bomb the templar HQ (that would ****** off the KC too enough who only looks for an reason to off the mages but you can steer him to violate pretty much all he believes in to the point of suicide helping you against the mages...Renmiri1 wrote...
You actually decide whether he lives or dies. Can't have more influence than that.
Anders is suicidal but if you ask for his help or if you side with templars he will stay alive to help mages and you. Or help mages and tell you you broke his heart (pot meet kettle, black). He might even help Templars (but then he commits suicide
PS: Is like Alistair and making Loghain a Warden. There is no middle ground, you either agree with Alibear or you lose him forever. Same here, with the addition of you actually being able to kill /anders yourself.
That is why i have an problem with DA2, companions do stupid things (like merrill helping you against the mages when the templars BBQ an elf alive to get to an mage they house.
(or even accepting an mage Hawk helping them when they are out to kill every mage in kirkwall and the circle because hawk is the "champion")
If you play an mage in DA2 he outcome should be mage side (or you play an char with suicidal tendencies), or does anyone really think the KC would thank hawk for the help and they all live happy and in peace together?
An Hawk with an bloodmage elven romance in kirkwall with an KC who desires to off any mage at the slightest transgression.
My suspension of disbelief meter went pop !
No disagreement there.
We should have been able to steer Anders to attack the Gallows not the Chantry. We should also not have been able to steer Merril to help Templars.
#161
Posté 31 août 2012 - 07:50
PounceTeazle
-
- Members
- 33 messages
[quote]Renmiri1 wrote...
[quote]PounceTeazle wrote...
[quote]Renmiri1 wrote...
You actually decide whether he lives or dies. Can't have more influence than that.
[/quote]
I tell him always " You made a mess bub now come and help to sort it out, no easy way out pulling the matyr number"
But i side with the mages anyways always (Merrill makes always theese big puppy eyes when i ponder templars, and Carver is such an jerk joining them is not an option anyways)
[quote]PounceTeazle wrote...
[quote]Renmiri1 wrote...
You actually decide whether he lives or dies. Can't have more influence than that.
[/quote]
I tell him always " You made a mess bub now come and help to sort it out, no easy way out pulling the matyr number"
But i side with the mages anyways always (Merrill makes always theese big puppy eyes when i ponder templars, and Carver is such an jerk joining them is not an option anyways)
#162
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 12:15
JohnCena94
-
- Members
- 158 messages
[/quote]
Doesn't have as many choices as the others I played, and most of the choices you do make are ultimately pointless.
[/quote]
I agree. No matter who you side with Orsino and Meredith both die in the ending, and just about all the mages die (btw I think more mages live if you side with the templars which I found very strange). Origins in contrast allowed you to side with Loghain, pick who rules Ferleden, take Morrigan's offer/or decide who makes the final blow.
Doesn't have as many choices as the others I played, and most of the choices you do make are ultimately pointless.
[/quote]
I agree. No matter who you side with Orsino and Meredith both die in the ending, and just about all the mages die (btw I think more mages live if you side with the templars which I found very strange). Origins in contrast allowed you to side with Loghain, pick who rules Ferleden, take Morrigan's offer/or decide who makes the final blow.
#163
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 12:37
Realmzmaster
-
- Members
- 5 510 messages
[quote]JohnCena94 wrote...
Doesn't have as many choices as the others I played, and most of the choices you do make are ultimately pointless.
I agree. No matter who you side with Orsino and Meredith both die in the ending, and just about all the mages die (btw I think more mages live if you side with the templars which I found very strange). Origins in contrast allowed you to side with Loghain, pick who rules Ferleden, take Morrigan's offer/or decide who makes the final blow.[/quote]
[/quote]
DAO does not allow the warden to side with Loghain. It allows the warden to decide whether he lives or dies. Riordan suggest that Loghain be allowed to an attempt at becoming a Grey Warden. Anora his daughter jumps at that chance because it could keep her father alive. The warden can say no and kill Loghain. The warden never sides or can side with Loghain because Loghain does not believe the wardens are necessary to defeat the Blight. It gives the same choice that Hawke has with Anders. Let him live or kill him. And the warden could not allow Alistair to duel him other wise Loghain was dead.
Doesn't have as many choices as the others I played, and most of the choices you do make are ultimately pointless.
I agree. No matter who you side with Orsino and Meredith both die in the ending, and just about all the mages die (btw I think more mages live if you side with the templars which I found very strange). Origins in contrast allowed you to side with Loghain, pick who rules Ferleden, take Morrigan's offer/or decide who makes the final blow.[/quote]
[/quote]
DAO does not allow the warden to side with Loghain. It allows the warden to decide whether he lives or dies. Riordan suggest that Loghain be allowed to an attempt at becoming a Grey Warden. Anora his daughter jumps at that chance because it could keep her father alive. The warden can say no and kill Loghain. The warden never sides or can side with Loghain because Loghain does not believe the wardens are necessary to defeat the Blight. It gives the same choice that Hawke has with Anders. Let him live or kill him. And the warden could not allow Alistair to duel him other wise Loghain was dead.
Modifié par Realmzmaster, 01 septembre 2012 - 12:50 .
#164
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 12:51
JohnCena94
-
- Members
- 158 messages
[quote]Realmzmaster wrote...
[quote]JohnCena94 wrote...
Doesn't have as many choices as the others I played, and most of the choices you do make are ultimately pointless.
I agree. No matter who you side with Orsino and Meredith both die in the ending, and just about all the mages die (btw I think more mages live if you side with the templars which I found very strange). Origins in contrast allowed you to side with Loghain, pick who rules Ferleden, take Morrigan's offer/or decide who makes the final blow.[/quote]
[/quote]
DAO does not allow the warden to side with Loghain. It allows the warden to decide whether he lives or dies. Riordan suggest that Loghain be allowed to an attempt at becoming a Grey Warden. Anora his daughter jumps at that chance because it could keep her father alive. The warden can say no and kill Loghain. The warden never sides or can side with Loghain because Loghain does not believe the wardens are necessary to defeat the Blight. It gives the same choice that Hawke has with Anders. Let him live or kill him.
[/quote]I met that it allowed you to side with Loghain as oppsed to Alistar, my bad. (Please don't bring up Sebastin as you could prove me wrong again. I know it is sort of the same, but Loghain/Alistar has a little bit more of a effect on the story, though this could change in DA3.)
[quote]JohnCena94 wrote...
Doesn't have as many choices as the others I played, and most of the choices you do make are ultimately pointless.
I agree. No matter who you side with Orsino and Meredith both die in the ending, and just about all the mages die (btw I think more mages live if you side with the templars which I found very strange). Origins in contrast allowed you to side with Loghain, pick who rules Ferleden, take Morrigan's offer/or decide who makes the final blow.[/quote]
[/quote]
DAO does not allow the warden to side with Loghain. It allows the warden to decide whether he lives or dies. Riordan suggest that Loghain be allowed to an attempt at becoming a Grey Warden. Anora his daughter jumps at that chance because it could keep her father alive. The warden can say no and kill Loghain. The warden never sides or can side with Loghain because Loghain does not believe the wardens are necessary to defeat the Blight. It gives the same choice that Hawke has with Anders. Let him live or kill him.
[/quote]I met that it allowed you to side with Loghain as oppsed to Alistar, my bad. (Please don't bring up Sebastin as you could prove me wrong again. I know it is sort of the same, but Loghain/Alistar has a little bit more of a effect on the story, though this could change in DA3.)
#165
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 02:13
Renmiri1
-
- Members
- 6 009 messages
Not really, Loghain or Alistair the blight ends, Archdemon dies, OGB can be conceived, Warden can do US. The only thing that changes is Alistair's fate. Ferelden gets united regardless. Under Queen Anora , King Alistair or both
What people fail to see, because Bioware didn't add it to the PR materials is that DA2 is essentially the story of how the Mage / Templar war started. Just look at the setting. A Seeker comes to know what happened, how it happened, what did this "Champion" do to start the conflict that is tearing Thedas apart.
No matter what you do in DAO the story is about ending the Blight. No matter what you do in DA2 the story is about how the mage / templar war started.
What people fail to see, because Bioware didn't add it to the PR materials is that DA2 is essentially the story of how the Mage / Templar war started. Just look at the setting. A Seeker comes to know what happened, how it happened, what did this "Champion" do to start the conflict that is tearing Thedas apart.
No matter what you do in DAO the story is about ending the Blight. No matter what you do in DA2 the story is about how the mage / templar war started.
Modifié par Renmiri1, 01 septembre 2012 - 02:15 .
#166
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 02:19
Spicen
-
- Members
- 902 messages
Renmiri1 wrote...
Not really, Loghain or Alistair the blight ends, Archdemon dies, OGB can be conceived, Warden can do US. The only thing that changes is Alistair's fate. Ferelden gets united regardless. Under Queen Anora , King Alistair or both
What people fail to see, because Bioware didn't add it to the PR materials is that DA2 is essentially the story of how the Mage / Templar war started. Just look at the setting. A Seeker comes to know what happened, how it happened, what did this "Champion" do to start the conflict that is tearing Thedas apart.
No matter what you do in DAO the story is about ending the Blight. No matter what you do in DA2 the story is about how the mage / templar war started.
But the war should have ended in DA 2. I did not get to enjoy my Champion status, i could not take advantage of it. The game was clewarly rushed. Darn it!
#167
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 06:14
Sylvius the Mad
-
- Members
- 24 118 messages
Except here the midfielder is an unwitting rube.Xewaka wrote...
In football (or soccer if you're from the USA) terms, Hawke is a midfielder doing the pass, Anders the striker securing the goal.
I'm pretty sure David Beckham is aware he's helping his team score.
#168
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 07:32
Renmiri1
-
- Members
- 6 009 messages
Spicen wrote...
But the war should have ended in DA 2. I did not get to enjoy my Champion status, i could not take advantage of it. The game was clewarly rushed. Darn it!
I get the impression DA2 was preparing the scenario for DA3 or a slew of war based DLCs. And ya, Act 3 was rushed and we got no time to absorb the shock of seeing a war starting, when we were expecting a "rags to riches" story. Is like winning the lottery and then being hit by a car before you barely got to spend any money
Sylvius the Mad wrote...
Except here the midfielder is an unwitting rube.
I'm pretty sure David Beckham is aware he's helping his team score.
There are actually two or three ocasions that you can tell Anders you know there is a war going on. When he talks to you right after offering his pillow to Varric, you can say it and he says "I knew you would understand".
We should have known a war was getting started.. This is where a rushed Act 3 damaged the game a bit. We are caught completely by surprise. I only noticed those prompts on a replay.
Modifié par Renmiri1, 01 septembre 2012 - 07:38 .
#169
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 09:04
AmstradHero
-
- Members
- 1 239 messages
The problem is that BioWare marketed DA2 as a "Rise to Power" and a hero's journey. Chalk it up as another awful gaffe from the marketing team, of which there were many. DA2 and ME3 have both been party to some awful marketing which gave people some specific expectations that in many cases were not met by those games.Renmiri1 wrote...
What people fail to see, because Bioware didn't add it to the PR materials is that DA2 is essentially the story of how the Mage / Templar war started. Just look at the setting. A Seeker comes to know what happened, how it happened, what did this "Champion" do to start the conflict that is tearing Thedas apart.
No matter what you do in DAO the story is about ending the Blight. No matter what you do in DA2 the story is about how the mage / templar war started.
People expect BioWare games to be reactive to their decisions and have well written stories. People barely bat an eyelid at the tripe that passes for writing in things like Call of Duty and Halo, but if you got that in a BioWare game, people would be bringing out the pitchforks. BioWare developed a reputation for writing and choice, so when they make promises on those issues and people don't believe they deliver, they get a lot of criticism. If that's what you're promoting in your PR material, then I'd consider that entirely valid.
#170
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 10:12
PounceTeazle
-
- Members
- 33 messages
That's why I buy them, noone can claim that the game mechanics are special, Ultima had it already on the 486AmstradHero wrote...
People expect BioWare games to be reactive to their decisions and have well written stories. People barely bat an eyelid at the tripe that passes for writing in things like Call of Duty and Halo, but if you got that in a BioWare game, people would be bringing out the pitchforks. BioWare developed a reputation for writing and choice, so when they make promises on those issues and people don't believe they deliver, they get a lot of criticism. If that's what you're promoting in your PR material, then I'd consider that entirely valid.
And they do this consolification now so even more minus to gamemechanics an UI
The thing Bioware did shine so faar was story but they seem to go the flasgy effects and "Do it all with 7 buttos" style.
One of the reasons I have my doubts about DA3, I will see what happens but if it turns out like DA2 why bother, console games are there in masses and cheaper.
#171
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 11:38
Firky
-
- Members
- 2 140 messages
Renmiri1 wrote...
He might even help Templars (but then he ........
He bloody did what?
(Wow, I had no idea.)
#172
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 02:47
RinpocheSchnozberry
-
- Members
- 6 212 messages
DAO was BioWare's more reactive game. Most people who played it were so bored they didn't finish it and didn't play the sequel. DAO... bad game!
#173
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 02:55
Fisto The Sexbot
-
- Members
- 701 messages
DA 2 was BioWare's most reactive game = most people who like RPGs were repulsed by it...?
#174
Posté 01 septembre 2012 - 03:16
LinksOcarina
-
- Members
- 6 571 messages
PounceTeazle wrote...
What irks me is that anders does something and thats it.
Ir does not matter how you interact with him and he is default pro mage.
I do not mind that he is 100% pro mage and an lunatic but it feels as if it does not matter if you interact with him or not beside some different audio.
An npc does his thing in game, with an companion i expect some sort of meaningful interaction (and not just another romance option), not that i am able to change what the character does but an slightly different outcome depending on what i do (how hawke decides and acts) otherwise why bother.
Because attempting to stop him, and failing to do so makes the story even more tragic.
The point behind Ander's as a character is to show the manifestation of the mages plight to an extreme method, and to make it personal because you know him, or even worse in some cases, you are in love with him. Ander's is either a Terrorist or a Freedom Fighter, but that is up for Hawke to decide, and in the same vein, the player, based on his actions.
The slightly different outcome is you trying to stop him, and his fate after the event. Does it do anything? No, he still goes forth with his plans irregardless of what you say before. What you say after is also important to what happens as well, because his fate is still an important choice for both this game, and the next.
#175
Posté 03 septembre 2012 - 07:38
Malsumis
-
- Members
- 256 messages
My advice for Mike Laidlaw, go play Alpha Protocol, New Vegas and TW2. See how poorly DA2 does in terms of C&C compared to these games and write down these words; REAL and interesting C&C.
Also pass on this advice to the ME team.
Also pass on this advice to the ME team.
