658 réponses à ce sujet

[Shampoohorn]

corlist wrote...

Shampoohorn wrote...



Next request: Dragoons. They seem to get DR during their Smash animation. Is that actually the case? Maybe I'm just annoyed by their high armor value (>6000 4811 on Gold).

Dragoons don't have special DR. We shot them while they're running, leaping, smashing, heavy meleeing and rolling. The shots did the same damage.

Thanks for testing!

[vironblood]

chipsandwich wrote...

I don't know if this is already known, but what is the nature of the Barrier/Armor evolution for Smash?

Also, since the electrical DoT is affected by the total rather than the base damage, does it affect the electrical DoT damage against armor/barrier?

Smash test with evolution 2 Electrical Damage & evolution 5 Armor Damage on a Gold Dragoon.

Test Conclusions:
- Smash has an innate bonus mutliplier of 1.5 vs armor
- evolution 2 Electrical Damage is multiplicative
- evolution 5 Armor Damage is multiplicative
- evolution 2 Electrical Damage benefits from both the innate 1.5 modifier and the evolution 5 Armor Damage.

Test Results:
Damage: 2598.750244 //550 * (1 + 0.2 + 0.4 + 0.2) * 1.5 * 1.75 = 2598.75
Damage: 86.625000 //550 * (1 + 0.2 + 0.4 + 0.2) * 0.5 * 1.5 * 1.75 / 15 = 86.625
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000

DOT damage is done in 15 ticks over 7.5 sec

Modifiers:
20% Smash rank 3 Force & Damage
40% Smash evolution 3 Force & Damage
20% Power damage bonus from Phoenix Training passive

Modifié par vironblood, 12 novembre 2012 - 07:11 .

[Shampoohorn]

I'm rethinking the value of asari heavy melee. Three of the four asari get significant damage resistance from powers.

Justicar: 40% from bubble, 40% from reave
Vanguard: 50% post charge
Valkyrie: 50% from Tech Armor, plus shield boosts from A.Field.

Question: How much DR do the Asari get during a heavy melee attack?

[peddroelm]

Shampoohorn wrote...


I'm rethinking the value of asari heavy melee. Three of the four asari get significant damage resistance from powers.

Justicar: 40% from bubble, 40% from reave
Vanguard: 50% post charge
Valkyrie: 50% from Tech Armor, plus shield boosts from A.Field.

Question: How much DR do the Asari get during a heavy melee attack?

apparently is significant

[Bleachrude]

peddroelmz wrote...

Shampoohorn wrote...


I'm rethinking the value of asari heavy melee. Three of the four asari get significant damage resistance from powers.

Justicar: 40% from bubble, 40% from reave
Vanguard: 50% post charge
Valkyrie: 50% from Tech Armor, plus shield boosts from A.Field.

Question: How much DR do the Asari get during a heavy melee attack?

apparently is significant

Holy crap...

He two shot a gold brute using just heavy melee?

Damn.....

[Deerber]

Bleachrude wrote...

peddroelmz wrote...

Shampoohorn wrote...


I'm rethinking the value of asari heavy melee. Three of the four asari get significant damage resistance from powers.

Justicar: 40% from bubble, 40% from reave
Vanguard: 50% post charge
Valkyrie: 50% from Tech Armor, plus shield boosts from A.Field.

Question: How much DR do the Asari get during a heavy melee attack?

apparently is significant

Holy crap...

He two shot a gold brute using just heavy melee?

Damn.....

Actually, taking just a short glimpse on that video makes me think he does only 2 bars of damage. Which means he needs around 5 heavy melee to kill a brute.

[Shampoohorn]

Idle question:

Do tech bursts primed and/or triggered by infiltrators during tactical cloak get the 80% damage boost?

[d_nought]

vironblood wrote...

chipsandwich wrote...

I don't know if this is already known, but what is the nature of the Barrier/Armor evolution for Smash?

Also, since the electrical DoT is affected by the total rather than the base damage, does it affect the electrical DoT damage against armor/barrier?

Smash test with evolution 2 Electrical Damage & evolution 5 Armor Damage on a Gold Dragoon.

Test Conclusions:
- Smash has an innate bonus mutliplier of 1.5 vs armor
- evolution 2 Electrical Damage is multiplicative
- evolution 5 Armor Damage is multiplicative
- evolution 2 Electrical Damage benefits from both the innate 1.5 modifier and the evolution 5 Armor Damage.

Test Results:
Damage: 2598.750244 //550 * (1 + 0.2 + 0.4 + 0.2) * 1.5 * 1.75 = 2598.75
Damage: 86.625000 //550 * (1 + 0.2 + 0.4 + 0.2) * 0.5 * 1.5 * 1.75 / 15 = 86.625
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000
Damage: 86.625000

DOT damage is done in 15 ticks over 7.5 sec

Modifiers:
20% Smash rank 3 Force & Damage
40% Smash evolution 3 Force & Damage
20% Power damage bonus from Phoenix Training passive

Interesting, most of that was as I expected, but I looked in Eric Fagnan's thread on multipliers and Smash wasn't there at all. Thanks.

[peddroelm]

Shampoohorn wrote...


Idle question:

Do tech bursts primed and/or triggered by infiltrators during tactical cloak get the 80% damage boost?

 

no

[Grinch57]

OP, can you test the "bugged" weight penalty mods? Or is this outside the scope of what you want to do?

Some other folks have done great work on the weighted mods (Hyperionyht and Miaoven Winter especially), but the results have raised almost as many questions as they have answered. You are probably the gold standard for testing on BSN and I think your results would be definitive.

Background, it seems the weighted mods don't apply a weight penalty to certain weapons, but only under some specific conditions. Some of the conditions are DLC vs non-DLC weapon (plus the Raider), not using ULM on the other weapon. Host versus off host. Second and subsequent matches with the same host AND not viewing your weapons while in the lobby between matches.

As I said, lots of issues. But if certain conditions are met, HVB on a Wraith can be free of the weight penalty.

Also in the right circumstances, you could outfit a Disciple with the blade and HVB, put the HVB and thermal scope on a sniper rifle (four weight penalty mods total) and not experience a weight penalty to your CD.

Are you up for it or is this outside your area of interest in testing? As Miaoven Winter pointed out (very politely), my own testing methods were flawed, your data driven tests are what we really need.

[peddroelm]

Grinch57 wrote...

OP, can you test the "bugged" weight penalty mods? Or is this outside the scope of what you want to do?

Some other folks have done great work on the weighted mods (Hyperionyht and Miaoven Winter especially), but the results have raised almost as many questions as they have answered. You are probably the gold standard for testing on BSN and I think your results would be definitive.

Background, it seems the weighted mods don't apply a weight penalty to certain weapons, but only under some specific conditions. Some of the conditions are DLC vs non-DLC weapon (plus the Raider), not using ULM on the other weapon. Host versus off host. Second and subsequent matches with the same host AND not viewing your weapons while in the lobby between matches.

As I said, lots of issues. But if certain conditions are met, HVB on a Wraith can be free of the weight penalty.

Also in the right circumstances, you could outfit a Disciple with the blade and HVB, put the HVB and thermal scope on a sniper rifle (four weight penalty mods total) and not experience a weight penalty to your CD.

Are you up for it or is this outside your area of interest in testing? As Miaoven Winter pointed out (very politely), my own testing methods were flawed, your data driven tests are what we really need.

I don't have a precise method to measure cooldowns in game directly  (cooldowns do not affect damage inflicted - I can probably get close - like measuring number of shots under adrenaline rush bonus with a weapon with stable rof and big enough clip (could always exend with ammo packs) - and thus get a pretty accurate measurement of adrenaline rush cooldown for example but it would take so long to setup... And altering any of the parameters // weapons//add-on would require setting everything up again ) ... Frame analysis on recorded footage might work but either way it would require a huge amount of work for disputable results....  
So far it seems like too much work for me (I'm such a lazy bastard -)  if you could narrow it down to a few particular tests - I might convince myself to do the tests ...   

[Arctican]

Are Homing Grenades considered tech, or is it just the DOT effect, or neither (does the engineering kits affect the damage)? Asking for the sake of knowing if Tech Vulnerability from Sabotage benefits Homing Grenades or not. Also, I'm seeing a few posts from the past saying Arc Grenades aren't actually tech powers either.

Modifié par Arctican, 17 novembre 2012 - 04:45 .

[corlist]

Arctican wrote...

Are Homing Grenades considered tech, or is it just the DOT effect, or neither (does the engineering kits affect the damage)? Asking for the sake of knowing if Tech Vulnerability from Sabotage benefits Homing Grenades or not. Also, I'm seeing a few posts from the past saying Arc Grenades aren't actually tech powers either.

Both tech powers.

Demolisher
No passives
Arc Grenade 1
Homing Grenade 1
Engineering Kit V (+15% tech)

cannibal 1 damage: 460.000000 //Arc: 400 * (1 + 0.15) = 460
cannibal 1 damage: 920.000000 //Homing: 800 * (1 + 0.15) = 920

[Xaijin]

What's the ACTUAL damage on Shaman's full rank BE, with all damage choices taken; same for Valkyrie with maxed AF and maxed warp with expose and pierce.

[Tybo]

Xaijin wrote...

What's the ACTUAL damage on Shaman's full rank BE, with all damage choices taken; same for Valkyrie with maxed AF and maxed warp with expose and pierce.

All information needed is linked in the OP or corlist's signature.   This can calculate the damage of any combo you like.

Modifié par tyhw, 18 novembre 2012 - 08:27 .

[KalilKareem]

How much do we know about evolution 6B (Shredder) on concussive shot? Some things I am curious about;

1) It the 200% listed base damage or total power damage?
2) With consequtive applications of concussive shot does the DOT component stack or refresh (I assume refresh....)?
3) Does this DOT application have any interaction with the DOT from incendiary ammo (like Warp)?

[peddroelm]

KalilKareem wrote...

How much do we know about evolution 6B (Shredder) on concussive shot? Some things I am curious about;

1) It the 200% listed base damage or total power damage?
2) With consequtive applications of concussive shot does the DOT component stack or refresh (I assume refresh....)?
3) Does this DOT application have any interaction with the DOT from incendiary ammo (like Warp)?

1) total damage
2) DOTs will run in paralel (like reave)
3) No such interations
4) Shatter evolution doubles impact damage and the DOT component from Shredder vs Frozen targets
5) Targets hit with CS will take random bits of  damage from hitting the floor//objects//walls (force component) ..

Vs cerb trooper (silver)

trooper 1 damage: 240.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000

200*(1+0.2)= 240 impact
(200*(1+0.2)*2) / 20 = extra 480 over 20 DOT ticks

/////////////////////////////////
/////////////////////////////////

trooper 1 damage: 436.250000 //falcon X with 25% WD barrel with cryo ammo wait for full freeze
//349 * 1.25 = 436.25

trooper 1 damage: 480.000000 // Double impact damage vs frozen targets
trooper 1 damage: 393.750000 // CE
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 284.255127 // ??
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 99.308105 // ??
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 37.890625 // ??
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.828369 // ??
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.429688 // ??
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000


200% the DOT component gets doubled vs frozen targets ...

?? // extraneous damage with unknown source (fall ?)

//////////////////////////////


repeat

trooper 1 damage: 436.250000 //falcon - wait for freeze


trooper 1 damage: 480.000000 //conccusive impact damage *2 vs frozen organic

trooper 1 damage: 326.158325 //?
trooper 1 damage: 393.750000 //CE 100 * 1.75 * 2.25
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 194.961304 //?
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 83.985107 //?
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 11.022949 //?
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 14.957886 //?
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 22.057739 //?
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000
trooper 1 damage: 48.000000


/////////////////////////
/////////////////////////


trooper 1 damage: 240.000000
trooper 1 damage: 104.948364 // ?
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 58.602173 // ?
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 7.725586 // ?
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000

//////////////////////
//////////////////////


incendiary test

trooper 1 damage: 436.250000 // falcon X impact 25% WD
trooper 1 damage: 11.633301 // incendiary 6 dot ticks
trooper 1 damage: 11.633301
trooper 1 damage: 11.633301
trooper 1 damage: 11.633301
trooper 1 damage: 11.633301
trooper 1 damage: 11.633301


trooper 1 damage: 436.250000 // falcon X impact 25% WD
trooper 1 damage: 11.633301 // incendiary 6 dot ticks - no interaction with CS DOT
trooper 1 damage: 11.633301
trooper 1 damage: 11.633301
trooper 1 damage: 240.000000 // CS impact damage
trooper 1 damage: 200.290283 //?
trooper 1 damage: 393.750000 // FE
trooper 1 damage: 11.633301 //?
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000 // CS 20 DOT ticks
trooper 1 damage: 80.567505 //?
trooper 1 damage: 11.633301
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 42.115601 //?
trooper 1 damage: 11.633301
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 4.664673 //?
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000



////

3 CS stack


trooper 1 damage: 240.000000 // first CS impact
trooper 1 damage: 112.440796
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 7.347412
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 240.000000 //second CS impact
trooper 1 damage: 17.567871
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 9.049927
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 27.292480
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 20.578369
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 240.000000 // third CS impact
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 46.548584
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 25.651855
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000
trooper 1 damage: 24.000000

//60 CS DOT ticks

Modifié par peddroelmz, 18 novembre 2012 - 11:12 .

[Feneckus]

peddroelmz wrote...


I don't have a precise method to measure cooldowns in game directly  

You can record with fraps and then count the number of frames between the activation of the power and the end of the cooldown. That's what I did when I tested my Geth Trooper + Javelin + new barrel mod and Drellguard + Claymore + new barrel mod. It definitely worked, exact same number of frames with or without the new mods.

I wasn't aware there was any specific conditions though, didn't test that.

[peddroelm]

Feneckus wrote...

peddroelmz wrote...


I don't have a precise method to measure cooldowns in game directly  

You can record with fraps and then count the number of frames between the activation of the power and the end of the cooldown. That's what I did when I tested my Geth Trooper + Javelin + new barrel mod and Drellguard + Claymore + new barrel mod. It definitely worked, exact same number of frames with or without the new mods.

I wasn't aware there was any specific conditions though, didn't test that.

 

Yup - but this is a method most folks can use  .. My special talents would not help one bit in this instance  ... 

[vironblood]

chipsandwich wrote...

vironblood wrote...
...

Interesting, most of that was as I expected, but I looked in Eric Fagnan's thread on multipliers and Smash wasn't there at all. Thanks.

Indeed, it was not. However, Eric Fagnan added Smash to the power list just yesterday

[Relix28]

corlist wrote...

Arctican wrote...

Are Homing Grenades considered tech, or is it just the DOT effect, or neither (does the engineering kits affect the damage)? Asking for the sake of knowing if Tech Vulnerability from Sabotage benefits Homing Grenades or not. Also, I'm seeing a few posts from the past saying Arc Grenades aren't actually tech powers either.

Both tech powers.

Demolisher
No passives
Arc Grenade 1
Homing Grenade 1
Engineering Kit V (+15% tech)

cannibal 1 damage: 460.000000 //Arc: 400 * (1 + 0.15) = 460
cannibal 1 damage: 920.000000 //Homing: 800 * (1 + 0.15) = 920

Good news for the Turian Engineer. I guess he won't be bottom of the barrel, after all.

[Jay_Hoxtatron]

Hey Peddro/Corlist/Viron/Ty, can you guys confirm that the Heat Sink doesn't work on the CSMG?

[corlist]

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

Hey Peddro/Corlist/Viron/Ty, can you guys confirm that the Heat Sink doesn't work on the CSMG?

Heat Sink does nothing. It's not bugged and does not cause increased ammo usage. (it's an innate property of the CSMG)
The first 10-11 shots (depending on whether you have an ext mag) uses 2 ammo per shot. If you have RoF bonuses, more shots will use double ammo.
The subsequent shots use 1 ammo.

All tests done by shooting the entire clip of the CSMG without break.

sink
30 ammo
19 hits

sink
31 ammo
20 hits

sink
33 ammo
22 hits

mag
54 ammo
44 hits

mag + sink
54 ammo
44 hits

destroyer (25% RoF)
36 ammo
23 hits

destroyer (10% RoF) + mag
66 ammo
54 hits

TSo (50% RoF)
54 ammo
37 hits

TSo (50% RoF)
30 ammo
18 hits

With help from tyhw/tthw.

[Elecbender]

Any other heavy melees that have a damage modifier?

[corlist]

Elecbender wrote...

Any other heavy melees that have a damage modifier?

This page has most of them. The armiger turians and voluses have not been tested yet.