1659 réponses à ce sujet

[JeffZero]

Darth Asriel wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

MrKrios wrote...

Why can't we all just get along and accept that Bioware made everything too vague and messy?
I don't see what we accomplish by squabbling over how people interpret the ending.

They did not make it vague now. We now know and have proof the catalyst is a shackled AI.

Accept the catalyst says you're wrong. 

Shepard: So you're an AI?
Catalyst: In so much as you are just an animal.

He outright says he is beyond being an AI. So please try again.

Shepard isn't beyond being an animal. O_o

[mauro2222]

Ok ok ok... more retcons? seriously?

[dreman9999]

Tazzmission wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

DENNIStehMENACE wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

DENNIStehMENACE wrote...

so. let me get this straight. the leviathans came first then their "thralls" created synthetics to kill them and then the leviathans created the AI program "the catalyst" in order to find a solution against these synthetics so the catalyst made the reapers by harvesting leviathans and splicing them with synthetics in order to preserve life? is that right?

Aka, the cycle stated way before the catalyst.
Also, it proves the catalyst is a shackled AI doing what it's programed to do.

so the leviathans willingly made themselves the reapers to preserve life with this AI that we come to know as the catalyst?

No, they dissagreed with how  the catalyst saw how to doit's programing.

so basicly casper is space hitler and the leviathans aka creators dont agree with him?

More like the creator forced casper to become space hitler by mistake by not imagining it would want to presserve all life as a reaper when they programed it to preserve all life.

Modifié par dreman9999, 28 août 2012 - 03:52 .

[RiptideX1090]

At Conduit now.

[Tazzmission]

dreman9999 wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

DENNIStehMENACE wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

DENNIStehMENACE wrote...

so. let me get this straight. the leviathans came first then their "thralls" created synthetics to kill them and then the leviathans created the AI program "the catalyst" in order to find a solution against these synthetics so the catalyst made the reapers by harvesting leviathans and splicing them with synthetics in order to preserve life? is that right?

Aka, the cycle stated way before the catalyst.
Also, it proves the catalyst is a shackled AI doing what it's programed to do.

so the leviathans willingly made themselves the reapers to preserve life with this AI that we come to know as the catalyst?

No, they dissagreed with how  the catalyst saw how to doit's programing.

so basicly casper is space hitler and the leviathans aka creators dont agree with him?

More like the creator forced casper to become space hitler by mistake by not imagine it would want to presserve all life as a reaper when they programed it to preserve all life.

so a miscalculation on there part

im likeing the sound of this honestly

[mauro2222]

Bfler wrote...

Seems like they try to reduce the hatred for the catalyst by changing him into a simple machine without own mentality.

Yeah, they tried with the "I'm crazy, I need asistance" and it didn't work either.

[dreman9999]

Mobius-Silent wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
Also, it proves the catalyst is a shackled AI doing what it's programed to do.

Well that does depend on the definition of "shackled". If that means "artificial limitations on action but not cognition" (As EDI seem to allude to) then no, but if it means "Fundimental components of the AI's motivation and cognative processes" (Like the 3 laws in an Azimovian Positronic Brain) then yes.

That's the same thing.

[Pedro Costa]

dreman9999 wrote...
Because the problem is withthe catalyst. The don't have an off switch for it. We also don't no the full conditions of their war with the catalyst nor the range of their control.

Turn off all Reapers, proceed to destroy Citadel. Problem solved.

[Jull3]

Fawx9 wrote...

Someone please tell me I'm reading this wrong:

1) Organic space cuttlefish can mind control.
2) Their slaves go crazy and start making robots to kill them.
3) Instead of ordering them to stop, they make an extremely stupid AI program with circular logic.
4) They are turned on by the stupid AI they created and fall to its forces
5) They retreat and plot dr claw style to get revenge someday, however they are lazy and dont do anything.
6) We see them crush a reaper with their mind flay powers, and then they join the war assets in a black hole.

If that's right, why the hell didn't they just mind flay the Reapers to begin with and blow up the stupid AI?

1. yes
2. no. They made robots, and the robots killed the slaves.
3. They made an Ai to "preserve life". The Catalyst as we know it decided that synthetic life is the one true way.
4. Yes. In their defense the Ai simple researched up until the war.
5. Yes.
6. Yes except the blackhole thing...lol wut?

[JeffZero]

RiptideX1090 wrote...

At Conduit now.

Expect a bit of dialogue with the Catalyst concerning the Leviathans, player-prompted via investigation. Don't expect anything else.

[BlessedSoldier]

dreman9999 wrote...

Mobius-Silent wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
Also, it proves the catalyst is a shackled AI doing what it's programed to do.

Well that does depend on the definition of "shackled". If that means "artificial limitations on action but not cognition" (As EDI seem to allude to) then no, but if it means "Fundimental components of the AI's motivation and cognative processes" (Like the 3 laws in an Azimovian Positronic Brain) then yes.

That's the same thing.

Its not EDI was restricted by hardware. The second example is a software restriction.

[dreman9999]

Darth Asriel wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

MrKrios wrote...

Why can't we all just get along and accept that Bioware made everything too vague and messy?
I don't see what we accomplish by squabbling over how people interpret the ending.

They did not make it vague now. We now know and have proof the catalyst is a shackled AI.

Accept the catalyst says you're wrong. 

Shepard: So you're an AI?
Catalyst: In so much as you are just an animal.

He outright says he is beyond being an AI. So please try again.

........That is not what that statement means.

[mauro2222]

"Each formed in Harbinger's image"... retcons, they just simply love them. Instead of changing textures they retcon things. How lazy is that?

Modifié par mauro2222, 28 août 2012 - 03:47 .

[dreman9999]

BlessedSoldier wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Mobius-Silent wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
Also, it proves the catalyst is a shackled AI doing what it's programed to do.

Well that does depend on the definition of "shackled". If that means "artificial limitations on action but not cognition" (As EDI seem to allude to) then no, but if it means "Fundimental components of the AI's motivation and cognative processes" (Like the 3 laws in an Azimovian Positronic Brain) then yes.

That's the same thing.

Its not EDI was restricted by hardware. The second example is a software restriction.

No EDI is restricted by both. This is pointed out in he video about her on cronos station. Tim  mentions an override program with in her programing.

Modifié par dreman9999, 28 août 2012 - 03:48 .

[Sarevok Synder]

Fawx9 wrote...

Someone please tell me I'm reading this wrong:

1) Organic space cuttlefish can mind control.
2) Their slaves go crazy and start making robots to kill them.
3) Instead of ordering them to stop, they make an extremely stupid AI program with circular logic.
4) They are turned on by the stupid AI they created and fall to its forces
5) They retreat and plot dr claw style to get revenge someday, however they are lazy and dont do anything.
6) We see them crush a reaper with their mind flay powers, and then they join the war assets in a black hole.

If that's right, why the hell didn't they just mind flay the Reapers to begin with and blow up the stupid AI?

To preserve Artistic Integrity.

[dreman9999]

DarkLord_PT wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
Because the problem is withthe catalyst. The don't have an off switch for it. We also don't no the full conditions of their war with the catalyst nor the range of their control.

Turn off all Reapers, proceed to destroy Citadel. Problem solved.

1.That not the center ofthe catalys. It's allt hereapers at once.

2.system destroying explotion.

[DENNIStehMENACE]

Tazzmission wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

DENNIStehMENACE wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

DENNIStehMENACE wrote...

so. let me get this straight. the leviathans came first then their "thralls" created synthetics to kill them and then the leviathans created the AI program "the catalyst" in order to find a solution against these synthetics so the catalyst made the reapers by harvesting leviathans and splicing them with synthetics in order to preserve life? is that right?

Aka, the cycle stated way before the catalyst.
Also, it proves the catalyst is a shackled AI doing what it's programed to do.

so the leviathans willingly made themselves the reapers to preserve life with this AI that we come to know as the catalyst?

No, they dissagreed with how  the catalyst saw how to doit's programing.

so basicly casper is space hitler and the leviathans aka creators dont agree with him?

so they create this AI but just like the "thralls" it betrays the leviathans and chosses to harvest them and turn them into reapers to preserve life forever through the cycles. and the levaithans you found were the surviving holdouts of their harvest. but they didnt chose to act because although they were betrayed the catalyst new plan (the cycles) still worked.

[Jull3]

mauro2222 wrote...

"Each formed in Harbinger's image"... retcons, they just simply love them. Instead of changing textures they retcon things. How lazy is that?

What exactly was retconed? We did know that all the reapers LOOKED like Harbinger. They functioned like Harbinger. The only differing ones are the destroyers, reaper ground forces, and the human reaper they tried to make it ME2. Probably can count a prothean reaper because they failed to make it.

[RadicalDisconnect]

mauro2222 wrote...

"Each formed in Harbinger's image"... retcons, they just simply love them. Instead of changing textures they retcon things. How lazy is that?

Actually, it's Harbinger's image but with an additional center leg and without the double spine. 

[dreman9999]

Bfler wrote...

Seems like they try to reduce the hatred for the catalyst by changing him into a simple machine without own mentality.

If you payed attaition you would of seen the catalystas a shackled AI monts ago when ec came out. People have been saying it's a shackled AI for months. It's not that they are now saying it. They are now making it as bunt aspossible to understand.

[RiptideX1090]

Just walked into the Conduit. No changes.

[Ar7emis]

So Leviathan's War Asset entry proves that conventional victory can be possible, and that they could well be a threat in the future...

[Sarevok Synder]

Jull3 wrote...


6. Yes except the blackhole thing...lol wut?

He's saying the war assets are meaningless, so Leviathan joins them in oblivion.

[Darth Asriel]

Human beings are animals only in the most basic sense. We are however far beyond any animal on this planet. He makes that comparison to illustrate that calling him an AI is being simple minded. So your whole shackled theory is drowning in it's own sh!t.

[dreman9999]

Ar7emis wrote...

So Leviathan's War Asset entry proves that conventional victory can be possible, and that they could well be a threat in the future...

No. I just gives us a knew way to kill one reaperat a time. This still can't stop a fleet of them.