1659 réponses à ce sujet

[neilthecellist]

Krogan Warlord wrote...

I didn't buy the DLC.Watched it on Youtube.Glad I didn't buy it.This is the most dissapointing DLC in my life.I bought every DLC in ME1 and ME2 didn't regret a penny.But since I saw ME3 ending I was in caution for the DLC's that might be released.And the caution payed off.Money well spent on other stuff.
Goodbye ME3!
ME3 R.I.P for me...

Ditto. I'd rather buy a textbook for med school than spend $10 on a crummy DLC for a company that has spiraled downhill. Every English professor I've spoke to that played this game has acknowledged the poor writing that went into the game altogether. ME3's story themes were wrong to start.

[Tankcommander]

Russmandarin wrote...

Man this whole organics vs machine thing just got pushed to the point of stupidity

How did the thralls of the Leviathans orginally become thralls? Did they have to have artifacts to dominate the first species, and if so, how did they make them? Surely some races weren't dominated?

The biggest plot hole is how a dominated species would be controlled into worshipping the Leviathans but still somehow be able to build synthetics against the Leviathans' wishes. Wouldn't it be the Leviathans themselves making synthetics if they are dominating other species?

[Revanor]

dreaming_raithe wrote...

1. If the Leviathans enthralled the entire galaxy, and their thralls started making synthetics, which were wiping them out, why didn't they wipe out the synthetics, and then stop their indoctrinated subjects from making more? Problem solved. No Reapers, no AI-kid.

2. If the AI's directive was to "preserve all life" they must have done a terrible programming job since it started killing organics pretty quickly. Mind you, this is actually a problem with the main game itself, but it's still there.

3. If they can just shut Reapers down, how did they lose to the AI army in the first place? For that matter, why didn't they just wipe the stupid thing when it made its first programming error (building a Reaper)?

Essentially, it hurts because Bioware keeps going down this ridiculous rabbit hole. I had faith in them once upon a time, and thought they could learn from the mistakes ME3 presented initially. Then they proved me wrong with more nonsense from the Catalyst in the EC. And now they're continuing with it in the DLC, as if to create a foundation for the out of left field stuff they did originally.

And they can't even do *that* right without causing issues.

1st point - valid.
2nd. - Others have pointed it out that the Catalyst does not percieve the harvest as a conflict, or as murder.
The people harvested are reborn in the form of a reaper, all their memories, all their knowledge live on in a form, they aren't wiped out premanently. It's like deleting all the files on your computer vs putting everything into a huge database accesible via one exe file. 
3. Several leviathans can be seen moving around deep in the ocean, and many of their spheres come to life. Yes, they disable that reaper in what appears to be a few seconds, but there is no reason why we shouldn't assume that this was a combined effort on their part, that is also energy consuming for them. Yes it is a hole, but it can be explained.
They lost their AI army, maybe because a great number of them believed that becoming a reaper is the only solution, so only a minority fled. But even if not, please just think. What about the quarians? What about the terminators in terminator. How come they overpowered their creators? How can any synthetic or AI overpower its creator in any scifi? This is not different. If you want to build an  AI you probably build it in a way that it exceeds your capabilities, skills, your very being. You build it like that, because you need it to do things you can't do. 
There is no reason why we should assume the leviathans didn't do the same. They are very powerful creatures, and if they created sligthly powerful synthetics, that would be enough to drive them into exile.

[Blackmind1]

 As much as I liked the DLC (and I really did!), I'm still disappointed that, even though Harby is officially the lead bad guy now, he still gets no face time at the end, nor a boss fight. I really wanted to speak to him directly at this point, and use the indoctrinated reaper fleet to kick the hell out of them.

With this DLC, they really could have given a path where we could have ignored the catalyst entirely if we didn't want to use it. Either that or I could have finally got my "Okay, you're right, I'll join you" ending, something I've wanted since release.

Still, awesome job Bioware!

[Revanor]

Nyoka wrote...

Fiery Phoenix wrote...

Nyoka wrote...

How many decisions do you get to make in this dlc?

There's no real decisions at all.

I was actually expecting a choice to either have Leviathan join you or exterminate it, as it kind of was building up to that during the mission. Evidently, that's not what happens. You do get a rather interesting conversation at the end, though.

Arrival was criticized as "the 1 decision DLC" and now we have a dlc with no decisions at all?

Aren't they basically the same? 
You have decisions. You can decide if you want the leviathans on your side, or you can decide not to play those missions at all during your next playtrough.

[mauro2222]

Revanor wrote...

2nd. - Others have pointed it out that the Catalyst does not percieve the harvest as a conflict, or as murder.
The people harvested are reborn in the form of a reaper, all their memories, all their knowledge live on in a form, they aren't wiped out premanently. It's like deleting all the files on your computer vs putting everything into a huge database accesible via one exe file. 

Say that to the husks, to the people pulverized by tons of molten metal because their planet made binoculars...
But of course, add some space magic, and the Reaper's lazers actually don't kill they take your soul into a higher plane to be harvested and pinned on the wall of the next Reaper.

Modifié par mauro2222, 29 août 2012 - 02:10 .

[Jackal13th]

the Leviathan is a very good DLC  i just got done with it .
I thought that i would never dtop droping down . Boy was thay ever meen looking . just glad i didnt have to shoot them . ( no where to run and not fast enough) . lol worth all the cash i paid for it .

[Revanor]

nwntask wrote...

PuppiesOfDeath2 wrote...

Of course this entire narrative is inconsistent with the nature of the Reapers in ME1 and ME2. In both, Harbinger delighted in causing you pain and taunted you. It was invested in your destruction and malevolent. Now we are supposed to think they are just galactic street sweepers working dispassionately at the behest of some misguided, twisted AI.

How ridiculous.

Bullseye, my friend!
That narrative incosistence and the unprecedented  and complete degradation of the major rival of the protagonist which in ME1 & ME2 was Harbinger is for me the biggest flaw of ME3.
And it is one of the main reasons why the endings made such a negative (too put it midely) impact to the majority of the gamers. Especially to those, like myself, who appreciate a good storyline as much as the gameplay itself.
And the storyline of ME1 could easily be considered a mastrerpiece of fiction.

I don't know how far the Reapers were from the Alpha relay, and I don't know how fast their conventional FTL drive is, but... given what a great view they had on the Milky Way galaxy at the end of ME2, they would have to be like a billion lightyears from it, so at best they should have arrived hundreds of years after ME2, especially arrival, where even their backdoor was destroyed.

[Revanor]

Hrothdane wrote...

legaldinho wrote...

Anybody else liked Edi's gag about a multiplayer character whose sync-kills are described by players as "overpowered"

Yes. I lol'd.

Yeah that was funny, though I liked the Sovereign and the  Lochness monster part better.
"The harbinger of our destruction huh. How's that playing out for you big guy?"

[jetfire118]

It was $10....was a good 2 hours..

[Revanor]

Alanosborn1991 wrote...

All I really want at this point is a

-Hairstyles pack
-Reunion DLC
-Normandy Cabin poster collection for decoration
-Halloween costumes for all the Reapers
-Team slayer option for multiplayer, one side the good side the other being the Reapers

Is that so much to ask?

I support most of those. 
I really liked the Mining Facility part in this dlc though, in the end when the woman said "2175" was really awesome, the ancient reaper stuff had potential in it, but they didn't explore it much, we could only see 2 or 3 paintings at the digsite while we evaded shells. This new digsite map, and the Thessia map was really good imho, it gave us a taste of the war, as well as other things, I think the game needs more places like that (especially Thessia). I know Shepard is somewhat of a commando guy, so he's not out in the frontline, he's pretty much behind the frontlines, but fighting in the trenches like in a neat WW2 game would be fun.

[SquishyAsari]

 What in gods name did I just watch on YouTube?

Answer me this, didn't the Leviathans say they can enlsave the Reapers? That ends control.
They plan on taking over organics to make them thralls/slaves if the reapers are destroyed? That ends destroy.

...
...
SYNTHESIS 

[3DandBeyond]

Ok, my nephew came over and bought the dang thing and I watched him play it. So the great big new hub is Bryson's office? Woowie, fantastic. And it's really a little bit annoying. You have to keep coming back to it for new datapads and info, once the guy is dead? Why wouldn't they pick all of that stuff up the first time around? And then at that one point, James is just there all of a sudden.

Ok, parts of it look cool, but it makes a lot of the story even more confused. I'd have to watch it again or play it again to remember the things that made for more plotholes, but undoubtedly someone will post it here. Some videos have been posted so I'll probably go for that. My nephew didn't play to the catalyst, but from the time of getting the message on Shepard's terminal to finishing the main part of Leviathan-getting to Hackett's communication was about 2 hours give or take a bit.

I know one thing that bothered me was this Bryson had a lot of reaper stuff including a piece of Sovereign that he had shielded so it couldn't indoctrinate people-well, why couldn't that have been used to prove the reapers existed? And it seemed amazing to me that Hackett kept this info hidden from Shepard for so long.

[3DandBeyond]

SquishyAsari wrote...

 What in gods name did I just watch on YouTube?

Answer me this, didn't the Leviathans say they can enlsave the Reapers? That ends control.
They plan on taking over organics to make them thralls/slaves if the reapers are destroyed? That ends destroy.

...
...
SYNTHESIS 

It does make you wonder.  The thing seems like a mess to me, but to be fair I only watched my nephew playing it and he didn't go to the end of the game.

It seems they created the kid-they call it the intelligence, IIRC and it's looking for something it hasn't found.  It may be that is synthesis.  If so, goodbye to all this.

[Urdnot Amenark]

Tankcommander wrote...

Russmandarin wrote...

Man this whole organics vs machine thing just got pushed to the point of stupidity

How did the thralls of the Leviathans orginally become thralls? Did they have to have artifacts to dominate the first species, and if so, how did they make them? Surely some races weren't dominated?

The biggest plot hole is how a dominated species would be controlled into worshipping the Leviathans but still somehow be able to build synthetics against the Leviathans' wishes. Wouldn't it be the Leviathans themselves making synthetics if they are dominating other species?

From what I understand, it seems they are already capable of indoctrination without the artifacts. They just created them so they could harness their power from long distance, sort of like what they do with the mining colony, etc. It's clear when the Leviathan is speaking with Shepard that they're more than capable of this ability without them.

While they mention themselves being apex predators, they seem to be more interested in reverance in the same vein as the Protheans perhaps rather than creating mindless husklike beings. Leviathan mentions the concept of bending the Galaxy to their will, which suggests that their control was one founded more on influence rather than complete control. They also mention that they didn't care about the lesser races much, so it's inevitable that their own arrogance would lead them to believe that their advanced technology wouldn't yield the same results.

[Urdnot Amenark]

SquishyAsari wrote...

 What in gods name did I just watch on YouTube?

Answer me this, didn't the Leviathans say they can enlsave the Reapers? That ends control.
They plan on taking over organics to make them thralls/slaves if the reapers are destroyed? That ends destroy.

...
...
SYNTHESIS 

If they can control Reapers, then they can control organics AND synthetics simultaneously. That ends Synthesis.

[3DandBeyond]

mauro2222 wrote...

Revanor wrote...

2nd. - Others have pointed it out that the Catalyst does not percieve the harvest as a conflict, or as murder.
The people harvested are reborn in the form of a reaper, all their memories, all their knowledge live on in a form, they aren't wiped out premanently. It's like deleting all the files on your computer vs putting everything into a huge database accesible via one exe file. 

Say that to the husks, to the people pulverized by tons of molten metal because their planet made binoculars...
But of course, add some space magic, and the Reaper's lazers actually don't kill they take your soul into a higher plane to be harvested and pinned on the wall of the next Reaper.

You also have to look in the codex listings for the different ways they use some people, some that are not considered for "ascension" and "preservation" because of their DNA.   And the rendering or liquefying of people-they are crushed first so that just sounds wonderful.

And, there is a lot of understanding of just such a thing by even less advanced AIs.  The AI in ME1 that was stealing money on the Citadel to try and get on a ship to get to the geth, understood he'd be killing Shepard if he self-detructed.  And it's said in ME that if you remove an AI from their blue box, they are just data files-if you upload them to another blue box they will not be the same person.  So, imagine what this does to people-their thoughts and memories are uploaded, but the person is not.

[SquishyAsari]

Urdnot Amenark wrote...

SquishyAsari wrote...

 What in gods name did I just watch on YouTube?

Answer me this, didn't the Leviathans say they can enlsave the Reapers? That ends control.
They plan on taking over organics to make them thralls/slaves if the reapers are destroyed? That ends destroy.

...
...
SYNTHESIS 

If they can control Reapers, then they can control organics AND synthetics simultaneously. That ends Synthesis.

I wasn't quite sure about that. During the "Space Magic Crucible Explosion Synthesis Spectacular" ending, everyone gets hit by the space magic lime green beams and get all happy (Yes, for lack of a better explanation) and everyone becomes peaceful and EDI writes a song about how happy everyone is. Why wouldn't Leviathans become peace activists like everyone else?

[Asari Goddess]

Urdnot Amenark wrote...

SquishyAsari wrote...

 What in gods name did I just watch on YouTube?
Y
Answer me this, didn't the Leviathans say they can enlsave the Reapers? That ends control.
They plan on taking over organics to make them thralls/slaves if the reapers are destroyed? That ends destroy.

...
...
SYNTHESIS 

If they can control Reapers, then they can control organics AND synthetics simultaneously. That ends Synthesis.

ok im confuse idk if bioware is trying to answer the reaper questions or adding on to it 

Modifié par lmysterie, 29 août 2012 - 03:15 .

[halbert986]

Wow I didn't think they could do it. Bu they did it. They actually made the endings worse....

[3DandBeyond]

What it seemed like to me was they took part of the dark energy plot where the decision is between the reapers and dark energy and they used Leviathan in place of dark energy, but then didn't use it for the ending at all.

As someone above said, the Leviathans would have green eyes too in synthesis and very likely wouldn't stand for control and would be a big threat in destroy. This is a non-addition that should factor into at least the slide show.

[babachewie]

3DandBeyond wrote...

Ok, my nephew came over and bought the dang thing and I watched him play it. So the great big new hub is Bryson's office? Woowie, fantastic. And it's really a little bit annoying. You have to keep coming back to it for new datapads and info, once the guy is dead? Why wouldn't they pick all of that stuff up the first time around? And then at that one point, James is just there all of a sudden.

Ok, parts of it look cool, but it makes a lot of the story even more confused. I'd have to watch it again or play it again to remember the things that made for more plotholes, but undoubtedly someone will post it here. Some videos have been posted so I'll probably go for that. My nephew didn't play to the catalyst, but from the time of getting the message on Shepard's terminal to finishing the main part of Leviathan-getting to Hackett's communication was about 2 hours give or take a bit.

I know one thing that bothered me was this Bryson had a lot of reaper stuff including a piece of Sovereign that he had shielded so it couldn't indoctrinate people-well, why couldn't that have been used to prove the reapers existed? And it seemed amazing to me that Hackett kept this info hidden from Shepard for so long.

So from what I gather you dont even understand what happeded but you just couldnt wait to **** about something. What a tool bag. 

[AresKeith]

babachewie wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

Ok, my nephew came over and bought the dang thing and I watched him play it. So the great big new hub is Bryson's office? Woowie, fantastic. And it's really a little bit annoying. You have to keep coming back to it for new datapads and info, once the guy is dead? Why wouldn't they pick all of that stuff up the first time around? And then at that one point, James is just there all of a sudden.

Ok, parts of it look cool, but it makes a lot of the story even more confused. I'd have to watch it again or play it again to remember the things that made for more plotholes, but undoubtedly someone will post it here. Some videos have been posted so I'll probably go for that. My nephew didn't play to the catalyst, but from the time of getting the message on Shepard's terminal to finishing the main part of Leviathan-getting to Hackett's communication was about 2 hours give or take a bit.

I know one thing that bothered me was this Bryson had a lot of reaper stuff including a piece of Sovereign that he had shielded so it couldn't indoctrinate people-well, why couldn't that have been used to prove the reapers existed? And it seemed amazing to me that Hackett kept this info hidden from Shepard for so long.

So from what I gather you dont even understand what happeded but you just couldnt wait to **** about something. What a tool bag. 

nice to try and insult someone, by making yourself a tool bag

[Sigma2010]

ToaOrka wrote...

So let me get this straight: Leviathan doesn't add anything meaningful to the endings?
...
Definitely a waste of money.

Just finished Leviathan and its a fairly good DLC "no where near LOTSB", but good.  I was hoping it would do more than add a few lines of dialog with Starbrat and his circular logic;  maybe impact the outcome of the war, by Leviathan actually joining the fight.  Instead, you meet him, there's an exciting cut scene where he disable a Repear and you see it fall out of the sky. Then for the rest of the game you neither hear or seem him as a war asset.   Instead you get a war asset that doesn't really have any value on the level that Leviathan would bring, if he joined you.  That said.  I really enjoyed the new locations, combat sequences and exploration.  But in the end you're still left with the same a, b, c, d endings.  Despite hearing Shepard make what only equates to blowing hot air by saying "Leviathan is joining the war" and Starbrat responding "oh goodie, you're dump enough to believe they'll be here.  I have some valuable swamp land in Florida,  I can you sell since you're an all day sucker".   Again, really good DLC, but the only things it adds to the single player, is time with no change in outcome to the endings.  Still wish Bioware would come up with a better ending!!!!

[Rft552]

I personally loved the DLC. It added a lot to the lore of the game and gave us new insights on the beginning of the Reapers. That said, the underwater portion was VERY underwhelming and over hyped. All you do is just walk a pre determined path until you get to Leviathan. I was expecting at least some combat or even a boss fight.