159 réponses à ce sujet

[CELL55]

I have another question: Why did this DLC play up Harbinger's importance even more, if it still wasn't going to really bring him back to the plot? Why is it that all that he gets is a cameo and yet Bioware still continues to label him as the biggest, baddest Reaper? Do they simply not care? (Okay, that was more than one question, but they are still relevant.)

[SpamBot2000]

Thanks for the info. Sounds pretty funny.

[erc1971]

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

I think any DLC will lose its spark when it's forced to conform to this game and the endings.

QFFT (Quoted For ****ing Truth)

[Lyaksandra]

Icinix wrote...

elessarz wrote...

Leviathan should have been the major plot point in ME2, instead of that glorified side-quest of a Suicide Mission. It would have solved everything people hate with ME3's plot.

This is kind of where I have a problem with ME as a trilogy and I've brought it up before - I really feel like all three games are disconnected.

I don't think they had enough enough structure for the story when they started ME1 and I understand games and stories evolve over time - but I don't think there was enough looking back as it evolved and now its a bit all over the place.

Has no one done a check on the dates related to this? Or do a lot of people just miss those specific posts.

Bioware is bought by EA, puts out ME1 almost immediately. The most likely scenario is that ME1 was already done by then. With no intervention by EA, or at least minimal. ME1 is the best game in the series, with its flaws and all. It just felt more "solid" than any of the sequels.

I've watched and re-watched videos about the ending of ME1, and you can see there never was a sequel planned. Sure, some elements were left open, but not the way a planned trilogy does. So yeah, no matter if even Bioware claims they planned it as a trilogy originally, that's just propaganda. At the end of ME1 the council sounds like they have "grown", thus the intro to ME2 doesn't make sense. The ending to ME1 is plagued with indications of closure.

This points to one thing. EA loves the dollars. They must have said to Bioware after buying them: "Hey, this sells a lot, make a sequel pronto!"

Therefore, you're right. The games ARE disconnected. Because they actually were never planned as a trilogy.

On a side note:

Writing a story is HARD. If you've ever dedicated time to trying to do so, and do a good job of it, you should know this. Now imagine trying to do it under the pressure of expanding something that was already done, and a deadline that is most likely ridiculous because your boss loves to milk the cash cow.

The end result is a rushed mess full of artificial scenes to create things that should arise naturally from the plot, instead of feeling like sudden bumps on a road. Things such as: love for the characters, a sense of awe at an epic story, curiosity to uncover the secrets of the made-up universe you're playing in, and the sense of wonder after said discoveries...

Add to this the corporate interests of improving gameplay for people who aren't RPG players, and of creating multiplayer and a bunch of inane apps and other crap to appeal to a broader crowd - and get their money too, of course.

ME should have stayed as a story driven RPG with action shooter elements, and never should have been made into something to appeal to the GOW crowd, or any other random shooter driven by action and not story.

In the end Bioware got torn between doing what they wanted and what they were ordered to do. Grab the action gamers and keep the RPG gamers. Also, do it by yesterday or sooner because we have deadlines to meet, money to earn. Just impossible.

This thing was dead since ME2, because that was never supposed to happen, at least not the way it did. If they were going to force it, they should've at least given enough time for it to happen. That's just not how money driven companies work, though.

TLDR version:

Stop flaming Bioware. Yeah, they screwed up badly, but remember that they're just grunts now. They don't run the show. Direct your flame throwers to where it's deserved - and to where they will still do nothing anyway. Electronic Arts. Many of you have already said it: Unless planned as a side story, stuff added to ME3 at this point will have to conform to the established canon. Which is bad canon. But bear in mind that well beyond "crappy writing" or designing, there are a miriad of other things affecting the outcome of a game. You would have to go back and read my wall of text for some insight, though.

PS: I think Dragon Age was far into the creative process by the time Bioware was acquired, thus it still managed to come out good. Then we received DA2. Faster combat, simpler RPG options. Again with the appealing to a wider audience, when the games were supposed to be story driven RPG's, not action games. As I implied before, this entails losing story elements, making the game lesser in general.

Whereas I actually enjoyed some of the gameplay changes in both games, said changes weren't worth the loss of story and depth, though. I'd rather go back to clunky gameplay and a rich, story driven universe, than what we got in the end. Too bad we couldn't get both because there wasn't enough time, and that meant less dollars for EA - for some reason a simple minded non economist like me cannot fathom.

PSS: I've also been wondering how many of the people that are unhappy with these changes are closer to their 30's and beyond. It seems to me that many young people are more interested in the "gameplay" and the instant gratification it entails, and we dinosaurs are just unable to adjust. That's not to say youngsters are wrong or fool. I'm just wondering if the game world is going through a transition and the older gamers are just doomed to be disappointed quite a lot from now on. Not like that would stop me from whinning

[obZen DF]

Alot of you guys scream "Plothole" about Leviathan controlling the Reaper Capitel ship. But if you pay attention you know that it's because of the artifacts.

[nacireman]

obZen DF wrote...

Alot of you guys scream "Plothole" about Leviathan controlling the Reaper Capitel ship. But if you pay attention you know that it's because of the artifacts.

Maybe that, but they also seemed to have some sort of an entreched position on that planet with a weapon capable of taking out ships that came to explore, with the artifact orbs to take care of surviving crew. Being that true synthetics operate without organinc elements I doubt Leviathans are able to deal with synthetics without some sort of directed emp pulse like what they used to take care of the shuttle and the other ships that came to the planet.

Or, you know, more space magic.

Just looking at the abilities we know of, it's probably Dominate that they use to control the husk reaper forces (rememer banshees, brutes, and mauraders are basically made te same way as husks are made) and other organics. It's not AI Hacking. 

So yeah, I call the weapon they use to keep probes from finding the planet they're hiding on, making thralls to help cover up human discoveries. Who remembers Zhu's Hope?

maybe I'm reaching.

[plfranke]

obZen DF wrote...

Alot of you guys scream "Plothole" about Leviathan controlling the Reaper Capitel ship. But if you pay attention you know that it's because of the artifacts.

I scream plothole that they can do this yet get defeated by the intelligence they built when there isn't even a single Reaper around.

[Mindfane]

I was about to buy some BioWare points to get this DLC> Then I thought...wait this is BioWare, they have already messed things up. So I read some reviews and finally watched the youtube videos (could not help it). Now I am relieved that I did not buy it.

However I do not see how they could make it any better without changing the ending. They have to conform the story within the preset boundaries of 4 endings. But if there is ever a Mass Effect 4, this is a great development.

Looks like Bioware is telling us that Destroy ending is the worst (I chose Destroy 3 times BTW). If Leviathans could destroy Reapers, how could Control or Synthesis (or even Refuse) make any sense,. If Leviathans get greedy again, they will control eveyone else in the galaxy (after destroying Shreaper)

And like the original ending, this DLC leaves more questions (and plot holes) than answers.

Modifié par Mindfane, 30 août 2012 - 06:03 .

[Mindfane]

obZen DF wrote...

Alot of you guys scream "Plothole" about Leviathan controlling the Reaper Capitel ship. But if you pay attention you know that it's because of the artifacts.

Ok but how did they destroy the reaper on Dis. That was far away from their watery home.

[Blueprotoss]

Apathy1989 wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

I wasn't planning on getting it anyway

This. Seems it makes the story even worse aswell. Bioware seem to hate their stories.

I wonder if you have played thier other DLCs based on this hate?  I also wonder if you didn't like the decisions that Bioware took since ME1?