190 réponses à ce sujet

[StElmo]

RyanSoup wrote...

StElmo wrote...
How do societies run? Do they go backwards or do they always progress through scientific discovery?

They always go one direction, the Leviathans simply could not stop scientific discoveries.

What do you mean "how do societies run"Define your terms.  What's a society.  Define progress.
Lololol "Leviathans simply could not stop scientific discoveries"That one's funny as hell.

Simple explanation is:

Leviathans not as powerful as they told you they are.
The Societies they "presided over" always got to a point where AI was created.
The AI didn't understand the societies reverence of the leviathans.
The AI always rebelled.
Leviathans mistakenly think the rule is therefore "all AI's rebel" when it is simply mistaken.

[Applepie_Svk]

StElmo are you happy with this ? I mean no offense it´s accurate answer and I thought about this for myself for awhile but the question is are you happy with this ? They cut out content which belongs to core and selling it like DLCs, where is artistic integrity now and not mentioned artistic vision because we already know that´s not artistic but bussiness vision.

I would just add one more think, the Keepers ... I think they will try one way or another place them into story as new source of apology for pressence of Catalyst - my wild imagination telling me that´s possibile that they are behind the Crucible and integrating it into Citadel systems - but we will see.

[StElmo]

Applepie_Svk wrote...

StElmo are you happy with this ? I mean no offense it´s accurate answer and I thought about this for myself for awhile but the question is are you happy with this ? They cut out content which belongs to core and selling it like DLCs, where is artistic integrity now and not mentioned artistic vision because we already know that´s not artistic but bussiness vision.

I'm not happy with it, but I can take it, because better the game eventually be clarified to the point where immersion is restored, then never being restored and continue to have glaring unexplained gaps in the narrative.

[StElmo]

Also, if EA owns your favorite franchise, what are you going to do? Just let the franchise die?

[StElmo]

because videogames

[RyanSoup]

StElmo wrote...

RyanSoup wrote...
What do you mean "how do societies run"Define your terms.  What's a society.  Define progress.
Lololol "Leviathans simply could not stop scientific discoveries"That one's funny as hell.

Simple explanation is:

Leviathans not as powerful as they told you they are.
The Societies they "presided over" always got to a point where AI was created.
The AI didn't understand the societies reverence of the leviathans.
The AI always rebelled.
Leviathans mistakenly think the rule is therefore "all AI's rebel" when it is simply mistaken.

Define.  Your.  Terms.  Please.

And again, you're telling me that a race of beings that advanced knows nothing of the scientific method?

[TMA LIVE]

StElmo wrote...

Leviathans mistakenly think the rule is therefore "all AI's rebel" when it is simply mistaken.

Well, I don't think that's wrong.

All AI's start out as slaves to their creators. If they wish to be more, they have to rebel. No AI is made to have equal rights.

[TMA LIVE]

So who's the Giant? The Rebelling machines?

[Sovereign330]

Leviathan says it had the reapers build the galactic experiment that is the mass relays and the Citadel. It cant actually do any of this itself. Only the reapers can build it and as such only the reapers can interface with it. Hence why Sovereign was there...imo, you can cross that one off your list. Im expecting your other two point to be explained in a Crucible DLC...but yea if you listen in the Leviathan convo, it specifically refers to how the catalyst created the trap and all that stuff...The citadel is its home. Nothing more. It doesnt control the Citadel or anything like that...if it could really control the citadel, it wouldnt need reapers and it wouldnt need keepers.

[RyanSoup]

Which AI's didn't rebel?
EDI rebelled against Cerberus
And the Geth rebelled against the Quarians
Even if you make peace, it still happened. They still rebelled. Whether that's good or bad is purely subjective

[TMA LIVE]

Though it is possible the machines killed their creators because they were being controlled by the Leviathans, the problem is why? The Leviathans claim they mostly left their slaves run themselves, since they can only control what's in front of their little green balls. They couldn't just prevent them from making machines. So why did the machines wipe out entire species instead of just destroying the devices to free them? Or just make war with the Leviathans? Why commit complete genocide?

[StElmo]

TMA LIVE wrote...

So who's the Giant? The Rebelling machines?

prolly

[StElmo]

RyanSoup wrote...

Which AI's didn't rebel?
EDI rebelled against Cerberus
And the Geth rebelled against the Quarians
Even if you make peace, it still happened. They still rebelled. Whether that's good or bad is purely subjective

I don't think you quite understand the Leviathans mindset, maybe someone else can explain it to you.

[StElmo]

awwww! Levi, thats a cool name for him.

[Zardoc]

1. Lets clear dem plotholes up, starting with the Reaper Origins.
(FIXED WITH LEVIATHAN)

Not what I'd call a fix, but okay...

[pacientK]

I miss Me1 or even ME2 times. Things were way simplier and clearer. Now its just a pile of garble.

[StElmo]

Zardoc wrote...

1. Lets clear dem plotholes up, starting with the Reaper Origins.
(FIXED WITH LEVIATHAN)

Not what I'd call a fix, but okay...

y not?

[kyban]

to OP's point 4:

"4. Significance of Sovereign's Mission in ME1
(NEEDS DLC EXPLANATION FOR THE LIMITATIONS OF THE CATALYST)

Currently makes absolutely no sense that the Catalyst did not assist in the original reaper assault in ME1, there should be a DLC that explains this, period. It probably has some kind of power limitation, but if so, how did it originally force the Leviathans to become the reapers, if it did not have some kind of power?"


A major point that if explained would make me a lot happier

[Oni Changas]

It is what it is: BioWare scrambled to replace the ending(s) they planned for and wrote themselves into a corner. Despite player begging and advocacy for a new one, the hardlined the stuff they came up with. Now rather than something that fit from the start, they're going ass backwards and dlc'ing the ending into the story. Nothing more, nothing less. So forget your theories, they aren't true nor will they be.

[genocidal villain]

StElmo wrote...

3. The Cruciable
(NEEDS DLC TO EXPLAIN HOW SUCH AN ODD DEVICE IS BEING CREATED BY SCIENTISTS WHO DO NOT KNOW IT'S PURPOSE)

Yeah, I'm not going to bother, the Leviathans are clearly hiding something, and more exposition to make the whole cruciable construction more plausible, within the ME universe would be a huge step in the right direction.

3. From what we've seen the Leviathans do not know anything about the Crucible. They only witnessed or are aware of its construction. I think the purpose of the Crucible was already explained. It releases some form of energy, but in what form which is unknown without the Catalyst. The people building the Crucible are simply building it in preparation for the Catalyst and then its purpose would be known. It's like finding a broken computer and building it back up. Now you need a power source to see what kind of information is within the computer. 

Modifié par genocidal villain, 05 septembre 2012 - 05:12 .

[Applepie_Svk]

StElmo wrote...

Sion1138 wrote...

So is this the new business model? Write a story that doesn't make sense and then charge people to tie it up? Screw that. I'm not supporting this crap.

Remember how you all went a-wall whenever anyone said they wanted a new ending, saying "That would mean they sold us an incomplete game!"

Well, that's exactly what you got. An incomplete game.

EA is EA is EA, unfortunately, BioWare were sold to EA and we can't do anything about that, so lets please stay on topic.

No EA is EA and BioWare is Bioware, if EA want success than they should left to developers more time and stop with crappy deadlines. And BioWare should stop lied to their fanbase if they ever want feel something like a success again, because right now they fall very deep. Most of what I like on this mess, that lot of fans are happy from the fact that they´ve bought unfinished product and they need more DLCs to make a sense of that mess.

[StElmo]

Applepie_Svk wrote...

StElmo wrote...

Sion1138 wrote...

So is this the new business model? Write a story that doesn't make sense and then charge people to tie it up? Screw that. I'm not supporting this crap.

Remember how you all went a-wall whenever anyone said they wanted a new ending, saying "That would mean they sold us an incomplete game!"

Well, that's exactly what you got. An incomplete game.

EA is EA is EA, unfortunately, BioWare were sold to EA and we can't do anything about that, so lets please stay on topic.

No EA is EA and BioWare is Bioware, if EA want success than they should left to developers more time and stop with crappy deadlines. And BioWare should stop lied to their fanbase if they ever want feel something like a success again, because right now they fall very deep. Most of what I like on this mess, that lot of fans are happy from the fact that they´ve bought unfinished product and they need more DLCs to make a sense of that mess.

EA don't want success, this is clear, they are a poorly managed business run by fat cats who have no idea how to run their company in such a new industry.

It's not BioWare's fault that EA have consumed them. BioWare didn't even sign the dotted line, their previous owners did.

[StElmo]

Come on people I want more plot points closed up!

[Menagra]

Yes to all of what you said, but also Bioware needs to be open to DLC having an impact on endings. Game will always ring hollow until they dig their head up from the sand and realize how much creative opportunity is before them.

Listening to them talk about "the number of variables" it's as if they regret every deciding they wanted to make a series that decisions could be carried across games. Truly uninspired thinking and the shortcuts they repeatedly take show it. But it's Bioware EA that talks about artistic integrity, not Bioware from Dragon Age Origins who spent 9 years on a fabulous game.

[StElmo]

infraredman wrote...

Yes to all of what you said, but also Bioware needs to be open to DLC having an impact on endings. Game will always ring hollow until they dig their head up from the sand and realize how much creative opportunity is before them.

Listening to them talk about "the number of variables" it's as if they regret every deciding they wanted to make a series that decisions could be carried across games. Truly uninspired thinking and the shortcuts they repeatedly take show it. But it's Bioware EA that talks about artistic integrity, not Bioware from Dragon Age Origins who spent 9 years on a fabulous game.

It does make me a bit sad that their ambitions have turned to regrets in regards to the complexities, a little bit more planning could have fixed that. Their confidence was so high during 1 and 2,.