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#51
N7 Lisbeth

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BrotherWarth wrote...

One person even said to me that she routinely "took down" 300 pound men with her tiny 110 pound frame.
Seriously people, no one with a build that slight can rock a ****huge alien with a punch like femShep does. It's nonsense. "Wiry" doesn't mean the strength of someone twice your size. Wiry means strong for your size. And guess what? Weight classes exist for a reason. A light weight can't get in the ring/octagon with a heavy weight.


1. Don't discount other people. If they say they did it, first assume they did before assuming they didn't. "Taking down" could have implied just that, her using a judo throw to put him on the ground and they yielded. That is totally within the realm of possibility, since with martial arts you learn to use your opponent's weight against them. You don't pick them up and throw them bodily to the ground, you use their mass and momentum against them. Your balking at the notion implies something: not that you don't know how to fight (scrap), but that you haven't been trained to fight. It also suggests you have no experience in martial arts.

2. If you don't believe FemShep, at 140#, could take on a 300# alien, why do you think a 180# MaleShep could? If it's only about size and mass, you're going to lose as a man or a woman with your logic. I find that assertion ridiculous. Remember, sports-fighting doesn't allow for things you'd do to a person in a real fight. And nothing that Shepard has done is sports-fighting.

And all of that doesn't address the trade offs. Strength vs speed, et al. What good is being 300# if you can't catch your opponent? What about skill and experience? That tangent adds a whole different complexity that we haven't addressed (and won't for brevity).

Here's a question for you: Do you think skinny Bruce Lee could have taken a 300# opponent? If you said no, you'd be wrong. If you said yes, he was lighter and skinnier than FemShep. If you're curious, he was 135#. He did try some weight training that bulked him up to 160# for a short time, but it limited his flexibility and he hated it. He also had back problems with the extra weight. He said, after losing the weight, that he regretted bulking up and that he had suffered an injury doing it.

The rest, well, I agree with you. She needs to have broader shoulders and thicker arms when she's naked, but again I suspect that's an engine issue with the way clothes and armour layer together and adding bulk. The end result is that if she looked as fit naked as she did clothed then we'd have sumo wrestlers in armour. It's probably the reason for the odd pear-like appearance when she's naked like that, because not as many layers are added to the model's legs. Granted, this is an assumption, but it seems to fit the facts. (Look at Liara, she looks outrageously busty when wearing armour, too much so imo.)

Nonetheless, you should maintain some of your opinion. Developers will not change unless we tell them we want more realistic models. In that, I admire your stance. I may disagree with you about what's possible when it comes to fighting, but we both want more realistic models.

Oh, for an ideal game world. :wub:

Modifié par N7 Lisbeth, 30 août 2012 - 04:40 .


#52
Guest_BrotherWarth_*

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N7 Lisbeth wrote...

1. Don't discount other people. If they say they did it, first assume they did before assuming they didn't. "Taking down" could have implied just that, her using a judo throw to put him on the ground and they yielded. That is totally within the realm of possibility, since with martial arts you learn to use your opponent's weight against them. You don't pick them up and throw them bodily to the ground, you use their mass and momentum against them. Your balking at the notion implies something: not that you don't know how to fight (scrap), but that you haven't been trained to fight. It also suggests you have no experience in martial arts.


Doing a judo demonstration with a large man who is cooperating is not "taking down" anyone. If that's the standard you're using then I can take down Anderson Silva*.







*so long as he doesn't fight back or resist in any way

2. If you don't believe FemShep, at 140#, could take on a 300# alien, why do you think a 180# MaleShep could? If it's only about size and mass, you're going to lose as a man or a woman with your logic. I find that assertion ridiculous. Remember, sports-fighting doesn't allow for things you'd do to a person in a real fight. And nothing that Shepard has done is sports-fighting.


In what universe is FemShep 140 lbs? Or Sheploo only 180 lbs? And in what universe can a 140 lb woman with noodle arms punch as hard as a buff 180 lb man?

And all of that doesn't address the trade offs. Strength vs speed, et al. What good is being 300# if you can't catch your opponent? What about skill and experience? That tangent adds a whole different complexity that we haven't addressed (and won't for brevity).


What are you talking about? What sparked this argument?

Here's a question for you: Do you think skinny Bruce Lee could have taken a 300# opponent? If you said no, you'd be wrong. If you said yes, he was lighter and skinnier than FemShep. If you're curious, he was 135#. He did try some weight training that bulked him up to 160# for a short time, but it limited his flexibility and he hated it. He also had back problems with the extra weight. He said, after losing the weight, that he regretted bulking up and that he had suffered an injury doing it.


Bruce Lee famously said that on the set of one of his movies he tried wrestling with a very large man and was absolutely manhandled. Even when he got serious and was trying with everything he had he couldn't defend against the larger man's wrestling. He was so worn out afterward he had to rest for the remainder of the day.

#53
N7 Lisbeth

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BrotherWarth wrote...

Bruce Lee famously said that on the set of one of his movies he tried wrestling with a very large man and was absolutely manhandled. Even when he got serious and was trying with everything he had he couldn't defend against the larger man's wrestling. He was so worn out afterward he had to rest for the remainder of the day.


Bruce Lee wrestled someone twice his size and lost? You do realise you're talking about wrestling, again, sports fighting and one that totally biases towards mass. Completely voiding Bruce Lee of most of his ability (martial arts), his speed and agility, and pitting solely his strength and awkward skill against an opponent bigger and stronger and more skillful. Yeah, that's exactly what I'm talking about. You're looking at this the wrong way and taking everything out of context for absolutely no reason.

It's almost like you read something and pretend everything that you don't like doesn't exist. It's not as if I'm pretending fighting out of your weight class isn't hard, and in every game our characters go up against something gigantically out of our league, we struggle in a similar fashion in epic battles. They wouldn't be epic if they were fair or level. (That's all about contrasts.)

As for the weight estimations of the models, look at the real people they purportedly based Shepard on, both genders. The weights are pretty close to each, and they are fairly accurate with how the in-game models came out by their pixelated mass. (Minus the naked bit, but again, we went over that and why it is the way it is.) You're just a really bad judge for these things and too biased to accept it, or, well, anything.

Anyway, I've posted on this thread, what, five times? That's it for me. I had hoped you'd come away with a better understanding, BrotherWarth, but if I'm not here for your breakthrough, I'll just have to live with myself. :innocent:

Developers, we hope you're paying attention. Love your games, but we always hope for something a little better each time. And with that ... Have fun, people!

Modifié par N7 Lisbeth, 30 août 2012 - 05:43 .


#54
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So if I put on a muscle suit do I get to say I have ripped abs and that my naked body isn't the basis on which you should judge my physique?
Bruce Lee was not some God among men. He was a very good martial artist who made movies that made him look superhuman. He was not the best fighter ever. He couldn't even defend or evade a takedown from a slower fighter.
And who is it you think FemShep was based on? I don't recall ever hearing that FemShep was based on anyone. I know Sheploo is based on a model, but the Sheploo model is bulkier than the actual man. And unless FemShep has superdense bones there's no way she weighs more than 120 lbs.

Modifié par BrotherWarth, 30 août 2012 - 05:46 .


#55
MissMaster_2

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xI extremist Ix wrote...

EpicBoot2daFace wrote...

Doctor Moustache wrote...

She looks like a pear. The top half and bottom half of her body don't match.

Image IPB

Once you see it you will never unsee it.

What the ****? Image IPB


Holy Thunder THIGHS!


You know lots of women have pear shaped bodies. No tall of us are hourglasses. 
And also what the hell is wrong with thighs?....I don't think anyone I this thread knows what a real woman looks like. 

Modifié par MissMaster_2, 30 août 2012 - 05:55 .


#56
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MissMaster_2 wrote...

And also what the hell is wrong with thighs?....


When your thigh is as thick as your upper torso those probably aren't sexy thighs...

#57
MissMaster_2

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BrotherWarth wrote...

MissMaster_2 wrote...

And also what the hell is wrong with thighs?....


When your thigh is as thick as your upper torso those probably aren't sexy thighs...


Haha. Beg to differ on that.
Image IPB
 Model Bria Myles. 

If you guys are nit picking FemSheps body not because she is too thin but because she has thick thighs then I just don't know what to say on that.

Modifié par MissMaster_2, 30 août 2012 - 06:04 .


#58
habitat 67

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There is no way Shepard is petite. Walk her around the Citadel and pay close attention. She is taller than most of the men and even some of the Turians. I'd put her at close to 6 ft.

#59
MissMaster_2

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habitat 67 wrote...

There is no way Shepard is petite. Walk her around the Citadel and pay close attention. She is taller than most of the men and even some of the Turians. I'd put her at close to 6 ft.


Yeah I just think she has noddle arms.

#60
g40max

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Thessaly - Moon Witch wrote...

g40max wrote...

 I was playing ME last night and I was thinking that my female shepard is very slight. I feel as thought she needs a bit more muscle; not a huge amount like male shep, and all six of his chests, but like the build of a female athlete maybe? I'm thinking along the lines of Jessica Ennis or someone. It would just make it more believable when she's turning bad guys inside out. What do you guys think?


Actually, I'm rather partial to the way FemShep looks. I really despise large breasts and glamour lipstick on soldiers. I prefer plain and athletic any day. Not saying you can't have both, it's just a refreshing change to have a tall FemShep that's also athletic without being too robust or too pretty.

@Kya: Was she changed that much? I really liked FemShep's physique in ME2, and although she's a little thinner in ME3, I didn't notice that much change. (What mass she has is still very toned/muscularity clearly visible, moreso than in ME2 despite the overall weight loss. That could be addressed to thicker clothing in ME2.)

.  At what point in my post did I mention lipstick? Lol did you even read the OP before deciding to weigh in? 

#61
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habitat 67 wrote...

There is no way Shepard is petite.
Walk her around the Citadel and pay close attention. She is taller than
most of the men and even some of the Turians. I'd put her at close to 6
ft.


What does height have to do with being petite in this context? Obviously we're saying she has noddle arms and too-narrow shoulders. And considering all women and Turians in the game are all roughly the same height since they're all using one model...

MissMaster_2 wrote...

Image IPB


That's just strange looking to me. I do not find that attractive.

Modifié par BrotherWarth, 30 août 2012 - 06:09 .


#62
habitat 67

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Whoever designed Beefcake Vega should have a stab at designing Shepard. He is pretty... anatomically correct. I don't mean she should be as large as him though, lol.

#63
KBomb

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habitat 67 wrote...

There is no way Shepard is petite. Walk her around the Citadel and pay close attention. She is taller than most of the men and even some of the Turians. I'd put her at close to 6 ft.




No way she is 6ft. I would venture she is around 5’10 and around 130 or so—which is about average. She isn’t as tall as Garrus.

#64
habitat 67

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BrotherWarth wrote...
What does height have to do with being petite in this context? Obviously we're saying she has noddle arms and too-narrow shoulders. And considering all women and Turians in the game are all roughly the same height since they're all using one model...


less than 5 4" is the definition of petite, genius.

#65
MissMaster_2

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BrotherWarth wrote...

habitat 67 wrote...

There is no way Shepard is petite.
Walk her around the Citadel and pay close attention. She is taller than
most of the men and even some of the Turians. I'd put her at close to 6
ft.


What does height have to do with being petite? And considering all women and Turians in the game are all roughly the same height since they're all using one model...

MissMaster_2 wrote...

Image IPB


That's just strange looking to me. I do not find that attractive.


Psssssssssshh. Might be a bla... I mean cultural thing. Because she is perfect to me. Different stokes for different folks. But to say that femSheps thighs are too big and unattractive is to say that most women in the US are unattractive. Because size 14 is the most common size.  

#66
EnvyTB075

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crypticcat 2o2p wrote...

some random fokker might have a problem with.


Dat hurts my feelings yo

#67
MissMaster_2

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Seriously I have more muscle definition then FemShep and I'm 5'9 and 120 lbs. This is a top Alliance Navy N7 she would have more muscle then that. 

Modifié par MissMaster_2, 30 août 2012 - 06:18 .


#68
Guest_BrotherWarth_*

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habitat 67 wrote...

BrotherWarth wrote...
What does height have to do with being petite in this context? Obviously we're saying she has noddle arms and too-narrow shoulders. And considering all women and Turians in the game are all roughly the same height since they're all using one model...


less than 5 4" is the definition of petite, genius.


Learn to read, genius. I said what does it have to with being petite in this context. Obviously no one was saying she was too short.



MissMaster_2 wrote...

Psssssssssshh. Might be a bla... I mean cultural thing. Because she is perfect to me. Different stokes for different folks. But to say that femSheps thighs are too big and unattractive is to say that most women in the US are unattractive. Because size 14 is the most common size.


Half of the country is fat. That doesn't mean everyone's view of ideal physical aesthetics gets fatter. Can a size 14 woman be attractive? Definitely. I think Christina Hendricks is one of the sexiest women alive. But big thighs and a narrow torso is not my idea of sexy.

Modifié par BrotherWarth, 30 août 2012 - 06:23 .


#69
MissMaster_2

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KBomb wrote...

habitat 67 wrote...

There is no way Shepard is petite. Walk her around the Citadel and pay close attention. She is taller than most of the men and even some of the Turians. I'd put her at close to 6 ft.




No way she is 6ft. I would venture she is around 5’10 and around 130 or so—which is about average. She isn’t as tall as Garrus.


Average where? lol. 

#70
habitat 67

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BrotherWarth wrote...

habitat 67 wrote...

BrotherWarth wrote...
What does height have to do with being petite in this context? Obviously we're saying she has noddle arms and too-narrow shoulders. And considering all women and Turians in the game are all roughly the same height since they're all using one model...


less than 5 4" is the definition of petite, genius.


Learn to read, genius. I said what does it have to with being petite in this context. Obviously no one was saying she was too short.


Reading just fine, big boy. Obviously.

#71
Guest_BrotherWarth_*

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habitat 67 wrote...

BrotherWarth wrote...

habitat 67 wrote...

BrotherWarth wrote...
What does height have to do with being petite in this context? Obviously we're saying she has noddle arms and too-narrow shoulders. And considering all women and Turians in the game are all roughly the same height since they're all using one model...


less than 5 4" is the definition of petite, genius.


Learn to read, genius. I said what does it have to with being petite in this context. Obviously no one was saying she was too short.


Reading just fine, big boy. Obviously.


Obviously not since no one said "FemShep is too short."

#72
KBomb

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MissMaster_2 wrote...

Average where? lol. 


Here.

#73
MissMaster_2

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BrotherWarth wrote...

habitat 67 wrote...

BrotherWarth wrote...

habitat 67 wrote...

BrotherWarth wrote...
What does height have to do with being petite in this context? Obviously we're saying she has noddle arms and too-narrow shoulders. And considering all women and Turians in the game are all roughly the same height since they're all using one model...


less than 5 4" is the definition of petite, genius.


Learn to read, genius. I said what does it have to with being petite in this context. Obviously no one was saying she was too short.


Reading just fine, big boy. Obviously.


Obviously not since no one said "FemShep is too short."


They were just putting in thier 2 cents to conversation, calm down. 

#74
MissMaster_2

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KBomb wrote...

MissMaster_2 wrote...

Average where? lol. 


Here.


Ah I thought you meant this in a different way. 

#75
Verkir

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I come here for the pictures of hot, built women.

I do not like our culture that pushes towards the right weight women rather then physically strong and healthy women. By right weight I am referring to basically a femshep build. There isn't a ton of muscle mass but it "fits to the standard"

WTB a new culture the encourage women to be stronger, to be fitter and to understand that they can woop some ass too.

Also post more pictures of Giana, would make me a happy camper.