367 réponses à ce sujet

[upinya slayin]

TazMonkey2011 wrote...

Feneckus wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

Feneckus wrote...

That's not much of a challenge. Basically every single post of yours is "Blah Blah Blah I'm awesome Blah Blah Blah"

if its so easy then do it. I never said it once

All right.

upinya slayin wrote...

it does take skill and practice. anyone can hit a baseball but it takes skill and practice to hit 30 home runs in a season

 

That wasn't so hard.

Exactly how is this Upinya saying "I'm AWSOME blah blah blah..." Upinya is only pointing out that almost everyone at somepoint in there lives hits a baseball...not everyone can hit 30 HR's per season. That usually take sa certin amount of skill and practice. So does understanding and implementing a successful speed run strategy.

its becuase he is a troll and he's reaching becuase he is wrong

[upinya slayin]

Also will it ever be possible for me to have a thread that stays on topic?

[LuckyBullet95]

MastahDissastah

This'll be my last post on this topic (spawn control and nuking) as quite frankly I am derailing the thread, and just providing lots of walls of text that are quite often just me repeating myself.

To be honest I think we would realise what weapon killed quickest without DPS calculations. Though of course without them we would probably have never known that the Claymore is oftentimes overkill and you can kill quicker using the Harrier, Reegar or Piranha. I don't pay much attention to DPS. The only one I can quote is the Claymore's 1648. All I really know is that the Piranha kills an ATLAS in 3 seconds if two people focus fire it's weakspots when used on the Geth Infiltrator.

I already said we don't speedrun the same maps. You just referenced a Hydra strat pieced together by Tatty. I didn't come up with that (If I said I did I apologise). The only strat I optimised is the Dagger strat. So yeah there are in fact 6 maps that we have strategies for and Tatty is looking to have a strat for every ,map before he hangs up his boots. We don't spend much time speedrunning as much as we do doing fun runs like Geth vs. Geth or Particle Rifle Soldiers on Giant. Doing one thing does indeed make it tedious and boring however I don't think I've ran Glacier's strategy in 3 days...

Again I don't look to achieve the world record. I am not and will never be in the league of AreleX, zHHk or the current holders Bech, Milk Ninja, SilentBlade and Gollum. I don't mind trying to break my own though.

For me the majority of the fun in this game comes from teaching other's how to speedrun, developing strategy for speedrunning different maps and doing goofy runs like the Vorcha Flamer Only. That is how I get my kicks. Running and gunning aimlessly is often how those fun funs go by the way. I do live and die in Mass Effect with speedrunning being my objective. It's just one of many things I find fun. Bettering myself by working to understand the spawn pattern. I just don't understand why other's wouldn't.Through speedrunning I can safely say that I can crutch later waves in a pug game with relative ease. It's because I bettered myself. Learning how spawns work, knowing how to dodge effectively, using right hand advantage, reload cancelling. All mechanics get better at by speedrunning. Camping is easy, it's simple, for some it'll be fun but I just don't see why you wouldn't at least try and challenge yourself with speedrunning.


EDIT Upinya you are often the cause of things going off topic lmao. Or need I remind you of the "Miranda vs. Jack, Krogan Testicals vs. Salarian Horn and Krogan vs. Vorcha, Which would be a better pet?" thread?

Modifié par LuckyBullet95, 30 août 2012 - 08:23 .

[upinya slayin]

LuckyBullet95 wrote...

MastahDissastah

This'll be my last post as quite frankly I am derailing the thread, and just providing lots of walls of text that are quite often just me repeating myself.

To be honest I think we would realise what weapon killed quickest without DPS calculations. Though of course without them we would probably have never known that the Claymore is oftentimes overkill and you can kill quicker using the Harrier, Reegar or Piranha. I don't pay much attention to DPS. The only one I can quote is the Claymore's 1648. All I really know is that the Piranha kills an ATLAS in 3 seconds if two people focus fire it's weakspots when used on the Geth Infiltrator.

I already said we don't speedrun the same maps. You just referenced a Hydra strat pieced together by Tatty. I didn't come up with that (If I said I did I apologise). The only strat I optimised is the Dagger strat. So yeah there are in fact 6 maps that we have strategies for and Tatty is looking to have a strat for every ,map before he hangs up his boots. We don't spend much time speedrunning as much as we do doing fun runs like Geth vs. Geth or Particle Rifle Soldiers on Giant. Doing one thing does indeed make it tedious and boring however I don't think I've ran Glacier's strategy in 3 days...

Again I don't look to achieve the world record. I am not and will never be in the league of AreleX, zHHk or the current holders Bech, Milk Ninja, SilentBlade and Gollum. I don't mind trying to break my own though.

For me the majority of the fun in this game comes from teaching other's how to speedrun, developing strategy for speedrunning different maps and doing goofy runs like the Vorcha Flamer Only. That is how I get my kicks. Running and gunning aimlessly is often how those fun funs go by the way. I do live and die in Mass Effect with speedrunning being my objective. It's just one of many things I find fun. Bettering myself by working to understand the spawn pattern. I just don't understand why other's wouldn't.Through speedrunning I can safely say that I can crutch later waves in a pug game with relative ease. It's because I bettered myself. Learning how spawns work, knowing how to dodge effectively, using right hand advantage, reload cancelling. All mechanics get better at by speedrunning. Camping is easy, it's simple, for some it'll be fun but I just don't see why you wouldn't at least try and challenge yourself with speedrunning.

my on topic comment wasn't directed at you BTW.

[jd641]

Smass Effect 3 co-op, it's serious business for sure.

[TazMonkey2011]

upinya slayin wrote...

Also will it ever be possible for me to have a thread that stays on topic?

LOL I doubt it

OFF Topic  How long did the Bronze speed run you did the other day take? like 7 mins lol

[Ashen One]

LuckyBullet95 wrote...

Ashen Earth wrote...

LuckyBullet95 wrote...

Your average player sees strategy as "we stay here, enemies come from those two directions", "If I place a Decoy here we get less aggro" and "Duration cloak". That is indeed strategy for camping. It's an easy strategy though and doesn't involved spawn control beyond accidental control. (They camped there because it is safe not to block that spawn).

Out of curiousity, how does duration cloak tie into a camping strategy?

I find that it helps me flank more frequently, and spend extended periods of time outside of cover. I can get from one group of enemies to another group on the far side of the map and ambush them all with the TC bonus while remaining undetected.

Maybe it's not what you meant, but this "DPS is all that matters" mentality in regards to utility vs damage is a bit ridiculous.

I know some people make use of it for speedrunning but mainly it is used as a utility in camping strats.

Not just for speedrunning, but also in a real game scenario. (as in not stacking the odds in your own favor by choosing the best classes tailored to fight a specific enemy on a specific map)

For example, I frequently outperform damage specced GI's with their Piranhas using my own GI with extended cloak duration and the speed and vision bonus in Hunter Mode. ( I don't use the Piranha either) The ability to find enemies more easily, and get to them faster and with less resistance is worth more than an overkill damage bonus imo. Enemies die fast enough to my setup.

And the same could be said of any power (being used as a utility in camping strategies), because the majority of the playerbase are campers. It's not anywhere near exclusive to duration cloak.

[upinya slayin]

TazMonkey2011 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

Also will it ever be possible for me to have a thread that stays on topic?

LOL I doubt it

OFF Topic  How long did the Bronze speed run you did the other day take? like 7 mins lol

longer then my gold and platinum runs lol.seriously like 14 mins. i've done gold and platinum runs in that time. it would take forever looking for enemies to kill. they aren't agressive enough on bronze and since they don't spawn in large groups they are hard to spot

[TazMonkey2011]

upinya slayin wrote...

TazMonkey2011 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

Also will it ever be possible for me to have a thread that stays on topic?

LOL I doubt it

OFF Topic  How long did the Bronze speed run you did the other day take? like 7 mins lol

longer then my gold and platinum runs lol.seriously like 14 mins. i've done gold and platinum runs in that time. it would take forever looking for enemies to kill. they aren't agressive enough on bronze and since they don't spawn in large groups they are hard to spot

Damn I've done a couple of 15 minute Bronze runs although my best silver/gold was 22 so I'm not 1337 as the kids like to say...

[Kenadian]

upinya slayin wrote...

Kenadian wrote...

First, I shall call you Slaya in honour of the band. Second, tldr did you make a vid? I'd love to see this.

i couldn't get him to join the game

I am now a sad Canuck. I am disappoint.

[upinya slayin]

TazMonkey2011 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

TazMonkey2011 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

Also will it ever be possible for me to have a thread that stays on topic?

LOL I doubt it

OFF Topic  How long did the Bronze speed run you did the other day take? like 7 mins lol

longer then my gold and platinum runs lol.seriously like 14 mins. i've done gold and platinum runs in that time. it would take forever looking for enemies to kill. they aren't agressive enough on bronze and since they don't spawn in large groups they are hard to spot

Damn I've done a couple of 15 minute Bronze runs although my best silver/gold was 22 so I'm not 1337 as the kids like to say...

i'll take you thorugh one. I did it with 3 randoms in about 20 mins flat and i outscored all 3 combined. I can at least get you an 18 minute one with a decent team. the randoms were cool as hell though. they kept apoligizing and I told them don't worry, everyone starts from somewhere and its a learning experiance.. nad that was w/o rocket spawns too

[Feneckus]

 How does that ignore list thing work ?

[Geek]

Semi relevant to original post: I played a quick game with randoms yesterday. Nobody had mics in but everyone played well and it was a 17 minute extraction. I had to leave right after and I sent a quick message to one of the guys saying ""GG, always nice to get a great game with randoms".

His response was "Sarcasm?". Was like he was expecting me to be condescending or rude even with a nice message. Just how the internet is I suppose.

[whateverman7]

wait a min: are yall trying to tell me being able to speed run is the measure of whether a player has skill or not?...lol i've heard it all now...

[whateverman7]

rymoulton wrote...

Semi relevant to original post: I played a quick game with randoms yesterday. Nobody had mics in but everyone played well and it was a 17 minute extraction. I had to leave right after and I sent a quick message to one of the guys saying ""GG, always nice to get a great game with randoms".

His response was "Sarcasm?". Was like he was expecting me to be condescending or rude even with a nice message. Just how the internet is I suppose.

well, your message kinda implied that you having great games with randoms is rare, far and few in between....it wouldve been better if you wouldve just left it at GG

[upinya slayin]

rymoulton wrote...

Semi relevant to original post: I played a quick game with randoms yesterday. Nobody had mics in but everyone played well and it was a 17 minute extraction. I had to leave right after and I sent a quick message to one of the guys saying ""GG, always nice to get a great game with randoms".

His response was "Sarcasm?". Was like he was expecting me to be condescending or rude even with a nice message. Just how the internet is I suppose.

its sad how people expect other to be asses automatically becuase its the internet

[upinya slayin]

whateverman7 wrote...

wait a min: are yall trying to tell me being able to speed run is the measure of whether a player has skill or not?...lol i've heard it all now...

no, people are saying that it takes skill to speed run. but i'd hardly say its the pure measure of soembody's skill.

[Ashen One]

whateverman7 wrote...

wait a min: are yall trying to tell me being able to speed run is the measure of whether a player has skill or not?...lol i've heard it all now...

Not at all, but people will comprehend what they want.

If that's what you want to take from it then nothing anyone says will convince you otherwise. Such is the way of BSN.

[Feneckus]

LuckyBullet95 wrote...

1. Why would you be arguing against rocket use if you weren't? If you're going to run and gun then you migth as well try and force spawns to make things  organised and easier. Rocketting or not it's basically the exact same strategy but you forced them somewhere rather than accidentally allowing to spawn somewhere potentially game ending.

2. It is, actually. Efficiency means you're killing enemies. Killing enemies is what gets you half your overall xp. The other half comes from medals which you mostly get for killing enemies. So Upinya rockets a spawn to get himself 5k xp. What of it? It's a rocket he would only use to kill those enemies later anyways once they are entrenching him and he is trapped whilst the enemies themselves have split up. Why kill 2 banshees with a rocket when you can kill 2 banshees, 2 Ravagers, a Marauder, a Brute and 2 Cannibals?

3. Like I said all spawn control does is let you use your rocket before you're forced to. Also the mystery player could easily do the self-same thing. You know, unless he  didn't have to know-how to force a full intial spawn inside the most compact, safest to get spawn point available.

4. I never did say Speedrunning was fun, it's novel and nice on Glacier and White however it is also a challenge. First to create the speedrun strategy. Second to modify the strategy. And third to continue to try and beat your previous best time. Keep pushing yourself to be quicker at clearing spawns, to be better positioned for possible objective spawns. To be at the top of your game before extraction (there is no point in going for an extraction if you're just going to die anyways). However if you grind those maps and strategies it does indeed get boring. That is why there is now a strategy for Jade, Goddess, Hydra and Dagger created by Team AreleX.

There are also attempts to speedrun every other map. You can indeed camp the basement once or twice on White, it's easy, it's a novelty run. However if too long passes it becomes tedious. You can however camp each map with it become tedious as long as you change it up. On top of that there are numerous challenge runs we get ourselves into (check the Team AreleX presents... discussion topic in our group and you'll see there is only actually four speedrun vids whilst there are about 12 challenge vids).

5. Once again you baselessly insult and slander me with your fake propaganda. I am in no way a gift. Indeed I am good. But I am in no way as good as the guys I noted in the post you quoted. And that includes a group of soloers, campers and speedrunners. Don't try and paint me in a bad light by saying I lord around with my e-peen hanging out because I don't. I just pointed out that there is no reason for people not to challenge themselves. If they are camping, try their hand at speedrunning, I know I enjoy a few camping sessions now and then for fun but it doesn't mean I'm not going to try beating my personal speedrun record on Glacier...

This game in general has become somewhat tedious and boring to me. I can't truly get fun out of it by simply like others. Camping and speedrunning both become boring after a while with the only challenge coming from cheap enemies and mechanics (Turrets, Stunlock and Magnet Grab) with or without rockets. Again check the discussion topic and you will see exactly that. Four speedrun vids (all the current records for those maps) and 10-15 challenge vids (I'm not counting them...) ranging from the poopular "Hold the Reactor" and "Have you got a Quad" to Flamer and Demo stuff only runs.

I play this game mainly for Team AreleX now. The community (at least that community) is awesome and it's a nice and fun challenge to try and piece together a speedrun strategy for Ghost, and just as fun and challenging to do a common class and weapons only run. The novelty of camping and speedrunning both wear off after a while though the friendly competition between Team AreleX members (you may have noticed the tournament thread) keeps speedrunning much more fun and enjoyable for longer. I can maybe stomach one or two camp matches before I just get bored and start running and gunning whilst I can sometimes forget the time during speedruns thanks to Team AreleX.

So yeah all I pointed out was how wrong it was for people to point out how skill-less rocketting spawns are and yet suddenly you are slandering me as an obnoxious egotist? May I ask why?

You obviously didn't understand what I was trying to say ....

[Mobius69]

so does this mean i won my first speed challange

[LuckyBullet95]

whateverman7 wrote...

rymoulton wrote...

Semi relevant to original post: I played a quick game with randoms yesterday. Nobody had mics in but everyone played well and it was a 17 minute extraction. I had to leave right after and I sent a quick message to one of the guys saying ""GG, always nice to get a great game with randoms".

His response was "Sarcasm?". Was like he was expecting me to be condescending or rude even with a nice message. Just how the internet is I suppose.

well, your message kinda implied that you having great games with randoms is rare, far and few in between....it wouldve been better if you wouldve just left it at GG

It is true though to be honest. Most randoms involve carrying one orw two players (sometimes even the whole team). It is good to get a game in where you get outperformed or you are all on equal ground. I don't mind carrying and I won't send dick messages like Upinya's mystery player did but I will always commend people for playing a great game.

Though I do think that the run and gunner's perspective is slightyl cloudy. I see myself as carrying campers simply because I play off of the spawns they blocked and run and gun. I will also use them as a massive decoy to flank and nuke (without rockets) the enemy. I will do most of the killing because I simply am not letting them kill. Also they will see me as a run and gunner and I willl often be treated as the objective capper (I will be responsible for the devices objective if a Duration Infiltrator isn't amongst the party).

You can see easily that what may have been a great set of camping players is otherwise toned down because camping only works if enemies get within line of sight, something I will be preventing by raping the spawn (attacking the Side room and LZ on White). And when they do get within range I will often flank and kill them before they are in ideal range. (i.e killing enemies at the bottom of the strairs heading into the White basement's main entrance). If I was camping with them however I wouldn't be candidate for objectives and I wouldn't be "killwhoring" through my run and gun playstyle allowing more kills for the team as a whole.

[Geek]

whateverman7 wrote...

rymoulton wrote...

Semi relevant to original post: I played a quick game with randoms yesterday. Nobody had mics in but everyone played well and it was a 17 minute extraction. I had to leave right after and I sent a quick message to one of the guys saying ""GG, always nice to get a great game with randoms".

His response was "Sarcasm?". Was like he was expecting me to be condescending or rude even with a nice message. Just how the internet is I suppose.

well, your message kinda implied that you having great games with randoms is rare, far and few in between....it wouldve been better if you wouldve just left it at GG

Honestly games that go that well with randoms are few and far between. I said it was a great game but I suppose I probably could have just left it at gg.

[whateverman7]

Ashen Earth wrote...

Not at all, but people will comprehend what they want.

If that's what you want to take from it then nothing anyone says will convince you otherwise. Such is the way of BSN.

people comprehending what they want is true...but the other poster's posts implied what i asked...just go look at that whole exchange talking about it...

[LuckyBullet95]

PSA ON SPAWN CONTROL AND SPAWN NUKING

I know I said my last post on this would be my last post but I just thought I'd say this. I apologise to anyone I may have offended by saying spawn control was the pinnacle of understanding this game's mechanics. I know other people will have differing opinions but to me it is. Being able to do everything I've noted in the last three pages worth of text walls is to me what defines a speedrunner.

I did not mean to come of as obnoxious or elitist and if I did I apologise. My purpose of the original post was that spawn nuking effectively takes alot more skill than people make it out to because a full strategy is needed to do it efficiently. You can ofcourse just nuke stuff but you need to organisation the group so that when you do rocket, you do so as best as possible. That was all I was getting at. There is indeed a reason why not everyone is posting 10 minute speedruns. Skill is a large factor (I can't get 10 mins, I am not THAT good) but the main thnig is that speedrunners take an interest in the spawn system, spawn patterns and learn to control spawns. It is something that an average camper can't do (though can learn to do).

It is by far one of the hardest mechanics to learn because of it's variation on every map as opposed to other mecahnics like combos, reload cancelling and dodging which are a constant. You learn it once you don't need to learn it again.I also said I don't see why people don't push themselves because I honestly don't see any fun in not. Without challenging myself to better my record, create a new strat or handicap myself. This game has come down to challenging myself and Team AreleX. My definition of fun though is obviously not going to be the same as the next guy. Team AreleX was created as a union of players with my mindset. I am glad to be a part of it and enjoy teaching others. If you still enjoy this game for itself, for simply running and gunning or camping then good for you. I just don't.

Once again I am sorry if I insulted or came off as arrogant to any of you. My own views on this game may have clouded my judgment of it. However I still stand by my original post that spawn control is (in my eyes) the pinnacle of a player's knowledge of this game's mechanics.


/endofftopic

Modifié par LuckyBullet95, 30 août 2012 - 09:27 .

[whateverman7]

LuckyBullet95 wrote...

It is true though to be honest. Most randoms involve carrying one orw two players (sometimes even the whole team). It is good to get a game in where you get outperformed or you are all on equal ground. I don't mind carrying and I won't send dick messages like Upinya's mystery player did but I will always commend people for playing a great game.

Though I do think that the run and gunner's perspective is slightyl cloudy. I see myself as carrying campers simply because I play off of the spawns they blocked and run and gun. I will also use them as a massive decoy to flank and nuke (without rockets) the enemy. I will do most of the killing because I simply am not letting them kill. Also they will see me as a run and gunner and I willl often be treated as the objective capper (I will be responsible for the devices objective if a Duration Infiltrator isn't amongst the party).

You can see easily that what may have been a great set of camping players is otherwise toned down because camping only works if enemies get within line of sight, something I will be preventing by raping the spawn (attacking the Side room and LZ on White). And when they do get within range I will often flank and kill them before they are in ideal range. (i.e killing enemies at the bottom of the strairs heading into the White basement's main entrance). If I was camping with them however I wouldn't be candidate for objectives and I wouldn't be "killwhoring" through my run and gun playstyle allowing more kills for the team as a whole.

it's not true...all i play is games with randoms and i have had more good games then bad

also, using how people play to determine if the game was good/bad is something we will just have to agree to disagree on...i dont use that as a meausre cause people play the game how they want