6432 réponses à ce sujet

[Blueprotoss]

ShepnTali wrote...

Blueprotoss claims most of the complaints directed at Bioware were death threats with physical violence.

We're still waiting on these 'facts'.

I'm sure you would love to hack into Bioware and become a BSN mod.

[Isichar]

Blueprotoss wrote...

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

Blueprotoss wrote...

Applepie_Svk wrote...

Blueprotoss wrote...

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

Now you're just trolling. But hell, you've been doing that already for the past hundred pages.

How am I "trolling" when nobody knows whether or not that ME3 wouldn't have a canon ending later on like in ME4.

Are you saying that BioWare could have lied again ?

Yet Bioware never said this while you forget that Shepard was still able to continue his/her journey throughout ME with established canon.

Your ability to give straight answers is impecable.

Yet I am giving you staright answers.

Without any basis or proof to those answers.

[Blueprotoss]

Icinix wrote...

Blueprotoss wrote...

Icinix wrote...

Rubbish - they haven't tried to engage on the forums (beyond the odd Moderator keeping an eye on things)

It was the same thing as DA2 - and they started up some threads, engaged with people, and its all pretty much died down.

You'll get a few who will fire up as you always have anyway - but the devs haven't tried to get involved at all.

As for Twitter - well I stay away from that so can't comment - but from what I've seen Twitter has people troll and flame everything anyway regardless of what it is - so I don't think thats exclusive to BioWare.

I'm sure you haven't heard of the few topics that have occured and its not good to make assumptions.

Really? BioWare developers have engaged with fans and started threads discussing the endings?

I don't know about the endings but several discussions did appear and quickly died.

[ShepnTali]

Blueprotoss wrote...

ShepnTali wrote...

Blueprotoss claims most of the complaints directed at Bioware were death threats with physical violence.

We're still waiting on these 'facts'.

I'm sure you would love to hack into Bioware and become a BSN mod.

No. But keep on misdirecting.

[Blueprotoss]

Isichar wrote...

Without any basis or proof to those answers.

I'm sure you would love to hack into Bioware and become a BSN mod.  I haven't done that while you won't find the answers the way you're looking at BSN. 

[Solmanian]

Almostfaceman wrote...

First, I qualified my initial statement with "if enough people". Which is true. 
Then, you responded with a blanket absolute statement that all boycotts are ineffective.
So, I responded with something equally as silly, that all boycotts work.
But boycotts do work sometimes. I've lived through one. I grew up on the 80's when the American car manufacturers were boycotted by the American public in favor of Japanese manufacturers. It worked. Over the years the loss in sales prompted the American car manufacturers to stop making junk like they did in the 70's. So, it solved the problem of low car quality in the American industry. Quality has gone up and thanks to competition and a discerning customer we now have a wide range of quality cars to choose from, both American and Japanese. 

Didn't the majority of american car manufacturers went bankrupt in the last crisis, with the survivors being kept on life support by the goverment? Lack of support on homefront from the american public ran the american automobile industry into the ground. I wouldn't consider it as a boycot story with a happy ending, unless your idea ofhappy ending involves all leading game companies going out of bussiness and the only survivors are companies who keep cloning games from the last decade at best, or at worst raping the memories of our childhood by making them into FPS shooters (I'm looking at you syndicate).

[Blueprotoss]

ShepnTali wrote...

Blueprotoss wrote...

ShepnTali wrote...

Blueprotoss claims most of the complaints directed at Bioware were death threats with physical violence.

We're still waiting on these 'facts'.

I'm sure you would love to hack into Bioware and become a BSN mod.

No. But keep on misdirecting.

Yet there's no misdirection other then you being in denial.

[Isichar]

BP is a troll, have yet to see one comment from him that is serious.

Modifié par Isichar, 10 septembre 2012 - 10:42 .

[ShepnTali]

Blueprotoss wrote...

ShepnTali wrote...

Blueprotoss wrote...

ShepnTali wrote...

Blueprotoss claims most of the complaints directed at Bioware were death threats with physical violence.

We're still waiting on these 'facts'.

I'm sure you would love to hack into Bioware and become a BSN mod.

No. But keep on misdirecting.

Yet there's no misdirection other then you being in denial.

I'm rightfully in denial of your lie. 

[AresKeith]

so can we try to put this back on topic now?

[Isichar]

AresKeith wrote...

so can we try to put this back on topic now?

Sorry.

[LupusXIII]

I totally agree with the OP and as much i would apricate that bioware fix that issue i dont think they will they sold there soul (prove me that im wrong BW) but i think its up to us the comunity who seems to care much more for waht ME deserve BW stated already that they dont have problems with modifications that only affect SP (http://social.biowar...index/9917845/2) so why not do so i know ME never was as easy to mod as Bethesda games but it should be possible and i also know modding is a very time consuming work and u only do it to deliver something waht others may like i know it exactly im a modder my self and im part of a small mod team since a year now and if u look how big this comunity is im sure there are people who have the skill and have the interest to fix up waht BW didnt if anyone wants to start such a mod PM me and i will try to help in anyway i can i just dont have the time to start such a project cause my actual mod project is still in work

[Blueprotoss]

Isichar wrote...

BP is a troll, have yet to see one comment from him that is serious.

I'm no "troll" and its ironic when you're doing the insulting here.

ShepnTali wrote...

I'm rightfully in denial of your lie. 

Yet you're not interested in reason. 

Modifié par Blueprotoss, 10 septembre 2012 - 10:50 .

[Iakus]

3DandBeyond wrote...

Part of this is directed at one poster who for some reason had to bring up particularly disgusting and abhorrent things-things that should be put in the past or that should have been dealt with in a mature way.  I will not apologize for things I did not do and I cannot feel any shame for that kind of thing since I never took part and I wouldn't, so it has no place here in this discussion.  It only opens old wounds.

I believe that some people are merely here to argue and I have no wish to debate the past with them. I can't change that and bringing it up implies that certain things are still ongoing.

This gets us nowhere and it is casting blame on everyone which if the reverse were true would be just as wrong.

It needs to stop. It's childish and stupid. When I was twelve my one brother hit me. Should I blame my other brother for that? And how long is long enough for me to blame both of them?

Bioware shouldn't use proxies to defend themselves and we should all have more constructive discussion.

I do think there's middle ground in all of this and compromise and I've laid out that compromise. And contrary to what one person has said here, that does not mean we'd get everything we want because we'd rather they wiped out the whole ending. Compromise isn't giving them everything either. I've suggested that we pay for it and that is compromise. I've also suggested that it not impact other people's games unless they want it to and that's compromise those people don't want to make. It won't affect them but they don't want it to happen. Now that's real compromise.

My appeal remains to Bioware. I have never threatened them, but have at times been extremely critical. I do not think any of my criticism has been without merit, but I am hopeful that they can put that behind them and that we can all put things behind us and work together for a way forward. I've no interest in continuing on with this same discussion forever.

It should be evident to anyone with 2 brain cells to click together that this site is far less active than it used to be and that does not bode well. I've recently been on gaming sites for even older games that are much more active, so we can keep on arguing the same old stuff or all agree to compromise. One person's supposed suggestion is not at all in line with any real compromise and does not at all address what we've discussed here or what is in my OP.

Here here!

I'm eagerly awaiting the release of the enhanced version of a game nearly 15 years old more than any ME product.  But I keep coming here hoping to be pleasantly suprised.

What happened?

[Solmanian]

Ozida wrote...

Solmanian wrote...

Snip

and snap

As I said, I believe everyone is entitled to his own opinions. But I just have to say something.

You complain that a game centered around choices is forcing you to choose. Every RPG that worth his salt ends by making you choose, and never lets you get it all. a couple of examples:
Witcher 2 - choose the kingdom or the girl.
Dragon age forces you to sacrifice yourself, one of your companions or your child.

Would you really be happier if ME3 ended with a dialogue choice:
Do you wish to save the galaxy? Yes or no.

[Warrior Craess]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Icinix wrote...

Redbelle wrote...

Icinix wrote...

Pheonix57 wrote...

For what it's worth, I too would like Bioware to issue an apology. Or at least give us something solid that explains what they did/are trying to do.

I want them to start talking about the ending like they said the day after launch they would do once more people had played it.

They said discussions were imminent....

You never know. They may have planned a DLC like the arrival that adds another way to potentially end the trilogy on.

In ME2 blowing up the collector base was the end. But continuing, (yes I know you can't continue in ME3 but I'm basing this on past DLC release events)...... continuing past the collector base gave you The Arrival DLC that, being the last DLC produced for ME2 had another bookend feel to it. i.e. It didn't feed into further events within the game but served as a bridge between ME2 to ME3.

Maybe they won't, or can't do something similar in ME3. But from past form the last DLC BW release should be one that rocks the game. Cause every game developer wants to end their games on a high note and the ECDLC 'Retake' movement etc, have pretty much told BW that a significant portion of fans didn't get that high.

Maybe, I would love to see them try to salvage and give it their all to get back in the game.

Most companies just cut their losses when it blows up anywhere like this, and despite the 'vocal minority' tag, I don't think a game has caused this much of an outcry in my memory.

Fingers crossed you're right and they'll pull it out of the fire yet.

Diablo 3 online single player requirement and RMAH caused a much larger backlash. Do not confuse some people sending cakes or pulling PR stunts to mean bigger backlash. Number wise vastly more people were unhappy about D3 online only requirement and real money auction house than people who dislike ME3 ending. Funny thing about bias you only see what you want to see, if you only read about ME3 then ME3 is the biggest thing you see. Take step outside of ME3 topics and will notice there have been much bigger backlashes to games than ME3 endings.

I actually play both games, and the back lash for D3 wasn't bigger, unless you want to talk just in absolute numbers. As a percentage they are probably on pare, and both made it into forbes. Blizzard however hasn't had 3 bad games in a row though (at least based on customer opinion)  where as bioware has had, DA2, SWToR, and now ME3 blow up in their face. 

Blizzard will eventually pull their heads mostly out of their rectal cavity. Jury is still out on Bioware. For all the fans that are happy about the EC there are fans like me, who found it, adequate, but not enough to restore my faith in biowares product.  

And since I purchased both SWtor and ME3 CE pre-orders, alientating fans like me isn't a smart thing. How many fans like me are alienated is a bit of a mystery, but it would really suck if biowares next game tanked due to lack of sales simply becuase they refused to work with their fan base. 

[Jaryd theBlackDragon]

Icinix wrote...

Redbelle wrote...

Icinix wrote...

Pheonix57 wrote...

For what it's worth, I too would like Bioware to issue an apology. Or at least give us something solid that explains what they did/are trying to do.

I want them to start talking about the ending like they said the day after launch they would do once more people had played it.

They said discussions were imminent....

You never know. They may have planned a DLC like the arrival that adds another way to potentially end the trilogy on.

In ME2 blowing up the collector base was the end. But continuing, (yes I know you can't continue in ME3 but I'm basing this on past DLC release events)...... continuing past the collector base gave you The Arrival DLC that, being the last DLC produced for ME2 had another bookend feel to it. i.e. It didn't feed into further events within the game but served as a bridge between ME2 to ME3.

Maybe they won't, or can't do something similar in ME3. But from past form the last DLC BW release should be one that rocks the game. Cause every game developer wants to end their games on a high note and the ECDLC 'Retake' movement etc, have pretty much told BW that a significant portion of fans didn't get that high.

Maybe, I would love to see them try to salvage and give it their all to get back in the game.

Most companies just cut their losses when it blows up anywhere like this, and despite the 'vocal minority' tag, I don't think a game has caused this much of an outcry in my memory.

Fingers crossed you're right and they'll pull it out of the fire yet.

BioWare fairly obviously has nothing to say about their own IP anymore, that or they changed so much in recent years that they aren't really  "BioWare" anymore.

The fact that a load of the people that actually cared about the games they made quit not all too long after Bioware was acquired by EA says more than enough for me (eg. Brent Knowles, the lead designer of DAO). With DAO BioWare started giong in a direction I clearly didn't like: mostly mediocre DLCs that added little, arguably they might still have been trying to get the hang of this "DLC-thing", but when ME2 was released as an obvious console port (what do you mean, there's no shortcut for the Journal?) with stupid crap like "horse armor"-style DLCs I knew where we were headed.

But for Mass Effect we were promised a trilogy and closure with ME3, so I waited, not in eager anticipation, oh no, but in fear of what might come. A milk-cow had been found, a setting and a conflict that had ensared a lot of people all sitting and waiting for the end. ME3, so we had been told, was to be that end. And it turned out as I feared: unfulfilling, without definite conclusion, leaving as much room as possible for the IP to be milked further.

After the disaster that was DA2, ME3 only confirmed the course BioWare seems to have taken. Instead of trying to reinstate faith in their brand they seem to have decided making a quick buck is more important. They can claim all they want, but Mass Effect is nog longer about the art or about the story, it's about the money (fair does,but at least be up front about it).

It's their IP and their money, but if they want to make generic games and just want to money-milk people's emotional investment in the stories they started then these are not the games I want to play. Maybe they'll amaze me with whatever they release next, but really after DA2, ME3 and SWToR it will have to be a game with raving good reviews from sources I deem reputable (because most major news outlets are just shills or lack any form of critical thougth, pick one).

Luckily I still read books I will get my story fix there, and if I want a good RPG there's always Bethesda and who knows, maybe Obsidian manages to put something out that's as inspired as Alpha Protocol but actually finished and by some divine miracle even has less bugs than your average Bethesda game.

And hey, even over 10 years after release I still enjoy Baldur's Gate, Fallout etc. The BioWare that made all those classics possible may be dead, but the games are still there.

So long BioWare, and thanks for all the fish.

Modifié par Jaryd theBlackDragon, 10 septembre 2012 - 10:59 .

[Ozida]

Solmanian wrote...

As I said, I believe everyone is entitled to his own opinions. But I just have to say something.
You complain that a game centered around choices is forcing you to choose. Every RPG that worth his salt ends by making you choose, and never lets you get it all. a couple of examples:
Witcher 2 - choose the kingdom or the girl.
Dragon age forces you to sacrifice yourself, one of your companions or your child.

Would you really be happier if ME3 ended with a dialogue choice:
Do you wish to save the galaxy? Yes or no.

First of all, I haven't plaid those other games, sorry. However, I have played Fallout 2, a pretty dark game, if you ask me, and it let me have everything in the end if I tried hard. The same happened with Arcanum too. So, yes, I sometimes expect RPGs to have happy endings, especially if 2 out 3 games actually had them.

And secondly, I am one of those people who thinks that we were better with NO choices at the end of ME3 at all. I think it should've shown our War assets in use, calcualte all other choices we have made and render results based on that. No picking the color at all.

However, this is just my opinion, of course.

[AresKeith]

Ozida wrote...

First of all, I haven't plaid those other games, sorry. However, I have played Fallout 2, a pretty dark game, if you ask me, and it let me have everything in the end if I tried hard. The same happened with Arcanum too. So, yes, I sometimes expect RPGs to have happy endings, especially if 2 out 3 games actually had them.

And secondly, I am one of those people who thinks that we were better with NO choices at the end of ME3 at all. I think it should've shown our War assets in use, calcualte all other choices we have made and render results based on that. No picking the color at all.

However, this is just my opinion, of course.

thats what I was expecting at the end of ME3, after they stated having multiple endings and our choices affecting those endings

[Solmanian]

@Warrior Craess, I would note that blizzard hasn't released a game that wasn't a sequel in 15 years. In that time bioware made BG, NWN, JE, ME and DA. So they even made more games than blizzard, who decided to milk WOW to death instead of developing something new. Is it realy a surprise that they can't find a buyer for blizzard, even thouigh they made the most successful game like EVER?

[TheRealJayDee]

Ozida wrote...

And secondly, I am one of those people who thinks that we were better with NO choices at the end of ME3 at all. I think it should've shown our War assets in use, calcualte all other choices we have made and render results based on that. No picking the color at all.

However, this is just my opinion, of course.

Word!

[Warrior Craess]

Solmanian wrote...

@Warrior Craess, I would note that blizzard hasn't released a game that wasn't a sequel in 15 years. In that time bioware made BG, NWN, JE, ME and DA. So they even made more games than blizzard, who decided to milk WOW to death instead of developing something new. Is it realy a surprise that they can't find a buyer for blizzard, even thouigh they made the most successful game like EVER?

Why would they need to make a new game?  You've got the 800lb gorilla raking in cash hand over fist. You have a rabid fan base for games like Diablo and SC. 

New doesn't equate to better. Aside from having to be online to play single player, most of the fuss from Blizzard is about from those rabid fans who spent tons of time farming llot and selling it online. I played D2, and saw all the cheats and farming, item sales etc that was done on that game. Only real issue with RMAH is that it takes away the ability to sell crap on ebay. 

Blizzard has the luxury of being able to ****** off a half a million people, because their fan base is significantly higher than biowares. They will recover many of those fans when they release SC expansion, or the Protoss/zerg for SC2. Bioware has alientated a large portion of thier fan base, wether they will gain them back, well thats still to be determined. 

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

@Dragoon where in this thread have you seen someone demand a conventional victory?

It has been said multiple times in this thread that to some people here conventional or unconventional victory is the only thing they will accept. That is not compromise. My suggestion like 30 or so pages back suggested actual compromise that gives three out of the four major things people have asked for in a way that won't undermine Biowares story they wished to tell. Like I said some people in here do not grasp the concept of compromise or know what "middle ground" is.

Since you like posing questions here's one for you and for 3D. If they gave a reunion via one additional cutscene on the destroy ending, if they gave another Harbinger confrontation in another pre-endgame DLC and if they gave a more emotional set of cutscenes for the refuse ending even though still ends in loss (to keep their story wished to tell intact) would you accept that and be done with your complaining or in reality would nothing other than conventional or unconventional victory be acceptable to you two? Because my suggestion had all of those things except the last one yet was dismissed and thrown out the window .

I know this isn't addressed to me, but it looks like I missed a show this afternoon. What I bolded and underlined is the only dog I have in this fight. I get that and I'm good.

I still may point out other weaknesses in the game and the ending from a literary standpoint, but from a replay standpoint and from a "will I purchase DLC for the game" standpoint I'm good then.

[Warrior Craess]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

@Dragoon where in this thread have you seen someone demand a conventional victory?

It has been said multiple times in this thread that to some people here conventional or unconventional victory is the only thing they will accept. That is not compromise. My suggestion like 30 or so pages back suggested actual compromise that gives three out of the four major things people have asked for in a way that won't undermine Biowares story they wished to tell. Like I said some people in here do not grasp the concept of compromise or know what "middle ground" is.

Since you like posing questions here's one for you and for 3D. If they gave a reunion via one additional cutscene on the destroy ending, if they gave another Harbinger confrontation in another pre-endgame DLC and if they gave a more emotional set of cutscenes for the refuse ending even though still ends in loss (to keep their story wished to tell intact) would you accept that and be done with your complaining or in reality would nothing other than conventional or unconventional victory be acceptable to you two? Because my suggestion had all of those things except the last one yet was dismissed and thrown out the window .

I know this isn't addressed to me, but it looks like I missed a show this afternoon. What I bolded and underlined is the only dog I have in this fight. I get that and I'm good.

I still may point out other weaknesses in the game and the ending from a literary standpoint, but from a replay standpoint and from a "will I purchase DLC for the game" standpoint I'm good then.

I'd have to say that depending on what DLC they release prior to that, I'd be happier, and would probably buy their product on release day again if they did what Dragoonlordz wrote. Let me clarify though that if they continue to release stuff like Levi, which changes the equation of the war more than just a little bit, then they may indeed have to release un/conventional warfare victory. 

I would have been happy with the endings if they had just removed the stupid star child; given us a verbal confrontation between Harbinger, and Shepard; the need to explore the crucible/catalyst in order to initiate it's firing, and some visual clues that my war assests mattered. 

Instead of Harbinger defending the beem, it could have been a crap load of reaper forces. The number based the choices I made.. Destroy the geth, then Reapers are agumented by geth survivors, leave the Rachni queen, then a  metric ton of ravangers,  Save the queen less krogan shock troops during the run to the beem,  etc etc...

[3DandBeyond]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

@Dragoon where in this thread have you seen someone demand a conventional victory?

It has been said multiple times in this thread that to some people here conventional or unconventional victory is the only thing they will accept. That is not compromise. My suggestion like 30 or so pages back suggested actual compromise that gives three out of the four major things people have asked for in a way that won't undermine Biowares story they wished to tell. Like I said some people in here do not grasp the concept of compromise or know what "middle ground" is.

Since you like posing questions here's one for you and for 3D. If they gave a reunion via one additional cutscene on the destroy ending, if they gave another Harbinger confrontation in another pre-endgame DLC and if they gave a more emotional set of cutscenes for the refuse ending even though still ends in loss (to keep their story wished to tell intact) would you accept that and be done with your complaining or in reality would nothing other than conventional or unconventional victory be acceptable to you two? Because my suggestion had all of those things except the last one yet was dismissed and thrown out the window .

I know this isn't addressed to me, but it looks like I missed a show this afternoon. What I bolded and underlined is the only dog I have in this fight. I get that and I'm good.

I still may point out other weaknesses in the game and the ending from a literary standpoint, but from a replay standpoint and from a "will I purchase DLC for the game" standpoint I'm good then.

The funny thing is why did it take 132 pages for that person to suggest what we've been mostly saying all along?  Why did we go through all the name calling from him in order to get to the place from which we began?  This person who has never needed to be involved in this discussion from the beginning inserted himself into this discussion for no particular reason.  But this is not compromise.  This was the thing that should have existed all along.  And this would be way more intrusive upon the ending than what I suggested even.  A Shepard reunion would be all that is gained as I see it, so we'd pay for one minor scene?  A confrontation with Harbinger to what end?  Just to say we argued with him?  And refusal still leading to death through a fight?  And it only leads to death and a loss.  Uh no.  I have no interest in fighting with no chance of winning ever.  And I have already succinctly stated that I've not been advocating anything here that destructively changes what anyone now has. 

I also don't see this as worthy of being paid for content.  The small amount of money it would be worth would not be enough for them to make it.

I have suggested many ways to an acceptable ending and didn't advocate ever that it be a conventional victory through refusal as the only way-in fact, I stated very specifically that that would be asking them to add way too much to the game-I'd desire it, but I don't see it as the least destructive way to do it.  I specifically have repeatedly said they could very minimally do it through a real destroy ending where the crucible is intact and EDI, the geth, and Shepard can live, but there is also the possibility they could die or win or lose.

I would love a true refuse/conventional victory ending, but I never advocated that as the only solution.  This once again indicates that dragoon did not read my OP and is putting words in my mouth.