Aller au contenu

Photo

One Last Plea - Do the Right Thing


  • Ce sujet est fermé Ce sujet est fermé
6432 réponses à ce sujet

#4476
CronoDragoon

CronoDragoon
  • Members
  • 10 413 messages

MegaSovereign wrote...

N7 Lisbeth wrote...

Netsfn1427 wrote...

There are very, very vocal fans of the Harry Potter series who think that J.K. Rowling destroyed the series because she dared to not pair Harry and Hermoine in the end. These fans are a minority, but they are very vocal, have fanclubs dedicated to their ship.


The difference here is we are not a minority. As proven by Bioware's own surveys, multiple times (before and after Extended Cut), we (those unhappy with the ending choices) are in fact the majority.


Please provide me a link to a survey showing that most people are unhappy with the endings post-Extended Cut.


In fact, most people are either satisfied or happy with the EC:
www.gamezone.com/products/mass-effect-3/news/majority-of-fans-satisfied-with-mass-effect-3-extended-cut

#4477
sH0tgUn jUliA

sH0tgUn jUliA
  • Members
  • 16 818 messages

Netsfn1427 wrote...

It's as Ieldra2 posted, DLC becomes canon. I can't just ignore that Miranda can't have children after LoTSB. It's not neccessary for the main plot, but it changes her view on her character. My entire perception of her backstory (maybe her father realized she wasn't perfect and let her go rather than she escaped, etc.) changed as a result. I never got Arrival on the 360, but I did for my definitive PC playthroughs. Because it was still canon. Paid DLC, content still counts towards canon. 

So that's why it's not as simple as ignoring it. 


Not all DLC becomes canon.

The Darkspawn Chronicles did not become canon for Dragon Age. Arrival is not canon for Mass Effect, while the events of Arrival are. The fact that Shepard did it is not canon. That was stated by BioWare in their official plot writing media called twitter some time.

Why? Because if a player did not play Arrival, then they lose the 103rd Marines War Asset, because that unit did the deed instead of Shepard.

Don't ask me why Shepard was in lock up for six months then. Lolz. Shepard was more likely on vacation in Vancouver waiting for the Normandy retrofit and her re-enlistment and security clearances to go through. The dialogue should change if Shepard did not do Arrival since BioWare said that the 103rd Marines did it instead. This should be corrected in a patch, but most likely will not, or will be fixed in an upcoming DLC if we make a big enough stink about it. (e.g. Miranda should say "I tried getting hold of you while you were in Vancouver, but the Alliance didn't have an active contact number for you." on your first contact with her on the Citadel if you didn't do Arrival)

#4478
3DandBeyond

3DandBeyond
  • Members
  • 7 579 messages

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...


I'm going to go you one further. I don't think they should give the player a running total of the paragon/renegade points. These points shouldn't be revealed until after the end of the game. Conversation choices? Call them something different. Maybe "flatter", "persuade", "persuade forcefully", "sarcastic", "intimidate", "be a complete ass". And on the para and ren interrupts, just make them a generic "interrupt". Changes things a bit.

Let the player actually role play for a change and not point play and metagame. Everyone metagames this. No one actually role plays. Not everyone can get Jack and Miranda to stand down. Not everyone can actually get Tali and Legion to come to an arrangement. It's not that simple. It shouldn't be that simple. Not anyone can choose to save both the Quarians and the Geth without metagaming.

The problem with RPGs is that the real RPG only works on the first playthrough without the walkthrough. After that or once you know the formula, it's a checklist anyway. At least without knowing what your percentage of para/ren is makes it a little more difficult

My choices do not exist in the dialogue presented on the Citadel. Shepard turns into a ****ing retard. That is not my Shepard up there. That is a broken stupid putz. My Shepard would have been point/counterpointing that insane little ****er to her last breath.

You can defend that ending all you want, but it has no defense. I value freedom. We have paid the price for freedom in blood. Did you not look around you in the ****ing game? What the hell were you shooting? Those were former people! And they were slaughtering us by the billions! And I have to make a choice? Yet another sacrifice for freedom because Mac Walters doesn't feel we sacrificed enough? We have to do this just to end the ****ing game? **** him and the horse he rode in on.

The EC changed nothing, my friend. It added a sugar coating to cover up the flaws, nothing more, and there are a ton of flaws remaining. With refusal at least I get to see a glimpse of Shepard, but it's for nothing because they decided "it's red, green, or blue, or it's nothing for you."

So to have an ending I can live with I have to play a ton of multi-player and on Rannoch... "Sorry Legion, I've seen the ending, and I'm letting the Quarians slaughter your people while they're as dumb as varren so I can have one ending I can live with. Tali, kill him."


This so much.  All that matters at the end is EMS (what a load of unfiltered manure) and supposedly paragon/renegade.  I was paragon without thinking, but did that matter?  No freaking way.  Could I do some version of some right thing?  No freaking way.  Could I remain immersed in the story?  No, you get it, no freaking way.  It's renegade or bust.  Only refuse is paragon, but before I catch heck for it, it's useless suicide.  Well, sometimes death is preferable to a life lived under some version of some unnatural external or internal tech.  That tech isn't inserted in order to stop reapers-it's primary purpose has nothing to do with reapers other than to maintain their presence in the galaxy.  It's there to shape the galaxy.  The kid wants it because anything he knows about becomes something he sees as inevitable.  Reaper tech that becomes of primary importance within the galaxy is used to determine the future just as it always was, because the kid believes the future must be controlled.

There's no balance there-it's reapers forever, internally or externally.  I don't want them as roommates, buddies, cops, fixit men, nor do I want others to have them running through their veins.  Shepard worried that she was not really herself at Cerberus' base.  Multiply that times the trillions that may with luck be left in the galaxy.

#4479
GreyLycanTrope

GreyLycanTrope
  • Members
  • 12 711 messages

CronoDragoon wrote...

In fact, most people are either satisfied or happy with the EC:
www.gamezone.com/products/mass-effect-3/news/majority-of-fans-satisfied-with-mass-effect-3-extended-cut


based on one poll, which asked if it met expectations, not about satisfaction.

Modifié par Greylycantrope, 19 septembre 2012 - 11:58 .


#4480
Lunch Box1912

Lunch Box1912
  • Members
  • 3 159 messages

CronoDragoon wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

N7 Lisbeth wrote...

Netsfn1427 wrote...

There are very, very vocal fans of the Harry Potter series who think that J.K. Rowling destroyed the series because she dared to not pair Harry and Hermoine in the end. These fans are a minority, but they are very vocal, have fanclubs dedicated to their ship.


The difference here is we are not a minority. As proven by Bioware's own surveys, multiple times (before and after Extended Cut), we (those unhappy with the ending choices) are in fact the majority.


Please provide me a link to a survey showing that most people are unhappy with the endings post-Extended Cut.


In fact, most people are either satisfied or happy with the EC:
www.gamezone.com/products/mass-effect-3/news/majority-of-fans-satisfied-with-mass-effect-3-extended-cut




umm..Here we are

#4481
CronoDragoon

CronoDragoon
  • Members
  • 10 413 messages

sdinc009 wrote...

Ok I understand what you're getting at now. I am starting to think there may be some miscommunication happening. I don't think anyone would be opposed to difficult choices. Hard choices make for extremely compelling stories and have always been a part of ME series. Where these difficult choices lead is what most are wanting to change. We can keep the exact same choices yet completely change the outcome of them to create a better resolution to the story. I think these 2 aspects are getting confused. We could probably go back and forth all day arguing about whether the tone fits or not and ultimately it would really come down to individual preferences and particular scenes so I'll skip that. Finally, I don't really think you can seprate ME 3 from the others since it's the final in a trilogy and should have continuity with the story as a whole, but I do understand the point you're making. And yeah, I don't know where Niezsche came from.


Although hard choices have always been a part of the ME series, I would argue that the Paragon/Renegade system has always been a bigger part. Even choices like the Council in ME1, the Collector Base in ME2, etc....these are all molded into Paragon and Renegade choices. Virmire is special in this regard, since the choice is completely divorced from morality, which in Mass Effect is represnted by the P/R system.

What I was trying to get at earlier with dreman, and admittedly did a bad job, is that many of the choices in ME are in fact easy choices because they focus on morality instead of consequences.

Take the Council. You can save the Council at the cost of soldiers' lives, or you sacrifice the Council to get a better shot at winning the battle. Let us assume that most people can comfortably fall into the Paragon or Renegade. If you are a Paragon taking the Paragon choice, you are leading soldiers to battle in the name of an ideal (what the Council represents). The soldiers who die doing so, do it willingly and succeed in their mission. Therefore, the consequences are actually rewards. Similarly, a Renegade who chooses to sacrifice the Council has nothing to complain about in the ending, since the consequences fit the morality which spurred the decision.

This type of choice that acts more as a pedestal for your morality, instead of a harbinger of negative consequences, reoccurs often in Mass Effect. If you have a Paragon-type of morality, you are safe to just automatically choose the upper option every time, because you know that you will be rewarded with positive consequences every time you do it. Similarly, a Renegade with be rewarded with renegade consequences.

Often, the only negative consequences garnered from Paragon choices are hypothetical future scenarios. Will the geth and quarians truly live in peace? Will the krogans learn from their mistakes or start a new empire? Will the Rachni truly ally with us or turn into a terror once more? Will sparing Sidonus from Garrus's wrath come back to bite us?

The answer to everything is essentially headcanon, and thus the player is insulated from true repercussions. That is why I tend to believe ME choices are relatively easy.

#4482
CronoDragoon

CronoDragoon
  • Members
  • 10 413 messages

Lunch Box1912 wrote...

umm..Here we are


That just links to this page, but if it's a BSN poll, then that is the same as linking a poll in Arkansas about gay marriage and thinking it represents all of America. The BSN is, of course, going to be wildly biased against the endings in any form, because at times this forum exists merely to channel complaints.

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 20 septembre 2012 - 12:06 .


#4483
CronoDragoon

CronoDragoon
  • Members
  • 10 413 messages

Greylycantrope wrote...

CronoDragoon wrote...

In fact, most people are either satisfied or happy with the EC:
www.gamezone.com/products/mass-effect-3/news/majority-of-fans-satisfied-with-mass-effect-3-extended-cut


based on one poll, which asked if it met expectations, not about satisfaction.


Please provide a poll from a neutral site that shows a different outcome. 

#4484
sH0tgUn jUliA

sH0tgUn jUliA
  • Members
  • 16 818 messages
Meeting expectations is a loaded question. If ones expectations are low, then if ones expectations are met or exceeded, it still does not mean they are satisfied or happy.

Example: we were served a pile of steaming s*** for an original ending on a paper plate. For the extended cut we received a pile of frozen s*** topped with whipped cream and a cherry served on china. It looked a hell of a lot better (i.e. met or exceeded expectations because we were expecting another steaming pile served on china), but it still tasted like s***.

Modifié par sH0tgUn jUliA, 20 septembre 2012 - 12:13 .


#4485
CronoDragoon

CronoDragoon
  • Members
  • 10 413 messages

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Meeting expectations is a loaded question. If ones expectations are low, then if ones expectations are met or exceeded, it still does not mean they are satisfied or happy.

Example: we were served a pile of steaming s*** for an original ending on a paper plate. For the extended cut we received a pile of frozen s*** topped with whipped cream and a cherry served on china. It looked a hell of a lot better (i.e. met or exceeded expectations because we were expecting another steaming pile served on china), but it still tasted like s***.


If people did not think the EC fixed the endings, regardless of whether or not it met their extremely low expectations, you know as well as I do they would pick the option that made the EC look bad.

#4486
GreyLycanTrope

GreyLycanTrope
  • Members
  • 12 711 messages

CronoDragoon wrote...

Greylycantrope wrote...

CronoDragoon wrote...

In fact, most people are either satisfied or happy with the EC:
www.gamezone.com/products/mass-effect-3/news/majority-of-fans-satisfied-with-mass-effect-3-extended-cut


based on one poll, which asked if it met expectations, not about satisfaction.


Please provide a poll from a neutral site that shows a different outcome. 

No neutral site has done a poll, that I'm aware off. This one was from the Mass Effect Facebook page, not everyone visited that page. Again the results didn't say if people were satisfied. I voted in this poll, I said I got what I expected which was clarity and closure and I'm not satisfied. See how that can scew the results?

#4487
sH0tgUn jUliA

sH0tgUn jUliA
  • Members
  • 16 818 messages

CronoDragoon wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Meeting expectations is a loaded question. If ones expectations are low, then if ones expectations are met or exceeded, it still does not mean they are satisfied or happy.

Example: we were served a pile of steaming s*** for an original ending on a paper plate. For the extended cut we received a pile of frozen s*** topped with whipped cream and a cherry served on china. It looked a hell of a lot better (i.e. met or exceeded expectations because we were expecting another steaming pile served on china), but it still tasted like s***.


If people did not think the EC fixed the endings, regardless of whether or not it met their extremely low expectations, you know as well as I do they would pick the option that made the EC look bad.


We wanted the EC to be good. We ate the cherry. It was good. We ate the whipped cream. It was good. The s*** was better while it was frozen solid (that's when the survey was filled out), but then it started to thaw and we realized it was the same old s***.

Cosmetic changes will fool most people.

#4488
Lunch Box1912

Lunch Box1912
  • Members
  • 3 159 messages

CronoDragoon wrote...

Lunch Box1912 wrote...

umm..Here we are


That just links to this page, but if it's a BSN poll, then that is the same as linking a poll in Arkansas about gay marriage and thinking it represents all of America. The BSN is, of course, going to be wildly biased against the endings in any form, because at times this forum exists merely to channel complaints.



I’m sorry I couldn’t help myself… just trying to lighten it up in here a little.Posted Image

 I’m not going to go pole hunting.  You cannot rely solely on a pole you have to look at all ends of the spectrum. Not everybody does poles either. There is even a section in wiki about the dissatisfaction with the ending. I’m not trying to say nobody likes the endings either but I am willing to bet that if you spent a long enough time searching the Internet you would find more articles and information about the controversy over the ending and dissatisfaction with it than for praise of how great it was.

I would also like to say that everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Mine is there is a lot more unhappy gamers than satisfied gamers.

Mass Effect on Fans Yahoo

See Controversy

Modifié par Lunch Box1912, 20 septembre 2012 - 12:28 .


#4489
N7 Lisbeth

N7 Lisbeth
  • Members
  • 670 messages

CronoDragoon wrote...

Take the Council. You can save the Council at the cost of soldiers' lives, or you sacrifice the Council to get a better shot at winning the battle.


Bad example, because you reversed it. If you rescue the Council at the expense of the soldiers, you get a better chance at winning the battle. It is also the Paragon choice (+Paragon points). Morality and tough decisions resulting in a long-view win still went hand-in-hand.

This is not the only example of such. Take ME2's decision regarding using or destroying the Reaper tech, after the Suicide Mission. Quick gains by saving it result in Renegade points, but destroying it for the long-win result in Paragon points.

This isn't to say that I take umbrage with abandoning that system at the end. My axe to grind is that the decisions aren't tough because they're difficult to make -- they're artificially weighted with consequences that have no relation to one another. This, on top of the whole reason for taking the Catalyst at face value is because Synthetic-Organic war is inevitable, except's not. Hello? Just settled one with the Quarians and the Geth. In fact, by DESTROYING the Geth with Destroy, you *cause* a Synthetic-Organic war in the future. The entire thing is massively flawed with logic that makes no sense on any level.

I suspect the only reason Legion killed himself to add Reaper tech to the Geth was solely added to make the ending more controversial. There's really no explaining that otherwise, given the complete turn-around in logic that went between ME2 to ME3 on the matter.

That is terrible writing, point and fact. No editor would let that out the door in any professional publishing house.

The answer to everything is essentially headcanon, and thus the player is insulated from true repercussions. That is why I tend to believe ME choices are relatively easy.


An unacceptable ending. Headcanon fills in the holes, not the entire ending. I shouldn't have to re-imagine everything. All you're doing in stating such is validating that one angry Twitter post in responce to Mike Gamble, where he says to Mike, "How about I sell you a book with the last quarter torn out and you can imagine the ending." Your whole defence of the ending is that you can imagine it properly. Haha, no.

Modifié par N7 Lisbeth, 20 septembre 2012 - 12:52 .


#4490
3DandBeyond

3DandBeyond
  • Members
  • 7 579 messages

Greylycantrope wrote...

CronoDragoon wrote...

In fact, most people are either satisfied or happy with the EC:
www.gamezone.com/products/mass-effect-3/news/majority-of-fans-satisfied-with-mass-effect-3-extended-cut


based on one poll, which asked if it met expectations, not about satisfaction.


Yeah, there were other polls on here where fans were ok with the EC or liked it and it was not the majority just loved it.  The thing is a lot of people had low expectations for the EC and I followed an awful lot of pre-EC and post-EC threads and comments about it here and on other sites and the comments were not glowing.  Some were really happy with it, but that was not universal.  Some said it was better, but not what they wanted.  Some said it made the ending playable and at last they could finish and sell it.  A lot of this type of sentiment.  And I'm being serious. 

In page after page of comments on the EC, some said it was great, and when I asked what people really liked about it, I got 3 responses.  2 said they really liked having more explanation and it didn't fall off a cliff like the originals.  1 said he had played ME1 and 2 awhile back and didn't really care that much about the story so it didn't matter what he picked at the end.  Others that appreciated the endings posted and said they loved being reaper god, thought it was cool what EDI said in synthesis, that they might become immortal, and there were a lot of comments in this vein.

On other websites there were a lot of "too little, too late" comments.  When Leviathan was announced, I went to a bunch of different websites and a lot of comments were of the kind saying "I'm done with ME, so why now?" or "pretty pointless" and some saying, "cool, more ME".  After Leviathan, review sites tended to give it about 7.5 out of 10 and reviewers said, "meh", or said something along the line of, "I'm not saying don't buy it because it has great visuals", it was compared to a shooter, and some said it was pointless if you'd already played the ending.

Comments on Leviathan on a lot of sites, ranged from people saying they had played ME3 through once and were going to play ME1 and 2 next for the first time to others saying they thought ME3 was already done, to others saying they finished it a long time ago and were done.  Some did really like the shooting and the husk head and underwater scenes.

All of the things in quotes, to be fair and up front are not direct quotes and are paraphrased.  I know I'm not the most objective person, but I truly did try to characterize this as best I could with exactly what I read.  It is anecdotal, but it does indicate that a vocal population does still have issues.

My point here is not to bash ME3 or Leviathan, it is to say that there is still a large group of people that don't just love it all.  Any company that ignores that and any fan that won't see it, might find the fanbase has greatly changed.  Now, BW may want that.  This whole debacle might have been a way to judge if an MMO would better suit them and if a new group of fans might want an MMO with microtransactions.  I guarantee that people that disliked the original and EC endings don't tend to want an MMO and are ok with MP, but not if it impacts SP. 

I'm just saying there are indications that some (perhaps a lot) of people that liked the endings want more of an action and less of a story RPG.  Yes, my opinion but it fits everything I have read.  There are others that like them too, but given what BW hoped ME3 would be, a lot of this fits, and they were very interested in an MMO before The Old Republic's problems.

I think we can still try and voice our opinions that we want ME to continue with rich stories and characters, but in order to bring others back or even keep those still waiting who want that, it's a positive move to at least look at the franchise and what people liked.

#4491
N7 Lisbeth

N7 Lisbeth
  • Members
  • 670 messages
Headcanon is typically something that is not necessary to the story, that fills in some player-inspired ideas about something unexplored.

For instance, Zaeed is actually your biological father; he had a relationship with Hannah Shepard but it didn't work out between them and she later ends up with a man named Shepard, but she was pregnant with Zaeed's kid and never told Zaeed about it. Your Shepard doesn't know this, but Zaeed does, learning your mother's name and piecing together some facts like your age. (This is someone's real headcanon - I wish I could properly credit the person who created it; I can't find the original post for the life of me, but I thought I had come across it in the FemShep thread in the Romance forum.)

Headcanon is not used to correct massive game-breaking logic faults or endings. Good writing does that.

Edit: Tidied up a bit. Pretty sure I've repeated myself over several posts, never remembering what I've said in which thread about the exact same issue.

Modifié par N7 Lisbeth, 20 septembre 2012 - 01:18 .


#4492
3DandBeyond

3DandBeyond
  • Members
  • 7 579 messages

CronoDragoon wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Meeting expectations is a loaded question. If ones expectations are low, then if ones expectations are met or exceeded, it still does not mean they are satisfied or happy.

Example: we were served a pile of steaming s*** for an original ending on a paper plate. For the extended cut we received a pile of frozen s*** topped with whipped cream and a cherry served on china. It looked a hell of a lot better (i.e. met or exceeded expectations because we were expecting another steaming pile served on china), but it still tasted like s***.


If people did not think the EC fixed the endings, regardless of whether or not it met their extremely low expectations, you know as well as I do they would pick the option that made the EC look bad.


See that there is a really erroneous post.  I'm sorry but I looked at refuse as doing something so BW could laugh at us.  I didn't ever see it as making the EC look bad.  I learned that others said that's why people picked it.  Maybe some thought that's what it was for, but the only people I ever read saying that were people calling me names because I wished refuse could lead to some real type of win.  I got told off for being so ignorant as to want a conventional victory (no, I wanted imaginative, innovative means to have been used instead of Mr. MacCrucible). 

I was even told that I was basically stupid for not knowing what suicide meant when I said that things thought impossible in the other games were overcome-suicide mission didn't have to mean that.  And then, one genius told me that the only reason I would choose refuse would be to tell BW to F... Off.  Even though I've gotten plenty mad about all this, most of my anger has not been directed at BW, to be honest and I've never considered telling them or others to F... Off.  Except maybe people that indicate that I have no concept of what it means to make hard choices or that I don't know what suicide means (believe me, I know far too well) or any one of a myriad of lovely things that have been said to indicate that I must be a 2 year old child because I couldn't possibly be this dumb and do anything for myself.

So, I get repeatedly told that I am doing things I have never done.  I've even been told that BW should never have to talk to me (I never said they did) because of death threats.  Ok, I shouldn't have to say this and neither should anyone that dislikes the endings-I don't condone threats.  I particularly don't condone threats of bodily harm or property damage or any other such thing.  We are not all alike.  We're not drones.

Why is this relevant?  I don't look at choosing refuse as telling BW anything.  But, since others tell me that's the only reason I would pick it (I must have missed another opposite day set of marching orders), then what it really could do is something constructive.  No it's not telling them to go screw in a light bulb.  Choosing refuse might actually let them see through Origin that a lot of people don't like the EC.  Is that wrong?  I don't think so.  What would be better, choosing to do that or taking a poll no one cares about? 

You can bet they keep track of people playing MP and buying things in that MP, so what's wrong with choosing refuse.  I've never used it for that, because I've actually only been able to finish the game about 4 times, I chose refuse to see the speech and my Shepard saying it.  I chose Destroy to see if that made any more sense with the explanation.  And I chose synthesis and control each once to verify what happens with a paragon just so I knew personally.  I've watched them on youtube more times than I care to remember.  And if I now personally want to hear the kid's dialogue and decide to see that, I don't finish the game or I go on youtube.

#4493
Conniving_Eagle

Conniving_Eagle
  • Members
  • 6 013 messages
If only Bioware knew something about polling.

They really should incorporate it into the game. I'm not sure how they get some of their data, or how accurate it is.

However, most polls aren't accurate.

#4494
Conniving_Eagle

Conniving_Eagle
  • Members
  • 6 013 messages

N7 Lisbeth wrote...

Headcanon is typically something that is not necessary to the story, that fills in some player-inspired ideas about something unexplored.

For instance, Zaeed is actually your biological father; he had a relationship with Hannah Shepard but it didn't work out between them and she later ends up with a man named Shepard, but she was pregnant with Zaeed's kid and never told Zaeed about it. Your Shepard doesn't know this, but Zaeed does, learning your mother's name and piecing together some facts like your age. (This is someone's real headcanon - I wish I could properly credit the person who created it; I can't find the original post for the life of me, but I thought I had come across it in the FemShep thread in the Romance forum.)

Headcanon is not used to correct massive game-breaking logic faults or endings. Good writing does that.

Edit: Tidied up a bit. Pretty sure I've repeated myself over several posts, never remembering what I've said in which thread about the exact same issue.


Bioware can have fun headcanoning this:

Posted Image

#4495
Lunch Box1912

Lunch Box1912
  • Members
  • 3 159 messages

3DandBeyond wrote...

 Choosing refuse might actually let them see through Origin that a lot of people don't like the EC. Is that wrong? I don't think so. What would be better, choosing to do that or taking a poll no one cares about?


You can bet they keep track of people playing MP and buying things in that MP, so what's wrong with choosing refuse.  I've never used it for that, because I've actually only been able to finish the game about 4 times, I chose refuse to see the speech and my Shepard saying it.  I chose Destroy to see if that made any more sense with the explanation.  And I chose synthesis and control each once to verify what happens with a paragon just so I knew personally.  I've watched them on youtube more times than I care to remember.  And if I now personally want to hear the kid's dialogue and decide to see that, I don't finish the game or I go on youtube.



What about all the skewed numbers from people who just wanted to blast Starkid in the face again after downloading the Extended Cut who then got the refuse ending?... Well I guess if we were blasting Starkid in the face maybe there was some dissatisfaction there in the first place?Posted Image

Modifié par Lunch Box1912, 20 septembre 2012 - 01:40 .


#4496
Xellith

Xellith
  • Members
  • 3 606 messages

CronoDragoon wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

N7 Lisbeth wrote...

Netsfn1427 wrote...

There are very, very vocal fans of the Harry Potter series who think that J.K. Rowling destroyed the series because she dared to not pair Harry and Hermoine in the end. These fans are a minority, but they are very vocal, have fanclubs dedicated to their ship.


The difference here is we are not a minority. As proven by Bioware's own surveys, multiple times (before and after Extended Cut), we (those unhappy with the ending choices) are in fact the majority.


Please provide me a link to a survey showing that most people are unhappy with the endings post-Extended Cut.


In fact, most people are either satisfied or happy with the EC:
www.gamezone.com/products/mass-effect-3/news/majority-of-fans-satisfied-with-mass-effect-3-extended-cut





That poll is retarded.

Posted Image
the question is malformed.  It never asked if people were satisfied.  They asked if it met expections.  Which can be read either way.

I expected it to be garbage and it was worse.  Therefore it exceeded my expectations.  Therefore Im in the majority and therefore most people hated it.  Get how the question itself is wrong?

That poll is worthless.

Modifié par Xellith, 20 septembre 2012 - 01:52 .


#4497
Lunch Box1912

Lunch Box1912
  • Members
  • 3 159 messages
I'm sorry I gave em an honest response.

Are you kidding me really? That was the pole they were quoting.

Modifié par Lunch Box1912, 20 septembre 2012 - 01:54 .


#4498
3DandBeyond

3DandBeyond
  • Members
  • 7 579 messages

Lunch Box1912 wrote...

I'm sorry I gave em an honest response.

Are you kidding me really? That was the pole they were quoting.


The problem was if you take a poll like that and expect something to be terrible and it's ok, it exceeded your expectations.

Say you really hate rainy days and expect it to rain terribly all day and it rains most of the day.  I might ask you if it was a better day than you expected.  Sure it was.

The question that seems to be better to ask was if it was a good day.  Your answer would be different most likely.  But, then there's another problem.  Is that based on weather or other things.  If it was a terrible day outside and you spent it with someone you love and avoided the rain, it might have been a great day.  The problem is most polls only ask the questions the person who wrote the poll wants.  A good poll creator could make one that would have you believe everyone (or most everyone) loves to eat rotten fish.  You have to be a good statistician to ask questions that are relevant if you really want to know the truth (as best you can).

Polls are written ambiguously when used for ads and by politicians.  The relevant polls ask questions that can't be answered yes or no or that don't allow for explanations. 

#4499
Lunch Box1912

Lunch Box1912
  • Members
  • 3 159 messages

3DandBeyond wrote...

Lunch Box1912 wrote...

I'm sorry I gave em an honest response.

Are you kidding me really? That was the pole they were quoting.


The problem was if you take a poll like that and expect something to be terrible and it's ok, it exceeded your expectations.

Say you really hate rainy days and expect it to rain terribly all day and it rains most of the day.  I might ask you if it was a better day than you expected.  Sure it was.

The question that seems to be better to ask was if it was a good day.  Your answer would be different most likely.  But, then there's another problem.  Is that based on weather or other things.  If it was a terrible day outside and you spent it with someone you love and avoided the rain, it might have been a great day.  The problem is most polls only ask the questions the person who wrote the poll wants.  A good poll creator could make one that would have you believe everyone (or most everyone) loves to eat rotten fish.  You have to be a good statistician to ask questions that are relevant if you really want to know the truth (as best you can).

Polls are written ambiguously when used for ads and by politicians.  The relevant polls ask questions that can't be answered yes or no or that don't allow for explanations. 



Agreed.. My original respone to  CronoDragon was...

Lunch Box1912 wrote...

CronoDragoon wrote...

Lunch Box1912 wrote...

umm..Here we are


That just links to this page, but if it's a BSN poll, then that is the same as linking a poll in Arkansas about gay marriage and thinking it represents all of America. The BSN is, of course, going to be wildly biased against the endings in any form, because at times this forum exists merely to channel complaints.



I’m sorry I couldn’t help myself… just trying to lighten it up in here a little.Posted Image

I’m not going to go pole hunting. You cannot rely solely on a pole you have to look at all ends of the spectrum. Not everybody does poles either. There is even a section in wiki about the dissatisfaction with the ending. I’m not trying to say nobody likes the endings either but I am willing to bet that if you spent a long enough time searching the Internet you would find more articles and information about the controversy over the ending and dissatisfaction with it than for praise of how great it was.

I would also like to say that everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Mine is there is a lot more unhappy gamers than satisfied gamers.

Mass Effect on Fans Yahoo

See Controversy



#4500
Lunch Box1912

Lunch Box1912
  • Members
  • 3 159 messages
I didn't realize the pole we were debating was a complete joke.

Modifié par Lunch Box1912, 20 septembre 2012 - 02:59 .