6432 réponses à ce sujet

[AresKeith]

Snypy wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

Snypy wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

* snipped *

I like your point about having to keep creative minds on a leash. Mac Walters also got carried away a bit with his ultra-powerful Cerberus, given the fact that, according to ME1 lore, Cerberus is a small, unimportant pro-human faction. In ME2, they become a powerful faction (good thing Drew Karpyshn was on the team). And in ME3, their information network rivals that of the Shadow Broker, their finances are virtually unlimited, and their agents are better in espionage than the STG. I don't want to know what would happen if there was Cerberus in ME4.

Anyway, the fact is that almost every piece of the ME3 story had to be peer reviewed by the rest of the writing team as a sort of quality control mechanism, except for the ending.

I heard there was a narrative director who used to keep the lead writer(s) from going over board with the plot during ME1 and ME2 but left Bioware and went to Halo 4 before ME3

Yep, there was. Armando Troisi.

and that was one of their biggest downfall, because he kept both Drew and Mac in check with the plot and with him gone they both went over-board with the plot and ending, Dark Energy ending and Mac's RBG Deus Ex endings

[BearlyHere]

Benchpress610 wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

I'm just waking up, so pardon the misspellings and stuff. There are a few factors involved here as to what went wrong and to what is going wrong. I'll post them and they are hypothetical. I've been through corporate mergers and stuff and they get ugly. People leave sometimes when they see the handwriting on the wall.

* The person who used to keep Casey Hudson on a leash all those years is now at 343 Games working on Halo 4. He left during ME2. Casey has no one keeping him in check now hence the endings to ME3. And now the rumors of Synthesis as the basis for ME4?

* The most recent retirements of the doctors? I'm skeptical about the reasons. Six months notice? I'm sure Ray and Greg got "golden parachutes" and good ones. There was a lot of negotiation that went on for those. They're quite young, way too young for traditional retirement. They could easily decide to go play on the golf course, and probably will this taking a vacation winter in So. Cal, but I don't buy the lost interest in video gaming excuse not one bit. The next two years will be about raising money. These agreements usually forbid them from doing anything in the business for two years. Look for them to start up a new company or go to work leading a small one in a couple of years.

-------------------
*sniped*

I think you are right on the money with that assessment. We might see the good doctors start another dev studio in a couple of years.

From his blog post, Greg sounded like he had definitely moved on from gaming. Ray maybe, depending on whether he has a non-compete clause,  but I still have to wonder about burnout.

The place I work was assimilated into a small corp last year that was started about 15 years ago by two former ER docs who saw a niche in the medical field that they decided to fill. At first they were very hands-on, working long hours. But for the past five years or so, once they got the kinks worked out with their management team, they've been persuing their hobbies more and spending time with their families. Now they pretty much just come in once every few weeks to sign things. But one thing they do is read the customer satisfaction cards personally. 

I had read that Ray in particular was disturbed by the negative reaciton to the game. Maybe that's why, being at the end of five years since EA took them over, if they decided to leave now.  That's what made me wonder if they play their own games anymore, or do they just drop in on the occasional meeting? Maybe they're blind to the problem because they're trusting their team more than their customer base, or they're really believing the marketing weasels who tell them they don't need us, there are plenty of other customers out there.

[darthoptimus003]

well caey should have know that this was the reacon they would get with this ending. in not one of them does the game let you win, isnt that the point to win, i guess in there eyes no its about art

[darthoptimus003]

sorry just wish that BW would fix this
i cant stand to see a series that ive played this long end on such an epic fall note

[3DandBeyond]

I agree so much and truly wish they'd see that a lot of this makes just some real sense. It would be a good will gesture that could allow everyone to gain something and yet everyone to bring something to the table.

[darthoptimus003]

3DandBeyond wrote...

I agree so much and truly wish they'd see that a lot of this makes just some real sense. It would be a good will gesture that could allow everyone to gain something and yet everyone to bring something to the table.

yeah lets hope they see the logic and the payday real soon i dont think i can handle this for much longer

[Bierwichtel]

the "fanbase" is not consistent enough on this, I guess... there are those who are not satisfied with the product, stating their dissatisfaction openly... others accuse the first of whining...
the third group overly praises BW and everything they do...

if everyone would manage to stand together on this issue, maybe just maybe we could reach a satisfying conclusion to this issue... (which is something I wish would happen for all of humanity... sadly humanity is not getting anymore intelligent...)

BW can choose not to listen to us (well, read that is) because our opinions only exist in the form of a few black pixels on a background of white pixels... easily ignored...

Modifié par Bierwichtel, 21 septembre 2012 - 09:40 .

[Bierwichtel]

like I stated a few posts back, people just do not know what they want, one has to tell them what they are supposed to like...

those who do at least know what they do not like are in the minority already, those who actually know what they do like are an even rarer breed...

[Ozida]

Bierwichtel wrote...

like I stated a few posts back, people just do not know what they want, one has to tell them what they are supposed to like...

those who do at least know what they do not like are in the minority already, those who actually know what they do like are an even rarer breed...

Isn't there an easy way to guide people of what they want?

Like:
Would you like more DLC with additional content? Yes-No-Doesn't matter
Would you like DLC altering engings? - Yes-No-Doesn't matter
Would you like DLC changig/ removing Catalyst - Yes-No-Doesn't matter
Would you like Red ending to be expanded? - Yes-No-Doesn't matter
Would you like a reunion scene? - Yes-No-Doesn't matter
Something like this?

Bioware, by the way, I am doing all the hard work for you here.

Modifié par Ozida, 21 septembre 2012 - 09:46 .

[AresKeith]

Bierwichtel wrote...

the "fanbase" is not consistent enough on this, I guess... there are those who are not satisfied with the product, stating their dissatisfaction openly... others accuse the first of whining...
the third group overly praises BW and everything they do...

if everyone would manage to stand together on this issue, maybe just maybe we could reach a satisfying conclusion to this issue... (which is something I wish would happen for all of humanity... sadly humanity is not getting anymore intelligent...)

BW can choose not to listen to us (well, read that is) because our opinions only exist in the form of a few black pixels on a background of white pixels... easily ignored...

exactly, we aren't trying to take away there endings that they liked, we want to feel the same way about the ending ( even though I had other issues with the game). And they actually don't have to do thing by a new ending DLC which they can do through pre-ending DLC

[Bierwichtel]

Ozida wrote...

Bierwichtel wrote...

like I stated a few posts back, people just do not know what they want, one has to tell them what they are supposed to like...

those who do at least know what they do not like are in the minority already, those who actually know what they do like are an even rarer breed...

Isn't there an easy way to guide people of what they want?

Like:
Would you like more DLC with additional content? Yes-No-Doesn't matter
Would you like DLC altering engings? - Yes-No-Doesn't matter
Would you like DLC changig/ removing Catalyst - Yes-No-Doesn't matter
Would you like Red ending to be expanded? - Yes-No-Doesn't matter
Would you like a reunion scene? - Yes-No-Doesn't matter
Something like this?

Bioware, by the way, I am doing all the hard work for you here.

even then, just a small minority would even participate (as alway when it comes to choices, why do you think the political theatre in most "democratic" countries look like cr'p?)

that minority could not possibly reflect the interests of everyone, so most will not be satisfied by the results... (you can't survey 6.5 billion people, I guess)

reaction from BW would most likely be: "Hey, we did want you wanted, stop complaining."

then there are the trolls who just vote negatively on any issue just for the sake of trolling...

asking people what they want does not work, for the simple reason that more than 90% of humanity is simply retarded (through many means, politics, religion, poverty caused by politics or religion... many reasons)

Modifié par Bierwichtel, 21 septembre 2012 - 09:55 .

[Bierwichtel]

AresKeith wrote...

Bierwichtel wrote...

the "fanbase" is not consistent enough on this, I guess... there are those who are not satisfied with the product, stating their dissatisfaction openly... others accuse the first of whining...
the third group overly praises BW and everything they do...

if everyone would manage to stand together on this issue, maybe just maybe we could reach a satisfying conclusion to this issue... (which is something I wish would happen for all of humanity... sadly humanity is not getting anymore intelligent...)

BW can choose not to listen to us (well, read that is) because our opinions only exist in the form of a few black pixels on a background of white pixels... easily ignored...

exactly, we aren't trying to take away there endings that they liked, we want to feel the same way about the ending ( even though I had other issues with the game). And they actually don't have to do thing by a new ending DLC which they can do through pre-ending DLC

see above...

you can't satisfy everyone, to try is pointless...

BW wanted to appease too many people at once...

[Ozida]

Bierwichtel wrote...

even then, just a small minority would even participate (as alway when it comes to choices, why do you think the political theatre in most "democratic" countries look like cr'p?)

that minority could not possibly reflect the interests of everyone, so most will not be satisfied by the results... (you can't survey 6.5 billion people, I guess)

reaction from BW would most likely be: "Hey, we did want you wanted, stop complaining."

then there are the trolls who just vote negatively on any issue just for the sake of trolling...

So how do you please majority then? If you don't do surveys, or don't listen to feedback... How does company even assume whet customers want then?

asking people what they want does not work, for the simple reason that more than 90% of humanity is simply retarded (through many means, politics, religion, poverty caused by politics or religion... many reasons)

Wow, someone is misantropic. Although, it is hard not to agree.

Modifié par Ozida, 21 septembre 2012 - 10:00 .

[AresKeith]

Ozida wrote...

Bierwichtel wrote...

even then, just a small minority would even participate (as alway when it comes to choices, why do you think the political theatre in most "democratic" countries look like cr'p?)

that minority could not possibly reflect the interests of everyone, so most will not be satisfied by the results... (you can't survey 6.5 billion people, I guess)

reaction from BW would most likely be: "Hey, we did want you wanted, stop complaining."

then there are the trolls who just vote negatively on any issue just for the sake of trolling...

So how do you please majority then? If you don't do surveys, or don't listen to feedback... How does company even assume whet customers want then?

well actually Bioware does listen to feedback but they assume it the wrong way and mess it up

[Bierwichtel]

Ozida wrote...

Bierwichtel wrote...

even then, just a small minority would even participate (as alway when it comes to choices, why do you think the political theatre in most "democratic" countries look like cr'p?)

that minority could not possibly reflect the interests of everyone, so most will not be satisfied by the results... (you can't survey 6.5 billion people, I guess)

reaction from BW would most likely be: "Hey, we did want you wanted, stop complaining."

then there are the trolls who just vote negatively on any issue just for the sake of trolling...

So how do you please majority then? If you don't do surveys, or don't listen to feedback... How does company even assume whet customers want then?

asking people what they want does not work, for the simple reason that more than 90% of humanity is simply retarded (through many means, politics, religion, poverty caused by politics or religion... many reasons)

Wow, someone is misantropic. Although, it is hard not to agree.

that's why there are many many failed products/decisions in the history of mankind...

you please on group, you p'ss off another... trying to please both groups just tends to p'ss off both groups...

like two children, one wanting a pony, the other wanting a dog... what to do? buy both? not really feasible, so just buy an armadillo so you can at least be assured that both are equally frustrated and dissatisfied...

not really misanthropic... just my perception of humanity...

faith (especially played by Eliza Dushku ) and believe are good things in my opinion, but putting strictures on those is wrong...

humanity needs leaders, yet those leaders should be people who ARE leaders, who are leaders because people follow them, because they trust them, not because of some pseudo-democratic process where again only a minority participates in anyway...

Modifié par Bierwichtel, 21 septembre 2012 - 10:19 .

[CronoDragoon]

While I would love more ending DLC, it is not accurate to say it wouldn't affect people who liked the post-EC endings, because dev time for an ending DLC is dev time not spent on another unique DLC.

[Bierwichtel]

CronoDragoon wrote...

While I would love more ending DLC, it is not accurate to say it wouldn't affect people who liked the post-EC endings, because dev time for an ending DLC is dev time not spent on another unique DLC.

then again, people will find a reason to complain about this so-called unique DLC...

and rightly so, because how good can this unique DLC be, if the rest of the product is still so heavily flawed...

just saying, repair first, then tune... to use a car reference, however inaccurate...

btw, do you think Garrus is following the bro-code?

Modifié par Bierwichtel, 21 septembre 2012 - 10:15 .

[CronoDragoon]

Bierwichtel wrote...

CronoDragoon wrote...

While I would love more ending DLC, it is not accurate to say it wouldn't affect people who liked the post-EC endings, because dev time for an ending DLC is dev time not spent on another unique DLC.

then again, people will find a reason to complain about this so-called unique DLC...

and rightly so, because how good can this unique DLC be, if the rest of the product is still so heavily flawed...

just saying, repair first, then tune... to use a car reference, however inaccurate...

Heh, people will complain period. They will complain if ending DLC is released, if it isn't, if the Rapture comes, if it doesn't, if....you get the idea.

[Hrothdane]

CronoDragoon wrote...

Heh, people will complain period. They will complain if ending DLC is released, if it isn't, if the Rapture comes, if it doesn't, if....you get the idea.

You can please some of the people all of the time or all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time.

[Bierwichtel]

indeed, complain but never act...

[Ozida]

Guys, guys, guys... Complaining about people complaining is not productive. Let's not get this thread closed because of that, OK?

Besides, what else are we, "whiners", suppose to do? We can only hope to fall under BioWare's "profitable clients" group and get something we'd like. If this is going to p*** off some other fans, well... I have a lot of "Deal with it" stickers that were giving to me by pro-enders before. :innocent:

Modifié par Ozida, 21 septembre 2012 - 10:26 .

[Bierwichtel]

Ozida wrote...

Guys, guys, guys... Complaining about people complaining is not productive. Let's not get this thread closed because of that, OK?

Besides, what else are we, "whiners", suppose to do? We can only hope to fall under BioWare's "profitable clients" group and get something we'd like. If this is going to p*** off some other fans, well... I have a lot of "Deal with it" stickers that were giving to me by pro-enders before. :innocent:

nah, that's just the last four posts...

now that would be a great DLC... choc-full of "artistic integrity"
you land on a planet in the Nubian Expanse... there you find a huge sign, saying "Deal with it." in big garrish letters...

it will be worth 200 points in war assets of course...

[Bierwichtel]

I guess this thread has officially derailed and ended up in... (well, somewhere no one really cares about, anyway... 'evilgrin')

[Ozida]

Bierwichtel wrote...

Ozida wrote...

Guys, guys, guys... Complaining about people complaining is not productive. Let's not get this thread closed because of that, OK?

Besides, what else are we, "whiners", suppose to do? We can only hope to fall under BioWare's "profitable clients" group and get something we'd like. If this is going to p*** off some other fans, well... I have a lot of "Deal with it" stickers that were giving to me by pro-enders before. :innocent:

nah, that's just the last four posts...

now that would be a great DLC... choc-full of "artistic integrity"
you land on a planet in the Nubian Expanse... there you find a huge sign, saying "Deal with it." in big garrish letters...

it will be worth 200 points in war assets of course...

Lol! We should also have Kai Leng as LI in this DLC too.

Ok, no more spamming.

I guess this thread has officially derailed and ended up in... (well, somewhere no one really cares about, anyway... 'evilgrin')

Nah, it will do fine. I mean, this thread is huge and it is not even about IT! 3D did a great job with keeping it intelligent and civil. So, koodos to OP and all the participants!

Modifié par Ozida, 21 septembre 2012 - 10:37 .

[darthoptimus003]

dont be a defeatest i think a hugh porsion of the fans would get the dlcs if the add more to the game even the pro-enders would so maybe we can get what we are asking for
they would get paid and we get happy and the ones that dont want it dont have to get it so it doesnt change there ending
win+win+win= everyone happy