geceka wrote...
That you find the Crucible plot ridiculous is an opinion, however, and thus does not proove that it is bad writing. You could just as easily dismiss your arguments here as a lack of imagination: Nobody ever states that no cycle has ever known what the Crucible does – The Protheans (and, through them, our cycle) know it can destroy the Reapers, but only from previous cyles. Neither we, nor the Protheans, added anything to the Crucible design. None of this solidifies the idea that *nobody* ever knew what it did. Previous cycles could have been fully aware of both the inner workings of the Crucible and thep potency of the Citadel as an "amplifier" – Which is even hinted at by Vendetta saying the somebody chose to integrate the Citadel as the catalyst, though it is unclear which cycle that was.
It is not lack of imagination that compels me to think that the Crucible plot is stupid, rather it is my imagination that leads me to think that the only logical conclusion is that the Crucible has to be of Reaper design. Possibly even Leviathan now after the DLC.
The thing is, I keep coming down the question of if the Protheans knew about this thing and obviously they did, why was this not the first thing they sent out in the Beacons? Why not make sure something like Vigil was screaming out, "There are giant space squids coming to kill you and here's how you defeat it!" Its pure luck and contrivance that we find that thing and far too late in the narrative for my liking to be anything other than one giant Deus Ex Machina.
My point through all of that it is, we don't know what it did. Did the Protheans know? Who knows because they sure as hell didn't feel the need to tell us about it. Why? And I mean exactly what this thing was capable of too.
There might have been cycles in which the workings of the Crucible were clear, but they didn't manage to build (or use) it anyway. Maybe those cycles lacked military strength, whatever. It is really not important. Yet the claim that the actual story that we have ever states that *none* of the cycles had any idea of how the Crucible and Citadel work is simply not true, and even more so, it is never implied that a cycle who did not understand these workings added anything to the Crucible design (e.g. neither we, nor the Protheans).
See my above point. For this to really work for the backstory of the narrative the Protheans at least should know what it did./ If the plans could have been passed on and on in as good a condition as was required to build it and to add on to it, the actual purpose of the thing should have survived too and there is no logical explanation as to why the detailed functionning of it was left out.
Also, I wouldn't take the catalyst's "You are the first organic to ever stand here" all too literally: This could very well mean "stand here, before me, the catalyst AI".
All I have to go on is what the Catalyst says. He doesn't lie. He is badly misinformed, but hes no liar.
That the design hasn't been eradicated by the Reapers, well, on one hand, the Reapers are notoriously bad (or simply not concerned) with removing all traces of previous cycles from the galaxy – we find Prothean ruins all over the place, as well as some traces of previous cycles (lots of these in planet descriptions, but also things like the cave paintings in Leviathan). On the other hand, in the EC, the catalyst even states that it thought the Crucible plans to be eradicated, but he is surprised at the organics' resourcefulness – I'm sure Liara wasn't the only one ever to think of a time capsule to help the next cycle – Vendetta suggests this as well even.
They are utterly incompetent then. The Catalyst clearly knows about this thing and still lets it carry on cycle after cycle after cycle. Its not as if he didn't have a minion left in the galaxy who could have continued to search for it.
Anyway, I'm not arguing against your opinion, you are totally entitled to that.
Ditto.
Then again, the victory was reaching the Citadel and, despite all odds, dock the Crucible. Beyond that point, we only resolve the Cerberus arc (partly related to the Reapers via TIM's indoctrination, but actually more of a clash of (human) views).
Neither of which are the main conflict. They are small victories and not suitable replacements for the main victory we all desperately craved.
The catalyst pretty much took the wind out of our sails by solidifying that the only way for the Reapers to truly fail their goal would be by destroying all organics, which is the only outcome that would truly qualify as a failure for them. Thus, there is little room for an externalized conflict anymore, the situation is more akin to a clash of philosophies, but even that is diluted if you interpret the cycle as a solution the Reapers chose to buy them time for their experiments with evolution, as the Leviathan DLC hints at.
A philosophy we have disproven. See Geth/Quarian conflict. I think this should give us liscence to discount everything he says and blow him the hell up.
You certainly won by ending the cycle, but it's not a satisfying "standing atop a pile of Reaper corpses" kind of victory. It's more of an "I could achieve what you didn't manage to do in billions of years of your horrible cycles" kind of intellectual victory, and this is certainly a valid conclusion (to my mind), but I see how other people might have preferred a more tangible "slaying the villain" type of victory. Leviathan only adds to this by stating that it's only a war for us, but just a harvest for the Reapers, basically meaning that they are not even playing the game we are trying to win.
You won by playing ball with the villain. I didn't feel particularly heroic about it did you?
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