233 réponses à ce sujet

[Ticonderoga117]

Master Che wrote...

They were leaving, thus no longer a threat. Resources were diverted to current threats.

This is so laughably basic

Except the Normandy represents a clear and present danger to a Reaper on the ground and the beam. Plus, since it wouldn't take more than a few seconds to swat the Normandy from the sky, it's laughably horrible that Harby didn't take a swat at her.

Which means everything is right in ME3, everyone acts like morons so that the plot works.

[halbert986]

Not only is the mere existence of this scene incomprehensibly stupid, but it's brought to your attention that harbinger is just sitting there eavesdropping on your conversation and thinking "holy **** a prothean I thought we killed all those guys... Did I leave the oven on? I think I remember turning it off... Yeah I turned if off. Or did I? Hmm well great now I gotta go all the way back home and check... They really should make an app for this or something. I wonder if there already is one? I should totally check. What did I come down here for again? Oh yeah." BZZZZZTTTT

[babachewie]

Wow. The nit-picky ****ing brigade

[halbert986]

Nit picking is saying that shepards armor doesn't match what I was wearing when I got blasted.
Or that the shuttle coats picks you up in is actually a cerberus shuttle model.
Or that sticking the word "Thanix" in front of a missile makes no sense.
Or that the normandy flying through crossfire after crossfire in the heat of battle is a really bad idea.
Or that Coats appears outside your shuttle before you land.

What it is not is pointing out how incredibly stupid an entire scene in the final moments of the game was that attempted to explain the survival of 2 main characters.

[Alex Kershaw]

I completely disagree that there was anything wrong with this scene.

In video games, you're used to being the centre of attention, so this is an easy mistake to make. However, you're making the mistake of thinking Harbinger cares about killing you or your companions at that point. Harbinger left the battle where he was killing millions of people so that he could block access to the beam. Blocking the beam is his focus. Why would he stop doing that just to kill people who are getting AWAY? Why would he care if 2 people are fleeing? TWO people?

To say that it's the worst scene in video game history to have Harbinger do what he just flew down to do - protect the beam - rather than stop doing that to kill 2 people who are fleeing is ridiculous.

(And as soon as Harbinger sees that Shepard is NOT getting away, he starts shooting at him. This makes perfect sense with Harbinger's motive.)

Modifié par Alex Kershaw, 04 septembre 2012 - 11:34 .

[halbert986]

OK for the purpose of this discussion let's say that Harbinger doesn't shoot the normandy for some reason. Take harbinger totally out of the equation.. He's too busy.

You're telling me that Commander Shepard is going to call a timeout on his suicidal, no retreat, balls to the walls, end all be all fight for existence. Disobey a direct order from Admiral Anderson, (no turning back) pull the Normandy out of combat with the reapers, risk it getting shot down in an incredibly hot LZ, ignore the 100s of alliance grunts getting vaporized around him, all to save 2 people?

2 people who before this assault began he told "had to be willing to die to win the day." 2 people who are still conscious and breathing, able to walk on their own, and have no apparent critical or life threatening injuries. 2 people who have accepted that this fight, right here right now, will determine the fate of the galaxy.

2 people who depending on choice can be: an artificial intelligence with a disposable physical platform. A suicidal prothean who has no reason to exist but to destroy the reapers. A human male who is willing to die, "willing to do whatever the **** it takes to end this goddamn war." An Asari who doesn't want to live to see this cycle consumed by the reapers. And so on, and so on...

No. No, he would not make that call. That's a call that gets you relieved of command.

Modifié par halbert986, 05 septembre 2012 - 12:05 .

[TNT1991]

@ halbert986

To some it was "epic", but to others (including myself) was anything but. And I didn't even see my squadmate's bodies. It was more frustrating than "epic".

[H2Ape]

EDI says in ME3 that she can basically pretend to be a Reaper. I'm assuming that's what she did.

[I am disappoint]

H2Ape wrote...

EDI says in ME3 that she can basically pretend to be a Reaper. I'm assuming that's what she did.

She should have landed us next to the beam and save a lot of time with bullsh*t.

[riesenwiesel]

halbert986 wrote...

The Normandy evac is the worst thing about ME3.

Really? The worst thing? OMG!

So which evac exactly? The one from the EC or the one in which the Reapers prefer to shoot harmless "civilian" shuttles, while Shepard and Anderson do some smalltalk in front of the Normandy about 500 feet away from them?

I seriously don't understand how people can complain so much about one of the scenes, but not about the other. They are pretty much the same.

Sometimes you should just "enjoy" certain moments in a game and don't take a too close look, that applies to ME3 as to any other game or even movie.

[CaptainZaysh]

@OP: y'all wanted it, y'all got it. Herd the line.

[Mondhase]

halbert986 wrote...

OK for the purpose of this discussion let's say that Harbinger doesn't shoot the normandy for some reason. Take harbinger totally out of the equation.. He's too busy.

You're telling me that Commander Shepard is going to call a timeout on his suicidal, no retreat, balls to the walls, end all be all fight for existence. Disobey a direct order from Admiral Anderson, (no turning back) pull the Normandy out of combat with the reapers, risk it getting shot down in an incredibly hot LZ, ignore the 100s of alliance grunts getting vaporized around him, all to save 2 people?

2 people who before this assault began he told "had to be willing to die to win the day." 2 people who are still conscious and breathing, able to walk on their own, and have no apparent critical or life threatening injuries. 2 people who have accepted that this fight, right here right now, will determine the fate of the galaxy.

2 people who depending on choice can be: an artificial intelligence with a disposable physical platform. A suicidal prothean who has no reason to exist but to destroy the reapers. A human male who is willing to die, "willing to do whatever the **** it takes to end this goddamn war." An Asari who doesn't want to live to see this cycle consumed by the reapers. And so on, and so on...

No. No, he would not make that call. That's a call that gets you relieved of command.

Really great post that states most of my own issues with this scene. When I played the original ending, I wasn't too happy about the three options you had to choose from and especially the lack of information regarding the different outcomes, but the one thing that bugged me the most was the question how on earth my squat mates had made it back to the Normandy after everyone getting hit by the beam.

After playing the EC, it sadly became painfully clear to me, that BW had simply not thought this scenario through at all. It wasn't just that they had left out a scene, leaving enough hints for the players to fill out the blanks, but the solution they now presented in the EC, and I'm absolutely agreeing with the OP here, is pretty much the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen.

I played FemShep and brought Kaidan, my LI, and Garrus, my BFF with me, and I was completely horrified when the game suddenly all but paused and Shep decided that the lives of these two men were more important than the fate of the entire galaxy. When I first picked my team for the final assault, I assumed that all of us might be killed during the attack, but I still took my favorite characters with me, because if my Shepard had to walk into hell, there was no-one else she would have rather had beside her, even if it meant accepting the possibility of their deaths.

This was it, the final push, the moment everything we had done before had let us to, and IMO the rescue by the Normandy was a slap into the face of every character that had died so far, every sacrifice that had been made.
If we can simply call for a time-out in the middle of battle, why couldn't a shuttle fly up to the shroud to save Mordin? Why wasn't there enough time to save both Kaidan and Ashley? If the Normandy can simply fly right up to the beam (supposedly because of the Reaper IFF, as some have suggested in this thread), why did we have to make this slow push on ground? Why did so many soldiers have to die?


I thought a lot about how this scene could have played out and I think it would have made a lot more sense, if the two squat mates had simply been to injured to continue running, maybe one of them knocked out, and as Shepard stops and looks back to them, tempted to come to their help, the other one, the LI, if present, tells her/him to continue on, that this attack is far too important to fall back now. Then you have paragon/renegade responses saying something like "I know, but it kills me to leave you behind."/"I promise I'll see this through, for you."/"You would have just slowed me down, anyway."

Then, as Shepard turns towards the beam again, we see the LI send out a distress signal and then pass out. Shep gets hit by the laser shortly after and the scene continues with Marauder Shields until we arrive on the Citadel. There, Shepard's presence could trigger something that deactivates the beam, giving a plausible reason why Harbinger would back off and allow the Normandy enough space to come and rescue the injured squat mates. They look for Shepard and even for other soldiers but find none alive in the vicinity (or maybe they do, if high EMS), and then they fly off, believing the mission to be a failure, with the beam now deactivated. Then the rest of the ending plays out as before.

This would of course shorten the farewell scene with the LI, but I have to say that I found it incredibly cheesy in the EC and much prefered the simpler goodbye back in the camp.


So, TD;DR, the people at BioWare get paid for writing these things, how could they not come up with anything better than this rediculous explanation. And how does Harbinger know what a time-out is?

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

No. The ending is the worst thing about ME3.

[txgoldrush]

H2Ape wrote...

EDI says in ME3 that she can basically pretend to be a Reaper. I'm assuming that's what she did.

This

Its all in the narrative.

This also explains the Anderson-Shepard scene in the opening of the game.

The First Salarian Fleet also have Reaper IFFs.

[halbert986]

txgoldrush wrote...

H2Ape wrote...

EDI says in ME3 that she can basically pretend to be a Reaper. I'm assuming that's what she did.

This

Its all in the narrative.

This also explains the Anderson-Shepard scene in the opening of the game.

The First Salarian Fleet also have Reaper IFFs.

halbert986 wrote...

OK for the purpose of this discussion let's say that Harbinger doesn't shoot the normandy for some reason. Take harbinger totally out of the equation.. He's too busy.

You're telling me that Commander Shepard is going to call a timeout on his suicidal, no retreat, balls to the walls, end all be all fight for existence. Disobey a direct order from Admiral Anderson, (no turning back) pull the Normandy out of combat with the reapers, risk it getting shot down in an incredibly hot LZ, ignore the 100s of alliance grunts getting vaporized around him, all to save 2 people? 

2 people who before this assault began he told "had to be willing to die to win the day." 2 people who are still conscious and breathing, able to walk on their own, and have no apparent critical or life threatening injuries. 2 people who have accepted that this fight, right here right now, will determine the fate of the galaxy.

2 people who depending on choice can be: an artificial intelligence with a disposable physical platform. A suicidal prothean who has no reason to exist but to destroy the reapers. A human male who is willing to die, "willing to do whatever the **** it takes to end this goddamn war." An Asari who doesn't want to live to see this cycle consumed by the reapers. And so on, and so on... 

No. No, he would not make that call. That's a call that gets you relieved of command.

[Applepie_Svk]

Eterna5 wrote...

Harbinger is trying to stop the army from reaching the beam, why would he shoot as the stationary Normandy when there are quite a few vehicles and people rushing towards the beam?

What about chain explosion ... did you heard about that ?

[Lavits75]

I figured the squad members with me for the final push would die, so I brought Vega and Kaiden. So whatever happened, they died, they got evacuated. I don't really give a flying f**k.

[RadicalDisconnect]

H2Ape wrote...

EDI says in ME3 that she can basically pretend to be a Reaper. I'm assuming that's what she did.

You mean this video?
 

Yeah, but no. The Normandy is within spitting distance of Harbinger. It's like saying a ghillie suit is going to hide a sniper when the sniper is in the target's face. No camouflage or faking can hide you when you're at friggin point blank range.

[txgoldrush]

RadicalDisconnect wrote...

H2Ape wrote...

EDI says in ME3 that she can basically pretend to be a Reaper. I'm assuming that's what she did.

You mean this video?
 

Yeah, but no. The Normandy is within spitting distance of Harbinger. It's like saying a ghillie suit is going to hide a sniper when the sniper is in the target's face. No camouflage or faking can hide you when you're at friggin point blank range.

Who said the Reapers see like organics?

The Reaper IFF not only lets them land on Earth twice in the game without attention, but lets them go to Menae and Thessia without incident as well. The Rannoch Reaper only shoots at the SR2 because it actually attacked it.

Sorry, but it works, without it, they could not go into warzones like they did throughout the game.

Modifié par txgoldrush, 05 septembre 2012 - 05:34 .

[halbert986]

It's not a matter of harbinger seeing you. That is just one part of the great WTF that is this scene.

[RadicalDisconnect]

txgoldrush wrote...

RadicalDisconnect wrote...

H2Ape wrote...

EDI says in ME3 that she can basically pretend to be a Reaper. I'm assuming that's what she did.

You mean this video?
 

Yeah, but no. The Normandy is within spitting distance of Harbinger. It's like saying a ghillie suit is going to hide a sniper when the sniper is in the target's face. No camouflage or faking can hide you when you're at friggin point blank range.

Who said the Reapers see like organics?

You know, even nowadays we have things like LIDAR, terrain-mapping radar, and image recognition software. Do you really think a Reaper will lack the most basic situational awareness?

Modifié par RadicalDisconnect, 05 septembre 2012 - 05:35 .

[txgoldrush]

RadicalDisconnect wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

RadicalDisconnect wrote...

H2Ape wrote...

EDI says in ME3 that she can basically pretend to be a Reaper. I'm assuming that's what she did.

You mean this video?
 

Yeah, but no. The Normandy is within spitting distance of Harbinger. It's like saying a ghillie suit is going to hide a sniper when the sniper is in the target's face. No camouflage or faking can hide you when you're at friggin point blank range.

Who said the Reapers see like organics?

You know, even nowadays we have things like LIDAR, terrain-mapping radar, and image recognition software. Do you really think a Reaper will lack the most basic situational awareness?

For now, absolutely.

Face it, they not only use the IFF here, but the entire game.

[JBPBRC]

RadicalDisconnect wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

RadicalDisconnect wrote...

H2Ape wrote...

EDI says in ME3 that she can basically pretend to be a Reaper. I'm assuming that's what she did.

You mean this video?
 

Yeah, but no. The Normandy is within spitting distance of Harbinger. It's like saying a ghillie suit is going to hide a sniper when the sniper is in the target's face. No camouflage or faking can hide you when you're at friggin point blank range.

Who said the Reapers see like organics?

You know, even nowadays we have things like LIDAR, terrain-mapping radar, and image recognition software. Do you really think a Reaper will lack the most basic situational awareness?

Besides, Sovereign clearly sees Shepard and goes:

"YOU ARE NOT SAREN."

Clearly he has some form of basic visual input going on.

[halbert986]

How do reaper eyes work?

Ultraviolet, xray, radio, sonar, visible light spectrum?

Is their vision largely based on movement? Don't move! He can't see us if we don't BZZZZTTT

[txgoldrush]

JBPBRC wrote...

RadicalDisconnect wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

RadicalDisconnect wrote...

H2Ape wrote...

EDI says in ME3 that she can basically pretend to be a Reaper. I'm assuming that's what she did.

You mean this video?
 

Yeah, but no. The Normandy is within spitting distance of Harbinger. It's like saying a ghillie suit is going to hide a sniper when the sniper is in the target's face. No camouflage or faking can hide you when you're at friggin point blank range.

Who said the Reapers see like organics?

You know, even nowadays we have things like LIDAR, terrain-mapping radar, and image recognition software. Do you really think a Reaper will lack the most basic situational awareness?

Besides, Sovereign clearly sees Shepard and goes:

"YOU ARE NOT SAREN."

Clearly he has some form of basic visual input going on.

Or indoctrination detection.