219 réponses à ce sujet

[Lord Goose]

but they aren't really considered synthetic life, or life at all or something

Well, they exist inside huge starship without organic bodies.

VA doesn't seems to fit into ME3, anyway.

[ghost9191]

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

Lord Goose wrote...

Sacrifice has always been a major theme in the ME games.
The Virmire situation. Arrival. And now sacrificing the Geth,
so all organic species can live. I really don't understand why
everyone are so upset over this.

In this situation, sacrifice is forced by plot, and is beyound player's influence. And it is still possible to try to save as much as you can in both situations (say, warn the colonies in Arrival).

On Virmire you have a choice: Kaidan or Ashley. No matter what, one of them dies.
In Arrival you have a choice: Warn the colonies or don't. No matter what, you blow up an entire system.
Dyring the ending, you have a choice: Destroy, Control or Synthesis. In control, the Geth 'dies', in the other endings, they don't. You're not forced to pick either of them.

yeah but you do get the chance to say somethin gfirst, would have been nice to tel the geth to gtfo. not that it would help, just like telling ash or kaiden that you will come for them next didn't help or warning the colony didn't help

the thought is what counts

[ghost9191]

Lord Goose wrote...

but they aren't really considered synthetic life, or life at all or something

Well, they exist inside huge starship without organic bodies.

VA doesn't seems to fit into ME3, anyway.

talking about reapers? right

[chasemme]

ghost9191 wrote...

chasemme wrote...

ghost9191 wrote...

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

Sacrifice has always been a major theme in the ME games. The Virmire situation. Arrival. And now sacrificing the Geth, so all organic species can live. I really don't understand why everyone are so upset over this.

as shepard says " Winning this war will have a high price, as it always does"

although the war had plenty of sacrifices already

I would argue not enough, given the scale, but that's just me.

yeah but if you think about the worlds that were lost, species on the brink of extinction and such. Plus mordin, it adds up

but as said, it is forced . no way to try and save other then going control or that awful awful choice synthesis <_<

Funny you should mention Mordin, he was the one who said it's hard to personify a galaxy in ME2. Hard for me to get worked up over a bunch of lost planets I never saw get taken. 3-4 ME2 squadmates dying + Anderson were all sad, but seemed like I didn't lose all that much really (Even if we include ME1 and 2, nothing REALLY notable comes to mind, except poor Kaidan). Having me kill EDI helped in that regard too, make my friend a direct cost of victory.

Honestly I thought destroy was the BEST-written ending. Not a difficult competition, but there you go.

I also don't absolutely loathe refuse, with a certain viewpoint.

[lynch108]

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

darkchief10 wrote...

same thing can be said for humans, albeit we are organic machines, we're not so special

Humans have their own personalities, and their own set of skills. 

Machines can only do what they were made to do.

The Morning Star War would suggest otherwise. They were not made to rebel. Itis because of them gaining consciences that led to their eventual rebellion. To flippantly say they are just machines and can be replaced would suggest to me that you didn't pay much attention to the geth-centric missions, especially the ones involving Legion. It's kind of like telling an animal lover when his or her dog dies that it's just an animal you can buy another one. Little consolation for the dog owner. Some people view life differently.

Modifié par lynch108, 05 septembre 2012 - 07:13 .

[ghost9191]

@Chasemme

yeah , which is why i don't get too upset over the geth, maybe if legion didn't kill itself earlier i might of had a second thought after the first shot at tube ( would've went through with it ) but they were all faceless. just a number on my war assets

Modifié par ghost9191, 05 septembre 2012 - 07:17 .

[.PHANTOM]

Yes of course they can be replaced anything in existence can be replaced me, you , this computer that computer, but not your memories, personality, experience, the way you feel about things, the Geth and Edi had those, or how Legion puts it a Soul, gotta say picking destroy not so easy at first, but hey they at least died as individuals with souls then as opposed to machines with animal intelligence at the Quarians hands, but yeah they shouldn't have used Reaper code to further themselves either.

[ghost9191]

Fandango9641 wrote...

lynch108 wrote...

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

darkchief10 wrote...

same thing can be said for humans, albeit we are organic machines, we're not so special

Humans have their own personalities, and their own set of skills. 

Machines can only do what they were made to do.

The Morning Star War would suggest otherwise. They were not made to rebel. Itis because of them gaining consciences that led to their eventual rebellion. To flippantly say they are just machines and can be replaced would suggest to me that you didn't pay much attention to the geth-centric missions, especially the ones involving Legion. It's kind of like telling an animal lover when his or her dog dies that it's just an animal you can buy another one. Little consolation for the dog owner. Some people view life differently.

It's a fear of the other. You know, those refusing the rights of things other than themselves  to live really should have a long hard think about what they are actually saying here - one could easily replace the word 'synthetic' with another differentiating label and get into all sorts of trouble talking such rot. Pretty scary actually.

as javik says, " war is an atrocity commited in the name of survival"

[Eterna]

Why on earth would the Quarians build the Geth again? What purpose would it serve?

[holdenagincourt]

If you view them as glorified washing machines and refrigerators, then sure.

The problem is that the entire narrative arc of the Mass Effect series in regards to artificial intelligence and synthetic life does not support this simplistic interpretation, and especially not the third game.

[Podge 90]

Does the Destroy ending show the Geth being wiped out? I mean, the Catalyst says it will kill Synthetics, and he states that Shepard is part synthetic and so alludes to Shep being killed. But then you see Shepard alive.

So if it kills all synthetics (but doesn't kill all synthetics), and some synthetics are still alive (despite all synthetics being wiped out), and we don't see the Geth shut down or blow up or anything, then they're most probably still alive, bearing in mind the amount of contradictions the Catalyst spews.

[Podge 90]

Fandango9641 wrote...

Nope, you cant justify genocide to me I'm afraid.

[ghost9191]

Podge 90 wrote...

Fandango9641 wrote...

Nope, you cant justify genocide to me I'm afraid.

LOL AT ^^

@Fandango9641

never tried to justify it. wish i knew the exact quote but "commiting genocide to prevent genocide only causes genocide" i don't try to justify it because there is no way to justify it. But will still make the choice to save the many

[ghost9191]

Podge 90 wrote...

Does the Destroy ending show the Geth being wiped out? I mean, the Catalyst says it will kill Synthetics, and he states that Shepard is part synthetic and so alludes to Shep being killed. But then you see Shepard alive.

So if it kills all synthetics (but doesn't kill all synthetics), and some synthetics are still alive (despite all synthetics being wiped out), and we don't see the Geth shut down or blow up or anything, then they're most probably still alive, bearing in mind the amount of contradictions the Catalyst spews.

feel the same way. if bioware had the geth destroyed then they could have added a single pic of geth deactivated or some bs. just like they added them in the other endings. yeah edis name was on the wall but doesn't mean the geth which only were upgraded with reaper code couldn't survive. i NEEDZ proof

[ghost9191]

Fandango9641 wrote...

ghost9191 wrote...

Podge 90 wrote...

Fandango9641 wrote...

Nope, you cant justify genocide to me I'm afraid.

LOL AT ^^

@Fandango9641

never tried to justify it. wish i knew the exact quote but "commiting genocide to prevent genocide only causes genocide" i don't try to justify it because there is no way to justify it. But will still make the choice to save the many

Right, but (and be honest here) would you be willing to make the same choice if we swapped out humanity for synthetics?

thought about this, and no. The geth are faceless to me , whereas humans are not. plus LI is uhman . so would have to think about it a bit more . The only geth that we knew really was legion, or the multiple programs in it . so in the end geth are easier to sacrificing humans

so idon't know how i would go about it if it was humanity instead of geth

that thought bothers me more then the whole sacrificing geth . But guess when it comes down to it , it is easier to sacrifice a number rather then a person

and i just mean the geth are a faceless number

Modifié par ghost9191, 05 septembre 2012 - 08:21 .

[Big I]

theillusiveman11 wrote...
I don't see why people make a big deal over the Destroy ending wiping out synthetics. Any synthetic can be replaced, there's nothing unique about any of them.

Every blue box AI is unique and can't be copied. Legion was unique, and so is every geth unit (or program?) after their upgrade. The geth as a whole, with their shared consciousness, are unique.


Any organic can be replaced with another organic but apart from Shepard no one in ME, organic or synthetic, has been resurrected, which seems to be what you're implying can be done for the AIs. If you accept that EDI and Legion are people (and why wouldn't you) choosing the option that wipes out the others like them is a pretty brutal thing to do.

[ghost9191]

@Fandango9641

which earlier comment? the one about trying to justify? because i wasn't and I am still not

[ghost9191]

fair enough , like i said thought about it before but not as much, not sure what i would choose then because i don't have to lol. Easy enough to say i would when i don't have to but prefer to be honest

@LookingGlass

every choice has some kind of sacrifice. some would say it is wrong to do synthesis or only a madman would give up his humanity for power. or wrong to enslave

destroy is just straightforward, and i mean we know what sacrifices and problems or what not come with destroys. whereas with the other 2 they are unknown

Modifié par ghost9191, 05 septembre 2012 - 08:31 .

[Big I]

They're all bad choices, no one's denying that, and Destroy's just as bad as the rest because you have to kill the synthetics.

[ghost9191]

yeah i know.