Modifié par Lividliver, 07 septembre 2012 - 08:00 .
Lividliver wrote...
I'm okay with rare(gold) cards but I disagree with giving them a guaranteed UR.As much as we would like to welcome them,we do not want to be spoonfeeding them to the point where the store RNG comes as a shocker to them and they start whining about it and quitting still.Better they get used to the RNG early and appreciate just how rare URs are.That will be the real test of their patience.If they cannot stand the RNG within the first week and expect to see multiple URs drop within that time,they would be better off not playing MP at all.
Also,such a pack should have a random chance of getting ANY of the gold cards,yes, including level 4 ammo and gold character cards.It is a starter pack after all,not a guaranteed x or y weapon,any stuff they get will be useful to them(considering they are starting from nil) and they should not complain about it.
Killahead wrote...
Why does it bother you if they get a better starter pack than you though? And take into consideration that you've played since the beginning. When the DLCs hit you probably had most of or all of the old stuff. Think about the overwhelming amount of items that a player has to unlock if he or she were to start today.
CarpeJugulum wrote...
I'm sorry, but whatever you say, ammo or gear is nowhere near as useful as a weapon or character. I find it rather amusing how you talk about wanting to keep people in the game and then make this suggestion in the next paragraph. If you give people something they can actually use, and continue to use, they're more likely to keep playing than if you give them a consumable thats gone after one match. And you seem to be missing the point when you talk about character cards as a bad thing. I'd happily trade a rare weapon card for a character card I didn't have yet. These are new players we're talking about here, not someone getting customisation options from character cards.
You are right, they shouldn't complain, but I don't see why this means we can't give them some decent stuff to get started with.
Lividliver wrote...
If they(newcomers) want to catch up with the rest,they should have bought the game early.
Lividliver wrote...
For a very simple reason,because we are the early adopters...because we put in time and effort to get every piece of rare and URs.
Modifié par CarpeJugulum, 07 septembre 2012 - 08:49 .
Killahead wrote...
Lividliver wrote...
If they(newcomers) want to catch up with the rest,they should have bought the game early.
Yeah, all they need to do is invent a time machine!
Joking aside, the compelling reason you seek is maintaining an as large player base as possible. We want that because we want Bioware to continue supporting the game. That means that we shouldn't scare off new players, and it might help giving them some shiny items. If they get such items, they will at least not quit until they've tried them out, and that might just get them hooked. Getting a recruit pack and a Katana 1.. not that intriguing.
I'm very much opposed to this notion: "we worked hard for this, no way those guys should get anything free". That's just egoism. We're talking about a few gold cards! Again, try to imagine entering MP for the first time at this point.
Lividliver wrote...
The notion of "reaping what you sow" aka hardwork is universally accepted,in both gaming and real life.I doubt .That is hardly egoism,considering we are only expecting them to work their way up just like the rest of us.It is not as if we are creating an entry barrier.Would an empty manifest make bronze any harder now than what we had to go through?
CarpeJugulum wrote...
Lividliver wrote...
For a very simple reason,because we are the early adopters...because we put in time and effort to get every piece of rare and URs.
I'd take exception to this. They're going to have to put in the same amount of time and arguably more effort, what with all the buffs the enemies have been given. They've also missed out on all the promotional weapons, and there's considerably less people playing now than there was. All of this makes their life harder.
Anyway, these sorts of people are precisely those that aren't all that likely to play for a long time. Let's face it, if you were really interested in ME3 you'd have got it before now. Anything that can be done to convince them to stay longer has to help.
Edit:
Why should we not let them try out level 4 consumables? Because unlike character cards, which are a bigger benefit to lower levelled people, consumables are considerably less of a benefit. On higher difficulties it's much more important to squeeze every ounce of performance out of a weapon. On bronze? Not so much. A new weapon or character would be a lot more useful. Or, if they really need to try them out, why not give them as well, instead of instead of, characters or weapons.
Lividliver wrote...
Killahead wrote...
Lividliver wrote...
If they(newcomers) want to catch up with the rest,they should have bought the game early.
Yeah, all they need to do is invent a time machine!
Joking aside, the compelling reason you seek is maintaining an as large player base as possible. We want that because we want Bioware to continue supporting the game. That means that we shouldn't scare off new players, and it might help giving them some shiny items. If they get such items, they will at least not quit until they've tried them out, and that might just get them hooked. Getting a recruit pack and a Katana 1.. not that intriguing.
I'm very much opposed to this notion: "we worked hard for this, no way those guys should get anything free". That's just egoism. We're talking about a few gold cards! Again, try to imagine entering MP for the first time at this point.
Regarding the time machine comment,that is uncalled for.
It is stating a matter of fact.It is not as if this game was some obsure title that had little to no marketing at all.Most gamers would have been aware of this title well in advance.If for some reason,they could not get the game at release time,it is their fault alone and not one that requires Bioware to make it up to them just because they are late for the party.If such newcomers cannot comprehand the need to make up for lost time on their own in exchange for getting it a cheaper price,then I'm not so sure they will survive the first week of RNG even if you gave them 3 URs.
Like I said,I'm okay with gold cards but not URs.However,my reason for accepting such an idea is as a form of goodwill gesture,not because I see it as a necessity to attract/retain players.
The notion of "reaping what you sow" aka hardwork is universally accepted,in both gaming and real life.I doubt .That is hardly egoism,considering we are only expecting them to work their way up just like the rest of us.It is not as if we are creating an entry barrier.Would an empty manifest make bronze any harder now than what we had to go through?
CarpeJugulum wrote...
I'm sorry, but when was playing a game about hard work? Surely the goal of ME3 should be to create entertainment. If you're playing purely to unlock stuff then something's gone wrong. I know I'd have loved something like this back when I was starting, and that must hold even moreso now, what with all the new stuff that's been added. Why should we deny them something good just because we can't benefit from it?
Lividliver wrote...
Firstly.I don't see how missing out on all the promotional weapons will make their life harder.When the early adopters(release buyers) started out,they had no promotional weapons of their own to speak off yet they all progressed fine and no one complained about it.
On bronze/silver,they can try out their weapons with or without level 4 ammo,thus letting them get a feel of just how useful they are too them.If they are the learning sort,they will continue to experiment with the various consumables as they go higher up in difficulty.Again,I emphasize that the perception of worth should be left up to them and not for us to decide.Bioware should not come out with a starter pack that places biasness towards any category of the manifest,it should be left up to the individual which they think is better.As such,the pack should have a random chance of dropping any of them.
Krantzstone wrote...
Yes, because they've buffed the enemy to balance them against the newer characters and weapons (not to mention a playerbase that has only gotten more knowledgeable and all-around better at multiplayer, not even counting map glitch abuse)... but the starter manifest is still the same. It's possible the starter weapons and classes have been buffed a little (I don't actually know/remember) but not enough to cover the difference between how the enemy was when we all first started playing and the way they are now.
Newer players also have way more to unlock now than we did when we first started when the game launched, which has increased the number of things you can potentially unlock/level up, so whereas when the game first launched, there were far fewer rares and ultra-rares, so if you got a rare or ultra-rare in a pack, chances are it was one you already got once, and thus allowing you to level it up, and level it up faster. Now, every time you get a rare or ultra-rare in a pack, it might be an entirely different one from one you've unlocked, so you'll have a greater variety of rares and ultra-rares (which might be good for those who want to try out different weapons), but it will take longer to level them up.
And let's face it, weapons are way more useful at X than at I, even rares and ultra-rares. Even now on my 360 manifest I tend to use my Avenger X with my SalEng, just to keep my cooldown maxed, because I still have so many other weapons I need to unlock/level up despite largely farming FBW/G/G since I restarted on the 360, and none of the more powerful weapons I have allow me to keep my cooldown at 200%.
Modifié par Lividliver, 07 septembre 2012 - 09:24 .
Lividliver wrote...
CarpeJugulum wrote...
I'm sorry, but when was playing a game about hard work? Surely the goal of ME3 should be to create entertainment. If you're playing purely to unlock stuff then something's gone wrong. I know I'd have loved something like this back when I was starting, and that must hold even moreso now, what with all the new stuff that's been added. Why should we deny them something good just because we can't benefit from it?
Yes,we game for fun but you cannot have it if you don't put any effort into it.The whole learning process is one great effort.For example,I doubt anybody would have fun if they constantly refuse to learn to use cover and just stand out in the open to be shot at.All the things we learned through long hours of playing have enabled the season players to attain a higher rate of success and more credits as a result.Giving them nice things before they even learn the basics is counter productive.
CarpeJugulum wrote...
Promotional weapons is a fairly minor point. As for bias towards different parts of the manifest, I point you towards the current packs. Notice how you don't get consumables until you've maxed, or nearly maxed, that category. I think that says something about how Bioware feels about the consumables as compared to other parts of the manifest, a view which is backed up by most of the community.
Modifié par Lividliver, 07 septembre 2012 - 09:48 .
Lividliver wrote...
I don't remember such a thing,at least not in recent times.Any buffs to enemies were solely for gold and platinum.Bronze and silver were left untouched.
More to unlock,more to level up.Are they even legitimate gripes about the game?I'm sorry to say but if a newcomer were to complain about having so many to unlock and level up,it would make it seem as if they are the "instant gratification" sort.Is that the kind of attitude we want to foster?Another player mentioned earlier that this game is about having fun and that if people only concentrate on unlocks,something is wrong.Wouldn't what you said contradict it since apparently newcomers cannot have fun without rapidly unlocking/levelling their manifest.
All these things are rewards that come with the time and effort put in.I dare say it is part of Bioware's intention and design for it to be so.They are free to correct me if I'm wrong.
CarpeJugulum wrote...
One weapon or character, no matter how good, is not going to stop you learning those things. Sure, they might be able to clear bronze a little bit easier, but at the end of the day if you don't learn those things you're not going to be playing gold. And if you give them one character or weapon, it's not going to take out the effort of getting all the others. They'll probably have more motivation to do so, because they'll know there's more decent stuff out there they can get if they just keep playing.
Retour en haut