I've always believed that Half-Blast is best, but after reading this I might reconsider. If I ever get into multiplayer again, since I quit before Platinum got released and it seems pretty intimidating...
Human Vanguard Tips and Tricks
Débuté par
Achire
, sept. 07 2012 05:06
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#27
Posté 08 septembre 2012 - 01:18
Achire
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You will spend more time vulnerable to enemy fire with Full Nova. That is not a problem on Gold, but it is definitely easier to survive on Platinum with Half-blast. Especially if there's less than 4 people. There's going to be a patch and a new DLC soon. That might be a good time to give the multiplayer a go to see if it's worth it.
Modifié par Achire, 08 septembre 2012 - 01:32 .
#28
Posté 08 septembre 2012 - 01:35
BetrayerOfNihil
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Really good guide. I'd like to add a little combo I like to use when reviving allies and clearing objective areas with enemy units around them. Shockwave to stagger shielded targets and knock down unshielded ones, Nova to strip shields and possibly kill unshielded enemies, then Shockwave again to knockdown/kill everyone. I upgrade Shockwave for Radius, Range, and Recharge Speed, as Lifting Shockwave bugs out on me and kind of messes up this combo. Nova has Radius, Boost Recharge Speed, and Pierce. Hope this helps.
#29
Posté 11 septembre 2012 - 03:45
JShepppp
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Nice guide. Not a Novaguard player myself, but an interesting read and I hope it will help others.
Also, great job in the videos in your sig, especially the solos. Those were damn good.
Also, great job in the videos in your sig, especially the solos. Those were damn good.
#30
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 02:29
Achire
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Added damage numbers for all the relevant Novaguard combos.
#31
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 09:30
konnect13123
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Fantastic guide, thank you. Do you recommend rolling after a nova to increase survivabilty?
#32
Posté 14 septembre 2012 - 01:06
Achire
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Thanks for the positive feedback.
I recommend nova canceling when necessary. If you meant the normal dodge roll, it is very situational. The normal dodge is, of course, useful if you have all your shields shot off so you can't nova cancel. Also I personally like to dodge backwards to the left after charging a Phantom to gain some distance from the grab attack. Outside of those situations, I don't see much of a reason to use the dodge. Banshee Warp, for example, you can safely just tank by nova canceling instead of trying to dodge.
One thing I don't recommend is using dodge or nova cancel in your normal damage routine (see basic gameplay). Novaguards have fairly low DPS to begin with, and I don't think it's a good idea to further lower that in this way. If played right, a half-blast Novaguard will have a very large amount of invulnerability frames. Adding a roll will actually hurt you since you won't be invulnerable, and adding a nova cancel is really not needed most of the time.
Full Nova builds have less invulnerability frames than half-blast even at full 4 recharge stacks. It's a trade-off for the higher damage. The thing is, if you want to mitigate the additional risk by using a roll or an additional nova cancel, you lose the DPS advantage over half-blast. At that point, you might as well be playing a half-blast build in the first place and gaining the additional invulnerability frames.
I recommend nova canceling when necessary. If you meant the normal dodge roll, it is very situational. The normal dodge is, of course, useful if you have all your shields shot off so you can't nova cancel. Also I personally like to dodge backwards to the left after charging a Phantom to gain some distance from the grab attack. Outside of those situations, I don't see much of a reason to use the dodge. Banshee Warp, for example, you can safely just tank by nova canceling instead of trying to dodge.
One thing I don't recommend is using dodge or nova cancel in your normal damage routine (see basic gameplay). Novaguards have fairly low DPS to begin with, and I don't think it's a good idea to further lower that in this way. If played right, a half-blast Novaguard will have a very large amount of invulnerability frames. Adding a roll will actually hurt you since you won't be invulnerable, and adding a nova cancel is really not needed most of the time.
Full Nova builds have less invulnerability frames than half-blast even at full 4 recharge stacks. It's a trade-off for the higher damage. The thing is, if you want to mitigate the additional risk by using a roll or an additional nova cancel, you lose the DPS advantage over half-blast. At that point, you might as well be playing a half-blast build in the first place and gaining the additional invulnerability frames.
#33
Posté 14 septembre 2012 - 01:45
konnect13123
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Achire wrote...
Thanks for the positive feedback.
I recommend nova canceling when necessary. If you meant the normal dodge roll, it is very situational. The normal dodge is, of course, useful if you have all your shields shot off so you can't nova cancel. Also I personally like to dodge backwards to the left after charging a Phantom to gain some distance from the grab attack. Outside of those situations, I don't see much of a reason to use the dodge. Banshee Warp, for example, you can safely just tank by nova canceling instead of trying to dodge.
One thing I don't recommend is using dodge or nova cancel in your normal damage routine (see basic gameplay). Novaguards have fairly low DPS to begin with, and I don't think it's a good idea to further lower that in this way. If played right, a half-blast Novaguard will have a very large amount of invulnerability frames. Adding a roll will actually hurt you since you won't be invulnerable, and adding a nova cancel is really not needed most of the time.
Full Nova builds have less invulnerability frames than half-blast even at full 4 recharge stacks. It's a trade-off for the higher damage. The thing is, if you want to mitigate the additional risk by using a roll or an additional nova cancel, you lose the DPS advantage over half-blast. At that point, you might as well be playing a half-blast build in the first place and gaining the additional invulnerability frames.
Thank you for the elaborate response.
I just recently tried half blast today and ran into some problems. Sometimes after my first nova the enemy somehow manages to pop my shields before i can get a second nova off, leaving me with with biotic charge 2 secs out without any shields. I'm pretty good at a full blast novaguard, but after watching your vids I'm trying learn a different playstyle utilizing the invulnerability frames. I'm guessing you have to do the second nova immediately after the first.
I asked about rolling because I usually charge-nova-roll against primes because they can magically stunlock me. Thanks again for the thread and the tips.
#34
Posté 14 septembre 2012 - 02:17
Achire
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Losing all your shields after Charging is a fairly common occurrence (Cyclonic Modulators help immensely with this). However you shouldn't be losing shields after a Nova. To maximize the invulnerability frames, you need to use Nova as soon as possible. On Gold/Platinum (the game is sped up 7.5%), you can do a Charge Nova Nova combo in about 4.1(4) seconds.
About switching to half-blast, I would generally say just play the way you find the most fun. Full Nova is probably better even on Gold, though I haven't seen a Novaguard solo faster than the one I did with half-blast. For Platinum, however, I would definitely recommend half-blast. If you don't plan on playing Platinum on the Novaguard (and there are a ton of easier classes to use), then I would say just keep using full nova.
About rolls and primes, probably ok with Full Nova. My main point about the dodge is that you don't want to always use it, whereas in a specific situation like that it might be ok. Nova cancel with melee is very fast, so you could try if that's faster than a even a normal roll. So Charge, Nova cancel with melee, then Nova. That'd certainly be safer thanks to the invulnerability frames. That is lower DPS than half-blast, so of course only use in special circumstances.
About switching to half-blast, I would generally say just play the way you find the most fun. Full Nova is probably better even on Gold, though I haven't seen a Novaguard solo faster than the one I did with half-blast. For Platinum, however, I would definitely recommend half-blast. If you don't plan on playing Platinum on the Novaguard (and there are a ton of easier classes to use), then I would say just keep using full nova.
About rolls and primes, probably ok with Full Nova. My main point about the dodge is that you don't want to always use it, whereas in a specific situation like that it might be ok. Nova cancel with melee is very fast, so you could try if that's faster than a even a normal roll. So Charge, Nova cancel with melee, then Nova. That'd certainly be safer thanks to the invulnerability frames. That is lower DPS than half-blast, so of course only use in special circumstances.
Modifié par Achire, 14 septembre 2012 - 02:20 .
#36
Posté 14 septembre 2012 - 02:30
Drummernate
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(Y) + [RB]
Modifié par Drummernate, 14 septembre 2012 - 02:31 .
#37
Posté 29 septembre 2012 - 11:02
Achire
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Added a more detailed explanation on Banshee sync kill behavior. They are trying to fix magnet handing in the next patch, so it's quite possible that Banshee behavior will also change.
Modifié par Achire, 29 septembre 2012 - 11:03 .
#38
Posté 06 octobre 2012 - 03:58
BlackbirdSR-71C
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Only learned about avoiding Banshee sync kills yesterday.
I tested it out as a Drellguard on gold. I never got grabbed, and didn't even die often (thanks to the Vanguard bug fix).
Must read for Vanguards of all kind, and melee classes as well!
I tested it out as a Drellguard on gold. I never got grabbed, and didn't even die often (thanks to the Vanguard bug fix).
Must read for Vanguards of all kind, and melee classes as well!
#39
Posté 17 novembre 2012 - 09:49
Achire
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Small update to better reflect the state of the game at this point.
#40
Posté 12 janvier 2013 - 05:53
Achire
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Apparently my guide was missing the info on bugged weapon mods. Furthermore, BUMP.
#41
Posté 12 janvier 2013 - 06:10
Stahlhammer
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Hey you're back! You should do more HV solo runs, preferably with the awesome music choice as usual 
#42
Posté 12 janvier 2013 - 06:12
heybigmoney
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The tech explosion changes were really a much needed buff to the novaguard. Best detonator in the game now imo.
#43
Guest_Heri_*
Posté 12 janvier 2013 - 06:36
Guest_Heri_*
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Great to see a guide for what is still the most powerful (not necessarily in terms of DPS, but overall) and fun class in the game to play IMO. People who think HVs are boring because the class looks like charge-nova-nova and nothing more don't know what they're missing. The key to a well-played HV is having good situational awareness, and that's not something you can pick up by reading in a guide.
I wish I played HV more often, but having to host is a downer and I'm often too impatient to wait for my own lobbies to fill
I wish I played HV more often, but having to host is a downer and I'm often too impatient to wait for my own lobbies to fill
#44
Posté 12 janvier 2013 - 06:37
Draining Dragon
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How can Shockwave, Melee attacks, or Weapons be worked into the class?
#45
Posté 12 janvier 2013 - 06:58
Deerber
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Wonderful, I didn't know of this thread. Your platinum solo pushed me to start playing the awesome character that novaguard is, and teached me the basics. It's amazing, I've been loving him ever since and have learned a lot about him lately. Still, there were some new infos in this thread as well, for me.
For example, something I'd like a clarification on: what do you mean when you say that hiding a reload animation inside a nova/charge adds a vulnerability period to that? Do you mean the invulnerability frames are shorter?
If that's so, it may account for loooots of BS deaths I've had with him. Well, I thought they were BS at least...
For example, something I'd like a clarification on: what do you mean when you say that hiding a reload animation inside a nova/charge adds a vulnerability period to that? Do you mean the invulnerability frames are shorter?
If that's so, it may account for loooots of BS deaths I've had with him. Well, I thought they were BS at least...
#46
Posté 12 janvier 2013 - 07:22
Fortack
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Achire wrote...
Not on Platinum or Gold. Charge will always stagger Phantoms now, so it's not really a problem. Charge, Nova, Nova with Power Synergy will take out a Phantom's Barrier on Platinum, but that seems like a bit of a risky way to deal with a Phantom.
Well, Phantoms sometimes act like shield bashing Guardians in that they melee (thus stagger you) on Charge's impact and immediately follow with their sync kill. Any idea how, why and, most importantly, when this happens?
Thanks in advance and cheers for posting this great guide.
On a side note. Does anyone know if it's possible to silence the Vanguard? I'm getting really tired of their constant screaming, but playing without sound doesn't sound like a really good idea
#47
Posté 12 janvier 2013 - 07:52
Achire
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@Stahlhammer: Cheers. Nice to know (some) people like the music choices. The thing about videos is, what's left to do? Solo Platinum Collectors? Ugh.
@Heri, Once you get comfortable playing the Novaguard, you can just start the game on your own and solo the first couple of waves. The other guys who join won't have any consumables on, but at least you don't have to wait in a lobby.
@Draining Dragon, lots of people have tried but I've never really seen that work. You can cancel Nova with a heavy melee, but it's just not really that great. The problem with shockwave is that it has hardly any synergy with charge and nova, whereas charge and nova have excellent synergy with each other.
@Deerber, basically my point is that if you mash the charge button after a nova, you will charge as fast as possible but you will not be able to do the reload trick. Nova always gives 1.5s of invulnerability. Charge gives less than that, and depends on how far you are from your enemies. If you want to reload during nova, you can't charge again until the reload is finished. Depending on the weapon used, this means you are vulnerable slightly longer.
Hypothetical example with numbers provided by the Stetson-Harrison institute:
Nova to charge (mashing 1): 1.6s (it's slightly longer than the 1.5s invulnerability from Nova)
Nova to charge while reloading Talon: 1.7s
Nova to charge while reloading Wraith: 1.75s
Nova to charge while reloading Claymore: 3.0s
The durations above are made up just to give you an idea of what I mean. They could be determined by counting frames with Fraps, but I can't really be bothered to do that.
@Fortrack, it's a pain when Phantoms do that. I don't know what causes it, but it's very rare compared to Guardians which do that all the damn time. I don't have any specific advice on avoiding it.
As for the sound, you get used to it. Your teammates will not, haha.
@Heri, Once you get comfortable playing the Novaguard, you can just start the game on your own and solo the first couple of waves. The other guys who join won't have any consumables on, but at least you don't have to wait in a lobby.
@Draining Dragon, lots of people have tried but I've never really seen that work. You can cancel Nova with a heavy melee, but it's just not really that great. The problem with shockwave is that it has hardly any synergy with charge and nova, whereas charge and nova have excellent synergy with each other.
@Deerber, basically my point is that if you mash the charge button after a nova, you will charge as fast as possible but you will not be able to do the reload trick. Nova always gives 1.5s of invulnerability. Charge gives less than that, and depends on how far you are from your enemies. If you want to reload during nova, you can't charge again until the reload is finished. Depending on the weapon used, this means you are vulnerable slightly longer.
Hypothetical example with numbers provided by the Stetson-Harrison institute:
Nova to charge (mashing 1): 1.6s (it's slightly longer than the 1.5s invulnerability from Nova)
Nova to charge while reloading Talon: 1.7s
Nova to charge while reloading Wraith: 1.75s
Nova to charge while reloading Claymore: 3.0s
The durations above are made up just to give you an idea of what I mean. They could be determined by counting frames with Fraps, but I can't really be bothered to do that.
@Fortrack, it's a pain when Phantoms do that. I don't know what causes it, but it's very rare compared to Guardians which do that all the damn time. I don't have any specific advice on avoiding it.
As for the sound, you get used to it. Your teammates will not, haha.
#48
Posté 12 janvier 2013 - 08:05
Fortack
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Yeah, I was afraid it's something random Fortunately it indeed does not happen often, but it sucks when it happens in wave 8+ when you play with lousy teammates. Thanks for the quick reply and I suppose I have to get used to the sound. I just hope my friends won't rage-remove me from Origin's friend list after a couple games
Fortunately it indeed does not happen often, but it sucks when it happens in wave 8+ when you play with lousy teammates. Thanks for the quick reply and I suppose I have to get used to the sound. I just hope my friends won't rage-remove me from Origin's friend list after a couple games
#49
Posté 12 janvier 2013 - 08:12
DANiiEL
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You wanna know how to play Human Vanguard? 13131313131313131313 repeat til the game is over.
#50
Posté 12 janvier 2013 - 09:02
Deerber
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Achire wrote...
@Deerber, basically my point is that if you mash the charge button after a nova, you will charge as fast as possible but you will not be able to do the reload trick. Nova always gives 1.5s of invulnerability. Charge gives less than that, and depends on how far you are from your enemies. If you want to reload during nova, you can't charge again until the reload is finished. Depending on the weapon used, this means you are vulnerable slightly longer.
Hypothetical example with numbers provided by the Stetson-Harrison institute:
Nova to charge (mashing 1): 1.6s (it's slightly longer than the 1.5s invulnerability from Nova)
Nova to charge while reloading Talon: 1.7s
Nova to charge while reloading Wraith: 1.75s
Nova to charge while reloading Claymore: 3.0s
The durations above are made up just to give you an idea of what I mean. They could be determined by counting frames with Fraps, but I can't really be bothered to do that.
@Fortrack, it's a pain when Phantoms do that. I don't know what causes it, but it's very rare compared to Guardians which do that all the damn time. I don't have any specific advice on avoiding it.
As for the sound, you get used to it. Your teammates will not, haha.
Haha this, so much this.
About the reload animation yeah, you're right, I never thought of that. So let's say you fire the claymore, nova-cancel. That means you can't do anything for about 2-2.5 secs (rate of fire of Claymore + reload animation = 3.5 secs approximately)? Uhm... Are you sure you cannot nova-cancel again? When I played it in single player I remember doing that...
And yeah, it sucks when Phantoms operate their Space Bull****...
