183 réponses à ce sujet

[Learn To Love Yourself]

Emerald_Phoenix wrote...

Jack Crapper wrote...

Makes me sad to find out the Kishock doesn't benefit from Incendiary as much as I had hoped. Thanks!

Agreed. 

You know, I ran a solo to fiddle around to see how much damage the Kishock did with Warp Ammo IV vs my previous findings with Incendiary.

With Warp Ammo IV: Warp + Charged Kishock will leave a Gold Banshee w/ 4 bars of Barrier.  Incendiary depletes this totally + sometimes even a bar of armor.

With Warp Ammo, Warp + Charged Kishock will take off about 4 bars of a Brute's armor.  If I detonate, I will have to shoot again with the Kishock to finish off.  With Incendiary, Brute drops down to 2 bars and sometimes 1 bar of armor, and I can finish easily with a Throw for BE.

With Incendiary, I could Warp + Charged Kishock a Ravager and run away.  It will drop down to 1 bar of armor from the Incendiary and then die from the Kishock's bleeding.

Incendiary does seem to complement the Kishock well, but perhaps not as ground-breakingly as with high ROF weapons.

[Josh.de]

Why should it be a bug?
It´s intendended to work stacked that way, I see no bug here.
Anyone should feel free to use this tactic, nothing new to my btw, always used incendiary ammo like you described Pedro, shoot, shoot other target, shoot again 1st target (if not dead already)....and so on, sure all this will be multiplied by the damage reduction warp gives, also no wonder here :-D

[peddroelm]

Jack Crapper wrote...

You know, I ran a solo to fiddle around to see how much damage the Kishock did with Warp Ammo IV vs my previous findings with Incendiary.

With Warp Ammo IV: Warp + Charged Kishock will leave a Gold Banshee w/ 4 bars of Barrier.  Incendiary depletes this totally + sometimes even a bar of armor.

Incendiary does seem to complement the Kishock well, but perhaps not as ground-breakingly as with high ROF weapons.

Got some clarification from a Bioware representative PM ..As he chose a PM and did not post here directly I hesitate to make more of his PM "public" ...

"..So I went ahead and dug deeper into this. ... It looks like you're right, incendiary ammo in particular is stacking in a way with itself that exceeds the expected.
..

The reason you are seeing the larger stacks with warp, as well as the disappearing warp ticks, is because warp and incendiary ammo both use the same damage effect for their DoT, this means that if an enemy is already warped and taking damage, and incendiary is added, the two effects are combined into one, this of course also works the other way (incendiary first then warp, creating one damage effect). Warp is still the 'owner' which is why when this effect kills a target, warp is the 'killing blow'.
...
"

This also means you can get incendiary bugged DOT to affect Barriers (normally incendiary ammo does 0 damage vs barriers) - What you describe above happening with Kishock and incendiary ammo vs Banshee...

See here for another example
incendiary burning barrier because of warp example

So the people calling it normal behavior ...

Modifié par peddroelmz, 14 septembre 2012 - 03:40 .

[jaydubs67]

Very interesting. I wonder what other damage effects use the same DoT? Incinerate? Inferno grenades? Frag? Arc? Concussive shot? Ballistic blades? Pull? Smash?

And what does "using the same damage effect for their DoT" even mean?

In any case, thanks for the info.

[peddroelm]

jaydubs67 wrote...

Very interesting. I wonder what other damage effects use the same DoT? Incinerate? Inferno grenades? Frag? Arc? Concussive shot? Ballistic blades? Pull? Smash?

And what does "using the same damage effect for their DoT" even mean?

In any case, thanks for the info.

I will do some more tests with other DOT effects (should get to test most of them eventually) .. Might do some ROF mechanics first ... 

[Josh.de]

As long as it works how it works now I´ll call it normal.
If anything is wrong with it, then they should change it, otherwise it´s just normal.
Damage from all the UR nerfed weapons is poor anyways (gold/plat), so anything that goes in direction of damage increase is welcome for me.

[peddroelm]

Josh.de wrote...

As long as it works how it works now I´ll call it normal.
If anything is wrong with it, then they should change it, otherwise it´s just normal.
Damage from all the UR nerfed weapons is poor anyways (gold/plat), so anything that goes in direction of damage increase is welcome for me.

Using this logic you can justify missile glitching ...

[Josh.de]

Missile glitching is just plain stupid.

But while it´s BioWare´s problem to remove or change anything that makes anyone able to use it, they punish the people who helped them to actually be able to eat each day!

In the U.S. you can even sell your right to say your own name, so EA and BW might be safe with such behaviour, if they make their step into the EU area robbing people of their bought service, they will feel the hard broadside of the law. Since they have probably some braincells left to burn out by doing stupid things, they wont ban anyone outside of north america for missile glitching.

Imagine you buy a car, then you discover a trick to use half the gas as advertised. The producer of the car (bc of their confinement with the oil lobby) find that out and proclaims in public: anyone exploiting the gas trick will get their car confiscated...

Hellooo?

Modifié par Josh.de, 14 septembre 2012 - 08:32 .

[Learn To Love Yourself]

peddroelmz wrote...

Jack Crapper wrote...

You know, I ran a solo to fiddle around to see how much damage the Kishock did with Warp Ammo IV vs my previous findings with Incendiary.

With Warp Ammo IV: Warp + Charged Kishock will leave a Gold Banshee w/ 4 bars of Barrier.  Incendiary depletes this totally + sometimes even a bar of armor.

Incendiary does seem to complement the Kishock well, but perhaps not as ground-breakingly as with high ROF weapons.

Got some clarification from a Bioware representative PM ..As he chose a PM and did not post here directly I hesitate to make more of his PM "public" ...

"..So I went ahead and dug deeper into this. ... It looks like you're right, incendiary ammo in particular is stacking in a way with itself that exceeds the expected.
..

The reason you are seeing the larger stacks with warp, as well as the disappearing warp ticks, is because warp and incendiary ammo both use the same damage effect for their DoT, this means that if an enemy is already warped and taking damage, and incendiary is added, the two effects are combined into one, this of course also works the other way (incendiary first then warp, creating one damage effect). Warp is still the 'owner' which is why when this effect kills a target, warp is the 'killing blow'.
...
"

This also means you can get incendiary bugged DOT to affect Barriers (normally incendiary ammo does 0 damage vs barriers) - What you describe above happening with Kishock and incendiary ammo vs Banshee...

See here for another example
incendiary burning barrier because of warp example

So the people calling it normal behavior ...

I guess this would also explain the additional damage vs Armor, since Warp is more effective vs both Barriers and Armor.

Thanks for that.  It saddens me that it is a bug, as I hate exploits.  This really makes me want to shelf my Human Sentinel Kishock, Turian Sentinel PPR builds with Incendiary.

This hurts me.

[peddroelm]

Remaining incendiary ammo + other DOT tests

Vorcha soldier 250 * (1 + 0.5 = 375 shield

Power Amplifier Module IV 50% PD
Mental Focuser I 4% PD

Bloodlust Regeneration, 5% WD stack , Movement Speed Bonus
Flamer 200 * (1+0.2+0.4) DPS Range, extra 50% vs armor *1.5 vs
armor // *0.5 shield&barriers
Carnage 350 * (1+0.2)
Passive 27.5% WD ; 10% PD ; 20% WD in case of headshot

Weapon Paladin IV (((531.1 - 424.9) / 9) * (4 - 1)) + 424.9 = 460.3
base damage (25% WD ; extended mag)

incendiary III (0.3% ammo damage )

//////////////////////////////////
//////////////////////////////////
//////////////////////////////////


Paladin IV shot

Damage Received: 674.972656 // 460.3 * (1 + 0.275 + 0.25 + 0.05)) - 50= 674.9725
Damage Received: 23.015137 //
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 23.015137

Had 5% WD damage from blood lust all the time (haven't killed anything
for ages ...)

(460.3 * 0.3) / 6 = 23.015 OK incendiary III dot ticks
////////////////////
/////////////////////
/////////////////////

5 paladin shot

Damage Received: 674.972656 //1
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 674.972656 //2
Damage Received: 84.500000
Damage Received: 84.500000
Damage Received: 674.972656 //3
Damage Received: 136.489746
Damage Received: 674.972656 //4
Damage Received: 178.747559
Damage Received: 674.972656 //5
Damage Received: 210.167480 //last 6 incendiary dot ticks - incendiary
BuG in effect
Damage Received: 210.167480
Damage Received: 210.167480
Damage Received: 210.167480
Damage Received: 210.167480
Damage Received: 210.167480

////////////////////////////
/////////////////////////////
/////////////////////////////

Carnage

Damage Received: 724.500000
Damage Received: 60.375000
Damage Received: 60.375000
Damage Received: 60.375000
Damage Received: 60.375000


/////////////////////////
////////////////////////
/////////////////////////

Carnage + paladin + paladin + paladin

Damage Received: 724.500000 // carnage impact
Damage Received: 674.972656 //paladin
Damage Received: 60.375000 //carnage dot
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 60.375000 //carnage dot
Damage Received: 674.972656
Damage Received: 87.510254
Damage Received: 60.375000 //carnage dot
Damage Received: 674.972656
Damage Received: 138.893066
Damage Received: 60.375000 /carnage dot
Damage Received: 138.893066
Damage Received: 138.893066
Damage Received: 138.893066
Damage Received: 138.893066
Damage Received: 138.893066


No interation between carnage DOT & incendiary dot
/////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////

Flamer vs armor 1 stack



Damage Received: 378.000000
Damage Received: 126.000000
Damage Received: 126.000000
Damage Received: 126.000000
Damage Received: 126.000000
Damage Received: 126.000000
Damage Received: 126.000000
Damage Received: 126.000000
Damage Received: 126.000000
Damage Received: 126.000000
Damage Received: 126.000000

((200 * (1 + 0.2 + 0.1 + 0.4 + 0.5 + 0.04)) / 8) * 1.5 * 1.5 = 126

//////////////////////
///////////////////////
///////////////////////

////////////////////
//////////////////////
//////////////////////

flamer 3 stacks


Damage Received: 378.000000 // 1
Damage Received: 126.000000
Damage Received: 378.000000 // 2
Damage Received: 239.202637
Damage Received: 378.000000
Damage Received: 340.542969
Damage Received: 378.000000 // 3
Damage Received: 431.636230
Damage Received: 431.636230
Damage Received: 431.636230
Damage Received: 431.636230
Damage Received: 431.636230
Damage Received: 431.636230
Damage Received: 431.636230
Damage Received: 431.636230
Damage Received: 431.636230
Damage Received: 431.636230

Flamer DOT stacks with itself (MOST DAMAGE INFLICTED AFTER YOU STOP FIRING IT -5 second DOT) - but not buggy as incendiary ammo does ...

////////////////////
//////////////////////
//////////////////////

flamer + paladin


Damage Received: 378.000000 // 1 flamer
Damage Received: 378.000000 // 2 flamer
Damage Received: 239.621094
Damage Received: 239.621094
Damage Received: 378.000000 //3 flamer
Damage Received: 340.944336
Damage Received: 378.000000 //4 flamer
Damage Received: 432.734863
Damage Received: 674.972656 //1 paladin
Damage Received: 763.272461
Damage Received: 674.972656 //2 paladin
Damage Received: 751.921875
Damage Received: 751.921875 //3 paladin
Damage Received: 674.972656
Damage Received: 757.424316
Damage Received: 757.424316
Damage Received: 757.424316
Damage Received: 757.424316
Damage Received: 757.424316
Damage Received: 757.424316

ONLY 6 DOT TICKS (incendiary ammo) NOT (10 flamer)
INCENDIARY AMMO WILL FEED OF FLAMER DOT TICKS

///////////////////////////
/////////////////////////
////////////////////////

3 FLAMER + Carnage

Damage Received: 378.000000
Damage Received: 378.000000
Damage Received: 239.453613
Damage Received: 239.453613
Damage Received: 378.000000
Damage Received: 340.514160
Damage Received: 340.514160
Damage Received: 340.514160
Damage Received: 724.500000
Damage Received: 340.514160
Damage Received: 60.375000
Damage Received: 340.514160
Damage Received: 60.375000
Damage Received: 340.514160
Damage Received: 60.375000
Damage Received: 340.514160
Damage Received: 60.375000
Damage Received: 340.514160
Damage Received: 340.514160
Damage Received: 340.514160

No interaction between Flamer and Carnage DOTs

/////////////////////
////////////////////
////////////////////

warp + 4 flamer

Damage Received: 478.125000
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 378.000000
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 378.000000
Damage Received: 239.669922
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 239.669922
Damage Received: 378.000000
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 340.975586
Damage Received: 378.000000
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 432.340332
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 432.340332
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 432.340332
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 432.340332
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 432.340332
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 432.340332
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 432.340332
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 432.340332
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 432.340332
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 432.340332
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 9.164063
Damage Received: 9.164063

No interraction

/////////////////////////
/////////////////////////

warp + 5 flamer + 3 * paladin incendiary ammo

Damage Received: 478.125000 //warp impact
Damage Received: 9.164063 //1 normal warp dot
Damage Received: 9.164063 //2
Damage Received: 9.164063 //3
Damage Received: 9.164063//4
Damage Received: 9.164063 //5
Damage Received: 378.000000 //1 flamer impact
Damage Received: 9.164063 //6
Damage Received: 378.000000 //2 flamer
Damage Received: 239.806641 //flamer dot
Damage Received: 9.164063 //7
Damage Received: 378.000000 //3 flamer
Damage Received: 341.236328 //flamer dot
Damage Received: 9.164063 //8
Damage Received: 341.236328 //flamer dot
Damage Received: 378.000000 //4 flamer
Damage Received: 9.164063 //9
Damage Received: 431.708496 //flamer dot
Damage Received: 378.000000 //5 flamer
Damage Received: 796.218262 // 1 st paladin incendiary
Damage Received: 134.484863
Damage Received: 513.848145 // 10 FLAMER DOT TICKS
Damage Received: 134.484863
Damage Received: 513.848145
Damage Received: 796.218262 // second paladin incendiary
Damage Received: 217.000977
Damage Received: 513.848145
Damage Received: 796.218262 // third paladin incediary
Damage Received: 289.946289 //// 6 incediary dot ticks
Damage Received: 513.848145
Damage Received: 289.946289
Damage Received: 513.848145
Damage Received: 289.946289
Damage Received: 513.848145
Damage Received: 289.946289
Damage Received: 513.848145
Damage Received: 289.946289
Damage Received: 513.848145
Damage Received: 289.946289 // 6 incediary dot ticks
Damage Received: 513.848145
Damage Received: 513.848145


In this case incendiary fed of warp DOT and left flamer do its thing

////////////////////////
///////////////////////
///////////////////////

Bartarian ballistic explosive blades

Damage Received: 804.214844
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195

Damage Received: 850.577148
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195

Damage Received: 947.715820
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 12.825195

Impact damage varies with range to target .. DOT is same ...
No secondary explosion vs armored targets ? Ravager


////////////////////////////
//////////////////////////
//////////////////////////

BB + Paladin (incendiary)

Damage Received: 948.565918
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 674.972656
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 12.825195
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 23.015137

no interaction

/////////////////////////
/////////////////////////

inferno grenade

Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125


///////////////////////////
///////////////////////////


Inferno + paladin (incedniary)

Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 674.972656 // pladin HIT
Damage Received: 737.596680 // 6 incendiary dot ticks
Damage Received: 737.596680
Damage Received: 737.596680
Damage Received: 737.596680
Damage Received: 737.596680
Damage Received: 737.596680

REMAINING Inferno grenade DOT (3585.9375 damage over 6 seconds) replaced by the 6 incendiary DOT ticks 737.59668 * 6 = 4425.58008 with 3 second duration ...

bonus damage = 4 425.58008 - (3 585.9375 + (460.3 * 0.3)) = 701.55258 EXTRA BUGGY DAMAGE and applied more rapidly

////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////


///////////////////////////////
//////////////////////////////

inferno + inferno + paladin

Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 674.972656 // paladin hit
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 575.535645
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 575.535645
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 575.535645
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 575.535645
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 575.535645
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 575.535645
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125
Damage Received: 298.828125

Incediary bugg affected only one of the inferno grenades ... One of them applied all DOT ticks for duration ...

////////////////////
///////////////////


/////////////////////////
/////////////////////////
Incinerate with extra DOT evolution - runs 2 DOTs in paralel

Damage Received: 1085.906250 // incinerate impact damage vs armor
Damage Received: 60.328125 // normal incinerate DOT tick (3 second duration)
Damage Received: 45.246094 // this is the secondary DOT (8 second duration)
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094

//////////////////
//////////////////
///////////////////

incinerate + incinerate


Damage Received: 1085.906250 // first incinerate impact
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 1085.906250 //second incinerate impact
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094

No interraction

//////////////////////////////
///////////////////////////////


incinerate + 1 paladin

Damage Received: 1085.906250
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 674.972656
Damage Received: 188.027832
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 188.027832
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 188.027832
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 188.027832
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 188.027832
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 188.027832
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094

no interaction

///////////////////////
//////////////////////

incinerate +flamer

Damage Received: 1085.906250
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 378.000000
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 378.000000
Damage Received: 239.564453
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 239.564453
Damage Received: 60.328125
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 239.564453
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 239.564453
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 239.564453
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 239.564453
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 239.564453
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 239.564453
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 239.564453
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 239.564453
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094
Damage Received: 45.246094

No interaction

////////////////////

dot arc grenade

Damage Received: 780.000000
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098

////////////////
2 arcs

Damage Received: 780.000000
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 780.000000
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098

no interraction

////////////////////
//////////////////////


arc + incediary

Damage Received: 780.000000
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 674.972656
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098
Damage Received: 15.600098

NO interation

////////////////////////////////
/////////////////////////////////

ShadowStrike

Damage Received: 1875.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000

////////////////////

ShadowStrike + incendiary

Damage Received: 1875.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 674.972656
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 75.000000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 75.000000


No interraction
///////////////////////////


Smash Electical Dot
Damage Received: 1691.250000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000

/////////////////////
///////////////////


Smash + incendiary

Damage Received: 1691.250000
Damage Received: 674.972656
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000

No interaction

///////////////////////

lash

Damage Received: 225.000000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000

/////////////////

lash + incendiary

Damage Received: 225.000000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 674.972656
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 23.015137
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000
Damage Received: 11.250000

No interraction

/////////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////////

lash + smash dot

Damage Received: 247.500000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 1691.250000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 12.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000
Damage Received: 56.375000

no interaction

Modifié par peddroelmz, 18 septembre 2012 - 03:59 .

[Koenig888]

Thanks for all the hard work. You should be getting paid for this!

[peddroelm]

OP updated with PM from Bioware dev Chris Schanche and link to last battery of tests ...

[slayer36live]

So how do you spec your warp to get the most out of this "bug."

[peddroelm]

slayer36live wrote...

So how do you spec your warp to get the most out of this "bug."

Don't think it makes a difference ...its not caused nor enhanced by any particular warp evolution .. Detonate , Expose ,Pierce ... (synonymous to warp )

Modifié par peddroelmz, 18 septembre 2012 - 03:25 .

[megabeast37215]

Pedro: I love the data you bring to the table... it's super thorough and I really appreciate it.

But seriously man... you gotta do something about the presentation of your data... it is REALLY REALLY hard to read/navigate sometimes. Perhaps breaking it up into multiple posts would help. It would be ashame for less people to be able to apply the knowledge from the data due to tl/dr attitudes.

[RGFrog]

peddroelmz wrote...

Josh.de wrote...

As long as it works how it works now I´ll call it normal.
If anything is wrong with it, then they should change it, otherwise it´s just normal.
Damage from all the UR nerfed weapons is poor anyways (gold/plat), so anything that goes in direction of damage increase is welcome for me.

Using this logic you can justify missile glitching ...

Pedro, that is a blatantly incorrect statement. There are game breaking issues, missile glitching is one of them. The existence of one does not define the other.

Comparing this with missile glitching is like comparing a hand grenade to a hydrogen bomb. They both explode but are not even in the same class. 

Warp+Incendiary is not a game breaking issue. There are far more worse bugs that are not even being addressed nor will they ever be addressed. EA is about profit, not customer support after the sale.

[BjornDaDwarf]

megabeast37215 wrote...

Pedro: I love the data you bring to the table... it's super thorough and I really appreciate it.

But seriously man... you gotta do something about the presentation of your data... it is REALLY REALLY hard to read/navigate sometimes. Perhaps breaking it up into multiple posts would help. It would be ashame for less people to be able to apply the knowledge from the data due to tl/dr attitudes.

I don't know, I felt that after seeing a few of his posts, I grokked the format of them and can understand the mechanics he's describing.  And his summaries cover the important parts, the numbers are there for people who want to see it in action. 

[BongMong]

Ruddy hell, a new exploit for the cheaters. So now we have to kick all warp power classes who equip incendiary ammo for fear of a ban for benefiting from playing in a game with cheaters?

This ban wave dodging is getting hard to follow. How many more exploits are just waiting to trigger an unexpected ban? It's almost worth swearing off MP until BW confirm it's safe to play without risking a ban on one's account.

[neteng101]

I think its hardly an exploit and far more of a bug... no wonder Incendiary ammo feels like it does nothing to me... cause I wait to wipe out a target before moving on, in which case I'm actually LOSING out on what its supposed to do ie. its DOT.

It seems to be the ammo is doing its intended job, but has been programmed to work in a very sloppy manner. Rather than evenly distributing the DOT they chose to stack it in weird ways because its simpler than having each bullet/round fired have its own decay (DOT) calculations.

I doubt this will ever get fixed, because applying DOT correctly would take a lot of state tracking/calculations so this weird formula they used provides the pseudo DOT instead.

[peddroelm]

neteng101 wrote...

I think its hardly an exploit and far more of a bug... no wonder Incendiary ammo feels like it does nothing to me... cause I wait to wipe out a target before moving on, in which case I'm actually LOSING out on what its supposed to do ie. its DOT.

It seems to be the ammo is doing its intended job, but has been programmed to work in a very sloppy manner. Rather than evenly distributing the DOT they chose to stack it in weird ways because its simpler than having each bullet/round fired have its own decay (DOT) calculations.

I doubt this will ever get fixed, because applying DOT correctly would take a lot of state tracking/calculations so this weird formula they used provides the pseudo DOT instead.

 

They used similar mechanics for flamer - and it works much better for the flamer... So they might also fix incendiary ammo ...

[RGFrog]

Based on what you reported from the dev PM, it's the exact same mechanic for the warp DOT. They can't fix one without breaking the other.

Each DOT would have to have it's own mechanic which would require a patch.

The only thing they can do is mess with the server side coalesced settings which means a severe nerf to either ammo or warp. Neither of which is welcome or necessary.

The only gamers that know about this bug are the 1% that have posted in this thread.

I would bet and expect to win that 99% of players don't even know that you have to stop shooting a target for the Inc. Ammo DOT to even kick in. Most only stop shooting once the target is dead.

IMO, it's a non-issue.

[Xaijin]

Josh.de wrote...

Why should it be a bug?
It´s intendended to work stacked that way, I see no bug here.
Anyone should feel free to use this tactic, nothing new to my btw, always used incendiary ammo like you described Pedro, shoot, shoot other target, shoot again 1st target (if not dead already)....and so on, sure all this will be multiplied by the damage reduction warp gives, also no wonder here :-D

It's a bug because rapid fire weapons get almost no BENEFIT unless you switch targets and stop application, which pretty much defeats the point of having it on a rapid fire weapon in the first place.

[peddroelm]

Xaijin wrote...

It's a bug because rapid fire weapons get almost no BENEFIT unless you switch targets and stop application, which pretty much defeats the point of having it on a rapid fire weapon in the first place.

The stacking mechanics are clearly intended ... I don't have a problem with incendiary ammo causing a different gameplay for big clip rapid fire auto weapons ...

[Xaijin]

Yeah but the problem is, you're not getting the reward based on your extended risk unless you stop firing.

The metaproblem is this. It further ****s with ARs and other rap weapons, more FULLY benefits ....


wait for it:



Shotguns.


again.

Using a claymore or nonDR shotgun is obviously the way to go to best synergize damage, again.

The stacking SHOULD occur, but it should start in gradation immediately, and volume of fire should be a benefit, not a potential hindrance.

[Hurkaleez]

Josh.de wrote...

Missile glitching is just plain stupid.

But while it´s BioWare´s problem to remove or change anything that makes anyone able to use it, they punish the people who helped them to actually be able to eat each day!

In the U.S. you can even sell your right to say your own name, so EA and BW might be safe with such behaviour, if they make their step into the EU area robbing people of their bought service, they will feel the hard broadside of the law. Since they have probably some braincells left to burn out by doing stupid things, they wont ban anyone outside of north america for missile glitching.

Imagine you buy a car, then you discover a trick to use half the gas as advertised. The producer of the car (bc of their confinement with the oil lobby) find that out and proclaims in public: anyone exploiting the gas trick will get their car confiscated...

Hellooo?

Let me get this straight:

• You buy a right to play their game.
• You agree (called a contract) to not grossly violate their EULA(which missile glitching does) specifically in ways that destroy the gameplay for their other customers.
• They have a right and obligation to protect me from missile glitchers and other hackers like yourself so they ban you.Now you pose a threat that people should and have the right to sue?

I am sorry to break it to European and US players who are complaining whose mothers tell them they were unique and special flowers that can do what they want when they want and if anybody gets in their way, whine and scream then threaten to sue BUT you will get laughed out of a court of law for various reasons.

Modifié par Corgun, 19 septembre 2012 - 05:52 .