327 réponses à ce sujet

[Epique Phael767]

Blueprotoss wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

You're not doing anything 'easily', you're just posting a heap of ambiguous sh*t that makes no sense because it has no context or any sort of reasoning. 

You have no argument. 

Putting up blinders won't help you and a simple read whole the ME1 artbook or the web docs on ME1 can easily prove you wrong.  Denial will only get you so far.

If you have to read things outside of the game, then the writers truly are untalented.

[The Night Mammoth]

Blueprotoss wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

You're not doing anything 'easily', you're just posting a heap of ambiguous sh*t that makes no sense because it has no context or any sort of reasoning. 

You have no argument. 

Putting up blinders won't help you and a simple read whole the ME1 artbook or the web docs on ME1 can easily prove you wrong. Denial will only get you so far.

Ha. 

You don't actually have an argument. 

You lose, compadre.

[Sable Rhapsody]

magnetite wrote...
I did a full complete playthrough of all 3 games over the course of about 3 weeks. Read every codex entry, video log, etc. The ending isn't as rushed as people are making it out to be.

I did the same, and everything did feel more cohesive.  But you shouldn't have to delve into the supplementary material just to have the ending make a bit more sense.  You don't hand the audience a codex going into a film because you shouldn't have to; it should stand on its own, with supplementary material as extras.  

DA:O had novels worth of codex entries, but I didn't have to go through each and every one of those hunting for clues about the plot.  Baldur's Gate introduced new players to the Forgotten Realms without shipping a stack of D&D sourcebookswith each disc.  If I have to comb the ME supplementary material for plot elements, it means there was a narrative, but it was poorly told.

Modifié par Sable Rhapsody, 09 septembre 2012 - 09:52 .

[SpamBot2000]

Yes, they invented Retroactive Foreshadowing ™. They hope this practical and flexible tool will be available for licensing to hacks and scamsters everywhere by the end of the fiscal year (March 2013, in case you forgot).

Modifié par SpamBot2000, 09 septembre 2012 - 09:53 .

[darkway1]

The Mass3 original ending demonstrates clearly that it wasn't finished,it was rushed,slapped together and poorly explained........without major speculation no one really knew what the hell was going on at the end............DLC is a perfect way to patch and fix,at the fans expense..

[blacqout]

LucasShark wrote...

Is Bioware really going to try and retroactively add foreshadowing for the insanity of the ending?

This will NOT work, it is the writing equivillent of cheating honestly.  Explanations and foreshadowing are what should have been in here in the first place!  This is like releasing an expansion pack to a book which didn't feature any foreshadowing or explanation of events.

I say this because of both the EC and the Leviathan DLCs, the first which made a scitzophrenic ending slightly less awful, and the second which retroactively tried to explain the mess of circular logic the Catalyst spouted.

I don't want this, focussing on the worst aspect of this story will mire everything, all it will do is produce more garbage, see the introduction of psychic space demi-gods which ruin the destroy ending.

The ending was already forshadowed by Javik and the Prothean computer on Thessia. Javik's conversation about the Metacon war was supposed to make it clear that synthetic/organic conflict happened in the previous cycle and is inevitable. 

The Prothean computer mentions that the same patterns occur in each cycle: the same peaks of evolution, the same conflicts. It even hypothesises that something is controlling the cycles.

BioWare just didn't do a good enough job of it originally, and many people missed this. I think Leviathan did a good job of retroactively foreshadowing the ending, for those that didn't understand the base content.

Modifié par blacqout, 09 septembre 2012 - 09:57 .

[nategator]

I remember when the endings were first presented, a big criticism was that to buy Synthesis or Control you had to end up believing the star child when everything in the game suggested that synthetics and organics could live peaceably.

So Leviathan is a way for Bioware to say, yes, you were supposed to take star child at his word when he said in general, organic and synthetic conflict is inevitable. There may be exceptions, and maybe even another way, but generally the status quo is a Battlestar-esque cycle of violence. Leviathan provides the details of why an organic race would have developed anything capable of creating the reapers.

[clarkusdarkus]

Dlc to explain foreshadowing isn't really a good thing, as basically your paying for little tidbits of information which you should already know after playing/buying a trilogy.

The EC covered some cracks of which was acceptable, Leviathan was good untill actually speaking with him.

[Sable Rhapsody]

clarkusdarkus wrote...

Dlc to explain foreshadowing isn't really a good thing, as basically your paying for little tidbits of information which you should already know after playing/buying a trilogy.

This.  Retroactive foreshadowing basically says, "Oops, that made no sense.  Here's a whole bunch of stuff you were supposed to know."  That being said, I do think Leviathan is a decent piece of DLC, and I appreciate that it at least tries to make sense of the in-game ending.  

[Dav3VsTh3World]

LucasShark wrote...

David7204 wrote...

So tell me. How exactly does Leviathan 'ruin' the Destroy ending?

Tell me: what is going to happen in the destroy ending where the only restraining element on a race of psychic space beings who lust to be worshipped has been removed?

Simple:
Mass Effect 4

[Kataphrut94]

Well, if they don't make DLCs that affect the ending, people would complain. I'm more annoyed that people make such a big deal about controlling the Reapers in Sanctuary and how impossible that should be when you've already seen Leviathan do it by that point.

[T-Raks]

LucasShark wrote...

David7204 wrote...

So tell me. How exactly does Leviathan 'ruin' the Destroy ending?

Tell me: what is going to happen in the destroy ending where the only restraining element on a race of psychic space beings who lust to be worshipped has been removed?

Mass Effect 4. The Leviathans are the new antagonist.

I actually like that. Shepard is only one person, he/she shouldn't be able to solve the galaxies problems forever (he/she can't if we want to have a sequel). Also: don't you want to fight the ones, that created the mess in the first place?

Though I also would like a sequel fighting a crazy humanoid trying to shift the power in the galaxy. Maybe that's the case in Mass Effect 5 - the sequel to the control ending... 

[Blueprotoss]

Epique Phael767 wrote...

Blueprotoss wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

You're not doing anything 'easily', you're just posting a heap of ambiguous sh*t that makes no sense because it has no context or any sort of reasoning. 

You have no argument. 

Putting up blinders won't help you and a simple read whole the ME1 artbook or the web docs on ME1 can easily prove you wrong.  Denial will only get you so far.

If you have to read things outside of the game, then the writers truly are untalented.

Its not that hard to look through an artbook or watch a couple videos.

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Ha. 

You don't actually have an argument. 

You lose, compadre.

How is that when the Geth were originally a race of bat-monkeys based on their concept while they were purposely turned into a robotic race later one.  Its like saying that Godzilla wasn't created by radiation. 

Modifié par Blueprotoss, 09 septembre 2012 - 11:21 .

[Blueprotoss]

 

darkway1 wrote...

The Mass3 original ending demonstrates clearly that it wasn't finished,it was rushed,slapped together and poorly explained........without major speculation no one really knew what the hell was going on at the end............DLC is a perfect way to patch and fix,at the fans expense..

ME3 wasn't rushed while you would have a better chance with ME2 based on how ME3 was done alongside ME2's development and production.  There was always going to be a small group of people that wouldn't have been pleased with ME3 just like any other game, movie, tv show, novel, comic, or song.  You can't please everyone no matter what happens. 

nategator wrote...

I remember when the endings were first presented, a big criticism was that to buy Synthesis or Control you had to end up believing the star child when everything in the game suggested that synthetics and organics could live peaceably.

So Leviathan is a way for Bioware to say, yes, you were supposed to take star child at his word when he said in general, organic and synthetic conflict is inevitable. There may be exceptions, and maybe even another way, but generally the status quo is a Battlestar-esque cycle of violence. Leviathan provides the details of why an organic race would have developed anything capable of creating the reapers.

Actually there wasn't that much of an uproar even when Control and Synthesis were themes shown throughout the trilogy just like Destroy was.  It isn't surprising that a synthetic race had a creator. 

FemaleMageFan wrote...

I love the way people don't know how long software processes take.

There would be a lot more respect if more people knew about that.

Modifié par Blueprotoss, 09 septembre 2012 - 11:29 .

[Applepie_Svk]

D24O wrote...

Buy DLC.

 

Sion1138 wrote...

Yes they are. 

It's a new technique, called aftershadowing.

 

I call it ****ing to own mouth...

Blueprotoss wrote...

 

darkway1 wrote...

The Mass3 original ending demonstrates clearly that it wasn't finished,it was rushed,slapped together and poorly explained........without major speculation no one really knew what the hell was going on at the end............DLC is a perfect way to patch and fix,at the fans expense..

ME3 wasn't rushed while you would have a better chance with ME2 based on how ME3 was done alongside ME2's development and production.  There was always going to be a small group of people that wouldn't have been pleased with ME3 just like any other game, movie, tv show, novel, comic, or song.  You can't please everyone no matter what happens. 

 


Haha you are funny aren´t you ? There is lot of things which was simple cut out or poorly done since the little ones like Emily Wong for bigger issues like Morinh´s fate or Tali´s face if that´s not mark of half-assed product than I don´t know what else you want.
Not mentioned that 2 dlcs which they released - EC and Leviathan are trying to fix that mess and with each new attempt they are falling deeper and deeper into own mess.

If you are telling me that those are just a little mistakes than ME3 is filled with those kind of "little mistakes" almost on each step, that´s more like a deffinition of rushed work than good preparation.

As a cherry on the pie is indoctrination theory, their writing of ending was so unfinished and filled with plotholes that fans developed actually something which fit into lore more than glow boy with his dinner menu and to be honest it´s far better than what we have recieved, despite that developers saying that it wasn´t planned at all there is too much coincidences to believe otherswise - simply said if it´s true that wasn´t intendet they have accidentaly created something better than own art despite that their own art denying previous 2 games.

Modifié par Applepie_Svk, 09 septembre 2012 - 12:16 .

[AlexMBrennan]

Is Bioware really going to try and retroactively add foreshadowing for the insanity of the ending?

Well, how else are you gonna fix the ending without changing it?

[Applepie_Svk]

AlexMBrennan wrote...

Is Bioware really going to try and retroactively add foreshadowing for the insanity of the ending?

Well, how else are you gonna fix the ending without changing it?

They won´t fix the endings, they will try to explain that goulash which they did there via paid DLCs in blind hope that all fans will shut up about it...

[Blueprotoss]

Applepie_Svk wrote... 

Haha you are funny aren´t you ? There is lot of things which was simple cut out or poorly done since the little ones like Emily Wong for bigger issues like Morinh´s fate or Tali´s face if that´s not mark of half-assed product than I don´t know what else you want.

This is semantical because Emily Wong was handled the same throghout the  trilogy, everyone has their own version ofwhat a Quarian looks without a suit, and its not a surprise that Morinth was turned into a banshee.  Its easy to say that Bioware was rushed  when its a matter of opinion.

Applepie_Svk wrote... 

Not mentioned that 2 dlcs which they released - EC and Leviathan are trying to fix that mess and with each new attempt they are falling deeper and deeper into own mess.

Thats a straw-mann especially when the EC weren't new endings like some people wanted and Leviathan isn't ending DLC.

Applepie_Svk wrote... 

If you are telling me that those are just a little mistakes than ME3 is filled with those kind of "little mistakes" almost on each step, that´s more like a deffinition of rushed work than good preparation.

Nothing is perfect and everything isn't rushed when "little mistakes" are made.

Applepie_Svk wrote... 

As a cherry on the pie is indoctrination theory, their writing of ending was so unfinished and filled with plotholes that fans developed actually something which fit into lore more than glow boy with his dinner menu and to be honest it´s far better than what we have recieved, despite that developers saying that it wasn´t planned at all there is too much coincidences to believe otherswise - simply said if it´s true that wasn´t intendet they have accidentaly created something better than own art despite that their own art denying previous 2 games.

Yet you assume that ME3 was unfinished even when DLC is one of the driving forces in the series.  Either way you can't please everyone even when Bioware owns the rights to ME and created every game in the franchise.

Applepie_Svk wrote...

They won´t fix the endings, they will try to explain that goulash which they did there via paid DLCs in blind hope that all fans will shut up about it...

Its up to Bioware not you and the endings don't need to be fixed because they are fine.  You're better off leaving since your demands have no backing.

Modifié par Blueprotoss, 09 septembre 2012 - 01:24 .

[MetioricTest]

Blueprotoss wrote...
Its up to Bioware not you and the endings don't need to be fixed because they are fine.  .

[Fixers0]

Blueprotoss wrote...
Its up to Bioware not you and the endings don't need to be fixed because they are fine.  You're better off leaving since your demands have no backing.

Is bad writing fine now?

[The Angry One]

Hey protoss, if the endings are fine, why are BioWare still trying to fix them?

Of course they're trying to fix the symptoms and not the cause and refusing to admit what the real problem is, but they are doing it. They clearly aren't confident in them, are they?

[hoodaticus]

D24O wrote...

Buy DLC.

They changed that message box.  It now thanks this community for its ideas and input.