lol. you all should see my brother's replica of Frostmourne. full size and all. from what i remeber, he made it for blizz con, but didn't get the time to go. and as for the swing speed, two-handers are actually lighter than they look. Frostmourne may have a long blade, but otherwise, swinging is slice and dice. it's pretty easy to leap up and strike down with, as the greatsword is meant to do. it's the battle axe that drives me nuts though. you can't just swing it like a greatsword, from what my brother tells me. greatswords looked fine in DA2. it's the battle axe that needs to change in my eyes. and i have never known ANYONE to just lift a battle axe with one hand like its a peice of paper. For our sakes, please just change the battle axe fighting. and if possible... could you guys try to make a companion that was like Justice and Sigrun? I kind of liked Justice in Awakening. Maybe you guys could even throw in Necromancer class.
Bioware asking fans what to put into Dragon Age 3
Débuté par
mademan2
, sept. 10 2012 12:47
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#102
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 06:11
Mick B
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Dragon Age II did NOT live up to its birthright. There are many reasons why players give it such a low score (4.2 user score currently at Metacritic).
I was about a quarter of the way through my 2nd playthrough (4th or 5th attempt to get back into the game since beating it), and I just put it down again. Replayability just isn't there the way it is in DAO.
Below is a list of improvements to be in DA3, followed by a more detailed list.This list is in no particular order, as each point is as important as the last.
TL;DR:
1- Return the race selection again at character creation: Let me be whoever/whatever I want
2- Add more detailed NPC dialogue - more NPCs to talk WITH instead of "hear from"
3- Synergize combat between DAO and DAII - No more spawn-ins, more strategy
4- Improve character roster, think outside the box - Make characters worth caring about
5- Character sexual orientation - It's the differences that make us special; let some characters be gay, some be bi, some be straight. In reality, we come in all different shapes and sizes.
6- Equipment - let me equip armour on my companions!
7- "Inside the box" world map - Give me a reason to come back to key areas, and leave them on the map whether or not I still have quests there
8- Re-used environments - let "cave" become "caves"!
9- Music could be improved to match the quality of music in DA:O
10- Visuals: drop the cartoony visuals and return to more sinister root of series
11- Return to the overlying tone of DAO: Pressure me with more enchanting reasons to care about my character and the worldly state of affairs, like impending doom or the potential end of the world as we know it.
Detail Below:
1- Allow the race selection again at character creation: Let me be me:
This adds to replay value. I played DAO several times because on each playthrough, there are subtle quest differences and nuances to the game. Not just in the origin stories, but where each character combination (race/class) adds subquests and dialogue nuances.
Another important thing to note is that the more customizable character creation is, the more the player feels immersed and motivated to see his/her character succeed. In DAII, there were six choices aside from the look: Male/Female Mage/Warrior/Thief.
2- Add more detailed NPC dialogue:
This was also a concern in the Mass Effect series. When a non-quest NPC is spoken to, they deliver a sentence or two, but without interaction. This hurts immersion, as when you put yourself in your character's shoes, you feel as though many of the NPCs are speaking "AT" you, as opposed to "WITH" you. It cheapens the gameplay to disallow conversation.
3- Synergize combat between DAO and DAII:
The combat in DAII was faster-paced, and the animations and design of the skills were great. Issue here is that with randomly spawning enemies, combat begins to drag on and feel like a chore. DAO's combat was slow, but there were far many more abilities and skills to choose from, combinations of spells to increase combat effectiveness, and well-balanced character specs.
4- Improve character roster, think outside the box:
While the Dragon Age franchise is no Baldur's Gate, it would only help to have more psychological diversity among the main characters. In DAO, there were 10 companions, and in DAII there are 9.
Anders was a weak character to begin with, carried over from Awakening.
Bethany and Carver both came off as whiny brats.
Merrill is ditzy and flaky with a very weak personality.
Aveline was quite likely my favourite character, for being strong and opinionated. More than any of the other characters, she felt as though she "belonged" in the game. That said, she was a boring character.
Varric is the only other character of whom I actually like in DAII. He loses points for agreeing with most everything Hawke says. Even when he would disagree, his argument is automatically nullified by any response from Hawke.
Fenris, Isabela and Sebastian may as well not have been in the game. Their dry dialogue and weak links to the main plot made it very difficult to care about them.
I think that more time could have been spent in the development of the characters, especially when explaining their backgrounds. This is a key point for Dragon Age 3.
5- Character sexual orientation:
As great as it is to cater to all gamers regardless of sexual preference, DAII was a little too bi. I found that the orientation of many of the characters should have been fixed. In life there are gay people, straight people, bi people, etc. At many points during the inter-character dialogue, male companions would flirt with me. It's great to have different orientations in game, and it would be all the greater if the potential love interest "got the hint" on the first flirt attempt, if turned down. I would expect that bi and gay/lesbian gamers would say the same thing about regularly being hit on by a character of the opposite sex in game. Another way to cater to all walks of life would be to initiate love interest options ONLY through protagonist dialogue choices, and have no characters hit on you beyond being friendly.
6- Equipment:
In DAII, when the only character who can wear armour is Hawke, 2/3 of armour drops (and in some cases, weapon drops) get sold off. This system in DAII was limiting to say the least - disallowing the option to customize and choose companion armour. DA3 would benefit from allowing the freedom to choose all armour for party members.
7- "Inside the box" world map
In DAII, after completing quests in an area, the area disappears from the map. At the onset of each new chapter in the game, an old area would become unplayable until more quests were given. This has the world feeling really small when all side quests are completed.
8- Re-used environments:
Isn't much to say here that Bioware is not already aware of. In DAII, caves were re-used to the point where even the minimap displayed a full cave, even when one half of it was inaccessible. This was sloppy and unacceptable. Bioware game level design has always been great in the past, so hopefully this will be corrected in the next game.
9- Music
Am I alone in asserting that DA:O's music was better? I can clearly recall memorable DA:O music such as the haunting orchestral melody at the Dalish Camp in the Brecilian Forest. DAII's music was not memorable at all.
10- Visuals
The redesign of fundamental visual elements of DA:O were poorly implemented in DAII. Everything felt too cartoony. And, why redesign elements such as the Darkspawn, or Qunari? The Darkspawn in DA:O were more frightening-looking, which again led to greater immersion than DAII.
11- Return to the overlying tone of DAO:
DAII is faulted for having lackluster story progression in a number of reviews. Far be it for me to claim "Entitlement", but DAII falls
so far short of DAO in the story department that it warrants
attention. It is reasonable to expect at least flat plot development,
if not growth. The plot in DAII felt stale, with most of the main
quests feeling like side quests from DAO. The tone of the game was
overall much more light-hearted and dozy. Since there was no impending
certain doom as in DAO, I felt as though the decisions that I made in
game held little weight, and that the world would have progressed down
the exact same path had my character not existed.
Finally, I would like to make the comment to Bioware that Dragon Age is not Mass Effect. Mass Effect worked handsomely with Shepard as he was a strong, solid protagonist who fit his role well. The same cannot be said for Hawke. The fundamental difference between Mass Effect and Dragon Age is that Mass Effect was a science fiction story, whose elements were slightly tweakable, but followed a generic protagonist through his perspective. No doubt, you could customize Shepard to be "your" Shepard. Dragon Age, on the other hand, is fantasy, and originally intended as an RPG. This means playing the story with YOUR custom-created character.
DAO was quoted to be the "spiritual successor to Baldur's Gate 2". If this is the case, in Dragon Age 3 allow for more customation, strengthen that feeling of immersion, and open the game world up more. Following common RPG archetypes that have worked well in the past (DAO, Baldur's Gate series, Jade Empire) will keep the fans loyal and happy with the final product. Broadening the target market for DAII alienated its core fanbase, which will result in lower sales for Dragon Age 3.
I regret buying DAII. After DA:O, I expected that at the very least, DAII would live up to its former. The PC gaming market felt the same, given the increased launch sales of DAII, in anticipation of something as good as DA:O. Embittered, the sales for DA3 will likely be less than DAII on launch, based upon the caution of its core fanbase.
Bioware people, if you read all that and you have any questions, please feel free to message me to chat about it. After DA:O, I'm pretty passionate about the series, despite the nature of the 2nd game.
Cheers!
I was about a quarter of the way through my 2nd playthrough (4th or 5th attempt to get back into the game since beating it), and I just put it down again. Replayability just isn't there the way it is in DAO.
Below is a list of improvements to be in DA3, followed by a more detailed list.This list is in no particular order, as each point is as important as the last.
TL;DR:
1- Return the race selection again at character creation: Let me be whoever/whatever I want
2- Add more detailed NPC dialogue - more NPCs to talk WITH instead of "hear from"
3- Synergize combat between DAO and DAII - No more spawn-ins, more strategy
4- Improve character roster, think outside the box - Make characters worth caring about
5- Character sexual orientation - It's the differences that make us special; let some characters be gay, some be bi, some be straight. In reality, we come in all different shapes and sizes.
6- Equipment - let me equip armour on my companions!
7- "Inside the box" world map - Give me a reason to come back to key areas, and leave them on the map whether or not I still have quests there
8- Re-used environments - let "cave" become "caves"!
9- Music could be improved to match the quality of music in DA:O
10- Visuals: drop the cartoony visuals and return to more sinister root of series
11- Return to the overlying tone of DAO: Pressure me with more enchanting reasons to care about my character and the worldly state of affairs, like impending doom or the potential end of the world as we know it.
Detail Below:
1- Allow the race selection again at character creation: Let me be me:
This adds to replay value. I played DAO several times because on each playthrough, there are subtle quest differences and nuances to the game. Not just in the origin stories, but where each character combination (race/class) adds subquests and dialogue nuances.
Another important thing to note is that the more customizable character creation is, the more the player feels immersed and motivated to see his/her character succeed. In DAII, there were six choices aside from the look: Male/Female Mage/Warrior/Thief.
2- Add more detailed NPC dialogue:
This was also a concern in the Mass Effect series. When a non-quest NPC is spoken to, they deliver a sentence or two, but without interaction. This hurts immersion, as when you put yourself in your character's shoes, you feel as though many of the NPCs are speaking "AT" you, as opposed to "WITH" you. It cheapens the gameplay to disallow conversation.
3- Synergize combat between DAO and DAII:
The combat in DAII was faster-paced, and the animations and design of the skills were great. Issue here is that with randomly spawning enemies, combat begins to drag on and feel like a chore. DAO's combat was slow, but there were far many more abilities and skills to choose from, combinations of spells to increase combat effectiveness, and well-balanced character specs.
4- Improve character roster, think outside the box:
While the Dragon Age franchise is no Baldur's Gate, it would only help to have more psychological diversity among the main characters. In DAO, there were 10 companions, and in DAII there are 9.
Anders was a weak character to begin with, carried over from Awakening.
Bethany and Carver both came off as whiny brats.
Merrill is ditzy and flaky with a very weak personality.
Aveline was quite likely my favourite character, for being strong and opinionated. More than any of the other characters, she felt as though she "belonged" in the game. That said, she was a boring character.
Varric is the only other character of whom I actually like in DAII. He loses points for agreeing with most everything Hawke says. Even when he would disagree, his argument is automatically nullified by any response from Hawke.
Fenris, Isabela and Sebastian may as well not have been in the game. Their dry dialogue and weak links to the main plot made it very difficult to care about them.
I think that more time could have been spent in the development of the characters, especially when explaining their backgrounds. This is a key point for Dragon Age 3.
5- Character sexual orientation:
As great as it is to cater to all gamers regardless of sexual preference, DAII was a little too bi. I found that the orientation of many of the characters should have been fixed. In life there are gay people, straight people, bi people, etc. At many points during the inter-character dialogue, male companions would flirt with me. It's great to have different orientations in game, and it would be all the greater if the potential love interest "got the hint" on the first flirt attempt, if turned down. I would expect that bi and gay/lesbian gamers would say the same thing about regularly being hit on by a character of the opposite sex in game. Another way to cater to all walks of life would be to initiate love interest options ONLY through protagonist dialogue choices, and have no characters hit on you beyond being friendly.
6- Equipment:
In DAII, when the only character who can wear armour is Hawke, 2/3 of armour drops (and in some cases, weapon drops) get sold off. This system in DAII was limiting to say the least - disallowing the option to customize and choose companion armour. DA3 would benefit from allowing the freedom to choose all armour for party members.
7- "Inside the box" world map
In DAII, after completing quests in an area, the area disappears from the map. At the onset of each new chapter in the game, an old area would become unplayable until more quests were given. This has the world feeling really small when all side quests are completed.
8- Re-used environments:
Isn't much to say here that Bioware is not already aware of. In DAII, caves were re-used to the point where even the minimap displayed a full cave, even when one half of it was inaccessible. This was sloppy and unacceptable. Bioware game level design has always been great in the past, so hopefully this will be corrected in the next game.
9- Music
Am I alone in asserting that DA:O's music was better? I can clearly recall memorable DA:O music such as the haunting orchestral melody at the Dalish Camp in the Brecilian Forest. DAII's music was not memorable at all.
10- Visuals
The redesign of fundamental visual elements of DA:O were poorly implemented in DAII. Everything felt too cartoony. And, why redesign elements such as the Darkspawn, or Qunari? The Darkspawn in DA:O were more frightening-looking, which again led to greater immersion than DAII.
11- Return to the overlying tone of DAO:
DAII is faulted for having lackluster story progression in a number of reviews. Far be it for me to claim "Entitlement", but DAII falls
so far short of DAO in the story department that it warrants
attention. It is reasonable to expect at least flat plot development,
if not growth. The plot in DAII felt stale, with most of the main
quests feeling like side quests from DAO. The tone of the game was
overall much more light-hearted and dozy. Since there was no impending
certain doom as in DAO, I felt as though the decisions that I made in
game held little weight, and that the world would have progressed down
the exact same path had my character not existed.
Finally, I would like to make the comment to Bioware that Dragon Age is not Mass Effect. Mass Effect worked handsomely with Shepard as he was a strong, solid protagonist who fit his role well. The same cannot be said for Hawke. The fundamental difference between Mass Effect and Dragon Age is that Mass Effect was a science fiction story, whose elements were slightly tweakable, but followed a generic protagonist through his perspective. No doubt, you could customize Shepard to be "your" Shepard. Dragon Age, on the other hand, is fantasy, and originally intended as an RPG. This means playing the story with YOUR custom-created character.
DAO was quoted to be the "spiritual successor to Baldur's Gate 2". If this is the case, in Dragon Age 3 allow for more customation, strengthen that feeling of immersion, and open the game world up more. Following common RPG archetypes that have worked well in the past (DAO, Baldur's Gate series, Jade Empire) will keep the fans loyal and happy with the final product. Broadening the target market for DAII alienated its core fanbase, which will result in lower sales for Dragon Age 3.
I regret buying DAII. After DA:O, I expected that at the very least, DAII would live up to its former. The PC gaming market felt the same, given the increased launch sales of DAII, in anticipation of something as good as DA:O. Embittered, the sales for DA3 will likely be less than DAII on launch, based upon the caution of its core fanbase.
Bioware people, if you read all that and you have any questions, please feel free to message me to chat about it. After DA:O, I'm pretty passionate about the series, despite the nature of the 2nd game.
Cheers!
#103
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 06:12
Kaiser Arian XVII
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Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Nah man, those are real historical weapons from a museum.
You can see some examples here:
http://www.thearma.o...ssays/2HGS.html
The
two-handed sword was a specialized and effective infantry weapon, and
was recognized as such in the fifteenth and sixteenth centuries.
Although large, measuring 60-70 in/150-175 cm overall, it was not as
hefty as it looked, weighing something of the order of 5-8 lbs/2.3-3.6
kg. In the hands of the Swiss and German infantrymen it was lethal, and
its use was considered as special skill, often meriting extra pay.
Fifteenth-century examples usually have an expanded cruciform hilt,
sometimes with side rings on one or both sides of the quillon block.
This was the form which remained dominant in Italy during the sixteenth
century, but in Germany a more flamboyant form developed. Two-handed
swords typically have a generous ricasso to allow the blade to be
safely gripped below the quillons and thus wielded more effectively at
close quarters. Triangular or pointed projections, known as flukes,
were added at the base of the ricasso to defend the hand
They're strange... I think halberds are more efficient anyway.
I suppose the swords from 11th/12th centuries were heavier but shorter. At 15th centuries the gun was replacing the cold weapons, I don't know what can be the relation between gun and sword size here.
#104
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 06:37
PinkDiamondstl
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Asking the fans may not be a good idea. That is how we got DA2. But I still enjoyed it.
#105
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 09:43
Shadow Warior
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- 95 messages
2 specialization per class relevant to the story/place
So I didnt like that there was no recognition from the world if you where a templar or a blood mage (this has been discussed already, I know). I would be happier to have less specs if that meant more unique conversations with followers, enemies etc.and/or cutscenes that reminded me of the specialisation I chose.
Also specs relevant to the place in which the story is set would be great. Like if DA3 where based in orlais players should be able to play as a bard,a chevalier or a templar, even if I wont be able to play as a shadow, a beserk or a reaver.
So is this a good idea?
So I didnt like that there was no recognition from the world if you where a templar or a blood mage (this has been discussed already, I know). I would be happier to have less specs if that meant more unique conversations with followers, enemies etc.and/or cutscenes that reminded me of the specialisation I chose.
Also specs relevant to the place in which the story is set would be great. Like if DA3 where based in orlais players should be able to play as a bard,a chevalier or a templar, even if I wont be able to play as a shadow, a beserk or a reaver.
So is this a good idea?
#106
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 11:41
SpunkyMonkey
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PinkDiamondstl wrote...
Asking the fans may not be a good idea. That is how we got DA2. But I still enjoyed it.
I think they definitely need to bare in mind the fans opinions.
I also think they need to have a focussed vision of what they want to achieve creatively and don't let that be compramised just because of fan views.
It's a tough balance to find but it can be done, and after so much love for DA:O it's seems to make sense that using that as a starting point would make far more sense than using DA:2 - I'd say if you created a game which was 80% like DA:O but with a few tweaks and additions then you'd have a great, sellable, and satisfying game.
Bioware should push for opinions on key matters they are undecided on IMO, eg which characters should return/be playable, during character creation do you want multiple races ot just human again?
Modifié par SpunkyMonkey, 13 septembre 2012 - 11:44 .
#107
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 01:45
eroeru
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The problem wasn't listening to fans, it was interpreting what they said and how important the fans actually (sic!) felt were their complaints. Also, Bioware did not think through the implications of making such a cheap and lowly (lo!) sequel to an eloquent game.
Modifié par eroeru, 13 septembre 2012 - 07:50 .
#108
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 01:51
eroeru
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Elhanan wrote...
^ Like the idea of something a bit faster than DAO, but allowing Talents, Spells, and Ability bonuses be the source for attack speed; not the base design.
Ditto.
Though the base speed would be ideally the same as DA:O imo.
The speed stat should be different than the damage and accuracy one though.
Also, I fully agree with
Mick B
And would *clap hands*
Modifié par eroeru, 13 septembre 2012 - 02:00 .
#109
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 02:44
Malsumis
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1. Real choice and consequence.
2. Branching pathways as a result of 1 being implemented.
3. Allow the player to take on the role of a villain. Due the implementation of 1 & 2.
4. A reactive world. Due to the implementation of 1, 2 and 3.
5. A 3/4 blank character, not an Shepard or Hawke, but a Warden/Spirit monk/Bhaalspawn.
2. Branching pathways as a result of 1 being implemented.
3. Allow the player to take on the role of a villain. Due the implementation of 1 & 2.
4. A reactive world. Due to the implementation of 1, 2 and 3.
5. A 3/4 blank character, not an Shepard or Hawke, but a Warden/Spirit monk/Bhaalspawn.
#110
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 03:05
David Gaider
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- BioWare Employees
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- 4 514 messages
SpunkyMonkey wrote...
I think they definitely need to bare in mind the fans opinions.
I also think they need to have a focussed vision of what they want to achieve creatively and don't let that be compramised just because of fan views.
Yep. The eternal struggle.
The comment I would make is that some people seem to think the only fans we should be listening to are the fans who liked DAO but didn't like DA2-- not the fans who liked DA2 and not DAO or the fans who liked both. Or people who were fans of neither. There are lots of justifications offered for this, from pointing at sales figures to perceptions of "all fans" being represented by those who are still present here on the BSN or who speak out on other websites (all different people, one would assume) to forecasts of doom and gloom should we not heed those who were displeased because they all want exactly the same things rectified.
It may seem like I'm being sarcastic on that front (and I am, but that's primarily because I'm a writer and I'm speaking and thus it's my default tone on almost any topic), but there's an element of truth in all those things. Unlike what most would have you believe, however, it's only an element. The way people talk on the internet you would think that only extremes are possible-- it's all-or-nothing-- when things generally exist in the middle ground.
Thus, inevitably, we will try to listen to as many different fans as we can-- and those fans (primarily the loudest) will struggle to ensure they're the only ones we listen to. We will also try to keep to our own vision of what we want Dragon Age to become... and that will include elements from both DAO and DA2, as well as some from neither.
What exactly those will be is something we won't talk about much until we can show it-- as those of you who are most invested in seeing a change have no reason to believe what we say until we do so, and fair enough. If someone's default position, however, is that a future DA game should be exactly like DAO and nothing like DA2, no matter how it's refined, and that anything else is just evidence of us not listening to the right fans... well, I think we'd be awfully sorry you feel that way, and while we'd be glad you liked DAO that much we're probably going to proceed with the plan.
Hopefully when we finally show what we've been working on, you'll see what we're doing and why and understand that the plan includes you in addition to others who might not be interested in the same things you are-- but undoubtedly there will be many people who just won't feel that way whenever we make any change. Some people will feel like they're being ignored even when they're not. But there you go.
Modifié par David Gaider, 13 septembre 2012 - 03:26 .
#111
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 03:35
eyesofastorm
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David Gaider wrote...
SpunkyMonkey wrote...
I think they definitely need to bare in mind the fans opinions.
I also think they need to have a focussed vision of what they want to achieve creatively and don't let that be compramised just because of fan views.
Yep. The eternal struggle.
The comment I would make is that some people seem to think the only fans we should be listening to are the fans who liked DAO but didn't like DA2-- not the fans who liked DA2 and not DAO or the fans who liked both. Or people who were fans of neither. There are lots of justifications offered for this, from pointing at sales figures to perceptions of "all fans" being represented by those who are still present here on the BSN or who speak out on other websites (all different people, one would assume) to forecasts of doom and gloom should we not heed those who were displeased because they all want exactly the same things rectified.
It may seem like I'm being sarcastic on that front (and I am, but that's primarily because I'm a writer and I'm speaking and thus it's my default tone on almost any topic), but there's an element of truth in all those things. Unlike what most would have you believe, however, it's only an element. The way people talk on the internet you would think that only extremes are possible-- it's all-or-nothing-- when things generally exist in the middle ground.
Thus, inevitably, we will try to listen to as many different fans as we can-- and those fans (primarily the loudest) will struggle to ensure they're the only ones we listen to. We will also try to keep to our own vision of what we want Dragon Age to become... and that will include elements from both DAO and DA2, as well as some from neither.
What exactly those will be is something we won't talk about much until we can show it-- as those of you who are most invested in seeing a change have no reason to believe what we say until we do so, and fair enough. If someone's default position, however, is that DA3 should be exactly like DAO and nothing like DA2, no matter how it's refined, and that anything else is just evidence of us not listening to the right fans... well, I think we'd be awfully sorry you feel that way, and while we'd be glad you liked DAO that much we're probably going to proceed with the plan.
Hopefully when we finally show what we've been working on, you'll see what we're doing and why and understand that the plan includes you as well-- but undoubtedly there will be many people who just won't feel that way whenever we make any change. But there you go.
I'd just like to see the decision making paradigm put down on paper. Post DA:O, pre-DA2 the big idea was throwing a certain intensely loyal section of your fanbase under the bus in order to broaden appeal so you could achieve bigger sales. Post DA2, we see that the audience *might* now be broader, but would also seem to pretty clearly be smaller *and* there is like ubiquitous, widespread haterade coolers serving up Bioware at every watering hole on the entire internet (which is certainly not purely about the DA team, but you played your part). But anyway, now it's like you guys are all, "Let's be loyal to our extremely tiny fanbase that liked static NPC appearances because cosplayers are like groupies and will love us and be grateful no matter what!" And you close your eyes and cover your ears and say, "NAH, NAH, NAH" to completely block out what anyone who follows the games industry can see and that is that Bioware is in freefall (in terms of customer relations and reputation if not necessarily financially) and has been since DA2. But why the denial? That's what I don't get.
#112
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 03:41
Darth Death
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- 2 396 messages
This is the second time I've seen you say that. Who are the "loudest"?David Gaider wrote...
SpunkyMonkey wrote...
I think they definitely need to bare in mind the fans opinions.
I also think they need to have a focussed vision of what they want to achieve creatively and don't let that be compramised just because of fan views.
Thus, inevitably, we will try to listen to as many different fans as we can-- and those fans (primarily the loudest) will struggle to ensure they're the only ones we listen to. We will also try to keep to our own vision of what we want Dragon Age to become... and that will include elements from both DAO and DA2, as well as some from neither.
#113
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 03:43
eyesofastorm
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Darth Death wrote...
This is the second time I've seen you say that. Who are the "loudest"?David Gaider wrote...
SpunkyMonkey wrote...
I think they definitely need to bare in mind the fans opinions.
I also think they need to have a focussed vision of what they want to achieve creatively and don't let that be compramised just because of fan views.
Thus, inevitably, we will try to listen to as many different fans as we can-- and those fans (primarily the loudest) will struggle to ensure they're the only ones we listen to. We will also try to keep to our own vision of what we want Dragon Age to become... and that will include elements from both DAO and DA2, as well as some from neither.
The majority.
#114
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 03:44
jackofalltrades456
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David Gaider wrote...
We will also try to keep to our own vision of what we want Dragon Age to become... and that will include elements from both DAO and DA2, as well as some from neither.
That's fine in all, but every feature that you've announced so far were features purely from Dragon Age 2.
1. Voiced Protagonist.
2: Dragon Age 2 Combat
3: Dragon Age 2 Art
4:Dialogue Wheel
5. Iconic appearances
6. Focus on cutscenes
#115
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 03:46
ianvillan
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Darth Death wrote...
This is the second time I've seen you say that. Who are the "loudest"?David Gaider wrote...
SpunkyMonkey wrote...
I think they definitely need to bare in mind the fans opinions.
I also think they need to have a focussed vision of what they want to achieve creatively and don't let that be compramised just because of fan views.
Thus, inevitably, we will try to listen to as many different fans as we can-- and those fans (primarily the loudest) will struggle to ensure they're the only ones we listen to. We will also try to keep to our own vision of what we want Dragon Age to become... and that will include elements from both DAO and DA2, as well as some from neither.
There is a saying of action speaks louder than words, and to me the way DA2 sold less than DAO says that Bioware went in the wrong direction in trying to appeal to the masses.
#116
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 03:47
Darth Death
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And who are they? Who are the majority?eyesofastorm wrote...
Darth Death wrote...
This is the second time I've seen you say that. Who are the "loudest"?David Gaider wrote...
SpunkyMonkey wrote...
I think they definitely need to bare in mind the fans opinions.
I also think they need to have a focussed vision of what they want to achieve creatively and don't let that be compramised just because of fan views.
Thus, inevitably, we will try to listen to as many different fans as we can-- and those fans (primarily the loudest) will struggle to ensure they're the only ones we listen to. We will also try to keep to our own vision of what we want Dragon Age to become... and that will include elements from both DAO and DA2, as well as some from neither.
The majority.
#117
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 03:48
ianvillan
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jackofalltrades456 wrote...
David Gaider wrote...
We will also try to keep to our own vision of what we want Dragon Age to become... and that will include elements from both DAO and DA2, as well as some from neither.
That's fine in all, but every feature that you've announced so far were features purely from Dragon Age 2.
1. Voiced Protagonist.
2: Dragon Age 2 Combat
3: Dragon Age 2 Art
4:Dialogue Wheel
5. Iconic appearances
6. Focus on cutscenes
Exactly Bioware wont even come on here and say one feature they liked about Origins, why not something as simple as yes there will be isometric view or something.
#118
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 03:53
Darth Death
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It's funny you say that because I'm starting to get the impression the DA team didn't like DAO in comparison to DA2. In otherwords, BioWare most likely thought DA2 was a better game than DAO.ianvillan wrote...
jackofalltrades456 wrote...
David Gaider wrote...
We will also try to keep to our own vision of what we want Dragon Age to become... and that will include elements from both DAO and DA2, as well as some from neither.
That's fine in all, but every feature that you've announced so far were features purely from Dragon Age 2.
1. Voiced Protagonist.
2: Dragon Age 2 Combat
3: Dragon Age 2 Art
4:Dialogue Wheel
5. Iconic appearances
6. Focus on cutscenes
Exactly Bioware wont even come on here and say one feature they liked about Origins, why not something as simple as yes there will be isometric view or something.
#119
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 03:56
fchopin
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Can we play a character that starts at a young age (about 12) so we can train them to become how we like?
I think this could be very interesting to train a character with a few scenes until they become older to help us become attached to the character.
I think this could be very interesting to train a character with a few scenes until they become older to help us become attached to the character.
#120
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 03:57
ianvillan
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Darth Death wrote...
It's funny you say that because I'm starting to get the impression the DA team didn't like DAO in comparison to DA2. In otherwords, BioWare most likely thought DA2 was a better game than DAO.ianvillan wrote...
jackofalltrades456 wrote...
David Gaider wrote...
We will also try to keep to our own vision of what we want Dragon Age to become... and that will include elements from both DAO and DA2, as well as some from neither.
That's fine in all, but every feature that you've announced so far were features purely from Dragon Age 2.
1. Voiced Protagonist.
2: Dragon Age 2 Combat
3: Dragon Age 2 Art
4:Dialogue Wheel
5. Iconic appearances
6. Focus on cutscenes
Exactly Bioware wont even come on here and say one feature they liked about Origins, why not something as simple as yes there will be isometric view or something.
Well Bioware said in one of the dev diaries that they took all the best bits of Origins and put them in DA2, so I dont know how they could make DA3 by taking the best bits of both games when DA2 had the best bits of Origins anyway.
#121
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 03:59
David Gaider
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jackofalltrades456 wrote...
That's fine in all, but every feature that you've announced so far were features purely from Dragon Age 2.
We've mentioned the things we're certain about-- and the ones that are easiest to talk about at this point are the ones that aren't changing... and that's ignoring the fact that some of those are still being refined, but we aren't going to talk about how until we can show it.
Eventually we will. Right now people here seem to be treating the lack of information as confirmation of its non-existence. As if this was an announced game that they just hadn't received sufficient information on yet, and we were remiss in providing it. So they raise a panic and dare us to contradict their conjecture, and when we don't treat their conjecture as the truth... which, fair enough. That's how the internet likes to roll. But we're just not going to do it until we're ready to talk. Sorry.
Modifié par David Gaider, 13 septembre 2012 - 04:00 .
#122
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 04:03
Darth Death
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Really?ianvillan wrote...
Well Bioware said in one of the dev diaries that they took all the best bits of Origins and put them in DA2, so I dont know how they could make DA3 by taking the best bits of both games when DA2 had the best bits of Origins anyway.
That's extremely debatable.
#123
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 04:10
Emzamination
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Darth Death wrote...
This is the second time I've seen you say that. Who are the "loudest"?David Gaider wrote...
SpunkyMonkey wrote...
I think they definitely need to bare in mind the fans opinions.
I also think they need to have a focussed vision of what they want to achieve creatively and don't let that be compramised just because of fan views.
Thus, inevitably, we will try to listen to as many different fans as we can-- and those fans (primarily the loudest) will struggle to ensure they're the only ones we listen to. We will also try to keep to our own vision of what we want Dragon Age to become... and that will include elements from both DAO and DA2, as well as some from neither.
He's talking about the users who constantly make threads/post about how much they hate Dragon age 2 and how bioware can grovel to earn back their goodwill.
#124
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 04:10
David Gaider
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- BioWare Employees
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ianvillan wrote...
There is a saying of action speaks louder than words, and to me the way DA2 sold less than DAO says that Bioware went in the wrong direction in trying to appeal to the masses.
Personally, I wish fans would stay away from trying to bring economics into their arguments. Because most of you suck at it, and muddy your own arguments by doing so.
You want to talk economics? Then talk about profit. Talk about how other games are selling, instead of ignoring them like they don't exist. If you don't, then you make it plainly obvious you're only paying attention to the part of the data that supports your own agenda, the very thing you're accusing the industry of doing. Or that you're treating this argument as valid only when it appears to support your stance-- because I'm certain nobody who talks about these figures also brings up games they think were high-quality but didn't sell or games they think were low-quality but sold gangbusters, and how there can be a lot of reasons why each of these things occur.
Talk instead about why you like a game and would like to see more games like it. That, at least, is a subject on which a fan can speak with authority.
#125
Posté 13 septembre 2012 - 04:18
Darth Death
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Can't say if this is true or not since Gaider never confirm it, but let's just say that it is for now. If the "loudest" are the "majority" who complain about DA2 then what does that imply?Emzamination wrote...
Darth Death wrote...
This is the second time I've seen you say that. Who are the "loudest"?David Gaider wrote...
SpunkyMonkey wrote...
I think they definitely need to bare in mind the fans opinions.
I also think they need to have a focussed vision of what they want to achieve creatively and don't let that be compramised just because of fan views.
Thus, inevitably, we will try to listen to as many different fans as we can-- and those fans (primarily the loudest) will struggle to ensure they're the only ones we listen to. We will also try to keep to our own vision of what we want Dragon Age to become... and that will include elements from both DAO and DA2, as well as some from neither.
He's talking about the users who constantly make threads/post about how much they hate Dragon age 2 and how bioware can grovel to earn back their goodwill.
