225 réponses à ce sujet

[The Night Mammoth]

arial wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

arial wrote...
You do not need a working knowledge of something to write it, thats why its called fiction.

You think Tolkein had experience taking down dark lords with a magic ring?

What's so f*cking difficut to understand?

Catalyst gives information. Information makes little to no sense.

People are confused. People think the Catalyst's logic is broken. 

You say people think this because it was intentionally written for human minds to be unable to understand it. 

For this to actually exist BioWare must understand things normal humans cant. 

BioWare are trying to tell us something logical. It's completely different to your stupid example. 

not understanding something does not make it Broken.

I never said it did. 

And you do not need to have working knowledge of something to write about it!

You do if it's supposed to be logical. 

[D24O]

What the catalyst says is true b/c authorial fiat. Now why that 10 minutes supersede a major arc and 2 major characters developments doesn't make sense, at least to me.

[The Night Mammoth]

drayfish wrote...

If this were true, if the intent were to sculpt something that made no sense to human grammar and logic, wouldn't the Catalyst's dialogue in that case consist of:

'Shepard, welcome to the Crucible. Want a soda? No? Okay. Prepare for your mind to get blown. I have something to tell you, something profound...

'Shepard, you have to hammock over banana tricycle boat-stamp! Because if you don't, megastore orange upward for triceratops. ...All the triceratops.

So tryout Friday armpit, Shepard!  For the love of all things sacred: Tryout Friday armpit...'

Pfft, I understood that potato. 

[D24O]

drayfish wrote...

If this were true, if the intent were to sculpt something that made no sense to human grammar and logic, wouldn't the Catalyst's dialogue in that case consist of:

'Shepard, welcome to the Crucible. Want a soda? No? Okay. Prepare for your mind to get blown. I have something to tell you, something profound...

'Shepard, you have to hammock over banana tricycle boat-stamp! Because if you don't, megastore orange upward for triceratops. ...All the triceratops.

So tryout Friday armpit, Shepard!  For the love of all things sacred: Tryout Friday armpit...'

Catalyst was trying to give us forshadowing for Dinosaur DLC all along... I was a fool....

[BaladasDemnevanni]

D24O wrote...

What the catalyst says is true b/c authorial fiat. Now why that 10 minutes supersede a major arc and 2 major characters developments doesn't make sense, at least to me.

Agreed.

I could get behind the Catalyst being a rogue AI which misinterpreted its creators' directives, as per Leviathan.

The problem, particularly before the EC, is that we are given so little exposition behind this apparently deadly problem of organics vs. synsthetics, especially after spending the last two games learning that we can all get along. Even if we buy that the Catalyst doesn't have to make sense, the endings are framed in a style to suggest that the player should consider the organic-synthetic conflict important, which doesn't work if we're also supposed to buy the idea that the Catalyst is insane.

[D24O]

BaladasDemnevanni wrote...

Agreed.

I could get behind the Catalyst being a rogue AI which misinterpreted its creators' directives, as per Leviathan.

The problem, particularly before the EC, is that we are given so little exposition behind this apparently deadly problem of organics vs. synsthetics, especially after spending the last two games learning that we can all get along. Even if we buy that the Catalyst doesn't have to make sense, the endings are framed in a style to suggest that the player should consider the organic-synthetic conflict important, which doesn't work if we're also supposed to buy the idea that the Catalyst is insane.

Shep going along with him pretty completley doesn't help matters IMO.

[Ryzaki]

Seriously "You can't comprehend this but make a choice"

"...wut?"

I really was waiting for Shep's "WTF?" dialogue choice.

[Kileyan]

OP: Seriously, do you really want the ending of your 5 years long game to be....

Its so darn deep and beyond our understanding, that the games writers do not even have to attempt to make it make sense? It is just so because.......

[drayfish]

D24O wrote...

Catalyst was trying to give us forshadowing for Dinosaur DLC all along... I was a fool....

He was a visionary.  Now take this saddle.  You're gonna need it for where we're going...

[D24O]

drayfish wrote...

He was a visionary.  Now take this saddle.  You're gonna need it for where we're going...

I will set off at once!

[GreyLycanTrope]

D24O wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

The Catalyst is probably the most interesting npc in the game (besides the squadmates)

 

The Night Mammoth wrote...
BioWare can't physically write something humans can't understand, because they are human. Derp. 

I agree with both these statements...and Dinosaur DLC, but that should go without saying at this point.

[MB957]

but does he make cents???

[Wowky]

The Night Mammoth wrote...
Unless you're implying BioWare are actually a conglomerate of super-intelligent machines.

Man, that would be so cool

[Jostle]

Ryzaki wrote...

Seriously "You can't comprehend this but make a choice"

"...wut?"

I really was waiting for Shep's "WTF?" dialogue choice.

I'm glad someone said it. The Catalyst does not make sense. If it were beyond our comprehension, why would it invite us up to make a universe-altering decision? If it was such an important decision, it wouldn't have us make it. If it wasnt important, than why would it have bothered with its "solution" in the first place?

Even setting all that aside, I don't buy the argument that he is correct but we just don't get it. I could just as easily argue that we are correct and they just can't comprehend why. Why? Because I say so! That's their argument, right?

[Conniving_Eagle]

[Epique Phael767]

D24O wrote...

F*** the Catalyst.

And the OP who obviously saw and heard a different catalyst than everyone else.

[D24O]

Epique Phael767 wrote...

And the OP who obviously saw and heard a different catalyst than everyone else.

I wouldn't go that far, arial can hold any view she likes.

[The Night Mammoth]

Wowky wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...
Unless you're implying BioWare are actually a conglomerate of super-intelligent machines.

Man, that would be so cool

That would explain a lot. 

I'm a fan of the Reptilians Theory myself. 

[arial]

Jostle wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Seriously "You can't comprehend this but make a choice"

"...wut?"

I really was waiting for Shep's "WTF?" dialogue choice.

I'm glad someone said it. The Catalyst does not make sense. If it were beyond our comprehension, why would it invite us up to make a universe-altering decision? If it was such an important decision, it wouldn't have us make it. If it wasnt important, than why would it have bothered with its "solution" in the first place?

Even setting all that aside, I don't buy the argument that he is correct but we just don't get it. I could just as easily argue that we are correct and they just can't comprehend why. Why? Because I say so! That's their argument, right?

he tells you why, the Crucible altered his programming

[arial]

D24O wrote...

Epique Phael767 wrote...

And the OP who obviously saw and heard a different catalyst than everyone else.

I wouldn't go that far, arial can hold any view she likes.

thanks D24O

[dreman9999]

Xellith wrote...

Organics and synthetics clash.  However every account on record has resulted in a "live and let live" truce or organics coming back and winning.  Every war between organics and synthetic has resulted in a synthetic victory because of reaper intervention.

The catalyst is a self fulfilling prophecy.

Not his fault. It's his creators fault. Rrmrber the conflict happened before it was created.

[dreman9999]

Ryzaki wrote...

Seriously "You can't comprehend this but make a choice"

"...wut?"

I really was waiting for Shep's "WTF?" dialogue choice.

It's a machine doing what it's programed to do. What not comprehended by organics is that organics are the source of the conflic with synthetic. The catalyst is trying to fix that by converting , changing and controling organics and synthetics. But it's casuing more conflict with organics and synthetics doing this by forcing it on organic and can't see it becauseit's blindling doing it's programing.

In short, We can't comprehend we are the source of the organic/syntheticconflict and the catalyst can't comprehend that it's making it worse.

We are ask to choose because the catalyst is at the limit it can do. It can't destroy itself with the desstroy option the catalyst has and it can rewrite itself with the control option because of the limits of it's programing. It only see synthesis as an option but need Shepard to be able to do it being that Shepard is the last peice need for it to work. It has no care to how it solve th eprobelm give, just that it's solved. The catalyst has no morals. It in a loop because it can't solve the solution give because of it limits. It limits being that it can't control all organics and all organics that will come.

[Conniving_Eagle]

arial wrote...

D24O wrote...

Epique Phael767 wrote...

And the OP who obviously saw and heard a different catalyst than everyone else.

I wouldn't go that far, arial can hold any view she likes.

thanks D24O

Are you two finished?

I think I'm going to get sick.

[Conniving_Eagle]

The Catalyst...

Modifié par Conniving_Eagle, 11 septembre 2012 - 04:37 .