14 réponses à ce sujet

[Lars_Himself]

 Why wasn't this an option? She fits the lesbian stereotype to a T (Imean no offence by this, I'm just being emphatic). She also mentions in dialogue in ME2 that she was used for sex (among other things) by a man AND a woman. It disappoints me that Male Shepard was able to romance Kaiden or Cortez while FemShep gets... Samantha Traynor. Yippee. There should have been more options for gay love, and not just in ME3. 

However, at least there is an option nowadays. Thanks, Bioware.

[Premier Bromanov]

She may fit a stereotype, but that doesn't mean she fits it fully, nor does the stereotype dictate who she is. How she behaves, how she appears, those don't mean that she's gay or bi. Being gay or bi means she's gay or bi. It's wrong to say that a masculine female is always gay, just as it's wrong to say that a feminine male is always gay. Sexual orientation doesn't have an appearance. It's normative to say it does.  Whether Bioware was trying to make this point with Jack remains to be seen.

As for what Jack said about her history with women, there are different ways to interpret what she meant. I myself see many possible explanations. Ask me in messages, if you care enough to know what I think. However, Jack rejects FemShep, so, without appealing to a meta-level of knowledge, that means Jack is straight, or not interested.

I'm surprised people still concern themselves with this topic, two years after-the-fact. As far as I'm concerned, Bioware settled the matter by including homosexual LIs in ME3, even if FemShep does receive overall fewer LIs.

Modifié par Premier Bromanov, 12 septembre 2012 - 02:19 .

[spirosz]

Premier Bromanov wrote...

She may fit a stereotype, but that doesn't mean she fits it fully, nor does the stereotype dictate who she is. How she behaves, how she appears, those don't mean that she's gay or bi. Being gay or bi means she's gay or bi. It's wrong to say that a masculine female is always gay, just as it's wrong to say that a feminine male is always gay. Sexual orientation doesn't have an appearance. It's normative to say it does.  Whether Bioware was trying to make this point with Jack remains to be seen.

As for what Jack said about her history with women, there are different ways to interpret what she meant. I myself see many possible explanations. Ask me in messages, if you care enough to know what I think. However, Jack rejects FemShep, so, without appealing to a meta-level of knowledge, that means Jack is straight, or not interested.

I'm surprised people still concern themselves with this topic, two years after-the-fact. As far as I'm concerned, Bioware settled the matter by including homosexual LIs in ME3, even if FemShep does receive overall fewer LIs.

Well put. 

[Lars_Himself]

Premier Bromanov wrote...

She may fit a stereotype, but that doesn't mean she fits it fully, nor does the stereotype dictate who she is. How she behaves, how she appears, those don't mean that she's gay or bi. Being gay or bi means she's gay or bi. It's wrong to say that a masculine female is always gay, just as it's wrong to say that a feminine male is always gay. Sexual orientation doesn't have an appearance. It's normative to say it does.  Whether Bioware was trying to make this point with Jack remains to be seen.

I shouldn't have included that part about stereotypes. I just thought based on who she is and what her character development entails could have dictated her feelings for Shepard, male or female. When I was playing the game for the first time it was my personal opinion that she could have been bisexual or gay. Her mannerisms and body language spoke to me in a way that made me think it was possible to romance her as male or female Shepard, and I was disappointed when I found out that it was impossible. The fact that she has had sex with both men and women kiiiiind of confirms that she has a sexual interest in women. Maybe Bioware should have left that particular story out of the narrative.

[EpicBoot2daFace]

You're not missing much. It didn't really add up to anything in ME3.

[Premier Bromanov]

Lars_Himself wrote...

I shouldn't have included that part about stereotypes. I just thought based on who she is and what her character development entails could have dictated her feelings for Shepard, male or female. When I was playing the game for the first time it was my personal opinion that she could have been bisexual or gay. Her mannerisms and body language spoke to me in a way that made me think it was possible to romance her as male or female Shepard, and I was disappointed when I found out that it was impossible. The fact that she has had sex with both men and women kiiiiind of confirms that she has a sexual interest in women. Maybe Bioware should have left that particular story out of the narrative.

Maybe they should have.  Maybe they were trying to make a point.  Maybe they were saying that, despite how Jack looks and acts, she's straight.  If you'll notice, the nature of her history with women is unclear, especially if it's considered along with the rest of her past, and her rejection of FemShep.  That's the open-to-interpretation part (that's the part where you can message me if you want to discuss what she says).  Maybe it's like I said - there are lots of way to interpret the meaning of what she said about her history with women, but you always come to the same conclusion, that's she's not interested in FemShep, for whatever reason.

Modifié par Premier Bromanov, 12 septembre 2012 - 03:35 .

[Skullheart]

I not againt a femShep/Jack romance, but I think femShep deserves more male LIs (they screwed to male romances).

[Ryzaki]

I never saw the appeal of Jack as an LI personally. Way too much damage and baggage for me I really can't even see her as an LI for Male Shep let alone FemShep.

[N7 Lisbeth]

Ryzaki wrote...

I never saw the appeal of Jack as an LI personally. Way too much damage and baggage for me I really can't even see her as an LI for Male Shep let alone FemShep.

The fan interest in a FemShep / Jack pairing is probably because there isn't a same-gender romance option in ME2. In that way, Jack's insertion (ahem) is a big tease.

Yes, technically Kelly is a same-gender option, but she isn't really romanceable; it doesn't count for Paramour nor does it cause a confrontation scene with a LI, so it's defined as a fling at best. Not really the way we want to associate gay relationships.

Modifié par N7 Lisbeth, 12 septembre 2012 - 04:17 .

[ottifant64]

Lars_Himself wrote...

 Why wasn't this an option? She fits the lesbian stereotype to a T (Imean no offence by this, I'm just being emphatic). She also mentions in dialogue in ME2 that she was used for sex (among other things) by a man AND a woman. It disappoints me that Male Shepard was able to romance Kaiden or Cortez while FemShep gets... Samantha Traynor. Yippee. There should have been more options for gay love, and not just in ME3. 

However, at least there is an option nowadays. Thanks, Bioware.

You forgot Liara.

And Samantha is awesome. <_<

[Ryzaki]

N7 Lisbeth wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

I never saw the appeal of Jack as an LI personally. Way too much damage and baggage for me I really can't even see her as an LI for Male Shep let alone FemShep.

The fan interest in a FemShep / Jack pairing is probably because there isn't a same-gender romance option in ME2. In that way, Jack's insertion (ahem) is a big tease.

Yes, technically Kelly is a same-gender option, but she isn't really romanceable; it doesn't count for Paramour nor does it cause a confrontation scene with a LI, so it's defined as a fling at best. Not really the way we want to associate gay relationships.

That is very true. I don't know, I'd rather Miranda if I had to choose. Then again Miranda is the only female LI I would actually romance.

[N7 Lisbeth]

Ryzaki wrote...



That is very true. I don't know, I'd rather Miranda if I had to choose. Then again Miranda is the only female LI I would actually romance.

I can see that. I find her intellect and daring quite, erm, compelling; the fact th at she's drop dead gorgeous doesn't hurt either. But considering her treatment in ME3, I'm not devastated that it wasn't included. I could, of course, say the same thing about Jack (and have elsewhere). I suspect the reason you don't see much campaigning for FemShep-Miranda pairings is because it's just not in the cards, and never was. But Jack alludes to having played the other side, she's just not interested in it now for reasons left unknown.

As for Jack's appeal, sometimes girls like bad girls. :innocent:

Modifié par N7 Lisbeth, 12 septembre 2012 - 06:22 .

[Premier Bromanov]

N7 Lisbeth wrote...


I can see that. I find her intellect and daring quite, erm, compelling; the fact th at she's drop dead gorgeous doesn't hurt either. But considering her treatment in ME3, I'm not devastated that it wasn't included. I could, of course, say the same thing about Jack (and have elsewhere). I suspect the reason you don't see much campaigning for FemShep-Miranda pairings is because it's just not in the cards, and never was. But Jack alludes to having played the other side, she's just not interested in it now for reasons left unknown.

As for Jack's appeal, sometimes girls like bad girls. :innocent:

And sometimes bad girls don't like girls, which may or may not be the point, depending on how you see it. 

[Ryzaki]

N7 Lisbeth wrote...
I can see that. I find her intellect and daring quite, erm, compelling; the fact th at she's drop dead gorgeous doesn't hurt either. But considering her treatment in ME3, I'm not devastated that it wasn't included. I could, of course, say the same thing about Jack (and have elsewhere). I suspect the reason you don't see much campaigning for FemShep-Miranda pairings is because it's just not in the cards, and never was. But Jack alludes to having played the other side, she's just not interested in it now for reasons left unknown.

As for Jack's appeal, sometimes girls like bad girls. :innocent:

LOL yeah Jack's treatement wasn't much better. Reasons unknown indeed.

Not too much of a bad girl too me though. Miranda's bad enough for me. Then again I don't like crass. Never have. *shrugs* YMMV. I like my evil characters the cold logical type. If they most be all crazy and bloodthirsty I don't like them as much. (Few exceptions of course but for the most part I like the Machiavellianists.) So...yeah I like my baddies...still don't like Jack. Especially not the "do you like me?" she kept doing to my dude Shep. No Jack. No. Never. He wouldn't touch you with a 20 foot pole. And that's the straight one.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 12 septembre 2012 - 07:40 .

[N7Calibrator]

I liked the fact that Jack was not a romance option for Femshep. The way I saw it , it revealed a lot more about the character.