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Since when was Kaidan Bisexual


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#51
erilben

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Chardonney wrote...

element eater wrote...

he wasnt bi he was clearly strait in me1 he mentioned liking liara or shep if ur a women and had no interest in man shep.

but then it doesnt realy matter aslong as it makes people happy


He was written as bi in ME1 but they cut it out. The files were/are still there and you could/can access them through the save editor.


It's bafffling to me that people actually think the Kaidan's ME1 romance is bisexual. Kaidan refers to Shepard as being a woman multiple times.

Modifié par erilben, 12 septembre 2012 - 04:00 .


#52
_aLucidMind_

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Fredvdp wrote...

Since he didn't show any romantic feelings for male Shep in ME1, while he did for Femshep, I figured he wasn't yet comfortable with his sexuality in ME1. I don't believe it's a retcon though. I'm surprised they didn't make him a bi romance option in ME1.

He could just not have been attracted to MaleShep during the events of ME1, but saw him as a good friend. Shep's death makes him realize he does care for him more than he thought, Cerberus cooperation makes him extremely wary, Shep's constant visiting at the hospital pushes it to the edge where he starts to fall for MaleShep a little.

From a non-metagaming perspective, it makes him a little more complex.

#53
EricHVela

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IsaacShep wrote...

tholloway93 wrote...

just make sure to not be over friendly! i was talking to cortez my first playthrough getting to know his character (before i even knew he was gay) then i started doing all the nice replies and got hit on, was like slow down cowboy im reserved for liara

Nonsense, you can't get hit on by Cortez unless you tell him that he should be looking at you because you're "eye candy too". Looks like we know you did say it to him :devil:

Depends on one's definition of "hit on". Cortez does say something like "I find it hard to say 'no' to you" or some such when broShep (I think femShep, too -- not sure) when you take the Paragon option of "Do it for me" when telling him that he needs to take a break before burning out. There's no harm in a friend telling a friend to do something for them, but one might interpret the response as a bit more than expected.

Me? I didn't care. I played all the angles. :) Call me a completionist.

I, too, found it odd that Kaidan was a LI for both genders in ME3, but after some digging, it looks like there might have been the option for all three to swing both ways in ME1. (I typically don't consider cut-content as canon.) Regardless, I found nothing that explicitly stated that he didn't go both ways.

Yet, the fact that only broShep cannot romance him in ME1 suggests that something did actually changed. When he could romance femShep in both ME1 and ME3 but broShep in only ME3, something has changed between the two games.

The whole "metagame" argument is bupkis. A writer that expects players to suffer total amnesia between play-throughs is being unrealistic. By merely attempting to make a different choice than before, the player is acknowledging the previous choice and is metagaming. If they don't want metagaming, they will have to make the game playable only once with no ability to go back to previous choices. That's not gonna happen. Metagaming will happen, and writers need to count on it happening.

Still, I am able to assume that broShep and Kaidan had not yet "connected" regardless of what femShep and Kaidan can do. I cannot shake the recognition of differences between ME1 and ME3 but I can apply what is necessary for me to accept the current Shep's story regardless.

#54
Ryzaki

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erilben wrote...

Chardonney wrote...

element eater wrote...

he wasnt bi he was clearly strait in me1 he mentioned liking liara or shep if ur a women and had no interest in man shep.

but then it doesnt realy matter aslong as it makes people happy


He was written as bi in ME1 but they cut it out. The files were/are still there and you could/can access them through the save editor.


It's bafffling to me that people actually think the Kaidan's ME1 romance is bisexual. Kaidan refers to Shepard as being a woman multiple times.


Less that and more early after ME1 (before they started spewing that Shep's straight garbage) they said there was an intention for a m/m romance but there wasn't enough time before they had to meet deadlines and started cutting things out. Due to the expected low audience it was cut. Only personal applicable for that romance would've been Kaidan thus logic follows that he was the cut m/m LI.

#55
Eclipse merc

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I'm pretty sure he was supposed to be Bi in ME1

#56
sammysoso

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Yea, it's a weird retcon, because he showed zero interest in men during ME1.

But, it's not like the game forces you to be with him, so it's not really a problem.

(Just to be clear, I don't have a problem with same sex relationships, I though Steve was pretty cool)

#57
_aLucidMind_

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sammysoso wrote...

Yea, it's a weird retcon, because he showed zero interest in men during ME1.

In the men he met, not men in-general. I'm straight, but I tend to find very few women actually attractive enough because I need to get to know them well before I become attracted. I know a lot of people (gay, straight, and bi) that are like that as well; perhaps Kaidan is one of those guys that require a friendship first.

He also never stated he only liked women or insinuated it in any way, so it isn't really a retcon.

#58
Prince Lex

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erilben wrote...

Chardonney wrote...

element eater wrote...

he wasnt bi he was clearly strait in me1 he mentioned liking liara or shep if ur a women and had no interest in man shep.

but then it doesnt realy matter aslong as it makes people happy


He was written as bi in ME1 but they cut it out. The files were/are still there and you could/can access them through the save editor.


It's bafffling to me that people actually think the Kaidan's ME1 romance is bisexual. Kaidan refers to Shepard as being a woman multiple times.


He was definitely supposed to be bi in ME1 before it was cut. Probably due to the media uproar about the sex scene as it was.

there proof.[/url]

The proof being in Shepard's lines - "Kaidan, I don't believe I've had the pleasure of you serving under me" "Bunk here tonight Kaidan, with me" "I'm not looking for a pet Kaidan". Are you telling me that Mark Meer recorded those lines for a straight Kaidan? I doubt it.

Also, if you hacked the save and continued a romance with Kaidan to ME3, 
the extra dialogue on Mars.[/url]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7_Bsh_TPnc ]

#59
Prince Lex

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erilben wrote...

Chardonney wrote...

element eater wrote...

he wasnt bi he was clearly strait in me1 he mentioned liking liara or shep if ur a women and had no interest in man shep.

but then it doesnt realy matter aslong as it makes people happy


He was written as bi in ME1 but they cut it out. The files were/are still there and you could/can access them through the save editor.


It's bafffling to me that people actually think the Kaidan's ME1 romance is bisexual. Kaidan refers to Shepard as being a woman multiple times.


He was definitely supposed to be bi in ME1 before it was cut. Probably due to the media uproar about the sex scene as it was.

Hello there proof.
The proof being in Shepard's lines - "Kaidan, I don't believe I've had the pleasure of you serving under me" "Bunk here tonight Kaidan, with me" "I'm not looking for a pet Kaidan". Are you telling me that Mark Meer recorded those lines for a straight Kaidan? I doubt it.

Also, if you hacked the save and continued a romance with Kaidan to ME3,
here's the extra dialogue on Mars.

Modifié par Prince Lex, 12 septembre 2012 - 04:33 .


#60
ZombieGambit

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Yeah, that bothered me. It just really came out of nowhere.

You can get around it by throwing in a couple renegade dialogue options during conversations, particularly in the hospital and when he talks about his family on the Normandy. Afterwards when he meets you on the Citadel he'll still be friendly and you can use all the paragon choices and he won't make a pass at you.

#61
M Hedonist

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Every since you changed the thread title.

#62
What a Succulent Ass

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Prince Lex wrote...

He was definitely supposed to be bi in ME1 before it was cut. Probably due to the media uproar about the sex scene as it was.

The media uproar came long after the game's release. This content, if it was cut at all, was removed early on.

IIRC, wasn't it just that the voice talent records all lines? That would explain why you can mine ME2 files that have MaleShep calling himself female and FemShep introducing herself as "Solomon Gunn."

#63
erilben

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Prince Lex wrote...

erilben wrote...

Chardonney wrote...

element eater wrote...

he wasnt bi he was clearly strait in me1 he mentioned liking liara or shep if ur a women and had no interest in man shep.

but then it doesnt realy matter aslong as it makes people happy


He was written as bi in ME1 but they cut it out. The files were/are still there and you could/can access them through the save editor.


It's bafffling to me that people actually think the Kaidan's ME1 romance is bisexual. Kaidan refers to Shepard as being a woman multiple times.


He was definitely supposed to be bi in ME1 before it was cut. Probably due to the media uproar about the sex scene as it was.

Hello there proof.
The proof being in Shepard's lines - "Kaidan, I don't believe I've had the pleasure of you serving under me" "Bunk here tonight Kaidan, with me" "I'm not looking for a pet Kaidan". Are you telling me that Mark Meer recorded those lines for a straight Kaidan? I doubt it.

Also, if you hacked the save and continued a romance with Kaidan to ME3,
here's the extra dialogue on Mars.



Yep. Meer recorded lines for a straight Kaidan romance, or it's better to say he recorded lines meant for female Shepard. There's recorded lines of Meer calling himself a woman to Liara and responding to Harkin's sexual harassment.

Look at the end of what you linked for ME1. "it's been a long time since I met a woman who--" That is not a same sex romance.

#64
Pitznik

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Prince Lex wrote...

Why do people keep calling this a retcon when it's absolutely not a retcon?

Kaidan was originally planned as a S/S romance option in ME1. If you have him flagged as a continuing romance for a Maleshep in the ME2 - ME3 there's actually extra mShep/Kaidan dialogue (on Mars).

It's not a retcon, it's the continuation of what was supposed to be there in ME1.

If it was cut, it would still technically make it a retcon. Still, probably smoothest ME retcon ever.

#65
What a Succulent Ass

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Still, probably smoothest ME retcon ever.

Dogg, that is not saying much, lbr.

#66
The Twilight God

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Mordak55 wrote...

Just played through as Male Shep for the second time, romance Ash the fist time, this time had Kaiden as VS, and noticed that he was getting romance options. While I dont mind as such, there was no hint of this in ME1. 

Why did BW decide to make him Bi, and why not Ashley as well, or in fact every character?, its not like therre were no option for Male Shep, Steve for example, my Male Shep was mates with Steve while romancing Ashley, and I liked Steves character development. But Kaidan's seems forced to me. 


Because appeasing minorities is progressive and being progressive makes you a better person. Being a better person then makes your farts smell good. Then you can smell your own farts in fancy wine glasses and drive a hybrid.

#67
wizardryforever

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ZombieGambit wrote...

Yeah, that bothered me. It just really came out of nowhere.

You can get around it by throwing in a couple renegade dialogue options during conversations, particularly in the hospital and when he talks about his family on the Normandy. Afterwards when he meets you on the Citadel he'll still be friendly and you can use all the paragon choices and he won't make a pass at you.

The easiest way to avoid the "pass" is to either not talk to him on the Citadel (which is kind of douchbaggy, unless you don't talk to anyone on the Citadel), or lock in another romance before you talk to him.  Kaidan won't hit on you if he knows that you're in a committed relationship already.  Kaidan's hit is largely unsolicited, unlike Cortez's, which I think is why people feel it comes out of nowhere.

#68
Blueprotoss

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EnvyTB075 wrote...

Hes not, hes bisexual.

Yep and OP it happens when you screw him over in ME2 without an apology in ME3.

Mythanblood wrote...

Retcon.

How is that when his sexuality wasn't asked neiher in ME1 nor ME2 and ME3.  So waht if he's bi just like 1/3 of the LIs in ME.

PhoenixUK wrote...

dont you remember all the media uproar about the sex scene in ME1? is it surprising that they cut out any hint of bisexuality in kaidan? Im surprised they got away with it with Liara (although she's an alien and also it's woman with "woman" and lesbianism is somehow ok and gay is not).

Maybe or maybe not that was removed in ME1 as a romance based on the sex.  Its odd that dudes are treated differently then chicks on this respect. 

BDelacroix wrote...

Since Bioware wanted to appear hip and PC.

How is that when Baldur's Gate was on the PC. 

erilben wrote...

It's bafffling to me that people actually think the Kaidan's ME1 romance is bisexual. Kaidan refers to Shepard as being a woman multiple times.

His general character hints of it while removed voice dialogue in ME1 will back that up.  Heck even Ashley was a possiblity for being bi from her also having removed voice dialogue in ME1.

Modifié par Blueprotoss, 12 septembre 2012 - 05:18 .


#69
GreyLycanTrope

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Blueprotoss wrote...

EnvyTB075 wrote...

Hes not, hes bisexual.

Yep and OP it happens when you screw him over in ME2 without an apology in ME3.

You're saying he becomes bisexual after horizon?

#70
Mordak55

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sammysoso wrote...

Yea, it's a weird retcon, because he showed zero interest in men during ME1.

But, it's not like the game forces you to be with him, so it's not really a problem.

(Just to be clear, I don't have a problem with same sex relationships, I though Steve was pretty cool)


I dont mind, I just wondered why they changed it character, I think if they decided to change Kaiden they should have changed Ashly as well, for all the fem shep players. 

#71
4stringwizard

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The real reason?

Bioware needed a second gay option for male shep (to make it more "fair"). Kaiden was the best candidate. RETCON!

Modifié par 4stringwizard, 12 septembre 2012 - 05:11 .


#72
Blueprotoss

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Greylycantrope wrote...

Blueprotoss wrote...

EnvyTB075 wrote...

Hes not, hes bisexual.

Yep and OP it happens when you screw him over in ME2 without an apology in ME3.

You're saying he becomes bisexual after horizon?

He was bi in ME1 while you can get Kaidan as a bi option in ME3.

Modifié par Blueprotoss, 12 septembre 2012 - 05:11 .


#73
GreyLycanTrope

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I get that it just sounded like you were saying something else, my mistake.

#74
Blueprotoss

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Greylycantrope wrote...

I get that it just sounded like you were saying something else, my mistake.

No problem and everyone makes mistakes.

Modifié par Blueprotoss, 12 septembre 2012 - 05:19 .


#75
Guest_Flog61_*

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If ashley became a femshep LI then there would be 3 lesbian options and 2 straight ones.

Imagine, just imagine the ****storm if for manshep there were 3 gay options and 2 straight. Society sucks.