1774 réponses à ce sujet

[Eurypterid]

Yrkoon wrote...

Second, the Mega-dungeon is in! I'll shamelessly take partial credit for this one. Me and a few other posters at the Obsidian boards made so much noise about wanting one. We managed to attract a dev to both of those threads to ask us for more details.... Again, really Breathtaking to see such quick and tangeable responses to our requests!

Nice! Are you using the same handle over there?

[Sister Goldring]

Heads up in case anyone's got questions. Feargus is answering Project Eternity questions on the kickstarter comments page now. Don't know how long he's staying for though.

[Yrkoon]

Eurypterid wrote...

Nice! Are you using the same handle over there?

No, My username is "Stun" over there.

Unfortunately. When I went to register an account, I discovered that "Yrkoon" was taken, and so was Yrkoon1, and Yyrkoon. So I settled on a quick, single sylable username that represented my feelings of a Big name company doing an old school RPG in 2012. 

I am using the same avatar that I use here, though.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 02 octobre 2012 - 12:39 .

[slimgrin]

[quote]Yrkoon wrote...

Second, the Mega-dungeon is in! I'll shamelessly take partial credit for this one. Me and a few other posters at the Obsidian boards made so much noise about wanting one. We managed to attract a dev to both of those threads to ask us for more details.... Again, really Breathtaking to see such quick and tangeable responses to our requests![/quote]

[/quote]

Good news. I like me some dungeon crawling.

Modifié par slimgrin, 02 octobre 2012 - 12:55 .

[GodWood]

Corto81 wrote...

GodWood wrote...
Hardly.

There's no way to spin "Ego-stroking" that isn't just shameless ... well, ego-stroking. I don't want my companions to necessarily like, agree, or even want to be following me around. Hell, I'd prefer it that my PC isn't even seen as "the leader".

What I want is for them to be their OWN character.

....which is EXACTLY what Avellone is saying.

Not at all. Everything said in Avellone's quote says he wants an exclusively 'positive' relationship with the companions with exclusively positive reactions.

How can you interpret what he is saying SO wrong? O.o

I'm more curious as to how one can interpret Avellone NOT wanting lecturing, complaining and ****ing to be the same thing as me wanting lecturing, complaining and ****ing.

I actually like conflict, it makes the game more fun.

[Dave of Canada]

Perhaps it's just me but I don't care too much for the fictional names they've gone with, sounds too fictitious *gasp horror shock*. "Glanfathans"? Sounds like a cartoon alien species.

[Yrkoon]

GodWood wrote...
 Everything said in Avellone's quote says he wants an exclusively 'positive' relationship with the companions with exclusively positive reactions.

Er...  yeah, you're hallucinating.  He neither said, nor implied any such thing.

He specifically gave an either/or.    And you friggin quoted it a page ago!  The "either" was Romance, and the "Or" was Reactivity.

And as anyone who's taken a 7th grade level or higher literature class can tell you, Ego-stroking/reactivity  can  *so* easily manifest  themselves in the form of conflict, even an open war-type conflict.  A companion or enemy who is consumed with the desire to destroy you *IS* stroking your ego.    Because the alternative is for him to not take you seriously,  To not waste time thinking about you... or to not  even acknowledge your presense and  the impact you've had on him and the world.

But whatever.  Avellone doesn't need me to explain his   *simple* words.  The  marvelously  dynamic characters he's written in past games speak for themselves. 

Modifié par Yrkoon, 02 octobre 2012 - 01:13 .

[Jozape]

Yrkoon wrote...

But whatever.  Avellone doesn't need me to explain his   *simple* words.  The  marvelously  dynamic characters he's written in past games speak for themselves.

Very true, and he's mentioned companions such as Dak'kon, Annah, and Kreia as 'ego-stroking' characters many times in the past. None of those companions are exactly what you call not at conflict with the player character.

[Yrkoon]

Not to mention Vhailor and Ignus.... actual companion *enemies* depending on how you act in the game.

[GodWood]

Yrkoon wrote...

GodWood wrote...
 Everything said in Avellone's quote says he wants an exclusively 'positive' relationship with the companions with exclusively positive reactions.

Er...  yeah, you're hallucinating.  He neither said, nor implied any such thing.

Please stop being so obtuse.

Saying companions NEED  to ego-stroke the player (romance, saying how badarse they are etc)  and then saying that a companion that complains, lectures etc is something NOT wanted implies exactly what I said it was implying. I.e. Companions should have exclusively positive reactions and relationships with the PC.

He specifically gave an either/or.    And you friggin quoted it a page ago!  The "either" was Romance, and the "Or" was Reactivity.

And as anyone who's taken a 7th grade level or higher literature class can tell you, Ego-stroking/reactivity  can  *so* easily manifest  themselves in the form of conflict, even an open war-type conflict.  An enemy who is consumed with the desire to destroy you *IS* stroking your ego.  The alternative is for him to not take you seriously,  or to not acknowledge your presense and  the impact you've had on him and the world.

So now you've bastardised ego-stroking to be pretty much "simply acknowledging the player's existence". Something every other game does as well making stating he wants this in his game to be obsolete.

Reactivity is fine. Choice and Consequence is fine. Ego-Stroking however is not something that should be actively strived for.

But whatever.  Avellone doesn't need me to explain his   *simple* words.  The  marvelously  dynamic characters he's written in past games speak for themselves. 

And this bit of your post here leads me to believe that your getting your fanboy on.

I too have liked Avellone's past games HOWEVER that quote on its own has incredibly negative conotations.

[Yrkoon]

GodWood wrote...
 Please stop being so obtuse.

Saying companions NEED  to ego-stroke the player (romance, saying how badarse they are etc)  and then saying that a companion that complains, lectures etc is something NOT wanted implies exactly what I said it was implying. I.e. Companions should have exclusively positive reactions and relationships with the PC.

^Behold, people, the scope of severe reading comprehension problems.

Here's what Avellone actually says:

The companion needs to ego-stroke the player in a variety of ways. Sometimes this can be romance, sometimes this can be simply reactivity (either brief barks or conversations about the player’s actions), or any of a variety of methods. Ultimately, however, any companion that simply sits around ****ing, complaining, and haranguing the player isn’t someone you want to drag into the nearest dungeon to help clear it out… you may simply want to throw them in the dungeon and lock the door.

While I'm sure in some far off, obscure, language  (not English),   "a variety of different ways", and  "reactivity", and "brief barks or conversations about his actions"  can only mean:  Boot licking,  and saying how badass the player is, here in reality land, they do NOT.

Derp.


Oh here, I got a better Idea.  Cite me an example of a companion you really enjoyed  and consider well written in an RPG, and I'll Show you  their  constant Ego Stroking.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 02 octobre 2012 - 01:34 .

[slimgrin]

I personally thought it was a poor choice of words by Avellone given that Bioware has a history of mistaking player empowerment for roleplaying.

Modifié par slimgrin, 02 octobre 2012 - 01:33 .

[Chromie]

Eurypterid wrote...
Crafting and Enchanting at $2.4 Million
We also have a new stretch goal at $2.4 million dollars to announce: Crafting and Enchanting!  

Omg! 

I am a BIG sucker for crafting especially when a game really embraces their crafting system like Vagrant Story or Star Wars Galaxies. I'll have to up my pledge soon then. This is something that really excites me. Crafting in western rpgs sadly is never given too much thought so I hopefully they give some more info on this.

@Yrkoon, good on you for pushing for the dungeons a 15 level dungeon that gets progressively harder would be even better. I sure wouldn't mind revisiting the dungeon at higher levels to access even deeper levels. 

Yrkoon wrote...
Oh here, I got a better Idea.  Cite me an example of a companion you really enjoyed  and consider well written in an RPG, and I'll Show you  their  constant Ego Stroking.

Kreia the Betrayer. <3

Modifié par Skelter192, 02 octobre 2012 - 01:36 .

[Jozape]

From the KickStarter page in the comments...

Obsidian wrote...

Sorry Everyone! I have to run, having dinner with Chris Taylor (Fallout Chris Taylor, not GPG Chris Taylor).. I will be on later though.

Looks like they might be bringing some more designers on board? I don't think Chris Taylor is with Obsidian atm.

[Yrkoon]

Skelter192 wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...
Oh here, I got a better Idea.  Cite me an example of a companion you really enjoyed  and consider well written in an RPG, and I'll Show you  their  constant Ego Stroking.

Kreia the Betrayer. <3

Kreia says that Everything she's done was because of you.

[GodWood]

Yrkoon wrote...
While I'm sure in some far off, obscure, language (not English), "a variety of different ways", and "reactivity", and "brief barks or conversations about his actions" can only mean: Boot licking, and saying how badass the player is, here in reality land, they do NOT.

Derp.

Christ I'm getting the feeling I'd need to draw a picture to drill this into your head. Yes, "reactivity!", "brief barks!" etc are all wonderful things however they're all under the banner of EGO-STROKING, meaning in this instance reactivity would be ego-stroking-reactivity, brief barks would be ego-stroking-brief barks.

Oh here, I got a better Idea. Cite me an example of a companion you really enjoyed and consider well written in an RPG, and I'll Show you their constant Ego Stroking.

I'm guessing I'm going to cite a character then you're going to point out one or two times in which they compliment the player and then use that as proof of how ****ing awesome ego-stroking is.

Well no. They are not awesome because of any ego-stroking they may have had. It's actually likely I consider the times they've ego-stroked the player to be negative aspects of their character, usually because said ego-stroking is unwarranted.

slimgrin wrote...
I personally thought it was a poor choice of words by Avellone given that Bioware has a history of mistaking player empowerment for roleplaying.

Exactly.

[Yrkoon]

GodWood wrote...

Oh here, I got a better Idea. Cite me an example of a companion you really enjoyed and consider well written in an RPG, and I'll Show you their constant Ego Stroking.

I'm guessing I'm going to cite a character then you're going to point out one or two times in which they compliment the player and then use that as proof of how ****ing awesome ego-stroking is.

Well no. They are not awesome because of any ego-stroking they may have had. It's actually likely I consider the times they've ego-stroked the player to be negative aspects of their character, usually because said ego-stroking is unwarranted.

Close, but you're still wrong.  And we're delving into the psychological here.  The fact of the matter is that Any well written companion is going to ego-stroke the player in some way or another. Otherwise, your mind will interpret them as incomplete/empty/non-believable/non-aware, or just plain meh, personality wise.  Again, this is easily proved.  Show me a companion you really liked and thought was well written in an RPG, and I'll show you their ego-stroking of the player.

Because again, Avellone said Ego-stroking the Player, which means ANY companion  reaction to the player's in-game choices (positive or negative)  IS, by definition, Ego stroking,   the alternative is for that companion to not  react at all.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 02 octobre 2012 - 02:15 .

[Sister Goldring]

And we have 2.2 million 

[Yrkoon]

$2.2 million stretch Goal - reached.

[Eurypterid]

Okay, there was a nice lengthy Q&A on the Kickstarter comments page with Feargus. Some good info in here. If there's anything that seems wonky, it's likely my cut/paste:

Q: What does early access beta entail? How early are we talking?

A: We are still working out all the details, however it will be early access to the game.


Q: Hey Feargus! Any chance we'll see a t-shirt add-on? (hint hint) I'd gladly up my pledge by $25 for a t-shirt.
A: We are talking about it. The thing we are not sure how to handle is International Shipping which means we need to explain a price that is US if you already are getting sent something, US if you are not, International if you are and International if you aren't. Working to figure that all out.

Q: howdy. i really love the dungeon thing. how many levels are you hoping to hit with that?

also, would you consider releasing more stretch goals before we hit the 2.3 million one? or did the really big one that you were thinking about not pan out in the meetings?
A: We are really hoping to get that dungeon up to about 15 levels. We are working hard this week to get the word out on Project Eternity even farther.

Q: As a new member of the 1000 tier how much of our NPC will we be able to help you design? Look, mannerisms, backstory, location, ect.
A: We want to give people some fun stuff they can do on the design. Has to be reasonable to a point though! We are going to get everyone at that level a way to get a hold of us to ask questions right after the end of the campaign.

Q: Feargus what about a catfolk race? And about the mega-dungeon, it will have a direct access to surface every X levels like Watcher's Keep in BG2?
A: We want people to be able to have fun in the dungeon and also get out when they need to - so there will be ways that make sense to get back up to the surface and then back down again quickly. As for a cat like race - I leave the race stuff up to Josh, Tim and Chris to figure out - they have some fun ideas already

Q: I like the crafting approach in BG 2 with craftable legendary items made of unique ingredients (like Carsomyr = paladin sword and Eye of Tyr). Can we expect something like that for PE?
A: I think we did a fairly good job in NWN2 with the crafting system that we released after the full game - the one in either Mask of the Betrayer or Storm of Zehir. So, we have experience with the systems. Goal is to have it be fun and not load down your inventory. I was just playing Dragon's Dogma and the crafting in there is pretty good and not just inventory filling.

Q: Hi Feargus, did you thought about showing us the screenshot that amazed Adam? That could increase the pledges dramatically...
A: Still working on the screenshot, really hope to show it off soon.

Q: Will it be possible to play as both male and female as all races?
A: If appropriate, you will be able to play as a male or female for each of the races.

Q: Will the PE ranger have animal companions like the D&D one? And one of the classes will be ranged-focused (I love archers)?
A: We are talking about summons / animal companions - figuring out the right level of them so that you don't end up with a party of 12 (crazy time). There will be a class that is ranged focused.

Q: Will any of the melee classes be able to dual wield weapons? Will the player house be on water front property?
A: (1) Waterfront property.... we haven't worked it out to that level just yet, cool idea though. (2) I would expect that dual wielding is doing to sneak it's way in there.

Q: I'd love to see a dedicated spiritual successor to Planescape. This sounds more like a spiritual successor to Baldur's Gate and IWD.
A: While this is not specifically a Torment sequel, I think you will see shades of it - particularly because of Chris Avellone's heavy involvement. Not trying to change your mind or anything, just wanted to point that out.

Q: With regards to crafting, it'd be great to see a crafting system like in the BG series, where ancient pieces of legendary weapons could be found throughout the course of a game and reforged, like The Equaliser, The Wave, Flail of Ages etc etc. I absolutely loved that feature, as it gave the whole crafting process a feeling of archaeological discovery, and a sense of purpose, rather than just 'I'm making this because I want a better beat-stick'
A: Yep, that was a cool system in BG2. I think we are going to have two systems - the building of things like that, which are almost quest based in a way and then the more systems based crafting as well.

Q: It may be too late but it may have been good to have a $180-200 tier. There's a lot of people on $140.00 but less than half of that on the $250.00 tier.
A: Looking for a way to create that tier - having a hard time with what else we can add.

Q: Thinking of big ticket stretch goal items, I was thinking some sort of portrait customisation options might be appealing to backers. I don't know if it could work but some sort of layering to change hair colour, add tattoos and you know...stuff. Is that something that could be achievable?
A: I'll get that on the list. And, cool idea!

Q: Are guys are going for a deus ex like feel to quests where every problem (or a lot of them) has 3-4 ways of approaching a problem or avoiding it altogether. Like Bandits are holding someone hostage and you can a) kill the bandits, poison their food stealthily, c) bribe someone to release the hostage when everyone is asleep, d) sneak into the camp disguised as a bandit and get the hostage out, e) shoot the hostage, blame the bandits, and start a war between the town and the bandits (lol).
A: We've designed many of our quests that way all the way back to the original Fallout. Tim Cain (on Project Eternity) was one of the three miain guys behind Fallout and he's a big proponent of having different ways of solving problems. Having said that, not every quest in the game would have every single way of solving it - but we try to do as many as we can, as often as we can.

Q: Do a facebook contest (get people to like your page, reward random person with bump up tier).

Also a twitter contest to name an NPC or an item, pick a winner and give them a tier bump.
A: We talked about that and we need to talk to Kickstarter about how that could work. They generally frown on contests, however we may be able to run that over on Facebook instead.

Q: I thought up the following things to add to a $200 tier:

- Playing Cards (Similar to the IWD2 Adventure Pack but more cards and with NPCs - and their stats)
- Small Color Prints of NPCs similar to the BG2 collectors edition
- Making of / Bonus DVD with Trailers, interviews, etc
- Small plastic figure of an NPC or end boss? Or even BOTH!
- Even though there's a cloth map, Perhaps a Poster of the World Map could be included.

Those are off the top of my head
A: Thanks for the ideas. Copied onto the list. We did talk with a filming company about putting a documentary together. If the budget works, that might be something we add in for everyone at either the $35 or $50 tier and above.

Q: any word on if the digital strategy guide add-on will have detailed walkthroughs for the quests?
A: Yes it will have detailed a walk through of the game including quests. Think of it as a detailed strat guide, not one of the ten page ones that get thrown in with a game.

Q: I've been following the updates and (correct me if I'm wrong) it seems like there will be only one companion for each class. While I understand why that would be the case, I would very much like to see more than that. Take Baldur's Gate for example: There were at least 3 companions for each class (eg. Good fighter, neutral fighter, evil fighter). I found that this plethora of companion really helped add immersion as it felt like the world was more realistically populated and the game could be played through several times each with a different party. Following on from that, I would like to see the acquisition of companions handled more like BG than Dragon Age/ Jade Empire, where heaps of characters that you would never use would always be following you around, waiting at a campfire somewhere.

I know this comment was convoluted and didn't actually pose any questions directly, but I would greatly appreciate a reply.
A: We should be talking soon about something that creates a good way for you to be able to do something like that in Project Eternity.

Q: a question I was wondering since the kickstarter announcement: is the PE "small" budget, and I assume "small" developing team, enough to bring back the old Infinity Engine games spirit in terms of lenght and content (given that the big lenght, and not only the game mechanics, had a crucial role creating the memories that brought most of us here)?
A: The original IE teams were not that large and they needed to create a whole new engine with BG. Since we are starting with Unity, our own internal tools (four years of development on our conversation editor) - we feel pretty good about creating a very indepth game for the budget that we end up with on PE

Q: was wondering about the drops system. will it be randomized at all? completely static? some combination of the two?

like you always get lore items period, but if there's say gold to be included it could be in the form of a gem or necklace of equal value, and the armor stats change a bit?
A: The drops system will be semi-random. What I mean by that is there will be specific loot drop lists for things and that loot with be more made loot and not randomly created items. The loot dropped is then picked from the list. Using loot lists, lets us balance the loot that is dropping in specific parts of the game and with specific encounters without having to bring up every single monster and change their specific loot. Although we can still do that for unique things.

Q: can we have a dungeon/backer graphic?
A: Your wish is my command. Talking about it with Adam/Rob in just a bit.

Q: Any plans for a tier in between $140 and $250?
A: Sorry to be a broken record here, we are still talking about it and figuring out what to put there.

Q: Something else I would like to ask about: Will changing the difficultly setting alter the amount of experience points (assuming that the game uses XP) acquired? I found this to be an issue in previous RPGs where, if the difficulty was raised, you levelled up faster and so the harder difficulty settings weren't as much of a challenge as they could have been.
A: We generally try to use XP tables that are your "power" vs. the "power" of the things you are defeating. That usually works better than giving extra XP if things are harder. I expect that hard quests will still get more XP, but it will be the same XP no matter what difficultly level you are on.

Q: Any hope that the Character Creation Tool idea will become a reality?
A: Sorry, don't know right now. Once we figure out where we are going to be with funding, we are going to get all the ideas on the list and start prioritizing. But, I just made sure that is on the list.

Q: In the last Tim Cain update, something he said could be interpreted as that there will be per-ability cool-downs a la WoW. Could you confirm/deny this? I personally feel they are bad design, and just a cheap way to nerf overpowered skills.
A: What we are moving forward with right now is a system that does not require a pure round system. In the IE games, each person was running their own six second round and spells were based on whether they were memorzied. How we look at it, rather than going with a memorization system for spells, in particular, we can use a cool down system. It's a similar balancing system without requireing the whole resting for spells. As for ablities being on that timer, D&D also had certain abilities that could only be used a certain number of times per day - again we want to mimic that with a cool down system.

Q: regarding the quest-based crafting, Drakensang had some powerfull items craftable-only, but one ingredient necessary is always a unique trophy (like the best longbow which uses a part of a dragon) and sometimes this unique item can be used in more then one recipe, which forces a choice by the player. What about this besides the reforging weapons from BG2?
A: That's pretty cool and I'd forgotten about that system in Darkensang. I'll put it down as another option.

Q: any Idea on how customizable the player housing will be?
A: Our first goal with the housing is to have a good number of quests and NPCs surrounding it to make getting it and upgrading it fun. After that point, we are still working out the level of customization.

Q: any word on if italian, russian and polish translations will be up for a stretch goal? i know a ton of people have been asking about that, and it'd be nice to have some info for them if you have anything.
A: Might have some announcements on that very soon.....

Q: Have you already decided if there will be a big city (or more than one) in the game (like Athkatla in BG 2)?
A: We have not determined that yet. Personally, I like having a big city in our games like BG, Neverwinter, Athkatla, the Hub, Sigil, etc...

Q: An idea for you guys. If you can queue actions (use this skill, then this skill, then go here, then attack this guy), you could do tactical combat pause style, but then unpause and watch the action unfold for a bit.
A: Absolutely, we are going to have a queue system so that when you un-pause your party will follow a certain number of them. Not sure on the number exactly yet, probably around three though.

Q: as a possible stretch goal, or part of one: maybe including exotic weaponry like whips and such? i think that could be an interesting add-on.
A: Added the Exotic Weaponary idea to the list/e-mail I'm putting together here to Adam and the team.

Q: Cool-downs are not real disadvantages that you take into account when deciding what to do next. They are artificial limitations. Each ability should come with real disadvantages (long execution time while you're locked in place, huge mana cost, etc).
A: Gotcha. Personally, I think that cool downs can be used for both good and evil. We would try to stay on the path of good.

Q: Question for us $65 tier pledgers.

Is the box version going to be cardboard or plastic?

Will there be a box release after launch?
A: It will, most likely, but something similar to a double DVD case - like you see most games in now-a-days. As for after the KS for a box copy, not sure, but we don't have any plans right now to do another run of them.

Q: I guess my next question is about dialogue. Any chance for Visual Novel style dialogue where the characters talking have potraits appear on the screen that have emotions that can change and stuff while the conversation is happening? It's a fairly cheap but powerful way to show the viewer what is going on without too much cost I think.
A: Cool idea, I'll put on the list.

Q: one last question, more artistic themed, I guess. There was a difference between Tormen and BG II (the most story focused games of the IE), maybe a slight deatil for lots of people, but something I felt very important: the narrative direction. In Torment the narrative was literary, with rich and detailed written descriptions. BG was far more "prosaic", almost a dull movie script. What narrative approach can we hope in PE, more Torment like or more BG like? Wich do you prefer?
A: Best way to answer is that Torment and Fallout designers are working on Project Eternity.

[Sister Goldring]

Eurypterid - wow that was comprehensive! Great job : )

[Jozape]

Rojahar wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Sounds like a cartoon

Now I can't stop thinking weird things like "What if Obsidian made a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles RPG?"

Kind of like "What if Obsidian made a South Park RPG?".

Wait a minute...

[Gibb_Shepard]

Wouldn't his past characters alone be enough to show you that his methods work? He shared his character creating process, and it is one he has continuously used throughout his career. It's not some new methodology he's testing out with this new game.

I just think he needs to go into more depth with how he defines ego-stroking. It doesn't necessarily mean opinion-less doormats, as his past character concepts have shown. But i do think it means he avoids creating characters that **** for the sake of ****ing and don't even have the decency to give variation to said ****ing; ala Fenris. Godammit i hate that character.

[bussinrounds]

Not liking this talk about cooldowns.