78 réponses à ce sujet

[Foolsfolly]

Yate wrote...

lotta people in here who paid no attention to EC

Because it isn't a director's cut. Where it was stuff that was taken out that really helped tell the story. It was a "Holy **** we ****ed up big time. Here's a bandaid that almost covers everything."

In fact, I'd have taken an Editor's Cut instead of a Extended Cut because maybe then they'd have cut the Catalyst out of the ending. Which wouldn't completely fix the ending but it would remove about 80% of the reasons why the ending failed.

[Mcfly616]

The Catalyst is not physically capable. The Reapers are it's tools.


I also agree with Yates. Not a lot of people paid attention to the EC. Then again, it would seem a lot of the people with complaints on these forums didn't pay attention to many things

Modifié par Mcfly616, 16 septembre 2012 - 08:08 .

[Robhuzz]

At the very last moment they turned the catalyst into that spacebrat we saw. In earlier versions of ME3 it was supposedly a prothean developed virus picked up from the Prothean VI on Thessia. Not the most original idea but still far better than what we got in the end :\\

Modifié par Robhuzz, 16 septembre 2012 - 08:07 .

[Mcfly616]

Robhuzz wrote...

At the very last moment they turned the catalyst into that spacebrat we saw. In earlier versions of ME3 it was supposedly a prothean developed virus picked up from the Prothean VI on Thessia. Not the most original idea but still far better than what we got in the end :

Hahaha no its not. A Prothean virus? That would've been awful lol instead of confronting the eons old creator and central consciousness of the Reapers(a being that's been shaping the Galaxy for as long as anybody knows)? I'll pass on the stupid computer virus, and gladly stick with what we have.

Oh, and the Catalyst isn't a StarBrat. The Catalyst is not a glowing kid. It is a highly advanced AI. It "projects" itself as that stupid kid to Shepard. That's all

[LiarasShield]

Foolsfolly wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

If the catalyst always resided in the citadel why didn't it help open the arms for soverign to let the reapers in and have the invasion happen during soverigns grand parade?


In mass effect 2 why not open the relay from the citadel or our system to  have the other reapers back up the collectors?

The catalyst seems to have zero or little to no involvement in the previous games so why would you introduce a new character in the last 10 minutes that is suppose to alter the entire story?

Because the Catalyst is so last minute that its existence doesn't even gel within the third game. There's the speech with the Reaper on Rannoch where it says "Harbinger speaks of you" this shows the Reapers have individual identities complete with their own memories. Then you have the Catalyst talking like it IS the collective of the Reapers.

Last minute choice that makes no sense.

Thats why I don't understand why the catalyst was even thought of when he has no connection in the previous games

[Mcfly616]

Why would it be talked about in previous games? Especially when only a tiny tiny fraction of beings in the history of the universe have even become aware of its existence.....considering Shepard is the first being ever to see it face to face, its safe to say the Catalyst is the Galaxy's oldest darkest secret....I think that secret wouldn't exist if they would've just thrown it into ME2: "oh, by the way the Reapers are controlled by a highly advanced AI that uses the galaxy as its experiment."

Hell, in ME1 they should've just revealed that Reapers are just entire species that have been processed. And while they were at it, they should've hinted at a species known as the Collectors in ME1 as well.....since they didn't, ME2 is just stupid, because they just came out of nowhere...


See what I did there? I'm treating the first two games exactly how you act towards ME3. The Catalyst's character(simply because of what it is) has connections with the entire series, whether he was foreshadowed or not. It makes sense whether you like to admit or not. Personally, I think you should just accept the fact that you just don't like the way it ended. The ending wasn't your type of ending, just say that and leave it at that. Just because you don't like the idea of it or how it played out, doesn't mean it makes no sense....it just means the ending wasn't for you


There's movies out there, where I'm not a fan of the way they end. Well, i don't go saying things don't make any sense because of it

Modifié par Mcfly616, 16 septembre 2012 - 11:00 .

[LiarasShield]

Mcfly616 wrote...

Why would it be talked about in previous games? Especially when only a tiny tiny fraction of beings in the history of the universe have even become aware of its existence.....considering Shepard is the first being ever to see it face to face, its safe to say the Catalyst is the Galaxy's oldest darkest secret....I think that secret wouldn't exist if they would've just thrown it into ME2: "oh, by the way the Reapers are controlled by a highly advanced AI that uses the galaxy as its experiment."

Hell, in ME1 they should've just revealed that Reapers are just entire species that have been processed. And while they were at it, they should've hinted at a species known as the Collectors in ME1 as well.....since they didn't, ME2 is just stupid, because they just came out of nowhere...


See what I did there? I'm treating the first two games exactly how you act towards ME3. The Catalyst's character(simply because of what it is) has connections with the entire series, whether he was foreshadowed or not. It makes sense whether you like to admit or not. Personally, I think you should just accept the fact that you just don't like the way it ended. The ending wasn't your type of ending, just say that and leave it at that. Just because you don't like the idea of it or how it played out, doesn't mean it makes no sense....it just means the ending wasn't for you


There's movies out there, where I'm not a fan of the way they end. Well, i don't go saying things don't make any sense because of it

You don't alter the entire triliogy in the last 10 minutes the collectors made sense because they were indoctrinated protheans from long past but the reapers have always been hinted at being able to harvest or indoctrinate other races


You don't reveal a plot altering character in the last 10 minutes you don't make powerful reapers who seem to have their own agenda be demolished or erased from the previous games

Indoctrination and harvesting has always been in the previous games but their was no hint or any idea to the catalyst until the last 10 minutes


Most good writers do not alter the entire plot in the final minutes of a story

[LiarasShield]

their is true and good explainations for what went on in me1 and me2 but the catalyst undoes alot of stuff and doesn't make sense in the previous games

[Mcfly616]

LiarasShield wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

Why would it be talked about in previous games? Especially when only a tiny tiny fraction of beings in the history of the universe have even become aware of its existence.....considering Shepard is the first being ever to see it face to face, its safe to say the Catalyst is the Galaxy's oldest darkest secret....I think that secret wouldn't exist if they would've just thrown it into ME2: "oh, by the way the Reapers are controlled by a highly advanced AI that uses the galaxy as its experiment."

Hell, in ME1 they should've just revealed that Reapers are just entire species that have been processed. And while they were at it, they should've hinted at a species known as the Collectors in ME1 as well.....since they didn't, ME2 is just stupid, because they just came out of nowhere...


See what I did there? I'm treating the first two games exactly how you act towards ME3. The Catalyst's character(simply because of what it is) has connections with the entire series, whether he was foreshadowed or not. It makes sense whether you like to admit or not. Personally, I think you should just accept the fact that you just don't like the way it ended. The ending wasn't your type of ending, just say that and leave it at that. Just because you don't like the idea of it or how it played out, doesn't mean it makes no sense....it just means the ending wasn't for you


There's movies out there, where I'm not a fan of the way they end. Well, i don't go saying things don't make any sense because of it

You don't alter the entire triliogy in the last 10 minutes the collectors made sense because they were indoctrinated protheans from long past but the reapers have always been hinted at being able to harvest or indoctrinate other races


You don't reveal a plot altering character in the last 10 minutes you don't make powerful reapers who seem to have their own agenda be demolished or erased from the previous games

Indoctrination and harvesting has always been in the previous games but their was no hint or any idea to the catalyst until the last 10 minutes


Most good writers do not alter the entire plot in the final minutes of a story

as I said....why would there be? It's the greatest secret ever. You just figured out at the end of ME2 that Reapers are created through harvesting an entire race. I think that kind of changed the plot in the last 10 minutes of the game. You don't just reveal all the secrets from the get go. You uncover them game to game. I find it hard to believe Shepard is going to discover the myth of the Reapers(ME1), also discover 'how' they're created(ME2), and discover 'why' they were created(ME3), all in the course of one game.....that would defeat the purpose of a trilogy, while being completely unrealistic. Considering up until ME1, the Reapers are such a well guarded secret that nobody even believes they exist.....and you want Shepard to stumble upon all the clues of their existence and origin within the first game? Riiiight.

Besides, the Catalyst does not change the plot at the last minute. It may be a big 'reveal' or a small 'twist'. But considering the Reapers themselves are a big mystery and also big robots, I dont find it to surprising that they are 'controlled' by something like a central consciousness in order to fulfill a purpose. Bioware could've resolved the mystery in whatever way they wanted(that's the benefit of writing a resolution to a mystery) they chose one that made sense and wasn't an overused cliche ending. It doesnt alter anything, it just wasn't how you wanted it to go.

Modifié par Mcfly616, 16 septembre 2012 - 11:26 .

[DWH1982]

Starbrat didn't need to be in ME3, and, in fact shouldn't have been in ME3. Period.

Starbrat just didn't feel right, which is part of the problem. The other stuff that they introduced in ME1 and ME2 - they at least felt like Mass Effect. Starbrat didn't, which is one reason, among many, that people hate him.

Of course, nothing about the ending, even beyond Starbrat, felt like Mass Effect. So, I guess, in that sense, Starbrat fit.

[Mcfly616]

No. The catalyst doesn't undo anything.


Oh, and when you say "good" writers don't change up the direction of the plot at the last minute.....you're just completely and utterly wrong. I could list plenty of good books and movies (by good writers) that completely change everything at the last minute, revealing that everything was never as it seemed. It's actually pretty common practice

Modifié par Mcfly616, 16 septembre 2012 - 11:27 .

[LiarasShield]

Mcfly616 wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

Why would it be talked about in previous games? Especially when only a tiny tiny fraction of beings in the history of the universe have even become aware of its existence.....considering Shepard is the first being ever to see it face to face, its safe to say the Catalyst is the Galaxy's oldest darkest secret....I think that secret wouldn't exist if they would've just thrown it into ME2: "oh, by the way the Reapers are controlled by a highly advanced AI that uses the galaxy as its experiment."

Hell, in ME1 they should've just revealed that Reapers are just entire species that have been processed. And while they were at it, they should've hinted at a species known as the Collectors in ME1 as well.....since they didn't, ME2 is just stupid, because they just came out of nowhere...


See what I did there? I'm treating the first two games exactly how you act towards ME3. The Catalyst's character(simply because of what it is) has connections with the entire series, whether he was foreshadowed or not. It makes sense whether you like to admit or not. Personally, I think you should just accept the fact that you just don't like the way it ended. The ending wasn't your type of ending, just say that and leave it at that. Just because you don't like the idea of it or how it played out, doesn't mean it makes no sense....it just means the ending wasn't for you


There's movies out there, where I'm not a fan of the way they end. Well, i don't go saying things don't make any sense because of it

You don't alter the entire triliogy in the last 10 minutes the collectors made sense because they were indoctrinated protheans from long past but the reapers have always been hinted at being able to harvest or indoctrinate other races


You don't reveal a plot altering character in the last 10 minutes you don't make powerful reapers who seem to have their own agenda be demolished or erased from the previous games

Indoctrination and harvesting has always been in the previous games but their was no hint or any idea to the catalyst until the last 10 minutes


Most good writers do not alter the entire plot in the final minutes of a story

as I said....why would there be? It's the greatest secret ever. You just figured out at the end of ME2 that Reapers are created through harvesting an entire race. I think that kind of changed the plot in the last 10 minutes of the game. You don't just reveal all the secrets from the get go. You uncover them game to game. I find it hard to believe Shepard is going to discover the myth of the Reapers(ME1), also discover 'how' they're created(ME2), and discover 'why' they were created(ME3), all in the course of one game.....that would defeat the purpose of a trilogy, while being completely unrealistic. Considering up until ME1, the Reapers are such a well guarded secret that nobody even believes they exist.....and you want Shepard to stumble upon all the clues of their existence and origin within the first game? Riiiight.

Besides, the Catalyst doesn't not change the plot at the last minute. It may be a big 'reveal' or a small 'twist'. But considering the Reapers themselves are a big mystery and also big robots, I dont find it to surprising that they are 'controlled' by something like a central consciousness in order to fulfill a purpose. Bioware could've resolved the mystery in whatever way they wanted(that's the benefit of writing a resolution to a mystery) they chose one that made sense and wasn't an overused cliche ending. It doesnt alter anything, it just wasn't how you wanted it to go.

Maybe to your own perception but most stories that I know do not add a main antagonist in the last 10 minutes that does alter or change the course of the story and yes the council was the one that didn't acknowledge the reapers but plently others did shepard and crew plus anderson and many other numerous souls that I can't remember of the top of my head

The reapers seemed to have had their own agenda in me1 and me2 but then me3 towards the end destroys it and alters it in the last 10 minutes that is not ok

[spirosz]

Whatcha talkin' bout Willis, he was introduced on Twitter long before ME3 arrived, remember Tweets are canon!

[Mcfly616]

LiarasShield wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

Why would it be talked about in previous games? Especially when only a tiny tiny fraction of beings in the history of the universe have even become aware of its existence.....considering Shepard is the first being ever to see it face to face, its safe to say the Catalyst is the Galaxy's oldest darkest secret....I think that secret wouldn't exist if they would've just thrown it into ME2: "oh, by the way the Reapers are controlled by a highly advanced AI that uses the galaxy as its experiment."

Hell, in ME1 they should've just revealed that Reapers are just entire species that have been processed. And while they were at it, they should've hinted at a species known as the Collectors in ME1 as well.....since they didn't, ME2 is just stupid, because they just came out of nowhere...


See what I did there? I'm treating the first two games exactly how you act towards ME3. The Catalyst's character(simply because of what it is) has connections with the entire series, whether he was foreshadowed or not. It makes sense whether you like to admit or not. Personally, I think you should just accept the fact that you just don't like the way it ended. The ending wasn't your type of ending, just say that and leave it at that. Just because you don't like the idea of it or how it played out, doesn't mean it makes no sense....it just means the ending wasn't for you


There's movies out there, where I'm not a fan of the way they end. Well, i don't go saying things don't make any sense because of it

You don't alter the entire triliogy in the last 10 minutes the collectors made sense because they were indoctrinated protheans from long past but the reapers have always been hinted at being able to harvest or indoctrinate other races


You don't reveal a plot altering character in the last 10 minutes you don't make powerful reapers who seem to have their own agenda be demolished or erased from the previous games

Indoctrination and harvesting has always been in the previous games but their was no hint or any idea to the catalyst until the last 10 minutes


Most good writers do not alter the entire plot in the final minutes of a story

as I said....why would there be? It's the greatest secret ever. You just figured out at the end of ME2 that Reapers are created through harvesting an entire race. I think that kind of changed the plot in the last 10 minutes of the game. You don't just reveal all the secrets from the get go. You uncover them game to game. I find it hard to believe Shepard is going to discover the myth of the Reapers(ME1), also discover 'how' they're created(ME2), and discover 'why' they were created(ME3), all in the course of one game.....that would defeat the purpose of a trilogy, while being completely unrealistic. Considering up until ME1, the Reapers are such a well guarded secret that nobody even believes they exist.....and you want Shepard to stumble upon all the clues of their existence and origin within the first game? Riiiight.

Besides, the Catalyst doesn't not change the plot at the last minute. It may be a big 'reveal' or a small 'twist'. But considering the Reapers themselves are a big mystery and also big robots, I dont find it to surprising that they are 'controlled' by something like a central consciousness in order to fulfill a purpose. Bioware could've resolved the mystery in whatever way they wanted(that's the benefit of writing a resolution to a mystery) they chose one that made sense and wasn't an overused cliche ending. It doesnt alter anything, it just wasn't how you wanted it to go.

Maybe to your own perception but most stories that I know do not add a main antagonist in the last 10 minutes that does alter or change the course of the story and yes the council was the one that didn't acknowledge the reapers but plently others did shepard and crew plus anderson and many other numerous souls that I can't remember of the top of my head

The reapers seemed to have had their own agenda in me1 and me2 but then me3 towards the end destroys it and alters it in the last 10 minutes that is not ok

their agenda was essentially the Catalyst's (their central consciousness, their creator) go figure.....it alters nothing. It's still the same agenda

[LiarasShield]

did star wars alter in the last minute

did lord of the rings alter in the last minute

did harry potter alter in the last minute

did star trek alter in the last minute ?

[Mcfly616]

LiarasShield wrote...

did star wars alter in the last minute

did lord of the rings alter in the last minute

did harry potter alter in the last minute

did star trek alter in the last minute ?

cool. You named a grand total of 4 movie series.

[Mcfly616]

You're telling me you never read or watched anything, where at the end it was revealed that all along, nothing was as it seemed?


Well, that just sucks. I'm sorry you haven't experienced such stories

[Dharvy]

LiarasShield wrote...

did star wars alter in the last minute

did lord of the rings alter in the last minute

did harry potter alter in the last minute

did star trek alter in the last minute ?

What exactly did the implementing of the Catalyst alter?

[N7Gold]

LiarasShield wrote...

If the catalyst always resided in the citadel why didn't it help open the arms for soverign to let the reapers in and have the invasion happen during soverigns grand parade?


In mass effect 2 why not open the relay from the citadel or our system to  have the other reapers back up the collectors?

The catalyst seems to have zero or little to no involvement in the previous games so why would you introduce a new character in the last 10 minutes that is suppose to alter the entire story?

I seriously doubt he's designed to control the Citadel. Since his real name is The Intelligence, his goal is to find out how to reach the ideal solution, which is Synthesis. The Citadel is just his "house", nothing more.

[LiarasShield]

Mcfly616 wrote...

You're telling me you never read or watched anything, where at the end it was revealed that all along, nothing was as it seemed?


Well, that just sucks. I'm sorry you haven't experienced such stories

Yeah the grand stories that will be remembered throughout all time don't have any last minute plot alterors as you may see

Modifié par LiarasShield, 17 septembre 2012 - 01:07 .

[SpamBot2000]

LiarasShield wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

You're telling me you never read or watched anything, where at the end it was revealed that all along, nothing was as it seemed?


Well, that just sucks. I'm sorry you haven't experienced such stories

Yeah the grand stories that will be remembered throughout all time don't have any last minute plot alterors as you may see

There are stories and there are stories. This one was a one of a kind epic RPG trilogy that many players have been emotionally invested in for years with their highly personalized avatars. Taking that investment and using it to force players to collaborate in the trashing of the fictional universe they loved shows an utter lack of respect for the players. If it was done in the spirit of art, it was a guerrilla stunt to shock the masses, designed to elicit our outrage. But it wasn't really. It was a story of how Mr. Hudson and Mr. Walters decided to leave the game business behind with a grand gesture of screw you to their bosses and the gaming public, all the while counting on said public to unwittingly support their own debasement. And it seems to have worked with some members of that public. 

Modifié par SpamBot2000, 17 septembre 2012 - 08:46 .

[KiwiQuiche]

Because.





Yeah, that's all I've got.

[LiarasShield]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Because.





Yeah, that's all I've got.

Sighs U_u I need migrane medicine I tell ya cause my head hurts from seeing the starchild

[LiarasShield]

Arcian wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

If the catalyst always resided in the citadel why didn't it help open the arms for soverign to let the reapers in and have the invasion happen during soverigns grand parade?

In mass effect 2 why not open the relay from the citadel or our system to  have the other reapers back up the collectors?

The catalyst seems to have zero or little to no involvement in the previous games so why would you introduce a new character in the last 10 minutes that is suppose to alter the entire story?

Super MAC. The very best there is. When you absolutely, positively have to destroy every mother****ng trace of a Covenant ship or franchise, accept no substitutes.

awesome post lol