513 réponses à ce sujet

[upsettingshorts]

"Project Eternity has 69,000 backers! SEE BIOWARE!"

"Who cares how many people play Mass Effect 3 multiplayer?!"

Yawn.

[FedericoV]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

"Project Eternity has 69,000 backers! SEE BIOWARE!"

"Who cares how many people play Mass Effect 3 multiplayer?!"

Apple and oranges.

I would like to see what kind of funding Bioware could raise with a KS campaign for ME multyplayer or a DA2 expansion, though. It could be a moment of truth, one way or the other.

[upsettingshorts]

FedericoV wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

"Project Eternity has 69,000 backers! SEE BIOWARE!"

"Who cares how many people play Mass Effect 3 multiplayer?!"

Apple and oranges.

Nope, not really.  It's just your standard run-of-the-mill hypocrisy.  Popularity is only a useful statistic around these parts if it reinforces your pre-existing perceptions.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 16 octobre 2012 - 07:19 .

[axl99]

They technically can't do that since ME and DA are already published.

Maybe it'd be different with a new IP altogether, but the business relationship between EA and Bioware may require that new IP be funded by the publisher regardless.

[mesmerizedish]

axl99 wrote...

They technically can't do that since ME and DA are already published.

Maybe it'd be different with a new IP altogether, but the business relationship between EA and Bioware may require that new IP be funded by the publisher regardless.

There is no business relationship between EA and BioWare.

BioWare are EA operating under a marketing name.

This is a big thing that a lot of the BSN don't seem to understand.

[FedericoV]

Upsettingshorts wrote...


Nope, not really.  It's just your standard run-of-the-mill hypocrisy.  Popularity is only a useful statistic around these parts if it reinforces your pre-existing perceptions.

I don't know. You're comparing the popularity of a new IP kickstarter (wich is not a game, just a promise of a game and the process of getting the money needed to develop that game) with the popularity of a playable game of a very famous franchise supported by millions of dollars in term of marketing and advertising.

Probably, ME3 ad campaign for the MP alone has costed more than what Obsidian is getting with the KS for PE. 

It would be more fitting to compare ME3 MP popularity with... I don't know, CoD MP or BF3 MP popularity or... I don't know, I don't play MP games anyway. Then, do as you like, for me it's still apple and oranges.

Btw, I sense some bitterness and there's no need. Thanks to the success of PE's KS and other crowd sourced game, Bioware is free to do what they want with the DA franchise with no worry of backlashes like what's happened with DA2... or ME3... or the ever popular TOR. 

Modifié par FedericoV, 16 octobre 2012 - 07:49 .

[FedericoV]

axl99 wrote...

They technically can't do that since ME and DA are already published.

I was just talking hypothetically. It's obvious that the EA's Edmonton studio called Bioware won't make any KS.

[Atakuma]

FedericoV wrote...
Btw, I sense some bitterness and there's no need. Thanks to the success of PE's KS and other crowd sourced game, Bioware is free to do what they want with the DA franchise with no worry of backlashes from older players like me like what's happened with DA2. 

True, Project Eternity, with it's magical RPG powers, will put an end to any backlash directed at Dragon Age.

[SpEcIaLRyAn]

I don't really care about the graphics but they couldn't hurt. It'd be nice if the were good this time. DA2 was an improvement but not by much.

[FedericoV]

Atakuma wrote...

True, Project Eternity, with it's magical RPG powers, will put an end to any backlash directed at Dragon Age.

What I mean, and I will stop it here since I haven't any need to start a flame is pretty simple. There were a lot of people angry with DA2 because of its abandonment of the whole "BG spiritual successor" theme. Not because they are angry lunatics but because they still like the IE games and they liked how DA:O tried to modernize that model. DA:O was the first game in years to cather to their tastes. And Bioware mostly abdandoned the whole model behind just after one game even if DA:O was quite successfull and praised critically.

Now, there's PE and other cool games that will cather to that niche. I guess that will stop at least in part the backlashes coming from that part of the potential DA player base.

[axl99]

The fact this thread has gone on a good 13 pages is a clear indicator that we need to see screenshots - but preferably a 1 hr game demo - to validate our own opinion on Dragon Age and Bioware by extension.

[Allan Schumacher]

It would be more fitting to compare ME3 MP popularity with... I don't know, CoD MP or BF3 MP popularity or... I don't know, I don't play MP games anyway. Then, do as you like, for me it's still apple and oranges.

Eh. I have seen a lot of people cite the backer number as proof that there's a significant group of individuals that appreciate the old school IE games, and I think if those people are dismissive towards the popularity of ME3's multiplayer and how it wasn't necessary aren't really being fair.

What I mean, and I will stop it here since I haven't any need to
start a flame is pretty simple. There were a lot of people angry with
DA2 because of its abandonment of the whole "BG spiritual successor"
theme. Not because they are angry lunatics but because they still like
the IE games and they liked how DA:O tried to modernize that model. DA:O
was the first game in years to cather to their tastes. And Bioware
mostly abdandoned the whole model behind just after one game even if
DA:O was quite successfull and praised critically.

Now, there's
PE and other cool games that will cather to that niche. I guess that
will stop at least in part the backlashes coming from that part of the
potential DA player base.

I think this will happen in some capacity, but I've also seen jabs and other passive aggressive types of comments that use the Kickstarter as support/ammunition for their critiques of BioWare.  Hopefully it becomes more of a "Well I am getting what I want elsewhere too" but I'd be surprised if those that lurk on the BSN simply to take potshots at BioWare really change much, unfortunately.

Modifié par Allan Schumacher, 16 octobre 2012 - 08:18 .

[FedericoV]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

It would be more fitting to compare ME3 MP popularity with... I don't know, CoD MP or BF3 MP popularity or... I don't know, I don't play MP games anyway. Then, do as you like, for me it's still apple and oranges.

Eh. I have seen a lot of people cite the backer number as proof that there's a significant group of individuals that appreciate the old school IE games, and I think if those people are dismissive towards the popularity of ME3's multiplayer and how it wasn't necessary aren't really being fair.

Oh... but I agree on that one. ME3 MP is popular, no reason to deny that. I would never play it because I do not like MP and in my opinion it has a negative influece on the game in many ways, but it's clearly popular.

I think this will happen in some capacity, but I've also seen jabs and other passive aggressive types of comments that use the Kickstarter as support/ammunition for their critiques of BioWare.  Hopefully it becomes more of a "Well I am getting what I want elsewhere too" but I'd be surprised if those that lurk on the BSN simply to take potshots at BioWare really change much, unfortunately.

It doesn't mean much but personally I can say that I will be able to approach DA3 in a more calm and open way when and if I will play it. I tried with DA2 but I couldn't at the end. About the jabs... consider that Bioware comunication during DA2 launch wasn't that forthcoming for the tastes of those people too. It has been a reaction in many ways.

Modifié par FedericoV, 16 octobre 2012 - 08:33 .

[Allan Schumacher]

About the jabs... consider that Bioware comunication during DA2 launch wasn't that forthcoming for the tastes of those people too. It has been a reaction in many ways.

I'm sure most, if not all, of those that fire off jabs feel justified in doing so.

[eyesofastorm]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

I think this will happen in some capacity, but I've also seen jabs and other passive aggressive types of comments that use the Kickstarter as support/ammunition for their critiques of BioWare. Hopefully it becomes more of a "Well I am getting what I want elsewhere too" but I'd be surprised if those that lurk on the BSN simply to take potshots at BioWare really change much, unfortunately.

Attitudes on the BSN are somewhat self-perpetuating I think. Back in the years while DA:O was still in development, the boards were predominantly "old-school" and very supportive of Bioware in general. People who came in with negative attitudes or crazy ideas like taking the franchise in an action oriented direction (ala the nut bag who wanted DA to be like AssCreed) were quickly shouted down and sent packing because the majority seemed to generally feel one way and there was little or no voice to support dissenters. Of course there is an ebb and flow to these "general attitudes", but it really seemed like post-DA2 that Biohate perpetuated more Biohate. If the folks who saw Bioware as their last bastion for true old-school RPG greatness (I'm one of these) are secure enough that inexile and Obsidian can and will deliver what they so desperately crave (I am), then maybe they will finally let Bioware fly free. That's kind of how I feel. I don't "need" Bioware anymore... I've found someone new so to speak. So maybe, a large percentage of the "haters" just let go and the general attitude of the BSN can flow back to butterflies and rainbows and whatnot. I hope so anyway... nothing good has come of what has happened here in the last few years. I guess time will tell.

[FedericoV]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

About the jabs... consider that Bioware comunication during DA2 launch wasn't that forthcoming for the tastes of those people too. It has been a reaction in many ways.

I'm sure most, if not all, of those that fire off jabs feel justified in doing so.

Look, I was one of the people who tried to defend your work on DA2 until I played and finished the game. I'm ashamed to admit that I wanted to like DA2 so much that I even rated positevely the demo on the boards: in retrospect, I was wrong . I defended your right to change direction in many long fights on those boards (loosed them all but I do not regret it)... even if I liked more the old model.

I'm just saying that if you start with "spiritual successor to BG" (I was there in the BG2 boards the first time you used that phrase) and end with "button and awesome", marketing your new game by dismissing the older (and succesfull) one and presenting a beloved genre as a fossil of game design, you're asking for trouble. You are nerds too, you like RPGs too. You must know how it feels.

[axl99]

Can we talk about how awesome Frostbyte 2 is as a game engine that delivers on realtime lighting?

Sure the UDK and CryEngine3 can deliver similar results, but we're talking about realtime simulated results here. In any case, it's always nice to hear the devs aren't using an antiquidated, user-unfriendly engine for their game.

/back on topic

Modifié par axl99, 16 octobre 2012 - 09:34 .

[upsettingshorts]

FedericoV wrote...

I don't know. You're comparing the popularity of a new IP kickstarter (wich is not a game, just a promise of a game and the process of getting the money needed to develop that game) with the popularity of a playable game of a very famous franchise supported by millions of dollars in term of marketing and advertising.

No, I'm not. 

I'm comparing one argument to another, based on the citation of popularity as an endorsement of a position.  It is viewed as valid in one context, and invalid in another.  This is standard hypocrisy.    

(I contributed to PE.  I like Dragon Age 2.  Does that blow your mind?)

FedericoV wrote...

Btw, I sense some bitterness

FedericoV wrote...

I'm just saying that if you start with "spiritual successor to BG" (I was there in the BG2 boards the first time you used that phrase) and end with "button and awesome", marketing your new game by dismissing the older (and succesfull) one and presenting a beloved genre as a fossil of game design, you're asking for trouble. You are nerds too, you like RPGs too. You must know how it feels. 

axl99 wrote...

Can we talk about how awesome Frostbyte 2 is as a game engine that delivers on realtime lighting? 

Sure the UDK and CryEngine3 can deliver similar results, but we're talking about realtime simulated results here. In any case, it's always nice to hear the devs aren't using an antiquidated, user-unfriendly engine for their game.

/back on topic

Yay!

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 16 octobre 2012 - 10:27 .

[Maria Caliban]

axl99 wrote...

Can we talk about how awesome Frostbyte 2 is as a game engine that delivers on realtime lighting?

Sure the UDK and CryEngine3 can deliver similar results, but we're talking about realtime simulated results here. In any case, it's always nice to hear the devs aren't using an antiquidated, user-unfriendly engine for their game.

/back on topic

I don't really care about realtime simulated results, but it sounds very impressive.

Alternatively, I like that BioWare has a user friendly engine.

[Atakuma]

axl99 wrote...

Can we talk about how awesome Frostbyte 2 is as a game engine that delivers on realtime lighting?

Sure the UDK and CryEngine3 can deliver similar results, but we're talking about realtime simulated results here. In any case, it's always nice to hear the devs aren't using an antiquidated, user-unfriendly engine for their game.

/back on topic

Apparently it's very complex, or at least that's the excuse they gave for why BF3 didn't have mod tools.

[FedericoV]

Upsettingshorts wrote...
No, I'm not. 

I'm comparing one argument to another, based on the citation of popularity as an endorsement of a position.  It is viewed as valid in one context, and invalid in another.  This is standard hypocrisy.   

I'm not. Still, your argument sound forced, biased and a little bitter to me.

(I contributed to PE.  I like Dragon Age 2.  Does that blow your mind?)

LOL... yes, thanks, you changed my life like forever ! I don't see any issue since at the end we're just talking about games. Do you really think that everyone except yourself see life in black and white?

Back on topic, the engine used by the game do not say anything about its gameplay or its look. It is known. We cannot judge anything untill we see ingame footage.

Modifié par FedericoV, 17 octobre 2012 - 07:40 .

[brushyourteeth]

axl99 wrote...

Can we talk about how awesome Frostbyte 2 is as a game engine that delivers on realtime lighting?

Sure the UDK and CryEngine3 can deliver similar results, but we're talking about realtime simulated results here. In any case, it's always nice to hear the devs aren't using an antiquidated, user-unfriendly engine for their game.

/back on topic

That was amazing! Thanks for the share.

There's this scene in DG's "The Stolen Throne" where the party is in the Deep Roads in the pitch dark and they wandered into a chamber full of corrupted spiders. The only way to kill them all was to light their collective webs on fire, which lit up the whole room and filled it with smoke.

If Frostbite 2 could pull off something like that, I think I'd pee my gamer pants.

[sassyJacen]

Oh this sounds so cool!! hopefully it will come to xbox 360, if it can handel skyrim it can handel anything!
Hmmm, you think bioware has spent time with the folks at bethseda?:-/

[Kileyan]

I am interested in how this new engine will affect the game Bioware makes. In the last couple of Bioware engines, you could see a large area sometimes, but most often you were herded into tiny little pathways that were actually navigable and could be interacted with. You couldn't swim, or even hop over a small log.

With this new game engine, will we be able to walk to anything we can see(other than background paintings), leap over that log, climb over a low fence wade through that stream, dare I say.....will we be able to swim or in my wildest dreams a minor levitation spell?

Just curious exactly what is going to be done with this engine. Will the game embrace the abilities of the engine, or will the engine just be used to emulate a prettier version of their old game engines.