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[rapscallioness]

ShadowDragoonFTW wrote...

rapscallioness wrote...

Well, no racist animations. I'm assuming that means more natural looking dark skin tones? Yay! I want my PC to be swarthy Moor.

No, it most likely means that a character model was doing some kind of weird gesture that someone took the wrong way. When "animations" are said in the context of game design, they rarely have anything to do with color pallette, it's pretty much always the way a body/object moves.

Unless you're talking about sprite-based games, then everything is animation. 

Ah! I see.

Okay, that's cool, too. I guess. I mean I'm not against the Inquisitor having a Pimp Walk. The Inquisitor apparently already has a Pimp Cape. I'd actually be totally okay w/that. Lol.

But srsly, I must say I find that DA games have some of the best "animations" (pc/npc body movement) I've ever played. I decided to do a lil ME3 PT recently...and I can really feel the difference when I'm moving Shep around. Or even how the NPC's move. There's a certain stiffness there I can't quite explain. And a certain..NPC thousand mile stare.

In DA I noticed that the NPC's will move their heads to look at whoever is talking at that moment. As opposed to just staring straight ahead while the PC has a convo w/someone.

It's more fluid and natural.

Altho, I will say I luv the way Shep does this over the shoulder look while walking away body movement. Luv it. Very gangster.

[Yrkoon]

ShadowDragoonFTW wrote...

They seem to be really pumped on the combat this time around. I have a good feeling about this...
 .

Not nearly as "pumped" as they were last time.  You remember last time, right?  Where they held whole PRESS CONFERENCES to brag about the 'awesome button".....

[GithCheater]

Well, the combat was awesome as it was faster and more visceral. However, on the other hand, the combat was less tactical, had over the top "ninja" moves, and worst of all, random parachuting enemies .

I am not so concerned about the awesome button possibly being in DAI, as Bioware "showed" better combat in the DA2 DLC (more tactical and less parachuting), and have repeatedly indicated that combat will be improved.

I am, however, concerned about the hype train, as I absolutely hated DAO (this is the new crap) and DA2 (fight like a spartan) over the top hype.

[ElitePinecone]

ladyofpayne wrote...

When the earliest show will be?

The northern hemisphere Spring, it looks like. That's some time from late March to late June, but i'd think closer to March or April is more likely.

GithCheater wrote...

I am, however, concerned about the hype train, as I absolutely hated DAO (this is the new crap) and DA2 (fight like a spartan) over the top hype.

The marketing for DA2 was massively frustrating, to me. I know it's not targeted at existing fans so much as it is new players or gamers unfamiliar with the franchise, but "think like a general, fight like a Spartan" was so nonsensical and jarring that I actually became cynical about the game itself.

[Fast Jimmy]

simfamSP wrote...

Thinking about it, marketing for BioWare games hasn't been really good since 2009. I personally wasn't there for the ride, but hearing people talk about it here draws those conclusions.

Eh. The Marilyn Manson trailers or the lingerie photo shoots with girls in chain mail bikini weren't any better. Bioware has never been all that good at marketing their actual product and instead loves to use sensationalist tactics that don't actually deal with their gameplay content at all. 

Contrast that with Skyrim, who used a live action trailer of a scene that can happen in the game and then actual game screenshots in their trailers. Bioware needs to learn that just like a movie trailer that doesn't tell you anything about the movie doesn't sell movie tickets, a marketing campaign that doesn't tell you anything about the actual game won't sell games. 

Modifié par Fast Jimmy, 04 février 2013 - 02:33 .

[andar91]

I agree that the marketing sometimes seems off to me. However, the CGI trailers are really cool. The Sacred Ashes trailer for DA:O is still one of my favorites. Kind of like the Old Republic trailers. Those are neat! They don't necessarily represent actual gameplay, but they can get you excited.

[ElitePinecone]

People may know David Gaider has relatively recently started a Tumblr, and even though this is technically the Twitter thread some of the posts there are a really frank and fascinating look at the game design process. I'd definitely recommend reading them to get an insight into the challenges and thought processes of game design that devs might not necessarily share that often.

This one today, about Cole from Asunder, struck me as very... portentous. I don't think we saw the last of him in the novel, and I'm really interested in his future role in the universe as a whole. Hopefully one day David can share the origins of the character, writers talking about that kind of thing is always really interesting.

[Face of Evil]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

Eh. The Marilyn Manson trailers or the lingerie photo shoots with girls in chain mail bikini weren't any better. Bioware has never been all that good at marketing their actual product and instead loves to use sensationalist tactics that don't actually deal with their gameplay content at all.

I can appreciate the intent of the Marilyn Manson trailer, as it was actually pretty catch-y and very fitting with the imagery in the trailer. That said, I know what that song is actually about and it shouldn't come within ten feet of any advertising product.

[Fiddzz]

I really liked the Marilyn Manson trailer for DA:O (it's how I found out/reason I bought the game way back when)

Bioware needs to learn that just like a movie trailer that doesn't tell you anything about the movie doesn't sell movie tickets, a marketing campaign that doesn't tell you anything about the actual game won't sell games.

I disagree with this, movie trailers should not be considered a valid comparison for video game trailers. The less description of a movie in a movie trailer the better. Where as game trailers I prefer the opposite. for example the 3 min Bioshock Infinite CGI trailer I was "meh looks cool" the 10 min Bioshock Infinite gameplay trailer I was like "TAKE MY MONEY" same with The Last of Us.

[ReallyRue]

simfamSP wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

My black avatar doesn't get it. Does he mean just darker shades?

I think he means if a character wants skin from Uganda, they won't have skin like chocolate-cake splattered onto a blackboard. We can actually have a very dark skin-tone without being the oompa lumpas of Thedas xD.

Oh, I will be so glad if this is true! I usually play characters with darker skin tones, but I never picked the darkest in DAO because they looked like mottled purple, or DA2 where they looked like strange powder. It'll be lovely to have a nice even dark skin tone on my main character.

[Fast Jimmy]

Blair Brown wrote...

I really liked the Marilyn Manson trailer for DA:O (it's how I found out/reason I bought the game way back when)

Bioware needs to learn that just like a movie trailer that doesn't tell you anything about the movie doesn't sell movie tickets, a marketing campaign that doesn't tell you anything about the actual game won't sell games.

I disagree with this, movie trailers should not be considered a valid comparison for video game trailers. The less description of a movie in a movie trailer the better. Where as game trailers I prefer the opposite. for example the 3 min Bioshock Infinite CGI trailer I was "meh looks cool" the 10 min Bioshock Infinite gameplay trailer I was like "TAKE MY MONEY" same with The Last of Us.

Well, I don't disagree with you on that. But I kind of consider a ten minute video discussing gameplay elements not exactly a "trailer" per se. In-depth videos discussing how a game works are awesome, but I wouldn't consider them marketing in the more traditional sense.

Again, Bethesda does in depth videos about the game mechanics and their development process really well. When Skyrim came out, you could watch two hours worth of videos discussing game physics, NPC behavior, their new radiant quest system, the new leveling system, etc. And their trailers showed clips from their actual game or a live action trailer of the Dragonborn confronting a dragon that is attacking a village, complete with the villagers running away (a scenario that can 100% happen in game).

Contrast that with DA2, which had a few in-depth videos which were developers using some of the now-cliche phrases (hot rod samurai, think like a general - fight lien a Spartan, virginal girl next door or up against the wall do it right here romances, Awesome Button, etc.) and then a CG trailer showing a Mage Hawke going toe to toe with the Arishok, fighting him with staff and spell (when the reality of the Arishok duel was constant kiting and moving around as fast as possible for twenty minutes, avoiding any direct contact in the least).

One is an explanation of your game and demonstrates what can happen in it. The other is a total buzz words campaign and a representation of a scene so far removed from the actual game it borders on ludicrous. The same could be said of the DA:O Sacred Ashes trailer, but at least those showed your companions taking out Darkspawn mooks fairly easily instead of HP bloated bosses.

I don't think any of DA's marketing campaigns to date were effective at selling what the product actually was. Don't get me wrong - they may or may not have resulted in more sales. But I don't think that what was being sold was accurately reflected at all with what was being Marketted. In Origins, I didn't mind, because I loved the final product. With DA2, I felt like it was a litte patronizing, since the way things were hyped were so far off the mark that it was infuriating to me.

Modifié par Fast Jimmy, 04 février 2013 - 08:27 .

[Fast Jimmy]

Skyrim's trailer just showed a Dragonborn strolling through a village and a dragon landing, presumably to start a fight. Nothing was shown regarding the fight itself.

In (stark) contrast to the CG Arishok fight, which showed Mage Hawke engaged in melee combat (which would have resulted in the Arishok executing him on sight with his one-hit kill move) and then taking him down with two spells, which couldn't be further than the truth.

[Yrkoon]

simfamSP wrote...
I've never seen a CGI trailer that shows anything from the gameplay really, unless it's a FPS.

Agreed.  And that's the  main problem with the majority of game trailers  these days.    Despite their subtle (and  sometimes unsubtle)  presentations, they usually  lack anything meaningful  with regards to the game itself.  One gets Far more information from demonstration broadcasts and , yes, listening to developers actually talking about the game.

Skyrim's trailer is the perfect example here.    Skyrim's CGI trailer was "cool", I suppose, but  information wise, it didn't tell us a damn thing beyond "there's dragons, and they attack villages."  Thus, it failed to properly advertise the game to me.  Far far more sucessful  were the little infomercials/demonstrations   of Todd Howard playing the game while the camera rolled.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 05 février 2013 - 12:14 .

[HiroVoid]

CGI trailers are usually shown in the hope they get a bigger crowd to watch it as well as the more casual market. It's also useful if your actual gameplay and visuals suck. A good gameplay trailer can do loads better than any CGI trailer though if Watch Dogs is any indication.

[Rorschachinstein]

CGI cinematic trailers are supposed to be announcements. Not really a form to test or reveal the videogames features.

[GithCheater]

Blair Brown wrote...

I really liked the Marilyn Manson trailer for DA:O (it's how I found out/reason I bought the game way back when)

Bioware needs to learn that just like a movie trailer that doesn't tell you anything about the movie doesn't sell movie tickets, a marketing campaign that doesn't tell you anything about the actual game won't sell games.

I disagree with this, movie trailers should not be considered a valid comparison for video game trailers. The less description of a movie in a movie trailer the better. Where as game trailers I prefer the opposite. for example the 3 min Bioshock Infinite CGI trailer I was "meh looks cool" the 10 min Bioshock Infinite gameplay trailer I was like "TAKE MY MONEY" same with The Last of Us.

I would not have considered seeing the new Star Trek (May 2013?), as I thought it would just be a cheap ripoff of the original.

However, after seeing "awesome" Star Trek previews in IMAX 3D, I now must see it in the theatres.

I recall seeing Bioware demo trailers for DA2 and thought they were "awesome".  However, the repetitive "Awesome Button" market speak left a bad aftertaste in my mouth.  Although I enjoyed DA2, that aftertaste got much worse after I grew tired of parachuting enemies and reused maps.

Perhaps if the DA2 marketing was not blatant hype, maybe any backlash over DA2 game imperfections might have been less severe.  However ... this is the internet so all bets are off ...

I hope that DAI marketing turns out to be more realistic (like actual gameplay without showing the dialog choices, screen icons or mouse clicks).

Modifié par GithCheater, 05 février 2013 - 04:57 .

[MilaBanilla]

Rorschachinstein wrote...

CGI cinematic trailers are supposed to be announcements. Not really a form to test or reveal the videogames features.

That's what I thought as well.
Announcements and some fancy/movie like advertisment of the game . 

[Fiddzz]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

Blair Brown wrote...

snip

snip

snip

Well, I don't disagree with you on that. But I kind of consider a ten minute video discussing gameplay elements not exactly a "trailer" per se. In-depth videos discussing how a game works are awesome, but I wouldn't consider them marketing in the more traditional sense.

 

I should have edited my post after i saw it, the Last of Us gameplay trailer was 10min, the Bioshock gameplay was 3min, just like the cgi one.

I meant to compare the CGI vs. Gameplay of Bioshock.  While I don't usually like huge long 10min gameplay trailers... the one for The last of us... blew my mind until i just started throwing money at my montior in the hopes that the game would appear on my HD.

[Allan Schumacher]

I have always just considered CGI trailers to be "buzz creators" and are used more for product exposure than for anything else.

They don't have a huge influence on me (at least I don't think they do), but by the same token I don't feel comfortable dismissing their effectiveness as a marketing tool outright. Simply because they don't appeal to me doesn't mean that they aren't effective.

I know they can be expensive, so perhaps I am being naive, but I get the impression that if they aren't seeing the results they want after releasing one, it'd be difficult to justify them.

[serenai]

ElitePinecone wrote...

People may know David Gaider has relatively recently started a Tumblr, and even though this is technically the Twitter thread some of the posts there are a really frank and fascinating look at the game design process. I'd definitely recommend reading them to get an insight into the challenges and thought processes of game design that devs might not necessarily share that often.

This one today, about Cole from Asunder, struck me as very... portentous. I don't think we saw the last of him in the novel, and I'm really interested in his future role in the universe as a whole. Hopefully one day David can share the origins of the character, writers talking about that kind of thing is always really interesting.

I enjoy his blog a great deal. It's one of the few I visit regularly. Not only do I enjoy learning about the creative process and development and behind the scenes info, but I also simply enjoy his writing. A cup of coffee + Mr. Gaider's blog = a good start to the morning. I wish we could see him more around here.