1841 réponses à ce sujet

[In Exile]

Degs29 wrote...
Haha, that's a great poke at the movie and video game industry.

I'm all for equal opportunity objectification, but is that actually supposed to be attractive?

[vehzeel]

The sex scenes in games tend to be cringe-worthy. I think they are in the DA and in the ME series. Romances in games can be good and fun, but the visuals hamper them. Fade to black is a good way to handle it, I think.

[Plaintiff]

In Exile wrote...

Degs29 wrote...
Haha, that's a great poke at the movie and video game industry.

I'm all for equal opportunity objectification, but is that actually supposed to be attractive?

No, which is the point.

If men in media were treated the way women in meida are, the results would be unsettling.

[zMataxa]

I am surprised that Bioware hasn't gone modular with all the options.
"Plug-ins" that you can buy.
Voice vs silent protaganist. Different cost.
Fade to Black vs. additional detailed romances including nudity.
Then consumers can say i bought the base game with such and such mods.
You can buy cars and tech devices from the same manufacturer with different options...
I don't get why dev studios can't see this and monetize accordingly?!

Better yet, allow devs to submit mods via an EA store like Apple...for resale for commissions
I mean come on...read about GMOD (minus the apple store idea)...and see why it was so successful.
Hint: Tool Kit. Puuuulease!!

That's all short, for variety is the spice of life and some of us want nudity in some form.
Cheers!

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Rubios wrote...

Nude people on a bloody themed killing simulator would be just disgusting.

I agree in part, but if the nudity and the killing are kept separate then there's no problem.

Modifié par Riverdaleswhiteflash, 30 juillet 2013 - 05:15 .

[Vilegrim]

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

Rubios wrote...

Nude people on a bloody themed killing simulator would be just disgusting.

I agree in part, but if the nudity and the killing are kept separate then there's no problem.

To quote Mage the Ascensions Book of Madness: We come into the world naked, screaming and covered in blood..why does the fun have to end their? 

[dracuella]

zMataxa wrote...

I am surprised that Bioware hasn't gone modular with all the options.
"Plug-ins" that you can buy.
Voice vs silent protaganist. Different cost.
Fade to Black vs. additional detailed romances including nudity.
Then consumers can say i bought the base game with such and such mods.
You can buy cars and tech devices from the same manufacturer with different options...
I don't get why dev studios can't see this and monetize accordingly?!

Better yet, allow devs to submit mods via an EA store like Apple...for resale for commissions
I mean come on...read about GMOD (minus the apple store idea)...and see why it was so successful.
Hint: Tool Kit. Puuuulease!!

Something along these thoughts but in-built? Perhaps a switch of sorts you can set that disables sex scenes and enables fade to black? Alternative thinking is the way to go, I think.

Oh and regarding the commissioned mods? OMG I WANT THIS! *throws money at the screen*

[IC-07]

Rubios wrote...

Nude people on a bloody themed killing simulator would be just disgusting.

We need a sex scene among corpses in a fountain full of blood. Perfect idea.

[Degs29]

Plaintiff wrote...

In Exile wrote...

Degs29 wrote...
Haha, that's a great poke at the movie and video game industry.

I'm all for equal opportunity objectification, but is that actually supposed to be attractive?

No, which is the point.

If men in media were treated the way women in meida are, the results would be unsettling.

Yes, but men find the same thing attractive in women characters, to varying degrees.  If women don't find such a costume attractive on their male characters, then that's a difference between the sexes.  Of course we, as straight men, don't find such a costume attractive on men.  But who's to say bi men and straight women don't?  I think we need more flavoured opinions. 

[PillarBiter]

if the nudity is functional (as in eg a temptress demon), then sure. If it's not, then it doesn't really have to be in there. There is no reason a romance scene NEEDS to have nudity.

if you want a fix, there are plenty of websites that offer it.

[Zazzerka]

It was wonderfully considerate of the soldiers at Fort Drakon to leave underwear on the people they'd just tortured to death.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Degs29 wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

No, which is the point.

If men in media were treated the way women in meida are, the results would be unsettling.

Yes, but men find the same thing attractive in women characters, to varying degrees.  If women don't find such a costume attractive on their male characters, then that's a difference between the sexes.  Of course we, as straight men, don't find such a costume attractive on men.  But who's to say bi men and straight women don't?  I think we need more flavoured opinions. 

I thought Plaintiff was gay?

Modifié par Riverdaleswhiteflash, 30 juillet 2013 - 03:52 .

[Degs29]

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

Degs29 wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

No, which is the point.

If men in media were treated the way women in meida are, the results would be unsettling.

Yes, but men find the same thing attractive in women characters, to varying degrees.  If women don't find such a costume attractive on their male characters, then that's a difference between the sexes.  Of course we, as straight men, don't find such a costume attractive on men.  But who's to say bi men and straight women don't?  I think we need more flavoured opinions. 

I thought Plaintiff was gay?

I wouldn't know.

[Zazzerka]

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

I thought Plaintiff was gay?

Fabulously.

[elvici]

Degs29 wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

In Exile wrote...

Degs29 wrote...
Haha, that's a great poke at the movie and video game industry.

I'm all for equal opportunity objectification, but is that actually supposed to be attractive?

No, which is the point.

If men in media were treated the way women in meida are, the results would be unsettling.

Yes, but men find the same thing attractive in women characters, to varying degrees.  If women don't find such a costume attractive on their male characters, then that's a difference between the sexes.  Of course we, as straight men, don't find such a costume attractive on men.  But who's to say bi men and straight women don't?  I think we need more flavoured opinions. 

Whoa!     How's this for a "flavoured opinion"? I don't think it's very smart to project your own preferences onto the immensely vast, incredibly varied population of "straight men" worldwide!   Not that I don't find that costume absolutely horrendous (and amusing), but even so...

By your rationale, I should be able to assert "of course we, as bisexual women, find straight men who attempt to generalize on a world scale extraordinarily daft and arrogant (regardless of their sartorial choices)."  <_<

Besides which, I think you missed the (very valid) point Plaintiff was making. 

Modifié par elvici, 30 juillet 2013 - 05:04 .

[Sylvanpyxie]

"Should there be nudity?" is a very broad question... In some situations a lack of nudity can certainly be absurd.

The victims in Fort Drakon were horrifically mistreated, brutally tortured and totally dehumanized by their captors.... Well, I say dehumanized, they wouldn't remove their undergarments because that would just be barbaric! I mean, even Rendon Howe wouldn't do something so utterly unforgivable as stripping a man of his loincloth. Could you imagine the indignity?

....Sarcasm aside, my point is obvious - One of the most effective shaming/humiliating/degrading tactics to torture is to completely strip a captive of their clothing and the lack of nudity when showing the horrific torture victims of Fort Drakon or Howe's estate in Denerim is something I found hilariously silly.

It's not game-breaking, by any means... But it definitely made me chuckle.


But, knowing the BSN as I do, I can only assume that at some point the topic has been changed from a general inclusion of nudity to something along the lines of "OMG NUDITY FOR ROMANTIC CUT SCENES"... So sod it, I'll give my two pennies on that as well.

Is nudity necessary for romantic cut scenes? Meh.... My opinion on romantic cut scenes in general is that they are an unnecessary inclusion that can cheapen the entire climax of character relationships (pardon the pun). It's not really the inclusion of the cut scene itself, so much as the way it's been used in previous titles I've played.

Allow me to clarify on that -: I believe that romantic cut scenes have their place, to highlight a beautifully crafted loving relationship between two people or to highlight a lack of affection in a lustful relationship that holds no real meaning - both can be important and both can be useful to a Player to further understand the kind of relationship they've built with the character in question.

What I don't like about romantic cut scenes is that they are rarely used as a highlighter for beautifully crafted relationships between two people. They're used as the benchmark for when that relationship becomes important... The importance of the relationship between PC and NPC shouldn't be dictated by a single 10-20 second cut scene, it should be dictated by the writing. You know... The dialogue... Those words that come out of a character's mouth before they dedicate their time to humping you...

Technically this is an entirely different gripe altogether, but I'm quite easily side-tracked... Sorry.


Back to the question "Nudity in Romantic Cut Scenes?"

Even excluding my personal hatred of romantic cut scenes, I still have to say no. Why? Because the Dragon Age franchise has taught me two things:

1) Companion Characters might end up with entirely different body models, which would make for extra work detailing completely unique nude models just for an optional 10-20 second cut scene.

2) Animation in video games has not yet reached it's fullest potential... Character movements are unnatural and jerky at the best of times. Putting such poor animation into a sexual scene with the inclusion of nudity is nothing short of uncomfortable.

Whether it's actually worth rendering unique nude models and attempting to make a fumbling mess of character animations look smooth enough that people won't be made horribly uncomfortable by the mere thought of it, all for the sake of a quick 10-20 second cut scene that a lot of people won't even bother to pursue.. It's really down to who you ask. Me? I don't see much point.


Was this post too long? Did you not read it? Cliff notes: Nudity has it's place.


Disclaimer: The entirety of this post is based on personal opinion. I am not claiming/have never claimed to be speaking for anyone other than myself. I am not attempting to pass my opinions off as fact and have no intention of arguing my personal opinions as factual basis for the exclusion/removal of nudity, romantic cut scenes or leprechauns.

Modifié par Sylvanpyxie, 30 juillet 2013 - 06:03 .

[elvici]

Sylvanpyxie wrote...

What I don't like about romantic cut scenes is that they are rarely used as a highlighter for beautifully crafted relationships between two people. They're used as the benchmark for when that relationship becomes important... The importance of the relationship between PC and NPC shouldn't be dictated by a single 10-20 second cut scene, it should be dictated by the writing. You know... The dialogue... Those words that come out of a character's mouth before they dedicate their time to humping you...

OMG - could we please all agree to use this statement as the basis for a big fat petition of all major RPG devs?!
(I am so with you, Sylvanpyxie!)

Modifié par elvici, 30 juillet 2013 - 06:10 .

[vehzeel]

"Heavy risk - but the priiiiiiize"

[Eternal Phoenix]

Zazzerka wrote...

It was wonderfully considerate of the soldiers at Fort Drakon to leave underwear on the people they'd just tortured to death.

Prisoner: "Are you going to take our clothes off and mock us while we're in the nude? Please don't! I am very sensitive..."

Guard: "No! Of course we're not! Who do you think we are?! We're just going to kill you is all..."

Prisoner: "Oh! Well carry on then! Phew! You hear that Maria? They're just going to kill us! Thank Go-I mean The Maker!"

[In Exile]

Plaintiff wrote...
No, which is the point.

If men in media were treated the way women in meida are, the results would be unsettling.

I guess where I'm having trouble with that parallel is that I'm not sure that the drawing gets across why it is that the portrayal of women is unsettling to men (which is what I understand the intent behind the drawing to be). 

[Maclimes]

Sylvanpyxie wrote...

....Sarcasm aside, my point is obvious - One of the most effective shaming/humiliating/degrading tactics to torture is to completely strip a captive of their clothing and the lack of nudity when showing the horrific torture victims of Fort Drakon or Howe's estate in Denerim is something I found hilariously silly.

I enjoyed your post. Although in regards to this particular quote, I would say the most egregious example is Caliain's corpse. The underwear there threw me off a bit.

[Urazz]

vehzeel wrote...

The sex scenes in games tend to be cringe-worthy. I think they are in the DA and in the ME series. Romances in games can be good and fun, but the visuals hamper them. Fade to black is a good way to handle it, I think.

I don't know, I think the sex scene in Mass Effect 1 was done well.  It had hinted at nudity where the private parts were tastefully covered in some fashion.  I think doing sex scenes like that would work best.

[dracuella]

Maclimes wrote...

Sylvanpyxie wrote...
....Sarcasm aside, my point is obvious - One of the most effective shaming/humiliating/degrading tactics to torture is to completely strip a captive of their clothing and the lack of nudity when showing the horrific torture victims of Fort Drakon or Howe's estate in Denerim is something I found hilariously silly.

I enjoyed your post. Although in regards to this particular quote, I would say the most egregious example is Caliain's corpse. The underwear there threw me off a bit.

You're right, that's it! When I came upon Cailan's corpse, something was off and I thought it looked a bit odd. At the time, I didn't know what it was, I couldn't put my finger on it but with your post it make perfect sense! It was this malplaced piece of clothing that gave the whole image a sense of decency despite the obvious torture and abuse, he'd been put through.
Personally, I would have thought it far more potent if he'd been stripped naked. The game is 17+, I think? It couldn't, or shouldn't, be a shock to anyone at that age what a naked man looks like. But if we can't have that, I think rags thrown on his body, covering more than the small clothes do but in a haphazard sort of fashion would be more fitting. It'd still give an impression of violence and molestation AND spare any sensitive eyes the image of a mans genitals. 

[Plaintiff]

In Exile wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...
No, which is the point.

If men in media were treated the way women in meida are, the results would be unsettling.

I guess where I'm having trouble with that parallel is that I'm not sure that the drawing gets across why it is that the portrayal of women is unsettling to men (which is what I understand the intent behind the drawing to be). 

No, the portrayal of women is unsettling to women. Many female gamers are uncomfortable with the way women are often presented in video games as objects that exist primarily for the titllation of male gamers.

The point of the comic is to demonstrate to men how it looks and feels for women to put up with that sort of thing.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 01 août 2013 - 06:36 .