350 réponses à ce sujet

[EssEeeEcks]

Fnork wrote...Waitaminute. Posting about something like this under a name like that. What's going on here ? :happy:

Old account name. I have nothing wrong with sexuality, but there is a right and a wrong way to do it.

[x12796]

Emzamination wrote...

StElmo wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

O for the love of the maker...Don't turn a few side boob shots into something it's not.As a woman, I find this statement rather sickening.

Explain.

Your claims of female character being too busty and unnatural is not only disingenious but offensive.Some women naturally have larger breast than others, there is nothing unnatural about it.Maybe you should get over your own insecurities.

While I agree with you I believe the OP is referring to how Ashley went from plain and military tom boy in ME1 to crossfit busty eye candy who could kick @ss in ME3 which seemed like Bioware was sexing up the game. 

[Dubozz]

So how about to post some pics with not a "fan service" characters from...you know..fantasy worlds.

Modifié par Dubozz, 18 septembre 2012 - 07:21 .

[Emzamination]

Dr. wonderful wrote...


Does she even count? Last I check, she was pretty much stuck inside that suit, and I heard something about her face but...ah forget it.


What about that  Morinth?

Morinth was peddled as being the ultimate seductress but upon meeting her I couldn't help but feel that reputation was highly exaggerated.She wore a leather body suit and even that wasn't appetizing, that's about it.

[Fnork]

ITT; far too much fuss over a pair of boobs. Isabela is awesome.

[Immortal fish]

Emzamination wrote...

Bob Garbage wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

StElmo wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

O for the love of the maker...Don't turn a few side boob shots into something it's not.As a woman, I find this statement rather sickening.

Explain.

Your claims of female character being too busty and unnatural is not only disingenious but offensive.Some women naturally have larger breast than others, there is nothing unnatural about it.Maybe you should get over your own insecurities.

You can't honestly be suggesting that there wasn't oversexualization of the women of ME....? I mean argue about stupid **** all you want but this is pretty obvious.

My being offended by the op insinuating that women with large breast are unnatural oversexed eye candy is stupid? I don't expect a man to fully understand how offensive that statement was but do try to show some empathy.

To answer your question: The only openly sexualized character in the ME series was miranda, I dare you to try and find another.

Hey calm down. No one is saying having large breasts or being sexy/ sexual or whatever makes a character dumb or eye-candy or shallow or anything like that. If so i'd be offended. 

Large breasts ≠ the problem.

While it's true characters who have large breasts are often oversexualized, their chest size ain't what's at fault. 
 
The problem is when they are treated as though their body including their breasts is the most important thing about them, more than their personality, motivations, relationships etc. When the camera angles are all designed to show them off regardless if its completely inappropriate for current mood/topic of the narrative. When the player is actually encouraged by the game to treat the character in a sexist manner. When writers choose to enforce ridiculous stereotypes like big-breasted people are dumb/sex-obsessed/eye-candy/shallow or that small-breasted people are all totally not sexual or attractive or are only any good as a "sister" character. When characters appearances are changed in a OOC way just to boost sex appeal. When they're forced to wear painfully useless armour in combat situations.

Those are problems.

(Just to be clear i'm not directing this humongous rant at bioware. They aren't perfect, but heck, no-one is and they're way better than a lot of developers). 

[Emzamination]

x12796 wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

StElmo wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

O for the love of the maker...Don't turn a few side boob shots into something it's not.As a woman, I find this statement rather sickening.

Explain.

Your claims of female character being too busty and unnatural is not only disingenious but offensive.Some women naturally have larger breast than others, there is nothing unnatural about it.Maybe you should get over your own insecurities.

While I agree with you I believe the OP is referring to how Ashley went from plain and military tom boy in ME1 to crossfit busty eye candy who could kick @ss in ME3 which seemed like Bioware was sexing up the game. 

I see...I'd love to argue that but I better get back on topic *sigh*

[Zkyire]

StElmo wrote...

I have total respect for how Female Hawke in DA2 initially dresses quite tough! (no boob shaped armor, or scantily clad attire - thank god!).

I had a little problem with not being able to maker her bulkier, a claymore wielding warrior would be bulkier, but alas, it's a minor concern, given how appreciative I am of the armor designs.

That said, there are a few moments where I think character designs over step the mark in relation to being exploitive of sexualized design, rather then natural or believable.

ME3 had a huge problem with making it's female characters bustier and less "natural" and therefore less "grounded" in comparison to the first game. I like believable characters, not manipulative designs seeking to attract my attention in all the wrong ways.

Make good characters through good writing, sure they can look beautiful, but only in the most practical sense of the word. A warrior on the front lines of a war would not be wearing heavy makeup for instance, or a chainmail bikini

By all means have romances, sex scenes and all that - but treat us like adults, not teenagers. 

Just a heads up, I do not expect BW to make DA3 more sexualized.

My only problem with Isabella's dress in DA2 was not what she wore in itself, but rather the fact that that's what she wore in combat. You wanna dress like that in your downtime? Fine go for it. Dressing like that for a battle will get you killed. So it's not that she was oversexualised, but rather simply impractical.

[Atalanta]

Emzamination wrote...
To answer your question: The only openly sexualized character in the ME series was miranda, I dare you to try and find another.

None of these seem sexualized to you at all? Not trying to argue here, just curious.

Allers
Ashley
Benezia
Edi
Edi
Jack
Samara

Modifié par Atalanta, 18 septembre 2012 - 07:39 .

[Dutchess]

Fnork wrote...

ITT; far too much fuss over a pair of boobs. Isabela is awesome.

I have no problems with Isabela as a character. She is awesome indeed, and probably my favorite companion. Even her outfit I can live with, but by giving her the enormous breasts in addition to that outfit, I think Bioware has made her a bit too much of a stereotype. I have read many posts here saying that Isabela is just a shallow wh*re, and it is easy to get that idea because of the way she is presented. That's just a shame, I think. People have that first impression and they decide not to look deeper, discouraged by the way she looks.

[Doveberry]

Oddly enough, I appreciated Isabela's design in DA2. Once I got to know her, I felt her design was completely in accordance with her character. So, in short, I do not mind sexualized characters if it makes sense. Though that tends to be very hard to accomplish.

[CuriousArtemis]

Isabela wearing nothing but panties throughout the entire game was pretty fcuking ... moronic (to avoid the use of the r-word here). That's pretty much the definition of fan service. Now I don't necessarily enjoy staring at her huge corseted breasts, but it wasn't wildly inappropriate (in regards to character and environment) the way her panties were.

Yes, she's a character who lives and loves freely, well, so was Zevran. So why wasn't Zevran running around in a thong.

So BW, if you absolutely insist on sexing up your female characters, then you'd better damn well do the same for your men. I want templars in skimpy underwear, you hear me? Oh wait, that's not practical, you say? Then put some damn pants on that pirate.

[Ghost]

motomotogirl wrote...

Isabela wearing nothing but panties throughout the entire game was pretty fcuking ... moronic (to avoid the use of the r-word here). That's pretty much the definition of fan service. Now I don't necessarily enjoy staring at her huge corseted breasts, but it wasn't wildly inappropriate (in regards to character and environment) the way her panties were.

Yes, she's a character who lives and loves freely, well, so was Zevran. So why wasn't Zevran running around in a thong.

So BW, if you absolutely insist on sexing up your female characters, then you'd better damn well do the same for your men. I want templars in skimpy underwear, you hear me? Oh wait, that's not practical, you say? Then put some damn pants on that pirate.

No. 

[Medhia Nox]

@Atalanta: I have to laugh. You asked if these were "sexualized" pictures - and the guy sitting behind me - having no clue why I was looking at them said - and I quote:

"Mass Effect eh? Hey, her chi chi's are hang'n out. That's some motherf-n chi chi action right there."

So - clearly he was .2 seconds MORE interested in the stylized ME art.... and then realized just how sexualized it was.

[The Hierophant]

Zkyire wrote...

StElmo wrote...

I have total respect for how Female Hawke in DA2 initially dresses quite tough! (no boob shaped armor, or scantily clad attire - thank god!).

I had a little problem with not being able to maker her bulkier, a claymore wielding warrior would be bulkier, but alas, it's a minor concern, given how appreciative I am of the armor designs.

That said, there are a few moments where I think character designs over step the mark in relation to being exploitive of sexualized design, rather then natural or believable.

ME3 had a huge problem with making it's female characters bustier and less "natural" and therefore less "grounded" in comparison to the first game. I like believable characters, not manipulative designs seeking to attract my attention in all the wrong ways.

Make good characters through good writing, sure they can look beautiful, but only in the most practical sense of the word. A warrior on the front lines of a war would not be wearing heavy makeup for instance, or a chainmail bikini

By all means have romances, sex scenes and all that - but treat us like adults, not teenagers. 

Just a heads up, I do not expect BW to make DA3 more sexualized.

My only problem with Isabella's dress in DA2 was not what she wore in itself, but rather the fact that that's what she wore in combat. You wanna dress like that in your downtime? Fine go for it. Dressing like that for a battle will get you killed. So it's not that she was oversexualised, but rather simply impractical.

Agreed, seeing a scantily clad Isabela knife fight a group of platemail wearing mooks who are armed to the teeth was annoying. 

Modifié par The Hierophant, 18 septembre 2012 - 07:54 .

[David Gaider]

StElmo wrote...
I have total respect for how Female Hawke in DA2 initially dresses quite tough! (no boob shaped armor, or scantily clad attire - thank god!).

I had a little problem with not being able to maker her bulkier, a claymore wielding warrior would be bulkier, but alas, it's a minor concern, given how appreciative I am of the armor designs.

That said, there are a few moments where I think character designs over step the mark in relation to being exploitive of sexualized design, rather then natural or believable.

ME3 had a huge problem with making it's female characters bustier and less "natural" and therefore less "grounded" in comparison to the first game. I like believable characters, not manipulative designs seeking to attract my attention in all the wrong ways.

Make good characters through good writing, sure they can look beautiful, but only in the most practical sense of the word. A warrior on the front lines of a war would not be wearing heavy makeup for instance, or a chainmail bikini

By all means have romances, sex scenes and all that - but treat us like adults, not teenagers. 

Just a heads up, I do not expect BW to make DA3 more sexualized.

I get what you're saying. Personally, I have no problem with "sexy" female characters... so long as it's consistent for the character and there is diversity in the representation. One must have Avelines as well as Isabelas. And thus I think we've done pretty good on that front.

I don't think one would get much traction with the suggestion that there should be no sexualization, or defining where the line is. There definitely is a line, however, between exploitation and idealization... particularly when it comes to female characters (which are generally the former) and male characters (which are generally the latter), so it's easy to see why anyone might be sensitive to such depictions.

[Atalanta]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@Atalanta: I have to laugh. You asked if these were "sexualized" pictures - and the guy sitting behind me - having no clue why I was looking at them said - and I quote:

"Mass Effect eh? Hey, her chi chi's are hang'n out. That's some motherf-n chi chi action right there."

So - clearly he was .2 seconds MORE interested in the stylized ME art.... and then realized just how sexualized it was.

LOL!

Hmm, maybe that's the line for me ... if I'd be super embarrased to have a picture of the character seen at work, it's oversexualized.

[Huntress]

Im a woman, I don't really care what size of their breast cup 90% of the females in Thedas have, all i care that My female character do NOT charge into battle with a bikini armor letting exposed all her vitals parts to the enemies, i find that extremely stupid.

Now to take a pic for some eye candy moments or to show tattoos.. thats totally Ok, to fight half naked thats NOT ok.

Walking animation in games are wierd 90% of the time, ME3 Shepard was ewwww.. worst that DA2 Femhawke demo and trust me I did BTched about FemHawke wierd walking, some players told me they walked that way or new someone who walked that way however.. BTW us, i thought they were alliens with some new ways of defying the force of gravity. who knows?

some womens swinging their hips when they walk, maybe is a culture things, maybe I do not find it offencive/offensive because.. well.. meh I don't actually look to womens that close.

[Cultist]

A world where everyone is beautiful, shiny and glossy is often annoying. Witcher got this right - there were beautiful women...and there were skanks in dirty brothels, there were actual old ladies and Dragon Age 2 we remember that even grannies got D-breast size and glossy skin.
We had no feelings like they are in a Truman's Show and some perfect world.
I prefer that drug alcogolic addict from the slums look appropriately.

Modifié par Cultist, 18 septembre 2012 - 08:07 .

[Emzamination]

Immortal fish wrote...


Hey calm down. No one is saying having large breasts or being sexy/ sexual or whatever makes a character  eye-candy. If so i'd be offended. 

StElmo wrote...

That said, there are a few moments
where I think character designs over step the mark in relation to being
exploitive of sexualized design, rather then natural or believable.

ME3
had a huge problem with making it's female characters bustier and less
"natural" and therefore less "grounded" in comparison to the first game.
I like believable characters, not manipulative designs seeking to
attract my attention in all the wrong ways.

That is exactly what's being said. The op is stating that the larger a female's bust, the more sexualized, unnatural and unbelieveable they become.She is effectively judging the merits a woman can obtain and how female she is on the size of her breast alone.Insinuating that a female should be remodeled or cover up so she won't be oogled by men and be respected as a person again is highly outrageous.A person's worth man or woman is judged by their actions and accomplishments, not the size of their body parts.Also just because a woman has large breast does not exclude her from being a good solider,scholar or any other profession she chooses to pursue.

Large breasts ≠ the problem.

While it's true characters who have large breasts are often oversexualized, their chest size ain't what's at fault. 
 
The problem is when they are treated as though their body including their breasts is the most important thing about them, more than their personality, motivations, relationships etc. When the camera angles are all designed to show them off regardless if its completely inappropriate for current mood/topic of the narrative. When the player is actually encouraged by the game to treat the character in a sexist manner. When writers choose to enforce ridiculous stereotypes like big-breasted people are dumb/sex-obsessed/eye-candy/shallow or that small-breasted people are all totally not sexual or attractive or are only any good as a "sister" character. When characters appearances are changed in a OOC way just to boost sex appeal. When they're forced to wear painfully useless armour in combat situations.

Those are problems.

(Just to be clear i'm not directing this humongous rant at bioware. They aren't perfect, but heck, no-one is and they're way better than a lot of developers). 

What character or characters are you referring to? I've seen none like that.

Modifié par Emzamination, 18 septembre 2012 - 08:18 .

[Iakus]

David Gaider wrote...

I get what you're saying. Personally, I have no problem with "sexy" female characters... so long as it's consistent for the character and there is diversity in the representation. One must have Avelines as well as Isabelas. And thus I think we've done pretty good on that front.

I don't think one would get much traction with the suggestion that there should be no sexualization, or defining where the line is. There definitely is a line, however, between exploitation and idealization... particularly when it comes to female characters (which are generally the former) and male characters (which are generally the latter), so it's easy to see why anyone might be sensitive to such depictions.

Exactly.  And that's where the ability to customize character and follower appearances can help a great deal.  It helps move things closer to where the players' individual lines are

[Rawgrim]

I don`t remember any of the DA characters being overly sexualized, though. Morrigan even puts on a bra before having sex for crying out loud.

[Gruntburner]

There is nothing wrong with sexualization of a character as long as it adds to their character and makes sense. But having every female in the game where armor bikinis goes too far. I just hope that Bioware strike a more mature balance than in often seen in videogames today.

[Emzamination]

Atalanta wrote...

Emzamination wrote...
To answer your question: The only openly sexualized character in the ME series was miranda, I dare you to try and find another.

None of these seem sexualized to you at all? Not trying to argue here, just curious.

Allers
Ashley
Benezia
Edi
Edi
Jack
Samara

Allers- dresses girly but non exploitive

Ashley - Let down her hair and bust got bigger without armor constantly constricting it, no exploitation.

Benezia - She just has a big bust

Edi - No, I saw nothing remotely sexy about edi

Jack - She's always covered

Samara - She just has a big bust, her actions and moral differed from her body.

[Rawgrim]

The witcher had good balance. Triss Merigold, for example, wears regular clothes.