5257 réponses à ce sujet

[Aethgeir]

Redbelle wrote...

WNxPowder wrote...

If one of you gives bioware the idea to bring back the mako, i will not be assuming direct control of me4

Bring back the Mako!

Just not a direct translation of the Mako from ME1!

While I cannot say the Mako was a bad game mechanic due to expanding the scope of gameplay and lonely planet exploration it provided..... Plus the way it became a critical component of some of the main missions, I have to admit..... it was a hard beast to tame. The controls and handling were difficult and though I loved the fact I had a soldier who had a tank at his beck and call..... obviously some people didn't connect to it.

So while I would like a tank in my loading bay again, that can be used in the same manner as the one in ME1. I'd like to see how it handles after BW reinvent the way operates in regard to how players connect with it. The same way foot soldier run and gun mechanics were redeveloped from ME1 and ME2.

I'd also like to see the vehicle loading bay become a kind of workshop. A way to change the Mako's stats and loadout. Perhaps even change the vehicle base from the wheeled Mako to the hovering Hammerhead. If ME4 is going to be about exploration while opening up the sense that the galaxy is bigger than your character, then the Mako route is the way to go as it worked very well in ME1. But the Mako needs to be able to carry it's own weight in battle. Be something that players can invest in through customisation.

On the other hand. If players only want foot missions, hand, he/she who is not Shepard a stealth bike and hidden routes through large maps that bypasses the fighting. Or something along those lines. Give players choice in how they choose to handle situations. Since BW have turned the concept of choice in action and narration in games into it's hook to reel gamers in

And if BW choose to go for another MP component.... (Which I hope doesn't hurt the SP mode), then having a tank that can be tuned to an APC/Anti armour/Anti air would be great for wide open match based play.

Some great suggestions on vehicles here!

Personally, I loved the Mako in ME1. Mind you, I play on PCs so I never had any problems with the controls. I actually had more complaints about the rather monotonous environments, particularly on the "greener" worlds. Plus the Mako's "climbing" was a little silly at times too.  Once again though, this goes back to level design (and interface for consoles) not something intrinsically wrong with the dynamic itself - which is the impression I think BioWare got from all the negative feedback on the Mako.

If vehicles are to be included in ME4, then they really should go all the way with them: make them an essential component of both side-missions and story-missions and multiplayer!  They absolutely should include a "vehicles workshop" on the ship and in the multiplayer lobby.  This could involve acquiring and installing different vehicle-mounted weapons and "heavy-weapons", upgrades for shields, armour, repairs, speed, maneuverability, etc. and plenty of superficial stuff like custom paint-jobs, decals, etc. some of which would be unlocked or purchased from shops in game.

The ultimate vehicle dynamic for both single and multi-player, would be an actual "selection" of different vehicles to collect. One might be slow but heavily armed and armored, another might be a lightly equipped, but fast and maneuverable hover-craft, another might be a well-balanced ATV, and so on.  Again this goes towards - as you suggest - catering to different play-styles, i.e.: Giving more to the player!

Modifié par Aethgeir, 16 février 2014 - 12:20 .

[Aethgeir]

@Invisible Man; Redbelle

I found the integration of multi-player and single-player in ME3 especially poor. Nothing about multi-player was canon, and no one playing it is preoccupied with single-player.  And all you get is a "war-asset" which (if you've played as MP much as I have) is worth more than the entire Alliance war asset roster combined!  I also resent the lazy inclusion of the multi-player maps as "N7 missions" in the single player. That could have been unique six side-missions that actually had a meaningful impact on the story (for example,  the indoctrinate hanar mission on Kahje I suggested a few posts back).

I'm not against multi-player. In fact I've had a lot of fun with ME3's multiplayer.  But if you're going to integrate it with the single-player campaign, than fully integrate it!  The direction a lot of games are going now, is multi-player co-op within the single-player campaign.  Essentially, this means that players build custom characters and play as "squad-mates" throughout the game: same missions, same story, but with hugely increased difficulty.  The "host" player might take on the role of the leader or "protagonist" in regards to story progression, controlling conversations with NPCs, major decisions, etc.  This might also include a "voting" dynamic so that other players can have imput on major decisions, conversation choices and so on.  There's probably no real need to include in-game character interactions between co-op players since they can do that in person, over a mic, through texts, etc.  The ship, and hub locations like the Citadel, Omega, etc. would be free-roaming areas where different players can part ways, run their own errands, visit shops, speak with NPCs, etc.

A dynamic like this lends itself especially well to LANing and might even be more attractive to female gamers. (My brother actually goes out of his way to find games that he and his wife - who normally prefers to just watch, rather that play games - can play together.)  And since you'd still be able to play the single-player campaign alone, the multiplayer component doesn't take anything away from that, whilst requiring little more to be added.

The prospect of multiplayer co-op "squads" also raises the possibility of multiplayer squad PvP outside the single player campaign.  And maybe even vehicle PvP!

Modifié par Aethgeir, 16 février 2014 - 12:59 .

[Rodus Maxumus]

I would like to see the return of the Mako, or even the Hammerhead. But if vehicles do make a return the ME2 Hammerhead missions with the check points and the platformer/obstacle course game play would not be welcomed by me. Though I loved to explore in ME1 with the Mako I found finding the hidden resources and artefacts a bit on the tedious side.
In a future ME I would like to see only one vehicle assigned to the ship like in ME2 the SR2 only had room for one Hammerhead and a couple of shuttles. But during a mission your squad may commandeer any sort of vehicle, say a convenient M29 Grizzly or some Quad Bikes or just a hover car (but for more than just a car chase like in ME2 Shadow Broker DLC, don’t get me wrong that was fun but I would like a bit more than just that).

[WNxPowder]

Redbelle wrote...

WNxPowder wrote...

If one of you gives bioware the idea to bring back the mako, i will not be assuming direct control of me4

Bring back the Mako!

Just not a direct translation of the Mako from ME1!

While I cannot say the Mako was a bad game mechanic due to expanding the scope of gameplay and lonely planet exploration it provided..... Plus the way it became a critical component of some of the main missions, I have to admit..... it was a hard beast to tame. The controls and handling were difficult and though I loved the fact I had a soldier who had a tank at his beck and call..... obviously some people didn't connect to it.

So while I would like a tank in my loading bay again, that can be used in the same manner as the one in ME1. I'd like to see how it handles after BW reinvent the way operates in regard to how players connect with it. The same way foot soldier run and gun mechanics were redeveloped from ME1 and ME2.

I'd also like to see the vehicle loading bay become a kind of workshop. A way to change the Mako's stats and loadout. Perhaps even change the vehicle base from the wheeled Mako to the hovering Hammerhead. If ME4 is going to be about exploration while opening up the sense that the galaxy is bigger than your character, then the Mako route is the way to go as it worked very well in ME1. But the Mako needs to be able to carry it's own weight in battle. Be something that players can invest in through customisation.

On the other hand. If players only want foot missions, hand, he/she who is not Shepard a stealth bike and hidden routes through large maps that bypasses the fighting. Or something along those lines. Give players choice in how they choose to handle situations. Since BW have turned the concept of choice in action and narration in games into it's hook to reel gamers in

And if BW choose to go for another MP component.... (Which I hope doesn't hurt the SP mode), then having a tank that can be tuned to an APC/Anti armour/Anti air would be great for wide open match based play.

don't get me wrong i didnt hate the mako,I loved it for the first few playthroughs being ablr to take in the scenery was pretty cool, but after dying and having to respawn at the misson start over and over and driving back to that stupid bunker isnt fun

[Invisible Man]

I had an idea on how to add a sp & mp tie-in to the me3 style n7 missions, though after I wrote it out I said to my self... on second thought if that was in the next me I'd find it annoying and immersion breaking, this is harder than I figured. so, I'm not going to post my idea here, cause I don't want to give the devs bad ideas.

---edit
I just know someone's going to say "spill it" invisible man.

Modifié par Invisible Man, 16 février 2014 - 08:55 .

[Redbelle]

Depending on what they do and how they choose to tell the story, what about crew members who can be trained to do their jobs better?

If the starting ships crew are fresh faced recruits then they would essentially be learning on the job how to apply what they know in theory into practice.

This means things like ship speed, max distance the ship can travel, sensor range, combat.... all these thing could be upgraded if the game supports this small sampling of talents as needed and usable skills through gameplay. Training your crew members gives a reason to invest in these individual characters and turn people who could be window dressing into a potential recurring crew resource thoughout the games.

And the coup de grace? Make them susceptable to death by the games end so that when you go into the next game, you either have your original station operators, or new recruits to occupy the stations they left vacant after their demise.

[Redbelle]

Personally, If BW do anything with MP, I'd prefer it to be a standalone MP that takes place in the ME universe.

I wouldn't be averse to BW releasing the ME4MP as a beta ahead of the single player mode game. On a few conditions.

1. ME3MP is as entertaining to watch and stream as it is to play.
2. That it showcases what ME3MP could do while taking feedback from the fanbase on how to make it better before it's actual launch.
3. That BW focus on a SP mode that doesn't lift totally from MP, and has feature's for SP to make the gameplay distinguishable from MP.
4. That BW look at the feedback on what the beta MP generates and uses the fans creativity to ask themselves how to fold their ideas into future content for both SP and MP.

And finally, that the SP is as good as they can make it without comprimising it through MP integreation. That means no more scoreboard of EMS assests. The scoreboard is done away with and instead, the game raises flags in the files to say that if you succussfully bring the Rachni to fight with you in a warzone..... you fight alongside Rachni in a warzone. Get a bomber fleet? You organise and use the bomber fleet.

What you gain in the game has to be usable in a narrative context rather than be implied without playable/cinematic interaction. And above all, what you do and gain has positive/negative consequences that affect the player.

[Aethgeir]

Redbelle wrote...

Depending on what they do and how they choose to tell the story, what about crew members who can be trained to do their jobs better?

If the starting ships crew are fresh faced recruits then they would essentially be learning on the job how to apply what they know in theory into practice.

This means things like ship speed, max distance the ship can travel, sensor range, combat.... all these thing could be upgraded if the game supports this small sampling of talents as needed and usable skills through gameplay. Training your crew members gives a reason to invest in these individual characters and turn people who could be window dressing into a potential recurring crew resource thoughout the games.

And the coup de grace? Make them susceptable to death by the games end so that when you go into the next game, you either have your original station operators, or new recruits to occupy the stations they left vacant after their demise.

This sort of dynamic would work especially well if they expanded the role of the ship in terms of exploration and combat. Just as equipment and vehicles would allow upgrading and customization, so too should the ship and its crew. 

In this case though, it would probably be best to significantly reduce the (apparent) size of the crew, so that individual crew members could be elevated to the level of Joker or Dr. Chakwas as characters.  They might even be chosen (by the player) from a "pool" of recruits, and each would be assigned to a specific "job" on the ship and  need the appropriate "skill" to carry it out.  They may also have a few general skills like repair or combat which are considered collectively for situations where the ship is damaged, boarded, etc.

Modifié par Aethgeir, 16 février 2014 - 09:16 .

[Aethgeir]

@Redbelle

I really feel that integrating multi-player and single-player is an "All or None" kind of deal.

Multi-player is just mindless fun.  Nobody playing it is concerned with how it affects the Mass Effect universe so it shouldn't affect it.  SP should not visit MP locales at all, and MP achievements should have no bearing on the SP campaign.  And if MP is a separate entity, it should offer all sorts of different game modes, like the current co-op survival, PvP team-deathmatch, capture the flag (or whatever), with vehicle inclusion, and so on. (That said there should be no classes, characters, weapons, skills, etc. available in MP that aren't also available in SP, and vice versa. In fact, I think the character creation process in MP should be modleled off the one in SP.)

If they are going to integrate SP and MP, then it should be in the "RPG spirit" on which Mass Effect is built, not some mindless shooter.  Earlier I suggested a MP co-op in the SP campaign; where the host takes on the role of the "protagonist" and other players act as his/her squad.  Having given it some more thought though, I think it might be better to take this one step even further:

Suppose instead of one "Shepard" type protagonist, there are actually several (perhaps three) protagonists.  The player selects one of these characters during the character creation process when he or she chooses the "background / psyche-profile" origin story for their character.  The character's class, skills, look, gender, etc. are all still entirely up to the player.  When the player begins the game, the two remaining characters appear in the game as default versions, perhaps one male one female, and as classes complimentary to the player's (i.e. you pick a soldier, they become a biotic and a tech specialist, etc.).  These two characters serve as the players first squadmates, and all three characters have an existing history with each other (friends, war buddies, etc.) They might even be the primary squadmates while one or two NPC squadmates joining missions in addition to these three.

In the multi-player co-op campaign, up to three players decide amongst themselves which of these characters they wish to play, and go through the game as a team.  The difficulty of the missions would scale accordingly.  And one of the characters would be considered the "leader" right from character selection.  This could then include fully developed character interactions between players, allowing for differences of opinion, and even possible romance sub-plots, and so on.  The story could even be written in such a way that these characters could potentially turn on each other at the end!

Modifié par Aethgeir, 16 février 2014 - 10:16 .

[DextroDNA]

I definitely think space combat needs to play a part in the next game.

Upgrading your ship's equipment, stats, appearance and crew would be really cool.

[Fetunche]

Keep MP and SP separate, and make space combat and vehicle missions optional if they feel the need to include them at all.

[Invisible Man]

i suppose it's a tad late at this point, however another thing i forgot to add was: make me-next for the pc, then import to consoles... not the other way around. me3 had a ton of interface glitches that got me killed more than enough times, they kept me from bumping up the difficulty setting above normal. or simply take the time to iron that stuff out. i don't think i should have to tap spacebar 7 times to get shep to dodge (it's true that usually it only takes 2-5 taps to get him/her to dodge normally, but twice it took 7 taps) brutes and banshees don't give you enough room for error here.

[Rodus Maxumus]

A possible story line for the next ME.

The protagonist (PC) is an Alliance marine 1st Lieutenant and he (or she) is part of a task force to neutralise a particularly organized band of pirates. The Staff Lieutenant (SL) leading the platoon sends the PC and his squad out on left flank screen as the platoon makes its way overland to the pirates’ base (this would be the tutorial mission). The platoon gets ambushed from the right and gets pinned down and the SL loses the plot and freezes as his platoon is getting massacred. The PC moves his squad as fast as possible to help the platoon by flanking the pirates and manages to drive them off. The pirates manage to evacuate their base and escape. That is when things go real bad for the PC, because the SL’s dad is a big nob in the Alliance, PC gets the blame and as his was the only squad not to take any casualties he is accused of staying out of the fight. So his reputation is mud and his career is ended.

So PC decides to use his training in the private sector and gets in touch with a recruiter that he knows and is told that he has been blacklisted. “Look mate, there is a rumour going about that you’re a scapegoat for that debacle, and it’s been made clear that by hiring you will give credence to that rumour and will also mean that Alliance contracts will cease for any company that hirers you.” The recruiter then tells the PC about a small salvaging ship going cheap. “It’s a good way to make money and you can do a bit of bounty hunting on the side.” That ship is little more than an RV version of a space ship with a garage for a hover truck.
So PC sets out to capture the pirates that got away but first he needs a proper ship and crew and to do that he needs to make money.

Modifié par Rodus Maxumus, 19 février 2014 - 08:55 .

[Madcat 124]

 I think others have said it, but please.... don't make it a prequel. We already know how it ends. Make it another universe/reboot, or make it in the future with a new threat.

[Danimals847]

 Lots of REALLY good ideas here!

• I think having the ship play a major role in the gameplay is a MUST. Ship-to-ship combat is kind of another whole genre, but I like the idea of customizing my ship, upgrading it or even buying new ships.
• We ABSOLUTELY need to be able to choose a race of the main character, Dragon Age: Origins style. There might be 1-2 different backgrounds for each race. I could even see some races like hanar, elcor, volus or drell being unlockable. Maybe you would start the game only able to play as human, asari or turian?!
• The main character should definitely NOT be a messiah. I want to play as a badass normal, not a demi-god.
• As for story, you just need to remember how BIG the Milky Way Galaxy is. Probably 90% of the galaxy by volume is out of range of the relay network, so it's no stretch at all to say there are people out of range of any relays, possibly even people who intentionally fled prior to the events at the end of ME3. So a chronological sequel starring familiar races is entirely do-able. A central plot element could be returning to what is currently familiar space. I like the idea that 1/3 of the way through the game you would go on a mission and find everything just... EMPTY. Even better, I like the idea that after 100% through (at least the first game) you wouldn't know definitively which ending of ME3 (if any) was "canon".
• I really like the idea of integrating SP and MP, but that would be SUPER tough to balance. I tend to play SP games very slowly, talking to everyone and not skipping anything. When I play MP games I usually want to just jump into action.

[Rodus Maxumus]

A possible story line for the next ME. (Revised)
The protagonist (PC) is an Alliance marine 1st Lieutenant and he (or she) is part of a task force to neutralise a particularly organized band of pirates. The Staff Lieutenant (SL) leading the platoon sends the PC and his squad out on left flank screen as the platoon makes its way overland to the pirates’ base (this would be the tutorial mission). The PC’s route is blocked from a sudden rock slide so he takes his squad further to the left.

The platoon gets ambushed and gets pinned down and the SL loses the plot and freezes as his platoon is getting massacred. Because the PC took his squad further to the left they find themselves behind the pirates that were to take out his squad. The PC dispatches the pirates and then moves his squad as fast as possible to help the platoon by flanking the pirates and manages to drive them off. The pirates manage to evacuate their base and escape. That is when things go real bad for the PC, because the SL’s dad is a big nob in the Alliance, PC gets the blame and as his squad was out of position and because his squad was only the one not to take any casualties he is accused of staying out of the fight. So his reputation is mud and his career is ended.

So PC decides to use his training in the private sector and gets in touch with a recruiter that he knows and is told that he has been blacklisted. “Look mate, there is a rumour going about that you’re a scapegoat for that debacle, and it’s been made clear that by hiring you will give credence to that rumour and will also mean that Alliance contracts will cease for any company that hirers you.” The recruiter then tells the PC about a small salvaging ship going cheap. “It’s a good way to make money and you can do a bit of bounty hunting on the side.” That ship is little more than an RV version of a space ship with a garage for a hover truck.

So PC sets out to clear his name by capturing the pirates that got away, but first he needs a proper ship and crew and to do that he needs to make money. As he gets betters ships and recruits his crew he of cause comes to the attention of the council.

Modifié par Rodus Maxumus, 20 février 2014 - 08:55 .

[Aethgeir]

@ Rodus Maxumus
Not bad! I'm getting kind of a "Firefly" vibe from you're idea: smaller, simple, and focused more on character, rather than event, driven plot-line. I really think that's what the next Mass Effect needs to set itself apart from the original. And it would also lend itself well to the ship having a larger role in the game.

One of the things that really hooked me on ME1 was the deeper characterization potential of the protagonist. In conversation with other characters, we (as players) actually got decide where this Shepard character stood on complex issues like racism, religion, morality, and so on. But I feel like the series lost that as it progressed and Shepard was swallowed up by the events unfolding.

Sadly though, it's probably a little late in the process for detailed or specific story suggestions, but I think the spirit of your idea is a good one.

[Rodus Maxumus]

It might be nice to have a more character driven story about a character’s own life, rather than the usual save the galaxy epic.
You can only save the galaxy so many times.

[Farangbaa]

MMORPG in the original universe.

[Invisible Man]

Psychevore wrote...

MMORPG in the original universe.

no, no, no, no, no, no... NO!
or were you joking?

[Rodus Maxumus]

Please have the sound track and sound effects (nightclub) music on separate channels.

I like to play with the music off, and in ME1 when you walked into the Flux and Chora’s Den you could hear the music but in ME2 & 3 when you walked into a nightclub or somewhere music was playing if you opted to have the music off you would not hear anything and see people dancing to nothing. So if you are like me and like to play without the mood music, in 2 & 3 you either had these strange people dancing without music or every time you went into a club you would jump into options and switch the music on for that bit of the playthough.

[Madcat 124]

"Firstly, anything that happens before the end of the trilogy will just not be exciting or suspenseful, namely because we already know the general outcome of the galaxy. To me, at least, there's nothing fun or engaging in knowing how this story will conclude (Probably one of the reasons I disliked Halo Reach)

Second, During the time of the trilogy, nothing noteworthy (at least in regards to the Reaper threat) happens that, I feel, would warrant making more games about. Any story would just mostly be overshadowed by the whole Reaper ordeal; you'd probably hear about Shepard's exploits and remember that there are bigger things in the galaxy. Besides, it would kind of seem like a downgrade, going from saving the galaxy to... not doing that.

Lastly, I really want to see how the Galaxy has been effected by the whole Reaper thing. I'd like to see a new threat, new race relations, new technology... New Story... stuff like that...

I just feel as if there would be no real reason to want to play a prequel or side story."

[EliotNesss]

Madcat 124 wrote...

"Firstly, anything that happens before the end of the trilogy will just not be exciting or suspenseful, namely because we already know the general outcome of the galaxy. To me, at least, there's nothing fun or engaging in knowing how this story will conclude (Probably one of the reasons I disliked Halo Reach)

Second, During the time of the trilogy, nothing noteworthy (at least in regards to the Reaper threat) happens that, I feel, would warrant making more games about. Any story would just mostly be overshadowed by the whole Reaper ordeal; you'd probably hear about Shepard's exploits and remember that there are bigger things in the galaxy. Besides, it would kind of seem like a downgrade, going from saving the galaxy to... not doing that.

Lastly, I really want to see how the Galaxy has been effected by the whole Reaper thing. I'd like to see a new threat, new race relations, new technology... New Story... stuff like that...

I just feel as if there would be no real reason to want to play a prequel or side story."

I agree 1000+++% with everything you said. As I said on the prior page; I think it would be neat if they took 2 characters from the old saga (Like Miranda & Clone Shepard). And weave a bunch of Post Reaper/Shepard sera adventures about them. Each a standalone new game and story. Don't even call them Mass Effect. Just say "inspired" by ME in the credits and packaging. With the post apocalyptic ME galaxy as a backdrop. Then make the new  ME trilogy about something entirely different as you suggest. That IMO is truly making the best out of everything and moving on at the same time.

[laudable11]

Co-op

[laudable11]

You know how Marvel does their movies? They have the big flagship movie like the Avengers and then the individual characters do a solo film. You know, like Thor and Captain America.

What if BioWare does something similar? The big "Next Mass Effect game" followed the next year or so by a game that focuses on one or two characters. For example: Mass Effect "4" comes out. The following year we get a FPS game starring a young David Anderson that explains the first contact war and his beef with Saren.

A year after that Mass Effect "5" comes out. And after that we get a space combat game starring some guy or gal...just think about it. It might work.

Modifié par laudable11, 22 février 2014 - 08:06 .