340 réponses à ce sujet

[Jay_Hoxtatron]

corporal doody wrote...

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

I'm against the Carnifex nerf, it doesn't make any sense. As for the Piranha, if it's a straight up damage and/or accuracy nerf, I'll be against that too.

how can you nerf the accuracy of a weapon that has a effective range so short?  a accuracy nerf on the pirahna is meaning less!!  you arent trying to hit a baddy at medium range... more often than not....you are close enuff to feel its breathe.

a damage nerf is just as meaningless imho. cuz once you are upclose...with the rate of fire...a few points mean nuthing.


weight increase and rate of fire decreased. tis what i realistically see. 


 

That's why I said 'if'. If it's a damage/accuracy nerf, I don't see the point to do this. Weight I wouldn't mind so much.

[Jay_Hoxtatron]

przemko877 wrote...

Stop panicking, even if they nerf your precious Piranha into nothingness they'll probably buff it one way or another after some time. The guns that were previously nerfed (Falcon, Krysae) are still 100% usable on most characters. People just overreact about it. Personally I'm curious how they want to nerf it. Carnifex too.

Krysae, usable on most characters?

Well, yeah, if you want to totally gimp yourself.

[Silasqtx]

I completely agree with RedJohn & supporters.

[ABjerre]

I may have missed some kind of announcement, but where have they (BW) stated that they are planning on nerfing weapons next week?

Quote from the poll:
"As you might know, Bioware are planning to nerf the weapon the next week, a weapon that is not Overpowered and only looks like that ( like all weapons ) when you put it in a GI or destroyer."

[Shadohz]

Hrrmm. I've played with Pira on several classes including a decked out Destroyer. Also I USED to play with Carnifex on my adept classes. I can't say that I find either weapon as OP. Seems to me that BW is taking "Halo-ish" tactics and applying it to an RPG. That's wrong.

The problems that I see, as several people have mentioned, is in the class balancing. BW should be looking harder at fixing those classes with combat modes (devastation, hunter, etc) and fixing them accordingly. If you compare the SP to MP you'll see where certain classes should have strength with some weapons and weaknesses with other. Casters, by default of weight cooldown, use lighter weapons so they can still use their powers and have a semi-decent weapon.

Why isn't this same approach being applied to other class types? For instance, why are Infil not being given a boon for sniper rifs and handgun, but getting a penalty for using other weapon types? Same as with other classes.

I'll even go as far as to say: Why not start doing class weapon restrictions (same as SP squadmates)? Yeah you heard me right. Restrict a GI to use sniper rifles and handguns and those OP threads are sure to go bye-bye. It's also in fitting with their class type.

Modifié par Shadohz, 19 septembre 2012 - 08:09 .

[john-in-france]

I have to agree with RedJohn, I normally play engineers and the QFE at that. I do not use the Pirahna because it is not particularly wonderful on the QFE, I use the Wraith instead for accuracy. If indeed the Pirahna was as overpowered as some claim, I'd be using it on my engineers all the time. It is highly inaccurate and has trouble hitting anything unless you are up close and personal. Good on vanguards and N7 Shadow though...not tried it on an N7 Destroyer yet.

Ditto Carnifex, overpowered....hahahahahaha, slam ULM on Talon and Paladin and then tell me that Carnifex is overpowered...don't make me laugh more.

[Hantaksk]

ABjerre wrote...

I may have missed some kind of announcement, but where have they (BW) stated that they are planning on nerfing weapons next week?

Quote from the poll:
"As you might know, Bioware are planning to nerf the weapon the next week, a weapon that is not Overpowered and only looks like that ( like all weapons ) when you put it in a GI or destroyer."

http://social.biowar.../index/14160718 

there you go...

or..

As a heads up, we are looking at balance changes to the Piranha and Carnifex for next week. We feel the Piranha is still too dominant of a weapon even with the recent balance changes and needs further adjustment. Although we haven't touched the Carnifex since ship, we feel it is obscuring too many other weapons in its class and needs some small adjustments as well. 

[Dimlor]

It's not that Piranha is OP, the problem for them is that it's overused, same thing for the Carnifex that is everything BESIDES OP.

Don't get(h) me wrong, I still support this 100%, it's just that trying to reason with them stating that something is not overpowered is not the right argumentation.

[kaileena_sands]

MP-Ryan wrote...

The effectiveness of the Piranha in the hands of particular classes speaks more to imbalance in the classes themselves than the weapon. Compare a GI+Piranha to a Novaguard+Piranha.

The trouble is that by allowing all classes to access all weapons with a weight mechanic, you can either balance the game to weapon damage or power damage. Multiplayer is clearly skewed to weapon damage. With that in mind, class that synergize weapon and power damage (infiltrators) with low cooldown are always going to be overpowered compared to classes that don't (vanguards).

Instead of addressing the symptom - weapon statistical use - BioWare should be addressing the cause: Poorly balanced class design. As it stands, anytime they "balance" low-weight weapons it is going to disproportionately hurt vanguards and adepts without really addressing the fact that soldiers and infiltrators have massive damage boosts with weapons. Easy fix: provide innate weapons damage bonuses or increased power damage on adepts and vanguards to compensate for cooldown, allowing them to use low weight weapons in a way that soldiers/infiltrators could not.

I support this post and RedJohn's topic.

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

That's why I said 'if'. If it's a damage/accuracy nerf, I don't see the point to do this. Weight I wouldn't mind so much.

 

No. It shouldn't be nerfed at all. But if they nerf the weight, the heavy hitting classes (or the classes that one may call OP) are still going to suffer less, and the classes like vanguards or a duration shadow if you will, will  suffer the most. That's the biggest advantage of the Piranha - that it's light enough that when levelled, it can be brought by classes that need the cooldowns. There is no shotgun that can fill its niche. The Claymore, Crusader and GPS are too heavy, the Wraith is almost unlevellable (for most players), the Reegar is also a bit niche, the Scimitar, Katana (and I might also argue for the Eviscerator) are crap. The Talon, which is also a good substitute is also hard to level considering it's an UR. Let's not even talk about the Graal, which I love, but sucks majorly off-host.

So no, I am also very much against a Piranha nerf, but I know that doesn't matter one bit. I am going to play the hell out of the Piranha this week while it's still a good weapon, and then it will probably go to that place where the Krysae is now - the dark corner of my manifest, never to be used again.

Modifié par kaileena_sands, 19 septembre 2012 - 08:12 .

[MaxBoss]

+1

[Necrotron]

born2beagator wrote...

We actually need more of these threads.  nerfs are poison to this MP.  There are no guns that need them at this point

+1

[Shadohz]

Hantaksk wrote...

ABjerre wrote...

I may have missed some kind of announcement, but where have they (BW) stated that they are planning on nerfing weapons next week?

Quote from the poll:
"As you might know, Bioware are planning to nerf the weapon the next week, a weapon that is not Overpowered and only looks like that ( like all weapons ) when you put it in a GI or destroyer."

http://social.biowar.../index/14160718 

there you go...

or..

As a heads up, we are looking at balance changes to the Piranha and Carnifex for next week. We feel the Piranha is still too dominant of a weapon even with the recent balance changes and needs further adjustment. Although we haven't touched the Carnifex since ship, we feel it is obscuring too many other weapons in its class and needs some small adjustments as well. 

pffft only thing this proves is they are spending too much time reading datasheets and not enough time playing the game they created.

[ABjerre]

Hantaksk wrote...
http://social.biowar.../index/14160718 

there you go...

Thanks a lot!

... and that ****ing sucks.

I cant help thinking that BW is assuming the premise that "Most used" is also "most powerfull", which i would think is horribly wrong.

[Lord Thornos]

NO MORE NERFS... seriously

[Jahoobs]

+1

[Jay_Hoxtatron]

kaileena_sands wrote...

No. It shouldn't be nerfed at all. But if they nerf the weight, the heavy hitting classes (or the classes that one may call OP) are still going to suffer less, and the classes like vanguards or a duration shadow if you will, will  suffer the most. That's the biggest advantage of the Piranha - that it's light enough that when levelled, it can be brought by classes that need the cooldowns. There is no shotgun that can fill its niche. The Claymore, Crusader and GPS are too heavy, the Wraith is almost unlevellable (for most players), the Reegar is also a bit niche, the Scimitar, Katana (and I might also argue for the Eviscerator) are crap. The Talon, which is also a good substitute is also hard to level considering it's an UR. Let's not even talk about the Graal, which I love, but sucks majorly off-host.

So no, I am also very much against a Piranha nerf, but I know that doesn't matter one bit. I am going to play the hell out of the Piranha this week while it's still a good weapon, and then it will probably go to that place where the Krysae is now - the dark corner of my manifest, never to be used again.

Er... You can put on a Claymore or a GPS on Adepts and Vanguards without any problem. Cooldown times are always a bit overrated, and you can use Power Efficiency mods.

[Hantaksk]

Shadohz wrote...

Hantaksk wrote...

ABjerre wrote...

I may have missed some kind of announcement, but where have they (BW) stated that they are planning on nerfing weapons next week?

Quote from the poll:
"As you might know, Bioware are planning to nerf the weapon the next week, a weapon that is not Overpowered and only looks like that ( like all weapons ) when you put it in a GI or destroyer."

http://social.biowar.../index/14160718 

there you go...

or..

As a heads up, we are looking at balance changes to the Piranha and Carnifex for next week. We feel the Piranha is still too dominant of a weapon even with the recent balance changes and needs further adjustment. Although we haven't touched the Carnifex since ship, we feel it is obscuring too many other weapons in its class and needs some small adjustments as well. 

pffft only thing this proves is they are spending too much time reading datasheets and not enough time playing the game they created.

just saying...
maybe if people would actually get out of the box and try to use other wepons besides the 4-6 they keep using over and over again.

I recall when they did operation goliath, i got the hurricane, people was complaining about how unusable this smg was, and they even came up with a build "turian soldier's marskman" to make this smg "usable" ( LOL )
How about the acolyte? how many people have not used it because it has a weird proyectile animation and it needs to be loaded up, stick that thing on a drell vanguard and be surprised of the amount of dead enemies you will get.
How about the wraith? the synergy between hipfiring/headshot, low weight, rate of fire wich pretty much asks you to use a power in between. I use it on plaitnium constantly, but people stick with the herp derp talon..

Im not defending bioware's flawed logic, but if people keep doing the same over and over again you start thinking there might be a problem, if you give players a wide arrange of options but they seem to stick with X character/build for the most of it you start thinking theres something wrong going on.

on this topic...

http://social.biowar...ndex/14165284/1

[Eelectrica]

So the Disciple and Wraith are going to buffed at the same time the Pirahna gets nerfed yes?

Oh and you'll need to nerf the acolyte too. I use it a lot more than the Carnifex. maybe give it twice the charge up time for half the shield damage. I really like destroying Phantoms with the acolyte. Can't have that now can we?

[kaileena_sands]

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

kaileena_sands wrote...

No. It shouldn't be nerfed at all. But if they nerf the weight, the heavy hitting classes (or the classes that one may call OP) are still going to suffer less, and the classes like vanguards or a duration shadow if you will, will  suffer the most. That's the biggest advantage of the Piranha - that it's light enough that when levelled, it can be brought by classes that need the cooldowns. There is no shotgun that can fill its niche. The Claymore, Crusader and GPS are too heavy, the Wraith is almost unlevellable (for most players), the Reegar is also a bit niche, the Scimitar, Katana (and I might also argue for the Eviscerator) are crap. The Talon, which is also a good substitute is also hard to level considering it's an UR. Let's not even talk about the Graal, which I love, but sucks majorly off-host.

So no, I am also very much against a Piranha nerf, but I know that doesn't matter one bit. I am going to play the hell out of the Piranha this week while it's still a good weapon, and then it will probably go to that place where the Krysae is now - the dark corner of my manifest, never to be used again.

Er... You can put on a Claymore or a GPS on Adepts and Vanguards without any problem. Cooldown times are always a bit overrated, and you can use Power Efficiency mods.

For the GPSG, I agree, at level X it could be used. Claymore on the other hand (excluding the Kroguard), is not a good choice. It's cooldown at level X with a Vanguard/Adept is 80%, and with the PE module III is 110% which is still not great (and one can have only so many PE modules. Plus, I prefer Cyclonics/Power damage mostly). 110% cooldown for a Caster is preeetty bad. I can also go with the Widow for my Adepts then, the cooldown will be the same... 

[mybudgee]

Who the f is gonna buff the disciple???

[nicethugbert]

/signed

I don't see any reason for the nerfs. It's just nerfing whatever ppl enjoy using. Why hate fun?

[Wild Wolfie]

I think it would be foolish to nerf the Piranha, why? By nerfing all the weapons to be similar in balance makes game play and game styles to be similar. Don't get me wrong, when a weapon is clearly unbalanced in it's raw state then sure, it should be nerfed. The Piranha lends its self well to those players who like to do speed runs more so than say the Particle rifle to those who like to defend an area against the oncoming hoards. My fear is that by balancing the weapons to be similar is that it destroys the various game styles adopted by players making the game itself monotonous to play.

Modifié par Wild Wolfie, 19 septembre 2012 - 08:48 .

[DESTRAUDO]

Picks up carnifex.

Modifié par DESTRAUDO, 19 septembre 2012 - 08:49 .

[Shadohz]

Hantaksk wrote...

Shadohz wrote...

Hantaksk wrote...

ABjerre wrote...

I may have missed some kind of announcement, but where have they (BW) stated that they are planning on nerfing weapons next week?

Quote from the poll:
"As you might know, Bioware are planning to nerf the weapon the next week, a weapon that is not Overpowered and only looks like that ( like all weapons ) when you put it in a GI or destroyer."

http://social.biowar.../index/14160718 

there you go...

or..

As a heads up, we are looking at balance changes to the Piranha and Carnifex for next week. We feel the Piranha is still too dominant of a weapon even with the recent balance changes and needs further adjustment. Although we haven't touched the Carnifex since ship, we feel it is obscuring too many other weapons in its class and needs some small adjustments as well. 

pffft only thing this proves is they are spending too much time reading datasheets and not enough time playing the game they created.

just saying...
maybe if people would actually get out of the box and try to use other wepons besides the 4-6 they keep using over and over again.

I recall when they did operation goliath, i got the hurricane, people was complaining about how unusable this smg was, and they even came up with a build "turian soldier's marskman" to make this smg "usable" ( LOL )
How about the acolyte? how many people have not used it because it has a weird proyectile animation and it needs to be loaded up, stick that thing on a drell vanguard and be surprised of the amount of dead enemies you will get.
How about the wraith? the synergy between hipfiring/headshot, low weight, rate of fire wich pretty much asks you to use a power in between. I use it on plaitnium constantly, but people stick with the herp derp talon..

Im not defending bioware's flawed logic, but if people keep doing the same over and over again you start thinking there might be a problem, if you give players a wide arrange of options but they seem to stick with X character/build for the most of it you start thinking theres something wrong going on.

on this topic...

http://social.biowar...ndex/14165284/1

Agreed. The problem is there are TOO many options (see my above post). Everyone wants their favorite gun buffed and never wants it nerfed so they can play it on any class. You don't go to a gun dealer and say 'hey that Saturday Night Special doesn't shoot as hard as that Ruger. You need to make it shoot faster so that it can compensate for its lack of strength." The guns are divvied in weapon types and rarity. The rarer guns are supposed to better because you work your butt off to buy them from the store. Including adding weapon restrictions (as per my above comment) they could also add min/max damage variants to weapons based on their rarity. I could ramble on... but it's late.

EDIT: I guess a summary of what I'm saying is if BW is buffing/nerfing to make the guns equally playable, then what's the <bleeping>> point of having rarities? If a uncommon gun is going to be as good/better than a rare/UR, then why not just remove the randomization and let people get all the guns they want and play with them how they want. *befuddle look*

Modifié par Shadohz, 19 septembre 2012 - 08:58 .

[Catastrophy]

RedJohn is right: Most cries for nerfs are "proved" by using certain characters (Destroyer, GI, TS...).
The Piranha sucks for damage output on most other classes than infiltrators or soldiers.

Why do I use it on a Paladin then?
It's lightweight, it's an excellent panic weapon and it's a freaking auto-shotgun, a thing I've nearly waited half a year for. I need to consider the pros and cons when I select the weapon mods and:
It's the damn right thing to use for a character that just looks like the riot police.

Modifié par dr_random, 19 septembre 2012 - 08:51 .