397 réponses à ce sujet

[ATiBotka]

ThaDPG wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

But a sequel in this galaxy with a decent canon, victory, Shepard and friends and EDI and geth can live-that's the only way to go for me.

You just want an easy victory. That's all your problem?

No, she wants a complete victory.  What's wrong with that?

The Reapers are too powerful?

[ATiBotka]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

ThaDPG wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

But a sequel in this galaxy with a decent canon, victory, Shepard and friends and EDI and geth can live-that's the only way to go for me.

You just want an easy victory. That's all your problem?

No, she wants a complete victory.  What's wrong with that?

No, she wants to "win".

Then use the Crucible.

[jpraelster93]

The only way there should be a canon ending is if its destroy sorry but thats the goal of all 3 games is to destroy the reapers NOT TO LET THEM LIVe

[Jadebaby]

ATiBotka wrote...

The Reapers are too powerful?

The Reaper being torn apart by Sword fleet and the Capital Ship that was disposed of in 9 seconds say otherwise.

ATiBotka wrote...

Then use the Crucible.

/Picard facepalm.

[Jadebaby]

jpraelster93 wrote...

The only way there should be a canon ending is if its destroy sorry but thats the goal of all 3 games is to destroy the reapers NOT TO LET THEM LIVe

Successful refuse would destroy Reapers. "I fight for freedom, mine and everyone's. I fight for the right to choose our own fight. And if I die, I'll die knowing I did everything I could to stop you. And I'll die free."

[ATiBotka]

jpraelster93 wrote...

The only way there should be a canon ending is if its destroy sorry but thats the goal of all 3 games is to destroy the reapers NOT TO LET THEM LIVe

The goal is to stop them. Not necessarily destroy them.

But yes, in ME3 we know destroy is possible with the crucible.

[ATiBotka]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

The Reapers are too powerful?

The Reaper being torn apart by Sword fleet and the Capital Ship that was disposed of in 9 seconds say otherwise.

And?

[3DandBeyond]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

ThaDPG wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

But a sequel in this galaxy with a decent canon, victory, Shepard and friends and EDI and geth can live-that's the only way to go for me.

You just want an easy victory. That's all your problem?

No, she wants a complete victory.  What's wrong with that?

No, she wants to "win".

I think the problem a lot of people have is they are fine in telling others to head canon an ending that they might like-seriously, 3D and friends don't you have any freaking imagination.  But when someone like me says they want a victory or a happier ending they are criticized by people who fail to use their own imagination.  If I say victory and happier all some can see is an easy victory or sunshine and bunnies, then I ask them to do what is constantly suggested to me-use your imagination.  I wanted a real victory that we could win for ourselves and that had a variety of consequences, really bad, bad, bleh, better, and best.  Imagine that.  I can't head canon that for you.

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 19 septembre 2012 - 03:53 .

[ThaDPG]

ATiBotka wrote...

ThaDPG wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

But a sequel in this galaxy with a decent canon, victory, Shepard and friends and EDI and geth can live-that's the only way to go for me.

You just want an easy victory. That's all your problem?

No, she wants a complete victory.  What's wrong with that?

The Reapers are too powerful?

Shepard's cycle already proved they can bring down Reapers without the Crucible.  They're not as all powerful as they want everyone to think.  Especially now that they have a united galaxy, plus the Leviathans arrayed against them.  Plus whatever assets we'll be getting from Omega, and the possible Citadel DLC, refusing to use the crucible and beating the Reapers conventionally using unconventional means(Leviathan, Thanix cannons, etc.), instead of picking one of 3 morally ambiguous choices, is definitly plausible imo

[3DandBeyond]

ATiBotka wrote...

jpraelster93 wrote...

The only way there should be a canon ending is if its destroy sorry but thats the goal of all 3 games is to destroy the reapers NOT TO LET THEM LIVe

The goal is to stop them. Not necessarily destroy them.

But yes, in ME3 we know destroy is possible with the crucible.

The goal was always to destroy them once it was known their goal was to end us.  No rational person in 3 games ever thought finding a way to let them live was a good idea.  The ones that did were crazy, indoctrinated, reapers, or the reaper god boy.

[jpraelster93]

ATiBotka wrote...

jpraelster93 wrote...

The only way there should be a canon ending is if its destroy sorry but thats the goal of all 3 games is to destroy the reapers NOT TO LET THEM LIVe

The goal is to stop them. Not necessarily destroy them.

But yes, in ME3 we know destroy is possible with the crucible.

Anything but destroy will eventually backfire and the reapers will once again dominate the cycle whos to say just because they have the same dna they wont kill us all whos to say that one day the reapers break free from shepards controll destroy is the only way and sythe@@@@ is galatic rape

[Jadebaby]

ATiBotka wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

The Reapers are too powerful?

The Reaper being torn apart by Sword fleet and the Capital Ship that was disposed of in 9 seconds say otherwise.

And?

Didn't seem too powerful to me is all I'm saying. Besides, other than Harbinger (maybe) the other capital ships don't seem to be as big or powerful as Sovereign and we have never seen the tenticle beems again. And we brought that big guy down. So why not the rest with the help of the "entire galaxy."

With Leviathan in the picture now. Anything is possible I say.

[Jadebaby]

ThaDPG wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

ThaDPG wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

But a sequel in this galaxy with a decent canon, victory, Shepard and friends and EDI and geth can live-that's the only way to go for me.

You just want an easy victory. That's all your problem?

No, she wants a complete victory.  What's wrong with that?

The Reapers are too powerful?

Shepard's cycle already proved they can bring down Reapers without the Crucible.  They're not as all powerful as they want everyone to think.  Especially now that they have a united galaxy, plus the Leviathans arrayed against them.  Plus whatever assets we'll be getting from Omega, and the possible Citadel DLC, refusing to use the crucible and beating the Reapers conventionally using unconventional means(Leviathan, Thanix cannons, etc.), instead of picking one of 3 morally ambiguous choices, is definitly plausible imo

Have you ever had your head explode at the use of "conventional victory" on the BSN? It seems everyone who states "conventional victory through unconventional means" has, at one time or another, had a blood vessel in their brain burst at someone going "BuT ConVenTioNaL VicToRy ImPossiBru!"

[KENNY4753]

ATiBotka wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...

ThaDPG wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

But a sequel in this galaxy with a decent canon, victory, Shepard and friends and EDI and geth can live-that's the only way to go for me.

You just want an easy victory. That's all your problem?

No, she wants a complete victory.  What's wrong with that?

No, she wants to "win".

Then use the Crucible.

Or how about we get a fully completed crucible. The catalyst says that it is largely intact but not complete if I am correct.

[Applepie_Svk]

ATiBotka wrote...

You just want an easy victory. That's all your problem?

You just bang my head kay ?
You are saying that is possibile to create a sequel from synthesis or control ? [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/lol.png[/smilie]

Seriously, they rather should stick with their guns and left there unfinished ambiguous endings rather than these sun-shine I am alive or Woman I once was bs...  because now it´s exactly unambiguous fairy-tale ending instead of depressive triple colored blast.

3DandBeyond wrote... 


I think the problem a lot of people have is they are fine in telling others to head canon an ending that they might like-seriously, 3D and friends don't you have any freaking imagination.  But when someone like me says they want a victory or a happier ending they are criticized by people who fail to use their own imagination.  If I say victory and happier and all anyone can see is an easy victory or sunshine and bunnies, then I ask them to do what is constantly suggested to me-use your imagination.  I wanted a real victory that we could win for ourselves and that had a variety of consequences, really bad, bad, bleh, better, and best.  Imagine that.  I can't head canon that for you.

I mentioned it before, it´s hypocricsy of high caliber from guys which need EC for their own sattisfaction ...

Modifié par Applepie_Svk, 19 septembre 2012 - 04:02 .

[ThaDPG]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

ThaDPG wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

ThaDPG wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

But a sequel in this galaxy with a decent canon, victory, Shepard and friends and EDI and geth can live-that's the only way to go for me.

You just want an easy victory. That's all your problem?

No, she wants a complete victory.  What's wrong with that?

The Reapers are too powerful?

Shepard's cycle already proved they can bring down Reapers without the Crucible.  They're not as all powerful as they want everyone to think.  Especially now that they have a united galaxy, plus the Leviathans arrayed against them.  Plus whatever assets we'll be getting from Omega, and the possible Citadel DLC, refusing to use the crucible and beating the Reapers conventionally using unconventional means(Leviathan, Thanix cannons, etc.), instead of picking one of 3 morally ambiguous choices, is definitly plausible imo

Have you ever had your head explode at the use of "conventional victory" on the BSN? It seems everyone who states "conventional victory through unconventional means" has, at one time or another, had a blood vessel in their brain burst at someone going "BuT ConVenTioNaL VicToRy ImPossiBru!"

I definitly can't wrap my head around how some people think conventional victory is impossible, given the Reapers have an entire galaxy arrayed against them, including organics and synthetics, plus the Leviathans who basically give a Reaper the "Look", and the Reaper's head explodes(exaggeration, i know), plus whatever Omega gives us.  I just don't get why it's so impossible to believe

[3DandBeyond]

I support a refuse/crucible intact ending. I believe that a victory with an intact crucible that results in a refusal to make a choice (or no choice at all) that does not shut down the crucible and allows it to weaken the reapers so that victory is possible is the way to go. The crucible is not intact so it is flawed in how it works with the kid-it changes him, but it's all messed up. If it's intact, perhaps there is no choice and the real solution presents itself. The solution that has already worked. Shepard found ways already to stop the conflict the kid says will always exist. So, a solution is no longer needed and the kid already says his will no longer work.

The incomplete crucible just messes things up and creates new solutions that are not needed. If it was complete perhaps the kid would be changed to the avatar he really should be-the voice of his creators within the reapers. He may even tell Shepard that s/he knows what s/he must do in order to save them or to help them all. But perhaps Harbinger is also in there as a separate intelligence that tries to deter Shepard. And Shepard can finally refuse the reapers as any kind of solution, because the problem is not valid. Shepard gives the refusal speech about people standing on their own and getting rid of reaper influence.

Now here I could play with this or just try to finish the game. To just finish it, say the intact crucible is not shut off at all and Shepard can decide to use this intact crucible and it weakens the reapers and then they can be destroyed. As I see this it could kind of meld destroy and refuse, but destroy is not related to a choice, it is the natural state of the crucible when intact. Refuse comes in with rejecting Harbinger's notion that the galaxy needs the reapers to maintain order. But once Harbinger is rejected, then the creators' voices come out and ask for Shepard's help to finish this all, to do what they can't do.

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 19 septembre 2012 - 04:09 .

[ATiBotka]

Applepie_Svk wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

You just want an easy victory. That's all your problem?

You just bang my head kay ?
You are saying that is possibile to create a sequel from synthesis or control ? [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/lol.png[/smilie]

Yes?

[Jadebaby]

ThaDPG wrote...

I definitly can't wrap my head around how some people think conventional victory is impossible, given the Reapers have an entire galaxy arrayed against them, including organics and synthetics, plus the Leviathans who basically give a Reaper the "Look", and the Reaper's head explodes(exaggeration, i know), plus whatever Omega gives us.  I just don't get why it's so impossible to believe

Shepard: "Well, the Leviathans are apart of this war now, whether you like it or not."

Child: "Good, then I welcome their involvement."


Currently, we see know Leviathan presense at the end. I do believe, however, that this piece of dialogue here is a sign that we haven't seen all there is to see in these endings.

[Jamie9]

Jade8aby88 wrote...
Shepard: "Well, the Leviathans are apart of this war now, whether you like it or not."

Child: "Good, then I welcome their involvement."

Currently, we see know Leviathan presense at the end. I do believe, however, that this piece of dialogue here is a sign that we haven't seen all there is to see in these endings.

The Catalyst says that because it thinks it will make no difference. Whether this is arrogance or not is up to interpretation.

What we do know is conventional victory is impossible. Hackett says so.

[Jadebaby]

3DandBeyond wrote...

I support a refuse/crucible intact ending. I believe that a victory with an intact crucible that results in a refusal to make a choice (or no choice at all) that does not shut down the crucible and allows it to weaken the reapers so that victory is possible is the way to go. The crucible is not intact so it is flawed in how it works with the kid-it changes him, but it's all messed up. If it's intact, perhaps there is no choice and the real solution presents itself. The solution that has already worked. Shepard found ways already to stop the conflict the kid says will always exist. So, a solution is no longer needed and the kid already says his will no longer work.

The incomplete crucible just messes things up and creates new solutions that are not needed. If it was complete perhaps the kid would be changed to the avatar he really should be-the voice of his creators within the reapers. He may even tell Shepard that s/he knows what s/he must do in order to save them or to help them all. But perhaps Harbinger is also in there as a separate intelligence that tries to deter Shepard. And Shepard can finally refuse the reapers as any kind of solution, because the problem is not valid. Shepard gives the refusal speech about people standing on their own and getting rid of reaper influence.

Now here I could play with this or just try to finish the game. To just finish it, say the intact crucible is not shut off at all and Shepard can decide to use this intact crucible and it weakens the reapers and then they can be destroyed. As I see this it could kind of meld destroy and refuse, but destroy is not related to a choice, it is the natural state of the crucible when intact. Refuse comes in with rejecting Harbinger's notion that the galaxy needs the reapers to maintain order. But once Harbinger is rejected, then the creators' voices come out and ask for Shepard's help to finish this all, to do what they can't do.

Then in ME4 we stop the creators from rising up to take over the galaxy again lol.

[Jadebaby]

Jamie9 wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...
Shepard: "Well, the Leviathans are apart of this war now, whether you like it or not."

Child: "Good, then I welcome their involvement."

Currently, we see know Leviathan presense at the end. I do believe, however, that this piece of dialogue here is a sign that we haven't seen all there is to see in these endings.

The Catalyst says that because it thinks it will make no difference. Whether this is arrogance or not is up to interpretation.

What we do know is conventional victory is impossible. Hackett says so.

You're trolling now, aren't you?

[LilLino]

The only 2 endings that could be cannon and into the future would be control or destroy
Personally I prefer destroy. Biggest freedom and heavy casualties. Lots of possibilities.

And Refuse? Really? Are you guys mad? It's the worst choice ever. It's a choice of a coward not a Military Man or N7. Too weak to handle a tough choice? I can't believe someone roleyplays Shepard like that.
Besides that'd not be Mass Effect universe as we know it with completely different aliens. Bah, there wouldn't even be humans anymore. Sorry OP but this is just stupid.

Modifié par LilLino, 19 septembre 2012 - 04:12 .

[Jamie9]

Jade8aby88 wrote...
You're trolling now, aren't you?

No, I'm serious. BioWare clearly make it a point that the Crucible is needed to win against the Reapers.

Now, they could change this with DLC (ala Puzzle Theory), but as it is now, it's impossible.

[AlanC9]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

ATiBotka wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...
The Reaper being torn apart by Sword fleet and the Capital Ship that was disposed of in 9 seconds say otherwise.

And?

Didn't seem too powerful to me is all I'm saying. Besides, other than Harbinger (maybe) the other capital ships don't seem to be as big or powerful as Sovereign and we have never seen the tenticle beems again. And we brought that big guy down. So why not the rest with the help of the "entire galaxy."

Blowing up a few Reapers doesn't equal victory. The Japanese blew up USS Princeton at Leyte Gulf. That didn't mean they had any hope of defeating the US Navy there. All they could hope to do in that operation was get at the invasion transports, and maybe inflict a few losses along the way. (It's the best RW parallel to the Battle of Earth I can find, although it's not quite clear what good sinking those transports would have done Japan)

Modifié par AlanC9, 19 septembre 2012 - 04:13 .