266 réponses à ce sujet

[KaiserShep]

Your own behaviour surprises you?

It's like living in your own adventure.

[Statichands]

The leviathans? Remember how it took down that reaper just with a thought? 

[Farangbaa]

Am I the only one who feels like crying when seeing the plural of Leviathan is Leviathans?

 

It sounds.. so wrong. Plural and singular should be the same. You know, like Pokémon

[TurianRebel212]

The leviathans? Remember how it took down that reaper just with a thought? 

 

Yeah, it also entered Shep's mind pretty effortlessly. 

 

I sure it's all okay and they're not mean or anything.... Right?

 

 

Right. 

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Most things do. It's surprising to me how utterly fragile some people are when I point out serious shortcomings in their darling story or videogame. Generally, the same people who shriek that Mass Effect and everything in is the worst writing ever, ever, of course.

 

Like how you react when people point out the flaws in Mass Effect and show that the writing behind the series was actually pretty bad when you consider everything, and how you don't like it when fans do come up with legitimately strong ideas to a point of denial where you say that it's not a good idea because you can't stand that someone is criticizing your beloved franchise so you spitefully attack other franchises that people like (most of the time with you never having played said games and doing nothing more than a cursory read-up on wikipedia and TV Tropes)?

[fhs33721]

Simply put: They shouldn't top the reapers. The reapers were/are the ultimate threat to the MEU. The most advanced, nigh invicible AI gods of the setting, that even almost anihilated their already all powerfull creators the leviathans.

If BW decides to as*pulls an even stronger foe it would be so utterly ridicioulus that even Hollywood action flicks would seem like masterpieces of writting in comparison.

The problem of many ongoing franchises is that they struggle to come up with more and more awfully over the top villains in every installment because they have the feeling that they somehow need to make the new villain stronger, harder and more evil.

In the end it almost always just dumbs down the entire plot, weakens the former installments and generally makes the whole thing look like they just decided to make another installment for the sake of money even though they had no idea where to take the story (Which is basically what ME4 will be anyways, but they don't have to make it that obvious.).

So whatever they do I hope they actually don't try to top the Reapers.

[Han Shot First]

Simply put: They shouldn't top the reapers. The reapers were/are the ultimate threat to the MEU. The most advanced, nigh invicible AI gods of the setting, that even almost anihilated their already all powerfull creators the leviathans.

If BW decides to as*pulls an even stronger foe it would be so utterly ridicioulus that even Hollywood action flicks would seem like masterpieces of writting in comparison.

The problem of many ongoing franchises is that they struggle to come up with more and more awfully over the top villains in every installment because they have the feeling that they somehow need to make the new villain stronger, harder and more evil.

In the end it almost always just dumbs down the entire plot, weakens the former installments and generally makes the whole thing look like they just decided to make another installment for the sake of money even though they had no idea where to take the story (Which is basically what ME4 will be anyways, but they don't have to make it that obvious.).

So whatever they do I hope they actually don't try to top the Reapers.

 

I agree with this.

 

The route to go isn't making more powerful villains. Its making more interesting ones. You can have the stakes be much lower than the Reaper War and still tell a great story.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

I agree with this.

 

The route to go isn't making more powerful villains. Its making more interesting ones. You can have the stakes be much lower than the Reaper War and still tell a great story.

 

Don't tell that to Blob.

 

But yeah, something like ME2 would actually be pretty nice. Of course, there are other options to go along with. And you can have a galaxy threatening situation without having an antagonist.

 

That's something they need to focus on. The Reapers are too big and too alien to truly be good villains, and TIM was too complex and ambiguous to be one. So instead of trying to make them into a mustache twirling villain, focus on their other strengths and stick to grey vs gray morally ambiguous ones.

[FlyingSquirrel]

Simply put: They shouldn't top the reapers. The reapers were/are the ultimate threat to the MEU. The most advanced, nigh invicible AI gods of the setting, that even almost anihilated their already all powerfull creators the leviathans.

 

Well, they could always bring in the Q Continuum from Star Trek, at which point the only hope would be for the Doctor to save us by reversing the polarity of the neutron flow.

[Han Shot First]

Don't tell that to Blob.

 

But yeah, something like ME2 would actually be pretty nice. Of course, there are other options to go along with. And you can have a galaxy threatening situation without having an antagonist.

 

You can also have a galaxy threatening situation where the stakes aren't annihilation. The main villain might want to rule the galaxy rather than destroy it, for example. 

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Well, they could always bring in the Q Continuum from Star Trek, at which point the only hope would be for the Doctor to save us by reversing the polarity of the neutron flow.

 

Doctor Who. The classic show of how every other season will destroy the universe (and multiverse). From the 1st Doctor to the Fall of the 11th.

 

Daleks build reality-destroying bomb that leaves everything in every universe dead except them.

 

Time Lords have the Moment, a sentient superweapon that casually tears apart time locks with ease. And the Ultimate Sanction, a weapon that will destroy all universes while the Time Lords live on as non-corporeal beings of pure consciousness.

 

Then the cracks in the universe from the exploding TARDIS erasing said universe.

 

Then River Song breaking a fixed point in time.

 

The Master trying to conquer the universe from Earth with his army of creatures from the very end of the Universe.

 

Fortunately, Season 7 averted that. 

[MassivelyEffective0730]

You can also have a galaxy threatening situation where the stakes aren't annihilation. The main villain might want to rule the galaxy rather than destroy it, for example. 

 

And if they actually do a good job with the villain, you might sympathize with him. Depending on how he is, I already think that's a good idea. One man, one vision, for all else to follow.

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

I agree with this.

 

The route to go isn't making more powerful villains. Its making more interesting ones. You can have the stakes be much lower than the Reaper War and still tell a great story.

Of course. Hell, that isn't even saying much. 

Sure, KotOR had much higher stakes than the second, but the second had a better story, better PC, better characters, and better villains. 

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Of course. Hell, that isn't even saying much. 

Sure, KotOR had much higher stakes than the second, but the second had a better story, better PC, better characters, and better villains. 

 

You're not serious are you? The game wasn't even finished. Even the makers disinherited it.

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

You're not serious are you? The game wasn't even finished. Even the makers disinherited it.

It wasn't finished because it was rushed out by Lucasarts. Try playing it with the restored content mod. Seriously, you should. 

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

You're not serious are you? The game wasn't even finished. Even the makers disinherited it.

 

It was not finished, but what was there was pretty interesting.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

It wasn't finished because it was rushed out by Lucasarts. Try playing it with the restored content mod. Seriously, you should. 

 

I did. And it's still not really something to compare to the First KotOR. Beyond maybe Kreia, T3, HK-47, and Mandalore (3 of whom were in the first game), I wouldn't say that any of the characters are better than the ones in the first. I wouldn't say the same thing at all about the PC either, since TSL goes out of its way to establish just how much of a god Revan was. The story was basically an author tract in a crapsack world about how everything sucks and how everyone hates you no matter what you do, but are still drawn to you that it end up killing them. Admittedly, the villains were fleshed out much better to be more than one-dimensional like Malak (although Revan was still technically a posthumous villain and much, much more complex than anyone else. There was almost no lead-up to Darth Nihilus at all: Hell, he's more a force of nature than a villain. Sion wasn't all that interesting. He's essentially a dead body held together by hate, pain, and rage. Otherwise, there's nothing too him. The mods don't restore much to anything that wasn't already shown in regards to the plot and the story.

[CronoDragoon]

It wasn't finished because it was rushed out by Lucasarts. Try playing it with the restored content mod. Seriously, you should.

Well, some of us played it on Xbox first and had no choice. I haven't played the restored content mod and wouldn't be comfortable debating specifics without replaying both for the first time in over a decade, but based on my playthroughs back in the day I'd go with KOTOR 1. Still really liked 2 though.

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

I did. And it's still not really something to compare to the First KotOR. Beyond maybe Kreia, T3, HK-47, and Mandalore (3 of whom were in the first game), I wouldn't say that any of the characters are better than the ones in the first. I wouldn't say the same thing at all about the PC either, since TSL goes out of its way to establish just how much of a god Revan was. The story was basically an author tract in a crapsack world about how everything sucks and how everyone hates you no matter what you do, but are still drawn to you that it end up killing them. Admittedly, the villains were fleshed out much better to be more than one-dimensional like Malak (although Revan was still technically a posthumous villain and much, much more complex than anyone else. There was almost no lead-up to Darth Nihilus at all: Hell, he's more a force of nature than a villain. Sion wasn't all that interesting. He's essentially a dead body held together by hate, pain, and rage. Otherwise, there's nothing too him. The mods don't restore much to anything that wasn't already shown in regards to the plot and the story.

Atton is better than Carth
Mira is better than Juhani
Admittedy, Jolee is far better than the Disciple
Visas and Mission are good, just in different ways. 
G0-T0 is certainly no worse than Zaalbar. (Can't say for Hanharr, as I've never actually played with him.)
And the Handmaiden is better than Juhani

TSL never established Revan as like a god. Yeah, Kreia said that looking at Revan was like looking into the heart of the force, but looking at the exile was like looking into the death of it. Those two aren't comparable. And as a character, the Exile has a better story arc anyway. (Even when you play as "Revan," you're not really playing as him. One plays as different person in the same body.)

Maybe all the squadmates hate you if you go darkside, but at least in a "good guy" playthrough, all the Jedi followers are fond of you. 

If Revan is godlike, then what is the Exile? Sure, Revan was more powerful before the Battle of Malachor V, but afterward, after the Exile has absorbed the force from all the people he's killed, completely on accident, who's really stronger? From the strength of feats alone, the Exile trained four padawans, defeated three Sith Lords, along with a lot of others in Trayus academy, and could have even taken on three Jedi Master one on three and won.

Sure, Sion and Nihilus aren't great, but they're better than Malak. And Kreia/Traya is on another magnitude.  

[Vortex13]

Simply put: They shouldn't top the reapers. The reapers were/are the ultimate threat to the MEU. The most advanced, nigh invicible AI gods of the setting, that even almost anihilated their already all powerfull creators the leviathans.

If BW decides to as*pulls an even stronger foe it would be so utterly ridicioulus that even Hollywood action flicks would seem like masterpieces of writting in comparison.

The problem of many ongoing franchises is that they struggle to come up with more and more awfully over the top villains in every installment because they have the feeling that they somehow need to make the new villain stronger, harder and more evil.

 

 

Exactly.

 

Look no further then Dragon Ball Z for how ridiculous your plot gets when your new "Villain of the Week" shows up; who is an order of magnitude more powerful then the previous one. This new villain then forces the protagonist to enlist the aid of the former big bads to take down the new one and/or train "harder then ever" to confront the new foe. 

[Farangbaa]

Exactly.

 

Look no further then Dragon Ball Z for how ridiculous your plot gets when your new "Villain of the Week" shows up; who is an order of magnitude more powerful then the previous one. This new villain then forces the protagonist to enlist the aid of the former big bads to take down the new one and/or train "harder then ever" to confront the new foe. 

 

Blashpemy....

 

Unspeakable blasphemy!!!

[Steelcan]

Don't try, it'll just belittle Shepard and the trilogy as a whole

[dreamgazer]

Just look at most episodes of Star Trek, Babylon 5, and Battlestar Galactica.  

 

No reason at all to go bigger.

[fhs33721]

Exactly.

 

Look no further then Dragon Ball Z for how ridiculous your plot gets when your new "Villain of the Week" shows up; who is an order of magnitude more powerful then the previous one. This new villain then forces the protagonist to enlist the aid of the former big bads to take down the new one and/or train "harder then ever" to confront the new foe. 

Don't forget completely new fighting technieques,  that have never been mentioned before , being as*pulled in order to beat the newest foe. *shudder*

[Farangbaa]

Stop killing my youth you guys, damn.