740 réponses à ce sujet

[Epique Phael767]

 Bioware logic: the most used weapon posted gets a nerf.  

[tMc Tallgeese]

Piranha was fun at first, however, it has since taken a backseat to all of those mentioned above. I prefer my GPS and Claymore over all others. One for sheer damage and the other because it is the bane of existence for anything below boss level units.

Q: Why do people want to use the Piranha?
A: Easiest shotgun to throw on ANY character and deal a large amount of damage and still maintain decent cooldowns.

Piranha:
Pros - Decent RoF, significant damage output per shot/clip, relatively lightweight, manageable recoil, gains effectiveness as enemies close distance and effective regardless of difficulty or enemy type
Cons - Rare (only matters to those who don't play regularly)

Hindsight Assessment:
Should have been released under the Ultra-Rare status with no need for changes buff or nerf.



Just my opinion, but you asked.

[Elotana]

Piranha has the best weight/DPS ratio in the game and it's not even close.

The "disadvantage" of having to be in CQC range isn't much of a disadvantage at all since the metagame has favored CQC for a while now. Once a player reaches a certain skill level (I'm using "skill" in the broad sense to include things like map knowledge, enemy tactics, twitch aiming, etc) they'll always kill things faster up close than far away.

This is universal when it comes to horde modes, given the predictability of enemy behavior. There's only two ways around it:

1. Constantly buff long range guns and nerf short range guns. This isn't a great idea because you're trying to hit a moving target. The advantage CQC has over long range depends on the "average" skill of the MP community, which goes up over time (remember when Gold was impossible?) but nerfing/buffing guns to try and match this skill level is horribly inexact and also discourages newer players.

2. Tweak the enemy AI, either by adding new and more complex behavior patterns, further randomizing spawn logic, or introducing entirely new units and factions. This is by far the better option in terms of gameplay but it requires a lot more effort on the development side since ME3 isn't setup to hotfix enemy AI.

[JameJame456xx]

Honestly? Most of those powerful shotguns are only single shot. Now imagine getting stunned by geth. You can't fire off a single shot and you die right then and there. At least with the piranha, its Rate of fire is enough to supress and stun mobs so you have a fighting chance on gold and it is lightweight too. And yes, I only play gold. The disciple is very lacking in power compared to its brothers, the claymore is strong but heavy as a truck, the Geth Plasma shotgun requires time to charge to do decent damage and if you miss,its not very forgiving. I have never used the Graal Spike thrower because I used it when it first came out, i found it very dissapointing due to the damage done to enemies. The wraith? For an ultra-rare, its power is very lacking.

Out of all the shotguns, my second favorite is the reegar because it does beautiful damage while already being balanced by its very low ammo capacity.

EDIT: Forgot the crusader. Its decent when its leveled to high levels and its like a sniper. The only thing is, I don't like participating in any of the events or don't have time for them so the crusader I have is poor. The one I have in single-player on the other hand is great.
Also, the wraith is an ULTRA RARE. Not many players have that or is very low-leveled. I think mine is only level 2. Not gold worthy in terms of damage. Its also lacking in ammo which is another downside.

Modifié par JameJame456xx, 19 septembre 2012 - 09:08 .

[Malanek]

tMc Tallgeese wrote...
Cons - Rare (only matters to those who don't play regularly)
 

It's not great at long range.

[Pedactor]

Derek Hollan wrote...

Ok,

So, you have a Claymore, a Geth Plasma Shotgun, a Graal Spike Thrower, a Disciple, a Reegar Carbine, a Piranha, a Wraith, and a Crusader. All gold plus the ultra rare and promo shotguns.

Why are you using the Piranha?

And don't give me, "Because the other shotguns suck!" That will just get you ignored.

Cheers

Claymore: I barely use it, honestly.  It's limited in application based upon weight, it's a single shot weapon that requires reload canceling.  Very powerful, great weapon, not my cup of tea.

Geth Plasma Shotgun: Weight again.  It's heavier than the Piranha.  Has issues off-host, but generally the best weapon to default to if you don't mind some of your shots not counting.  This is arguably the top gun in the game, but isn't great on power-based classes due to the weight, outside of Geth where the damage bonus on this thing is worth losing extra recharge times for.

Graal: Weight again.  Not a huge fan of it.  Some swear by it, but the GPS to me is more reliable off host, and it is a superior version of this weapon in my eyes since bosses cannot be headshot.

Disciple: The damage is pathetic.  The rate of fire is bad.  The stagger is unreliable.  I never use this gun.  I'll tell you why below

Reegar: Range.  This isn't really a shotgun.  It's a flamethrower.  Outstanding for CQC or strongly shielded classes.  

Wraith: A third shot and higher rate of fire are needed.  But a longer-range lightweight shotgun is great on something like a Kroguard against Reapers since this one can actually snipe from further range with a smartchoke, thereby bolstering the flexibility of the class.  Great Vanguard gun, needs a little love from you guys for it to get UR rep similar to other guns.

Crusader: Weight, Shieldgate, bizarre interactions: Is it hitscan?  Sometimes it doesn't behave like that.  Mainly weight and recoil, and the fact that the Saber and Paladin make it redundant.  Innate piercing isn't a big draw, really.  I used it on my MQI until I got the Saber last night.  It will likely rot now.

Talon: How didn't you add this?  Yeah it's not a shotgun, but its rep is higher than probably everything else listed on here combined.  Tight base spread, bonus against shields (it's great for Biotics).  It was just voted in an informal poll as the game's best gun.  I use the crap out of this with ULM now.  It's amazing for Vanguards, Adepts (especially the Fury), and I've seen GI's do inhuman things with it.  This is why I never use the Disciple.



Why do I use the Piranha:

So let me tell you what I use it with first:

Geth Infiltrator
Destroyer
Krogan Sentinel
Krogan Soldier
Batarian Soldier

That's it.

The Destroyer, Krogan Sentinel, and Krogan Soldier use it as half of their loadout.  They use it to kill bosses simply because nothing is better than MULTIPLE SHOTGUNS at doing so.  Not just this one.  I use this one, however, because it is great at mid range to CQC, which is where it shines and has its strengths and I'm not reloading after 1-3 shots.

On the GI and Batarian soldier this can be a primary weapon when you want Recharge times low.

But on the GI, its the accuracy bonuses plus cover accuracy bonuses, smart choke, plus a stability mod that let it snipe like a rifle.  Destroyer to a point to.

Multiple other infiltrators play very well with it, especially quarians and humans due to the range constraints of stickies.


Derek, here's my honest thoughts:

This gun should have been an Ultra Rare.  The Typhoon should have been a rare.  If you had flip-flopped them, none of this would have been necessary, because obviously nerfing what is the highest-rep weapon in the game (my best guess is that the Piranha is just that) then you wouldn't have so many running around at X right now.

Your best bet is directly nerfing what Hunter Mode and Devastator mode make insane on this gun:

Lower the Rate of fire and increase its spread further.  Those will impact the Vanguards and other caster-types who swear by this gun the least in my estimation.

Modifié par Pedactor, 19 septembre 2012 - 09:07 .

[justjack452]

pizzaface wrote...

I love almost all of those guns mentioned (Sorry, Disciple and Crusader), but I think that the deciding factor is how forgiving the guns are in a tight situation. With the exception of the Reegar, all the other shotguns have severely limited RoF/clip size. In a melee with a phantom, missing your Claymore shot is an easy way to find yourself with a new belly-button. With the Piranha, if you miss the first shot, it's no problem, as there are still 7 shots left to deal the majority of the DPS.

Agreed, the Piranha is a high powered with a sufficent magazine count. I would use the other shotguns in a heartbeat, but the more time you spend reloading is an opportunity for a banshe tummy rub.

[Tybo]

I mostly use it on classes with good CC ability and powers/melee which can deal with mooks well. The piranha is a lightweight weapon which allows me to use my powers effectively. However, unlike most lightweight weapons, it can wreck boss enemies, which are currently the weakness of classes which can natively deal with mooks.

Some examples:
Paladin-melee,snap freeze deals with mooks, piranha for bosses.
Slayer-Charge-PD for mooks, piranha for bosses
Shadow-SS or melee for mooks, piranha for bosses
Bat Soldier-Blades for mooks
Fury-Annihilation Field-Throw
Drell Adept-Reave-Cluster
QME-Arc Grenade-Incinerate

Which isn't to say I always use the piranha on these classes, as I like to change things up a lot. But that is its use to me.

I don't actually find it to be very useful against small enemies for classes with the accuracy boost. Only against large targets does it do anywhere near its listed damage for non GI, Destroyer, TS classes.

Modifié par tyhw, 19 septembre 2012 - 09:04 .

[tarsiak]

The piranha is very versatile and powerful. Missing one or two shots doesn't hurt the user a lot, if anything. It's also very light, thus desirable for ability reliant classes.

[Waffelmeister]

I do really wish the Disciple would get a slight damage boost.

I love it on caster classes like vanguards and really the Shadow as well. Recharge is pretty important for the shadow.

The knockback helps you move around, but the damage on it with the low accuracy is really not super pleasant, and mine is mk X. Because of that I don't really use it for shooting unless I run into something my powerset doesn't handle well, It's just kindof a gun to have on power spammers.

Also for farming, because if you run into an enemy type you have trouble with, that gun isn't going to be competitive.

When I just need a gun to have? Disciple. When I need a shotgun to actually do damage I like the Graal. It almost needs a scope.

[Waffelmeister]

Waffelmeister wrote...

I do really wish the Disciple would get a slight damage boost.

I love it on caster classes like vanguards and really the Shadow as well. Recharge is pretty important for the shadow.

The knockback helps you move around, but the damage on it with the low accuracy is really not super pleasant, and mine is mk X. Because of that I don't really use it for shooting unless I run into something my powerset doesn't handle well, It's just kindof a gun to have on power spammers.

Also for farming, because if you run into an enemy type you have trouble with, that gun isn't going to be competitive.

When I just need a gun to have? Disciple. When I need a shotgun to actually do damage I like the Graal. It almost needs a scope.

Oh also... I don't have the pirahna. It's the only rare gun i'm missing! I have the disciple X! 

[Oni Changas]

I use just about all shotguns but the graal, katana, and eviscerator regularly. Love the pirhana for its devastating damage on turian soldiers and slayers. Claymore is my favorite with wraith at number 2. Gps is fun to use on my paladin.

[Heldarion]

By the way Derek, I like the idea of opening a topic like this. Except it should be called

"Why do you like to play Geth Infiltrator?"

There. I said it.

[cgj]

ultra high damage output & good ROF & good clip & FREAKING UNBELIEVABLE WEIGHT &
very easy to use

seriously, its low accuracy doesn't make up for all that (it's not that low with smart choke)

caster have an hard time finding a weapon for bosses that doesn't kill their cooldown
piranha solve this problem (caster won't be using a claymore or a crusader that's for damn sure)

why would the average person use the claymore, piranha does the job just as well but is ten times easier to use (10times more forgiving too) and gives you better cooldown

why would they use the crusader, they're using a shotgun, not a sniper rifle, and crusader's weight is awful for what it does and considering it's hard to level the gun up. piranha much lighter does the job better and is easy to use

GPS and Graal, host dependant i believe and again, much more tricky to use

disciple, a joke, piranha and its currrent weight makes me wonder why the disciple is even in the game (well i know why, asari fans wouldn't be pleased without it -proud-)

Reegar: high risk, high reward. a real close range weapon, with most characters you want to keep a healthy distance, and piranha allows that while reegard don't, especially during hacks
again piranha, easier to use, better reward, less risk

wraith: piranha is lighter .... and the ROF of the wraith got the gun to be hated by most people somehow. Leave alone the fact that it's hard to level up


i used it for a while, now i don't, the game isn't fun to me when i use this gun
Gold become silver with it,
put it on a GI/destroyer and platinium becomes gold

Modifié par cgj, 19 septembre 2012 - 09:09 .

[UKStory135]

Derek Hollan wrote...

Ok,

So, you have a Claymore, a Geth Plasma Shotgun, a Graal Spike Thrower, a Disciple, a Reegar Carbine, a Piranha, a Wraith, and a Crusader. All gold plus the ultra rare and promo shotguns.

Why are you using the Piranha?

And don't give me, "Because the other shotguns suck!" That will just get you ignored.

Cheers

I use all of them but the disciple.  My Piranha is mainly for my CQC casters such as my Paladin, GI, and Fury.  My Claymore works really well on the Human Soldier and Infiltrators.  The Geth Plasma Shotgun is one of the best overall weapons due to its stagger and range.  The Graal is hard to use, but amazing if you can master it.  The Disciple doesn't hit nearly hard enough .  The Reegar is great on just about anybody, especially the Kroguard and Vorcha Sentinel, I carried it on every character until it's weight was upped.  The Wraith X, which I have, is an awesome mid-range caster shotgun, but it is the most level dependent gun in the game, which as an UR it shouldn't be. The Crusader is fun on the Destroyer and Krentinel, but it is too heavy on anyone else.

In many situations where the Piranha X is being used, a Wraith X would be as good or better of a choice, but a Wraith X is so rare that few players get to find that out.

[RamsenC]

The Piranha has very good burst damage AND sustained damage. Most guns have one or the other. It is inaccurate, but people usually play smaller maps like firebase white or glacier and enemies are usually more dangerous the closer they are so even on larger maps it's useful. 

It's also light enough to bring another gun with some range. The Piranha with the ULM Scorpion is the best overall set up in the game. It's also perfect for Vanguard which is my preferred class. On top of that it's a fun gun that feels powerful. The Reegar is great, but isn't as visceral as the Piranha. People also like ease of use, which the Piranha has covered. 

Reload cancel Claymore is still the most fun gun in the game, but the weight is an issue. 

Modifié par RamsenC, 19 septembre 2012 - 09:10 .

[Alijah Green]

The Crusader is the only Shotgun I use at the moment.

Besides I earned it so stop trolling us

[Canned Madness]

I hope this thread gives the balance department ideas for all the shotguns.

Why I use it is because it's the only true fully automatic shotgun in the game, something the Scimtar could have been.

[megawug]

On casters, I'd use Disciple if it actually staggered as specified. Yeah, the Piranha is arguably the only true buckshot shotgun in the game.

IMHO, the piranha needs to be two weapons - one that is heavier, higher damage for CQC, another that is light enough for casters to use for momentary point-blank defense.

[nicethugbert]

I'm not using the Piranha. It's accuracy is atrocious. Flippin' Phantoms dodge most of the pellets.

[Eelectrica]

I don't always use the pirahna. I like to use the Reegar/Wraith/GPS/Graal.
Occasionally the Claymore to improve my skills with it.
RNG has granted a Wraith 8 which is starting to become usefull.

I took my slayer for a solo silver run and give him the Disciple, and was thankfully I brought the acolyte. Acolyte stipped shields, PD to knock the armoured units over. The disciple to distract the baddies while they pointed and laughed.

[An English Gamer]

Claymore: Powerful with great range but the reload is too long.
Crusader: Too accurate for it's own good.
Disciple: Its stunning ability is unreliable. Maybe if it stunned with only 1 pellet hitting for a stun would it be good otherwise its just a low damage shotty.
Scimitar: Too weak.
Katana: Generally ****. But its a common so meh.
Wraith: Don't have.
Eviscerator: The range is obselete when the GPS is available.
Reegar: Awesome on a Kroguard.
Graal: Nothing special.

Now for the reason why I don't use the pirahna!
GPS: Best gun in the game if used on a non-power dependent class. No other gun as as reliable as this.

[-Sxx-]

CaoSlayer wrote...

Claymore and Crusader: weights like a whale.
GPS and Graal: Proyectile weapons, don't work well off-host, can't pierce nor use ammos. GPS can't headshot.
Disciple and Scimitar: Spiting in an enemy deal more damage.
Reegar Carbine: I use it on classes that benefits from power + reegar. Otherwise a Hurricane is better.
Wraith and Evicerator: Rate of fire of once shot every hour.
Katana: Slow firing, moderately heavy and lack of general punch.
Piranha: Light and big punch at close range, the things people usually seek in a shotgun.

This pretty much. Crusader's hit detection is very peculiar and dodgy, needs to be examined. 

It's unforgiving at longish to medium range but at close range it's all love-dovey. 

Modifié par Dest1ny, 19 septembre 2012 - 09:09 .

[LordDeathkeeper]

Because I don't like the Claymore's single-shot-ness
I use GPS and Graal for my Krogan, but only when hosting
My Wraith is only rank I
The Disciple is terrible in comparison to my rank I Talon,
My Crusader is only for Soldiers, since it's heavy.
That's why I-oh, wait. I don't have a Piranha. Because the store gives me only Falcons. At least I- wait, no, I don't have a Reegar, either. BatSens and falcons.

[badass47]

Because it wrecks everything and has only one down side with it being the slow reload time so buff the wraith or Claymore reload time or improve hipfire spread on them and I'll use other shottys