585 réponses à ce sujet

[Battlebloodmage]

Renmiri1 wrote...

Battlebloodmage wrote...
I face discrimination in real life, I just want to escape to a fantasy world. It would be disheartening to see that I can't even marry my virtual LI while others can. It's not enhancing anything, for me at least. I don't think it's too much to ask to be treated as equal in the fantasy world, at least. If there were a wedding, I hope everyone could get married. 

If weddings are hetero only I would rather not have them. 

One of the reasons I like Bioware games is their fair treatment of LGBT. I would hate to have in game content that perpetuates stereotype and bigotry.

To be honest, that was what drawn me to Bioware games in the beginning. I was allowed to love who I want. Most of the RPG games out there only have straight relationships. There's nothing wrong with that, I just can't get as immerse in the game. After trying out DAO, I'm hooked. Bioware is one of the most progressive developers out there right now, and I really appreciate their effort for equality.

[Battlebloodmage]

Vandicus wrote...

Battlebloodmage wrote...

I face discrimination in real life, I just want to escape to a fantasy world. It would be disheartening to see that I can't even marry my virtual LI while others can. It's not enhancing anything, for me at least. I don't think it's too much to ask to be treated as equal in the fantasy world, at least. If there were a wedding, I hope everyone could get married.

That is understandable. Presumably you would not enjoy playing an elf PC because they face fantasy racism in DA. However, DA is a dark fantasy setting. Happy, everyone wins situations are supposed to be the exception rather than the norm. I would guess that you found DA2's plotline depressing. DA2 holds closer to dark fantasy than DA:O and it may be that they continue to remain close to the dark fantasy ideal in DA3. The series may end up breaking your heart as Mass Effect did for many people who were expecting a happy ending(I was expecting a far more unhappy ending, but the ending regardless was nonsensical).

On the contrary, my favorite origin is city elf. I'm not a big fan of happy ending to be honest. Some bad endings are pretty well-done, so I don't mind Mass Effect 3's ending. I personally love overcome dark issues that everyone can relate to like the death of a loved one, but what I don't like is bringing political issues into the game like gay marriage.

Modifié par Battlebloodmage, 22 septembre 2012 - 04:17 .

[Wulfram]

I don't think gay marriage fits. The Dragon Age setting is not a nice place at all, it's not a haven of tolerance and justice.

There should certainly be equivalent content for those who don't get married

[Il Divo]

Battlebloodmage wrote...

Vandicus wrote...

Battlebloodmage wrote...

I face discrimination in real life, I just want to escape to a fantasy world. It would be disheartening to see that I can't even marry my virtual LI while others can. It's not enhancing anything, for me at least. I don't think it's too much to ask to be treated as equal in the fantasy world, at least. If there were a wedding, I hope everyone could get married.

That is understandable. Presumably you would not enjoy playing an elf PC because they face fantasy racism in DA. However, DA is a dark fantasy setting. Happy, everyone wins situations are supposed to be the exception rather than the norm. I would guess that you found DA2's plotline depressing. DA2 holds closer to dark fantasy than DA:O and it may be that they continue to remain close to the dark fantasy ideal in DA3. The series may end up breaking your heart as Mass Effect did for many people who were expecting a happy ending(I was expecting a far more unhappy ending, but the ending regardless was nonsensical).

On the contrary, my favorite origin is city elf. I'm not a big fan of happy ending to be honest. Some bad endings are pretty well-done, so I don't mind Mass Effect 3's ending. I personally love overcome dark issues that everyone can relate to like the death of a loved one, but what I don't like is bringing political issues into the game like gay marriage.

Gaider has said as much, at least with the approach to dealing with an atheist protagonist. There are points where you can question the Chantry, but the idea of playing a hardcore atheist is outside the scope and gets into dangerous waters. If Bioware were to go the wedding route, I don't think they'd draw too much attention to the politics of gay marriage. It might be safer to just side-step the issue completely.  

Modifié par Il Divo, 22 septembre 2012 - 04:26 .

[Battlebloodmage]

Wulfram wrote...

I don't think gay marriage fits. The Dragon Age setting is not a nice place at all, it's not a haven of tolerance and justice.

There should certainly be equivalent content for those who don't get married

You are not suggesting something like civil union, are you? Hopefully, they don't come to that. I would rather they're not implement any marriage at all if they're going to be a difference in how people are being treated.

[Battlebloodmage]

Il Divo wrote...

Battlebloodmage wrote...

Vandicus wrote...

Battlebloodmage wrote...

I face discrimination in real life, I just want to escape to a fantasy world. It would be disheartening to see that I can't even marry my virtual LI while others can. It's not enhancing anything, for me at least. I don't think it's too much to ask to be treated as equal in the fantasy world, at least. If there were a wedding, I hope everyone could get married.

That is understandable. Presumably you would not enjoy playing an elf PC because they face fantasy racism in DA. However, DA is a dark fantasy setting. Happy, everyone wins situations are supposed to be the exception rather than the norm. I would guess that you found DA2's plotline depressing. DA2 holds closer to dark fantasy than DA:O and it may be that they continue to remain close to the dark fantasy ideal in DA3. The series may end up breaking your heart as Mass Effect did for many people who were expecting a happy ending(I was expecting a far more unhappy ending, but the ending regardless was nonsensical).

On the contrary, my favorite origin is city elf. I'm not a big fan of happy ending to be honest. Some bad endings are pretty well-done, so I don't mind Mass Effect 3's ending. I personally love overcome dark issues that everyone can relate to like the death of a loved one, but what I don't like is bringing political issues into the game like gay marriage.

Gaider has said as much, at least with the approach to dealing with an atheist protagonist. There are points where you can question the Chantry, but the idea of playing a hardcore atheist is outside the scope and gets into dangerous waters. If Bioware were to go the wedding route, I don't think they'd draw too much attention to the politics of gay marriage. It might be safer to just side-step the issue completely.  

I wouldn't mind. Marriage should not be in the game if people are being treated differently. I want to relax, not depressed after playing a game.

[Vandicus]

Battlebloodmage wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

I don't think gay marriage fits. The Dragon Age setting is not a nice place at all, it's not a haven of tolerance and justice.

There should certainly be equivalent content for those who don't get married

You are not suggesting something like civil union, are you? Hopefully, they don't come to that. I would rather they're not implement any marriage at all if they're going to be a difference in how people are being treated.

When he says content I don't believe he means a marriage like ceremony, but rather content addressing the particular discrimination in place. Like an elf-human marriage would be taboo in Orlais, and any attempt at such would have to have different content than the normal marriage content.

[Wulfram]

Battlebloodmage wrote...
]You are not suggesting something like civil union, are you? Hopefully, they don't come to that. I would rather they're not implement any marriage at all if they're going to be a difference in how people are being treated.

Not civil union.  Just some sort of romantic content that doesn't involve getting married

[Jamesnew2]

Get them to release a toolset and you can..https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-SefjHrzQ8

[Rinji the Bearded]

Wulfram wrote...

I don't think gay marriage fits. The Dragon Age setting is not a nice place at all, it's not a haven of tolerance and justice.

There should certainly be equivalent content for those who don't get married

No.  No no no.

The reason why gay marriage would work in Thedas is because marriage is viewed as being a pragmatic decision rather than a romantic one.  Two men or two women cannot produce heirs.   People in Thedas (or at least where marriage is practiced) might find it strange of people of the same gender want to get married because of what the marriage contract usually entails in their world (BABIES).  There is nothing in the Chant or anything that says "two people of the same gender cannot love each other" and there's certainly nothing that says "extramarital relations are prohibited."  In other words, two people who love each other don't need marriage to define their union.

It works that way for the Dalish too.  Only one woman and one man can get married, but this is because a same-gender pair cannot produce offspring.

[Battlebloodmage]

Wulfram wrote...

Battlebloodmage wrote...
]You are not suggesting something like civil union, are you? Hopefully, they don't come to that. I would rather they're not implement any marriage at all if they're going to be a difference in how people are being treated.

Not civil union.  Just some sort of romantic content that doesn't involve getting married

It would be best to just include marriage for everyone. There is nothing forbiding gay marriage in Thedas in the first place, people in Thedas just think that gay relationship is strange because it doesn't produce offspring, but there is nothing outlaw it.

[Vigil_N7]

I'm not sure, it really depends on how they do it.

Marriage in skyrim and fable are pretty much pointless - you get very small bonuses but they're not important nor do they really add anything to the story. Its played out a little better in fable, but it wasn't properly fleshed out in both.

I can't see how marriage fits in, I'm guessing very BIG things will be happening in DA3. Probably not on the scale of ME3, but still something world-shattering. Can they fit a marriage in? I think it COULD work if they do it in the usual sex scene before the big final mission, but instead of sex they have a small marriage.

not bothered either way, bioware would never flesh it out in a meaningful way and I don't think I'd disagree with that.

[Rinji the Bearded]

Trista Faux Hawke wrote...

RinjiRenee wrote...


No.  No no no.

The reason why gay marriage would work in Thedas is because marriage is viewed as being a pragmatic decision rather than a romantic one.  Two men or two women cannot produce heirs.   People in Thedas (or at least where marriage is practiced) might find it strange of people of the same gender want to get married because of what the marriage contract usually entails in their world (BABIES).  There is nothing in the Chant or anything that says "two people of the same gender cannot love each other" and there's certainly nothing that says "extramarital relations are prohibited."  In other words, two people who love each other don't need marriage to define their union.

It works that way for the Dalish too.  Only one woman and one man can get married, but this is because a same-gender pair cannot produce offspring.

First off, I've played the game more times than I'm willing to admit. I've never come across a written "marriage contract" in the world of Thedas, nor studied it. So either you know something that absolutely no one else knows, or you're just assuming this is what a Thedas marriage contract would say, based on real life marital contracts that are part of a religious sacrament, vs. officiated by the state.  And since Thedas is full of different countries and regions, I doubt all contracts would be the same should the developers flesh that out. That'd be like saying that planet Earth shares the same marital contract, globally. pfff

Point being: How the bleepity-bleep do you know what a Thedas marriage contract says? Provide one, and we can all take a look. 

Second, how do you *really* know it works that way for the Dalish too? Again, I've played the game countless times and I've never heard or read anything provided by the Dalish citing they're for or against gay marraige. So, again, you're just assuming rules and details about a completely made up fantasy world. Unless of course you can provide proof - in which case I'd be shocked that the Bioware developers would kick a hornet's nest like that. (That'd be a bad marketing move, anyway... I mean really, look at Chik-Fil-A...)

Read it and weep.

Generally, it's the same all over Thedas -- Marriage is seen more as a duty rather it being a romantic gesture.  Not saying they CAN'T get married.  It'd just be more of a question of "why."

Modifié par RinjiRenee, 22 septembre 2012 - 05:17 .

[Rinji the Bearded]

Trista Faux Hawke wrote...

_______________________

Sidenote: As far as having children in Thedas, I've seen many different versions of "family" during gameplay. Alistair was raised in a chantry after having been picked up by the Arl. Bodahn couldn't have kids with his wife, and now he's a single father raising an unofficially adopted child (Sandal). Zevran was raised by prostitutes. Morrigan and Flemeth - need I say more? And countless mages are taken from their homes and raised in the circle. And yadda yadda blah blah. I don't see how gay marriage in the world of Thedas would really pose a threat to the sanctity of family/childbearing being that so many of the characters come from disjointed family situations, they are surrounded by magic/demons/and copious amounts of other bizarre sh**.

Besides, who says two gays just can't make babies via magic? Lol, they seem to procreate quite well in our world via science!

If marriage were seen purely as a romantic gesture, then yeah.

But it isn't. 

Modifié par RinjiRenee, 22 septembre 2012 - 05:20 .

[upsettingshorts]

It's very simple. Love and marriage are different things, and in many cultures including Thedas they are separate things.

Often in contemporary Western society marriage is seen as the "endgame" of a romantic relationship.  That's fine, but it is not always, and has not always been this way.

It is also not that way in Thedas. Failing to recognize this critically undermines any discussion as to whether or not marriage should be an option for any given PC/love interest in a future game, and if it is, what form it should take.

The reason Alistair and the female human noble PC can get married in DAO isn't because they love each other, it is because they are expected to get to work at making some heirs so that the kingdom won't fall into another succession crisis.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 22 septembre 2012 - 05:25 .

[Rinji the Bearded]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

It's very simple. Love and marriage are different things, and in many cultures including Thedas they are separate things.

Often in contemporary Western society marriage is seen as the "endgame" of a romantic relationship.  That's fine, but it is not always, and has not always been this way.

It is also not that way in Thedas. Failing to recognize this critically undermines any discussion as to whether or not marriage should be an option for any given PC/love interest in a future game, and if it is, what form it should take.

The reason Alistair and the female human noble PC can get married in DAO isn't because they love each other, it is because they are expected to get to work at making some heirs so that the kingdom won't fall into another succession crisis.

Exactly.  If love = marriage in Thedas, then why does Alistair break up with everyone who isn't human noble female PC?

[redBadger14]

It would be cool to see implemented. To have the option, but not have it shoehorned in. For instance, marrying Isabela would be more difficult than, say, marrying Merrill, just because of how their characters are. Each LI would have unique guidelines to go about progressing toward marriage, etc.

An interesting concept to be sure.

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

You need the amulet of Mara to do that!

[unbentbuzzkill]

if it impacts the story in some way like in fable 2 weddings would be a nice addition to the game, but not if it's just something they just tack on to get more people to buy the game if that's the case it's best just to live it alone.