232 réponses à ce sujet

[TheWout]

Battlebloodmage wrote...

TheWout wrote...

Battlebloodmage wrote...

TheWout wrote...

No, he's saying i am coming up with all kinds of reasoning to hide i would be "uncomfortable"

I find THAT offensive.


(although, he is not directing it at me personally, but in this context/thread it is)

I don't think that's what he meant. I do feel like you're exaggerate the problem more than it has to. Anders only flirts with you once, David does have a point in saying that the game allows you so many chances to make up for that small amount of friendship loss. You're focusing on ONE instance in which Anders will hit on you, but that's making it as if he's hitting on you every time you converse which is definitely isn't true. There are other characters which hit on you even if you don't necessarily hit on them first like Liara or Leliana. I guess it's okay because they're girls. I love that LIs sometimes took the initiative, it is very refreshing. Once you turn them down the first time, I don't think they hit on you again.

I didn't mind about Rival points, but i did play a Good Guy Hawke and the dialogue wheel is set up as
"Good Guy -> Smartass -> ****"

Because the text you choose is not what comes out of your mouth, being Nice and Understanding gets you on a romancing path that you might not want to follow.
The Alternative is, being a standoff douche

In real life situation, people may be interested in someone if someone is being nice to them, so it's not unexpected to see that happen. You don't need to be a douche, just turn down the companion's flirting the first time it happens. I don't often see them flirt with me again.

How many playthroughs did you do?

In my experience, every time i am nice to him, he flirts with me, so i continue being mean to him in order to get my point across.
How are you, as the player, supposed to know you are not being Ninjamanced the moment you say something nice.  (I like that expression)

[upsettingshorts]

TheWout wrote...

How many playthroughs did you do?

In my experience, every time i am nice to him, he flirts with me, so i continue being mean to him in order to get my point across.
How are you, as the player, supposed to know you are not being Ninjamanced the moment you say something nice.  (I like that expression)

There are no "ninjamances" in Dragon Age 2.

If you never once select a icon, you do not get romanced by that character.  Period.

[Battlebloodmage]

TheWout wrote...

Battlebloodmage wrote...

TheWout wrote...

Battlebloodmage wrote...

TheWout wrote...

No, he's saying i am coming up with all kinds of reasoning to hide i would be "uncomfortable"

I find THAT offensive.


(although, he is not directing it at me personally, but in this context/thread it is)

I don't think that's what he meant. I do feel like you're exaggerate the problem more than it has to. Anders only flirts with you once, David does have a point in saying that the game allows you so many chances to make up for that small amount of friendship loss. You're focusing on ONE instance in which Anders will hit on you, but that's making it as if he's hitting on you every time you converse which is definitely isn't true. There are other characters which hit on you even if you don't necessarily hit on them first like Liara or Leliana. I guess it's okay because they're girls. I love that LIs sometimes took the initiative, it is very refreshing. Once you turn them down the first time, I don't think they hit on you again.

I didn't mind about Rival points, but i did play a Good Guy Hawke and the dialogue wheel is set up as
"Good Guy -> Smartass -> ****"

Because the text you choose is not what comes out of your mouth, being Nice and Understanding gets you on a romancing path that you might not want to follow.
The Alternative is, being a standoff douche

In real life situation, people may be interested in someone if someone is being nice to them, so it's not unexpected to see that happen. You don't need to be a douche, just turn down the companion's flirting the first time it happens. I don't often see them flirt with me again.

How many playthroughs did you do?

In my experience, every time i am nice to him, he flirts with me, so i continue being mean to him in order to get my point across.
How are you, as the player, supposed to know you are not being Ninjamanced the moment you say something nice.  (I like that expression)

The only time Anders flirts with Hawke was during their initial meeting. You gain some rivalry points for rejecting him, but afterward, Hawke needs to take all the initiative with the flirt options which indicated by the heart icon. If you feel compel to click on it then it's not anyone's problem.

[Wulfram]

You're never ninja romanced in DA2. If you don't pick a heart, you're OK.

And he only flirts without prompting in one conversation. And I've actually never had that happened to me except deliberately, because I tend to be a bit sceptical about the whole possession thingy.

[AlleluiaElizabeth]

Misleading title is misleading. I would personally like bromances in this series. Its fun seeing two guys be best friends.

That said, it was certainly my experience as a female Hawke that Anders was forward, and often. And this was without me using the heart icons. I imagine it was the same for the male Hawkes, since they have the same dialogue trees. So, I empathize with what the OP is saying.

Anders' personality wasn't just charming and flirty; you couldn't comfort him without making him think he should hit on you. It also goes entirely along with his character, since he's got that whole "intense, bordering on obsession" thing going on about a lot of things in his life. Makes perfect sense it would also apply to romantic interest and that's how I felt he was approaching it with me. I would have appreciated not having a character act like that toward me, though, since I found that level of intensity and clingyness to be a major turn off and kind of creepy.

I don't know where the middle ground would be on it. I mean, its in character, but it also makes some players like myself uncomfortable. Perhaps if they made it so that, in the first of your interactions with Anders, you had to initiate any flirting. Maybe, if you've been picking certain nonromantic responses every time you've interacted with him before then, then Anders woulc test the waters on his own initiative. But, as it stands, he barely knows you really when he starts in.

[Nomen Mendax]

Maria Caliban wrote...

hoorayforicecream wrote...

TheWout wrote...

I'd also like to add that i was annoyed that i was pretty much dependent on Anders in my team since he is the only reliable healer if you are playing a warrior/rogue

so i had to listen to his whining throughout my whole gameplay

I used healing potions. They worked very well, and the game is designed to drop them if you are below a certain number. There's also the ability to order Elfroot potions too.

It would have been nice if the game told me this.

All you had to do was read the comprehensive manual (available only at the island in the centre of the venomous eel infested lake beyond the impassable mountains that lie on the other side of the noxious desert).

[TheWout]

AlleluiaElizabeth wrote...

Misleading title is misleading. I would personally like bromances in this series. Its fun seeing two guys be best friends.

That said, it was certainly my experience as a female Hawke that Anders was forward, and often. And this was without me using the heart icons. I imagine it was the same for the male Hawkes, since they have the same dialogue trees. So, I empathize with what the OP is saying.

Anders' personality wasn't just charming and flirty; you couldn't comfort him without making him think he should hit on you. It also goes entirely along with his character, since he's got that whole "intense, bordering on obsession" thing going on about a lot of things in his life. Makes perfect sense it would also apply to romantic interest and that's how I felt he was approaching it with me. I would have appreciated not having a character act like that toward me, though, since I found that level of intensity and clingyness to be a major turn off and kind of creepy.

I don't know where the middle ground would be on it. I mean, its in character, but it also makes some players like myself uncomfortable. Perhaps if they made it so that, in the first of your interactions with Anders, you had to initiate any flirting. Maybe, if you've been picking certain nonromantic responses every time you've interacted with him before then, then Anders woulc test the waters on his own initiative. But, as it stands, he barely knows you really when he starts in.

Did you get/play the game since launch?

[Plaintiff]

Filament wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

I'm scoured Youtube for this rumoured scene where Hawke supposedly verbally abuses Anders for daring to find him attractive. All I've found was this youtube clip, which covers all the dialogue options of this particular conversation: 

All Hawke says when rejecting Anders is "Don't go there", to which Anders replies "I hear you; strictly professional".

I fail to see what's so terrifying about that.

Hm... I think the paraphrase of "yes" (a sort of blunt, absolute statement) and the icon and the rival points and Anders' reaction and the fact that it ends the conversation may all have worked together to make me think the actual line was a lot ruder than it was.

Well, I never ever rejected him, so the heartbreak icon could've caused Hawke to kick him in the nuts (which is how people make it sound) and I wouldn't know about it without doing this independent research.

It is a bit... stern, I would say. But really, it's not even as harsh as half the rejections in Origins.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 20 septembre 2012 - 06:39 .

[Dutchess]

Although it is true you can shoot down Anders' romance before it starts by rejecting his flirt, he does not actually let it go. When you begin his quest Dissent in act 3 and are in a relationship with either Fenris or Merrill, Anders speaks very negatively of them and asks if Hawke doesn't want someone more "open-minded" (in the case of Fenris he uses that word at least).

[Adrian68b]

"I don't really see Ander's as the character the devs created to be all over the PC. What I see is that it is part of Ander's personality. He just speaks in a flirting manner. There are many people who are like this. He talks to those close to him as if they are in a conspiracy. All his intereactions in DA:A do nothing but support his manner and even though he has changed a little in DAII with the coming together of him and Justice, he still has these mannerisms. He flirts certainly and compliments Hawke, but I think saying he tries to force his romantic needs on Hawke is not only not the case, but is a misrepresentation of who Anders is. Is he interested? Yes. Will he force it on you? No. Like many have said his romance is easy to avoid. Avoiding it doesn't change who Anders is though. He'll still acts like Anders. Anders will still try to get you to see his side of things, because to him Hawke is an important force in his life for six years."

My viewpoint also. Not to forget his awkwardness in any social interaction because of his former secluded life as a Circle mage. The same being true about Morrigan. After accepting Justice he became dedicated, but still maintained the same humorous view about events (well, except those concerning mages). His humour is rather a self-preservation device, gained perhaps during his numerous escapes (he don't want to take the world to seriously because he could be captured any moment). The most tragic and complex character in both DA:O and DA2. And I felt like Hawke was rather a lifeline for Anders.

Modifié par Adrian68b, 20 septembre 2012 - 06:51 .

[Battlebloodmage]

renjility wrote...

Although it is true you can shoot down Anders' romance before it starts by rejecting his flirt, he does not actually let it go. When you begin his quest Dissent in act 3 and are in a relationship with either Fenris or Merrill, Anders speaks very negatively of them and asks if Hawke doesn't want someone more "open-minded" (in the case of Fenris he uses that word at least).

I attribute that more to his personality than anything. He's very wishy-washy and passive-aggressive. He pursues you but once you're in the romance with him, he said that you should find someone else because he would only bring Hawke troubles. I don't think all LIs should think and act the same. Anders is a bit aggressive, Merrill is oblivious to romance, Isabela sleeps with anything that move (with one exception), while Fenris plays hard to get. Each LI has their own personality and doesn't exactly the same. I kinda like it.

Modifié par Battlebloodmage, 20 septembre 2012 - 06:44 .

[Sylvianus]

Nyoka wrote...

The option to shut down the romance is "Let's not speak of this again". And Anders responds "Fine, I hear you. Strictly professional."

That isn't so rude.

Which tone did you have ? Diplomatic ? I thought my Hawk was uselessly and objectively rude to Anders, even If I don't like him. In any case, I didn't get those lines.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 20 septembre 2012 - 06:47 .

[Crowlover]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

TheWout wrote...

How many playthroughs did you do?

In my experience, every time i am nice to him, he flirts with me, so i continue being mean to him in order to get my point across.
How are you, as the player, supposed to know you are not being Ninjamanced the moment you say something nice.  (I like that expression)

There are no "ninjamances" in Dragon Age 2.

If you never once select a icon, you do not get romanced by that character.  Period.

Quite right, and that's a feature that needs to continue into DA 3. I'm tired of unknowingly walking into relationships in these kinds of games.

Sky has been following me around for years. <_<

[hoorayforicecream]

Part of it is small things reinforcing it, like the UI colors associated with friendship and rivalry. The light blue for friendship contrasts with the deep red for rivalry, and the rivalry red also is a similar shade to the red of 'damage taken'. Most of the time red is considered a negative in games. Furthermore, it happens early in the game where we're still getting used to things. In DAO, we saw that disagreeing with a character was always going to result in a bad situation (either it takes longer to reach the appropriate level for the follower to get a bonus, or the follower might even leave), so it puts the player in an awkward position. To me, it initially felt like I made a mistake, even if I didn't want to romance Anders.

[AlleluiaElizabeth]

TheWout wrote...

Did you get/play the game since launch?

I bought and played it through, I think, in March of this year. I don't actually know when it launched, but it was 2010 or 2011, right? Why do you ask?


As an aside, *wow* this topic is flying. lol

Modifié par AlleluiaElizabeth, 20 septembre 2012 - 06:49 .

[Iakus]

hoorayforicecream wrote...

Part of it is small things reinforcing it, like the UI colors associated with friendship and rivalry. The light blue for friendship contrasts with the deep red for rivalry, and the rivalry red also is a similar shade to the red of 'damage taken'. Most of the time red is considered a negative in games. Furthermore, it happens early in the game where we're still getting used to things. In DAO, we saw that disagreeing with a character was always going to result in a bad situation (either it takes longer to reach the appropriate level for the follower to get a bonus, or the follower might even leave), so it puts the player in an awkward position. To me, it initially felt like I made a mistake, even if I didn't want to romance Anders.

Red=Dark Side
Red=Renegade
Red=Closed Fist

So yeah there's that too

[eggs on leggs]

To me Anders was just a person who felt an instant connection / attraction to Hawke and therefore acted on it.

I felt like Anders did upon meeting Hawke when I first met my husband therefore when it happened in the game it bought back memories! We were even married within 4 months.. and have been happily married now for 21 years!

[AlleluiaElizabeth]

renjility wrote...

Although it is true you can shoot down Anders' romance before it starts by rejecting his flirt, he does not actually let it go. When you begin his quest Dissent in act 3 and are in a relationship with either Fenris or Merrill, Anders speaks very negatively of them and asks if Hawke doesn't want someone more "open-minded" (in the case of Fenris he uses that word at least).

Things like that, along with more subtle (or not so subtle, depending) conversations where Anders purposefully leaves you romantic openings, even when you haven't returned the initial flirting at the beginning of act 1. Yes, you don't have to act on them, but the fact he keeps doing it, its like... I dunno. Passive aggressive almost?

Modifié par AlleluiaElizabeth, 20 septembre 2012 - 06:53 .

[TheWout]

Because people are talking about a patch that tuned Anders down a bit, so i wonder if we are all talking about the same experience.

In my experience/memory, i either had to be a huge Douchenugget to Anders or endure his Sweettalk.
There was no "middle way". It was hard to be "friends" with the guy.

No everyone here basically says that it's OK and i shouldn't complain and that it must have to do with homophobia, but turn it around, would any girl hang out with a guy who is constantly making advances? It would get on her nerves and she would probably feel forced to become a Beeaatch as well.

[upsettingshorts]

AlleluiaElizabeth wrote...

Things like that, along with more subtle (or not so subtle, depending) conversations where Anders purposefully leaves you romantic openings, even when you haven't returned the initial flirting at the beginning of act 1. Yes, you don't have to act on them, but the fact he keeps doing it, its like... I dunno. Passive aggressive almost?

Anders? Passive-aggressive?  Judgemental?  

Never.

[Fallstar]

I wasn't bothered by it really. I was surprised as I missed any references to him being bi in Awakening, and he certainly gets straight to the point, but otherwise I wasn't bothered. The guy tries to flirt with you, you try to say nope politely and Hawke makes a massive deal out of it resulting in rivalry points. Blame the paraphrase system.

[Maria Caliban]

hoorayforicecream wrote...

Part of it is small things reinforcing it, like the UI colors associated with friendship and rivalry.

Thank you!

I've been saying that they need to change the colors for years now. You can't use red to mean renegade, closed fist, and dark side, and then have a game where it doesn't have a moral component.

Change the colors and move the options around.