242 réponses à ce sujet

[The Smitchens]

Rudy Lis wrote...

The Smitchens wrote...

It's really just not that big of a deal. It's been what? Over a half a year?

So you propose "forgive and forget" approach?
Just pure curiosity, not for an argument sake.

I say just forget.  Just let it go.  BioWare made a game as they saw fit.  We're all 50% closer to being a year older since the game came out.  To still be clamoring for an apology after all this time tells me that some people still have a bit of growing up to do.

I'm not trying to be a jerk, but really.  Think about it.  What is the greatest concern in your life?  Does it really come down to just getting an apology from people you've never even met in person?  And say you get it.  What are you going to do?  Smirk while nodding your head knowingly at the monitory while reflecting on a job well done?  Getting an apology from BioWare isn't going to make my resume look any better so it's not worth the time.

[Massa FX]

They don't need to apologize to me. Just do better next time.

[Ozida]

The Smitchens wrote...

I'm not entirely sure why anyone feels they deserve an apology. What would they be apologizing for? Not writing a story as we see fit? If that's the case then just write your own story. Authors do have legal rights permitting them to write how they wish.

It's really just not that big of a deal. It's been what? Over a half a year?

The thing was BiWare didn't need to apologize for being creative. However, they needed to apologize for ignoring the fact that many people found their art to be crappy. This was not about "minority complaining" and had nothing to do with their "artistic integrity", it was a fact: a lot of player were greatly upset. And BW continued to act like nothing was going on and even complained about their fanbase being non-appreciative. That what I personally found offensive.

Modifié par Ozida, 20 septembre 2012 - 08:51 .

[Code_R]

It's been said before but the claims they made were false advertising, they have just got very expensive lawyers so the case was dismissed because EMS = 90 hours of decisons having meaning right guys right yeah. Saying "all game devs lie" isn't quite the same, everyone hypes their own products but this is a whole other level and most people can see it clearly. Like I said, read the pre-release quotes thread, it's quite something.

[dsl08002]

its something but its not enough to get rid on the depressingnes you get from the ending.

if they simply added a new ending all would be forgiven

[Ridwan]

The Smitchens wrote...

Rudy Lis wrote...

The Smitchens wrote...

It's really just not that big of a deal. It's been what? Over a half a year?

So you propose "forgive and forget" approach?
Just pure curiosity, not for an argument sake.

I say just forget.  Just let it go.  BioWare made a game as they saw fit.  We're all 50% closer to being a year older since the game came out.  To still be clamoring for an apology after all this time tells me that some people still have a bit of growing up to do.

I'm not trying to be a jerk, but really.  Think about it.  What is the greatest concern in your life?  Does it really come down to just getting an apology from people you've never even met in person?  And say you get it.  What are you going to do?  Smirk while nodding your head knowingly at the monitory while reflecting on a job well done?  Getting an apology from BioWare isn't going to make my resume look any better so it's not worth the time.

you don't care, good for you.

[The Smitchens]

Ozida wrote...

The thing was BiWare didn't need to apologize for being creative. However, they needed to apologize for ignoring the fact that many people found their art to be crappy. This was not about "minority complaining" and had nothing to do with their "artistic integrity", it was a fact: a lot of player were greatly upset.

See, I'm a strong, strong believer in freedom of speech.  If someone writes a book I think sucks (which I've read many) I just don't read it.  I don't email them and say, "apologize to me for this... this... literary travesty."  I just address the stupidity and move on.  Now, I completely 100% understand that when it's something that really encompasses you it sucks when it doesn't meet your expecations, but the same thing applies. 

If you wanted it to end differently then maybe you should have started writing Mass Effect first.  Artistic integrity and the vocal complaints are irrelavent.  It's just peoples' right to write what they want.

Ozida wrote...

And BW continued to act like nothing was going on and even complained about their fanbase being non-appreciative. That what I personally found offensive.

I saw nothing about them making non-appreciative accusations so I can't really comment on that, but I will say if you wrote a story and everyone said it sucked would you really apologize?  I mean.  Really.  The closest I would come is the passive aggressive "I'm sorry you don't like it" approach.

[The Smitchens]

M25105 wrote...

The Smitchens wrote...

Rudy Lis wrote...

The Smitchens wrote...

It's really just not that big of a deal. It's been what? Over a half a year?

So you propose "forgive and forget" approach?
Just pure curiosity, not for an argument sake.

I say just forget.  Just let it go.  BioWare made a game as they saw fit.  We're all 50% closer to being a year older since the game came out.  To still be clamoring for an apology after all this time tells me that some people still have a bit of growing up to do.

I'm not trying to be a jerk, but really.  Think about it.  What is the greatest concern in your life?  Does it really come down to just getting an apology from people you've never even met in person?  And say you get it.  What are you going to do?  Smirk while nodding your head knowingly at the monitory while reflecting on a job well done?  Getting an apology from BioWare isn't going to make my resume look any better so it's not worth the time.

you don't care, good for you.

And you do.  Congrats.  We've hit a stalemate.

[Rudy Lis]

The Smitchens wrote...

I say just forget.  Just let it go. 

Forget? Hmm... Forget... Fuhgeddaboudit! 

Sorry, couldn't help.

The Smitchens wrote...

BioWare made a game as they saw fit. 

With that I have no problems.

The Smitchens wrote...

We're all 50% closer to being a year older since the game came out.  To still be clamoring for an apology after all this time tells me that some people still have a bit of growing up to do.

Eh, growing up is like losing weight - something from sci-fi...

But I digress, let's do for a moment what physics do - ignore surrouding and look on situation from this perspective: what's the difference when somebody "mistreated" you (due lack of better fitting word in my head for this very moment) in real life, be that colleague, clerk in shop, some co-/-mate, whoever, and you being "mistreated" by game developer? There is you, there is your "opponent" and there is subject of discussion.

The Smitchens wrote...

What is the greatest concern in your life?

  

When people leave Second Amendment alone. And when the ammo prices drop, srsly, people...

The Smitchens wrote...

Does it really come down to just getting an apology from people you've never even met in person?

And what if I did?

The Smitchens wrote...

And say you get it.  What are you going to do? 

I don't know, I haven't had any apology from them yet.

The Smitchens wrote...

Getting an apology from BioWare isn't going to make my resume look any better so it's not worth the time.

Well, here I agree with Sion1138, it's not about us, it's about them.
Plus I really want to see how this all ends, whether they got balls to stand up and admit they may failed, or they continue to hide behind that fig-leaf named "art".

[Ozida]

The Smitchens wrote...

I saw nothing about them making non-appreciative accusations so I can't really comment on that, but I will say if you wrote a story and everyone said it sucked would you really apologize?  I mean.  Really.  The closest I would come is the passive aggressive "I'm sorry you don't like it" approach.

Well, that is exactly the approach I was looking for. I wasn't demanding EC to come out, and I didn't want them to apologize for the story. I wanted them to acknowledge that people didn't like it, not to pretend that it was just 1-2 players who just didn't get the "depth" of their writing.

Once again, at this point I don't care for their words. Now I judge BioWare for what they do, not what they say. They kept their pride, I kept my umbrage, this relationship is stricly business now, no more love left.

[Kel Riever]

I don't need an apology and they can keep their pride, since they already seem so attached to it over fixing the obvious problem. I don't even care if they make another excuse. Just fix the freakin' ending. Not that I am expecting them to.

Because apparently being wrong and not admitting it is better than fixing the problem. Okay...

[Hudathan]

legion999 wrote...

I'd say it's pointless when everyone an and their mum knows about the ending debacle. I'd be adding fuel.

I don't hate ME3 and I waited for the EC (as did many people) in the vain hope that it would make the endings tolerable.
So can you answer my question please?

How is it adding fuel? If you are a consumer who spent your money on a product, then you are entitled to your opinion and can join a debate on said product whenever you want. Especially if you feel like there are things you can bring to the discussion or if there are issues being under/misrepresented. Your voice always counts.

Ok so you kept your copy of ME3 because I'm guessing you're fine with it, what question am I supposed to answer? You never really asked one.

Modifié par Hudathan, 20 septembre 2012 - 09:37 .

[Femlob]

To those that still hate the ending, how much would an apology do?

They don't have to apologize for anything; if this is the product they wish to stand behind, that's their good right.

It does mean I won't be purchasing any of their future products, but truth be told - not even the most elaborate apology ever conceived by man would change that. Hell, a complete remake designed entirely to fulfill my every desire wouldn't change that.

I added BioWare to my "$5 second-hand bargain bin only" list shortly after the release of Mass Effect 3, and no company I've put on that list has ever made it back to the realm of "purchase new to support the developer".

Come to think of it, most companies I've added to that list ended up going defunct. But that's surely just a coincidence, right?

Modifié par Femlob, 20 septembre 2012 - 09:38 .

[The Smitchens]

[quote]Rudy Lis wrote...

[quote]The Smitchens wrote...

We're all 50% closer to being a year older since the game came out.  To still be clamoring for an apology after all this time tells me that some people still have a bit of growing up to do. [/quote]

Eh, growing up is like losing weight - something from sci-fi...

But I digress, let's do for a moment what physics do - ignore surrouding and look on situation from this perspective: what's the difference when somebody "mistreated" you (due lack of better fitting word in my head for this very moment) in real life, be that colleague, clerk in shop, some co-/-mate, whoever, and you being "mistreated" by game developer? There is you, there is your "opponent" and there is subject of discussion. [/quote]

Bad analogy.  In the context you've presented you're talking about a confrontational co-worker who is making a hostile work environment.  In the context of ME3 we're essentially talking about being wronged by a book.  BioWare wrote a story.  They didn't mistreat anyone.

[quote]The Smitchens wrote...

Getting an apology from BioWare isn't going to make my resume look any better so it's not worth the time.
[/quote]

Well, here I agree with Sion1138, it's not about us, it's about them.
Plus I really want to see how this all ends, whether they got balls to stand up and admit they may failed, or they continue to hide behind that fig-leaf named "art". [/quote]

If it's about them then what's the apology for?

[quote]Ozida wrote...

[quote]The Smitchens wrote...

I saw
nothing about them making non-appreciative accusations so I can't really
comment on that, but I will say if you wrote a story and everyone said
it sucked would you really apologize?  I mean.  Really.  The closest I would come is the passive aggressive "I'm sorry you don't like it" approach.[/quote]
Well,
that is exactly the approach I was looking for. I wasn't demanding EC
to come out, and I didn't want them to apologize for the story. I wanted
them to acknowledge that people didn't like it, not to pretend that it
was just 1-2 players who just didn't get the "depth" of their
writing.[/quote]

And they did.  5 months ago which makes this entire conversation moot.

[Chardonney]

dsl08002 wrote...

its something but its not enough to get rid on the depressingnes you get from the ending.

if they simply added a new ending all would be forgiven

I somewhat agree.


I wouldn't need an apology. Heck, at this point I don't really care about many of the failings anymore, either. It they would only fix Thane's fate with dlc or something and add an extented end into the Destroy -option (the breath scene just isn't enough and never will be), I would be quite happy. A that point I wouldn't even mind having the stupid starbrat in the end, either.

Modifié par Chardonney, 20 septembre 2012 - 09:52 .

[Ezlo86]

Binary_Helix 1 wrote...
 
George Clooney apologized for Batman and Robin. He says he'll even refund anyone their ticket.

George Clooney had jacksh*t do to with the producing, scripting and directing of that movie. Go by that logic, and you'll have people asking Mark Meer for an apology. He was trying to be nice to the fans, but if you try to go to Warner Brothers and ask them to say they're sorry, they'll tell you to bent and get over yourself. As most people still butt hurt by the ending should.  

[AlexMBrennan]

They already offered an apology in the form of the extended cut

Well, what about an apology in form of an apology?

Modifié par AlexMBrennan, 20 septembre 2012 - 09:52 .

[Ozida]

AlexMBrennan wrote...

They already offered an apology in the form of the extended cut

Well, what about an apology in form of an apology?

Well said!

[The Smitchens]

Ezlo86 wrote...

Binary_Helix 1 wrote...
 
George Clooney apologized for Batman and Robin. He says he'll even refund anyone their ticket.

George Clooney had jacksh*t do to with the producing, scripting and directing of that movie. Go by that logic, and you'll have people asking Mark Meer for an apology. He was trying to be nice to the fans, but if you try to go to Warner Brothers and ask them to say they're sorry, they'll tell you to bent and get over yourself. As most people still butt hurt by the ending should.  

He was also making a joke because let's face it.  Batman and Robin was pretty damn bad.  It has a lot of abuse coming its way.  Mass Effect doesn't come any where near being as heinous as Batman and Robin so it's a bad comparison.

AlexMBrennan wrote...

They already offered an apology in the form of the extended cut

Well, what about an apology in form of an apology?

So you mean you'd rather have a blog post that says "we're sorry." than extra content for free?

[legion999]

Hudathan wrote...

legion999 wrote...

I'd say it's pointless when everyone an and their mum knows about the ending debacle. I'd be adding fuel.

I don't hate ME3 and I waited for the EC (as did many people) in the vain hope that it would make the endings tolerable.
So can you answer my question please?

How is it adding fuel? If you are a consumer who spent your money on a product, then you are entitled to your opinion and can join a debate on said product whenever you want. Especially if you feel like there are things you can bring to the discussion or if there are issues being under/misrepresented. Your voice always counts.

Ok so you kept your copy of ME3 because I'm guessing you're fine with it, what question am I supposed to answer? You never really asked one.

Did..did I say add fuel? Wow that's the complete opposite of what I meant to type. Forget it, I'm going to get some sleep.

Oh and the question was what Retailer gives a refund after three months?

[Hudathan]

Code_R wrote...

It's been said before but the claims they made were false advertising, they have just got very expensive lawyers so the case was dismissed because EMS = 90 hours of decisons having meaning right guys right yeah. Saying "all game devs lie" isn't quite the same, everyone hypes their own products but this is a whole other level and most people can see it clearly. Like I said, read the pre-release quotes thread, it's quite something.

Go ahead and show me the lawsuit involving Mass Effect 3.

legion999 wrote...

Did..did I say add fuel? Wow that's the complete opposite of what I meant to type. Forget it, I'm going to get some sleep.

Oh and the question was what Retailer gives a refund after three months?

I don't know where/how you bought your copy so I can't say. There are plenty of people who buy their games from private retailers who offer their own methods of credit. Even big time retailers like Gamestop allow you to trade in older stuff for some form of compensatoin towards future purchases. It's not like buying a piece of media means you're automatically screwed if you don't end up wanting to keep it for one reason or another.

Modifié par Hudathan, 20 septembre 2012 - 10:00 .

[AlanC9]

Chardonney wrote...
It they would only fix Thane's fate with dlc or something

What fix? It's a good death.

[The Smitchens]

Ozida wrote...

AlexMBrennan wrote...

They already offered an apology in the form of the extended cut

Well, what about an apology in form of an apology?

Well said!

How is that well said?  I'm sorry to harp on this, but I'm completely obfuscated by this.  BioWare says "sorry have free content" and he says "not good enough.  Give me a real apology".  Had he at the least included what he would like to have that could oust free DLC as a better qualifying apology as to qualify his opinion then maybe I wouldn't be writing this, but it's just left there hanging like little more than the rhetorical question that it is.

[Chardonney]

AlanC9 wrote...

Chardonney wrote...
It they would only fix Thane's fate with dlc or something

What fix? It's a good death.

It's a goddamn slap in the face for those who romanced Thane in ME2.

Oh yes, and... "Hey, Thane, let's have a private moment and go in front of the window to make out like horny teenagers."

Modifié par Chardonney, 20 septembre 2012 - 10:03 .

[BonFire5]

Chardonney wrote...

It's a goddamn slap in the face for those who romanced Thane in ME2.

Oh yes, and... "Hey, Thane, let's have a private moment and go in front of the window to make out like horny teenagers."

Jacob is the slap in the face for those who romanced him. Leaves you with only Traynor to romance.

Note, I don't really care about Jacob, forgot he was on the ship a couple of times, but his ME3 "romance" reads like crap.

Modifié par BonFire5, 20 septembre 2012 - 10:08 .