227 réponses à ce sujet

[berelinde]

The guy had about 30 seconds screen-time in all of DA:O. One person can know another their whole life and not know everything there is to know about their sexuality. I don't think we know Cullen well enough to rule out an attraction to men. Hey, for all we know, his apparent obliviousness in DA2 may have been a ruse. He may have spared the male mage!Hawke because he was crushing on him.

In any case, the romances aren't intended to be anything other than pleasant diversions. The DA2 romances would not have been any more (or any less) satisfying had they been written with a single gender in mind. The DA3 romances, if there are any, will probably be the same. Your blue pail is just as good for making sand castle's as your brother's pink pail is. The only difference is the paint.

[Sylvanpyxie]

people are not just "straight until proven otherwise."

Although I'm not against Cullen being a bi-sexual option, his character hasn't been established enough for any real complaints on his sexuality, I have to wonder... Where would the line be drawn?

Would a character like Sebastian Vael "remain straight"? Or would he be open to becoming a bi-sexual option, simply because his sexuality was not specified? Despite the fact he has a history of sexual deviancy and never once mentions anything but women among his lists of conquests, would he be a viable option for bi-sexuality?

Do we simply forsake all character development for the sake of choice?

I'm not against the concept as a whole, I'm just wondering what happens when we reach the point that multiple characters similar to Sebastian Vael might end up bi-sexual. Surely a continued shoe-horning of sexuality, indicative specifically to the Player Character, will eventually hit the point where it's bordering on absurd, no?

Forgive me if any of this seems offensive, I'm not trying to be rude. I'm just genuinely curious.

Editted because my English is bad today.

Modifié par Sylvanpyxie, 21 septembre 2012 - 05:37 .

[jlb524]

CommanderJessica wrote...
I don't like playing as males in games either, but it was worth it to experience the Morrigan romance. It just wouldn't be the same as a female warden.

That's one thing, but have you ever experienced a situation where your favorite PC (the one you identify with most/consider to be your 'main') couldn't pursue the romance option that was your favorite and felt was best for that character?

[Jessihatt]

jlb524 wrote...

CommanderJessica wrote...
I don't like playing as males in games either, but it was worth it to experience the Morrigan romance. It just wouldn't be the same as a female warden.

That's one thing, but have you ever experienced a situation where your favorite PC (the one you identify with most/consider to be your 'main') couldn't pursue the romance option that was your favorite and felt was best for that character?

Indeed, and although this is a game, c'est la vie 
Sometimes it could add to your character, like the people who knew they couldn't romance Aveline, but continued to flirt with her anyway.

[berelinde]

Had Sebastian Vael been an integrated romance option rather than DLC, he may very well have been available to both sexes. Male Hawkes can flirt with him, after all, and he says exactly the same thing, even down to the "I need to pray. A lot." line said in exactly the same voice. The only difference is that he will never propose a chaste marriage to a male Hawke. If somebody wants to take that as concrete proof of heterosexuality, I wouldn't argue with them over it, but the "evidence" we see in the game wouldn't be enough to convince me.

Edit: And yeah, I do play a lot of male Hawkes, and I've chosen every heart option in the game at one point or another. I have yet to complete the Sebastian romance with a Hawke of either gender, but the parts I've seen with Garrett vs. Marian have been identical.

Modifié par berelinde, 21 septembre 2012 - 05:44 .

[Quicksilver26]

Gabey5 wrote...

He was a collaborator with the likes of Meridith, if i see him again he will get an axe to the face.

 
without a dout i want to hurt the boy

[jlb524]

CommanderJessica wrote...
Indeed, and although this is a game, c'est la vie 

Which romance?

CommanderJessica wrote... 
Sometimes it could add to your character, like the people who knew they couldn't romance Aveline, but continued to flirt with her anyway.

Aveline isn't a romance option period so it's not the same kind of thing as not being able to romance someone who is an option b/c of a gender check.

[CuriousArtemis]

jlb524 wrote...

Aveline isn't a romance option period so it's not the same kind of thing as not being able to romance someone who is an option b/c of a gender check.

Alistair is a better example  I've never been able to romance him because I just *can't* play as a female character for some reason. 

[R2s Muse]

Wow, this thread got long! Only wanted to chime in that if Cullen becomes a LI in the next game, I hope anyone who wants to gets to romance him. I agree with others that him not flirting with the male warden isn't really evidence of anything except that he didn't flirt with the male warden. I can easily headcanon a number of scenarios for him being open to a m/m relationship in the next game. And, given the option, I'm certainly going to try it both ways!

[Jessihatt]

jlb524 wrote...

Aveline isn't a romance option period so it's not the same kind of thing as not being able to romance someone who is an option b/c of a gender check.

I find it similar to you expressing your canon PC not being able to romance someone they felt suited their character.

I would even welcome romances discriminating due to the PCs race, such as an elf refusing point blank to romance a human. 

But as I said before

 I would much prefer having some hetero, some bi and some homosexual character. 

I feel it adds more replay value.

[jlb524]

motomotogirl wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

Aveline isn't a romance option period so it's not the same kind of thing as not being able to romance someone who is an option b/c of a gender check.

Alistair is a better example  I've never been able to romance him because I just *can't* play as a female character for some reason. 

Right, that's what I was getting at.

I find it silly to think that it's a good idea for them to put the time and effort into adding a character to be romanced and then limit which PC can do it based solely on arbitrary gender checks.

I'm okay with characters that can't be romanced period b/c they don't have a romance path included (Aveline, Varric).

CommanderJessica wrote...
I find it similar to you expressing your canon PC not being able to romance someone they felt suited their character.

That's not really what I was asking though.

It's not really similar (see my comment above).  There's a difference between not being able to romance Alistar (a romance character) due to a gender check on your PC vs. Aveline lacking any romance path implementation.

Modifié par jlb524, 21 septembre 2012 - 06:22 .

[Jessihatt]

jlb524 wrote...
That's not really what I was asking though.

It's not really similar (see my comment above).  There's a difference between not being able to romance Alistar (a romance character) due to a gender check on your PC vs. Aveline lacking any romance path implementation.

Maybe a better example is Mass Effect 3's Steve.
Steve was a character I liked a lot. If he was a heterosexual or bi character, I would have romanced him.
He wasn't. I wasn't upset or disappointed.
I felt it added more to him as a character to be exclusive to the male player instead of Shepard-sexual.

I would like to see the Mass Effect 3 romances (bi/gay/straight elements) applied to DA3. 
I wasn't a big fan of the DA2 approach.

[Parmida]

motomotogirl wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

Aveline isn't a romance option period so it's not the same kind of thing as not being able to romance someone who is an option b/c of a gender check.

Alistair is a better example  I've never been able to romance him because I just *can't* play as a female character for some reason. 

Me too!

[Mr.House]

Short answer? Yes
Long answer? Hell yes

He has never been established as straight at all. He had interest in the female mage in DAO, sure. After that? Even in DAO his sexuality was never established(or even touched upon) So making him bi would not be OOC or anything, in fact making him interested in males could make for an interesting sub plot.

[mya11]

I am agree with you CommanderJessica, I want the same romance than Mass Effect 3. But the problem, the devs was talk they prefer since in dragon age 2 make all persons bi because it's to expensive and hard for create different sexuality !!! pfff pathetic ! I hope for Dragon age 3 they will be change this option !
Sorry for my bad english !

Modifié par mya11, 21 septembre 2012 - 06:39 .

[Battlebloodmage]

CommanderJessica wrote...

jlb524 wrote...
That's not really what I was asking though.

It's not really similar (see my comment above).  There's a difference between not being able to romance Alistar (a romance character) due to a gender check on your PC vs. Aveline lacking any romance path implementation.

Maybe a better example is Mass Effect 3's Steve.
Steve was a character I liked a lot. If he was a heterosexual or bi character, I would have romanced him.
He wasn't. I wasn't upset or disappointed.
I felt it added more to him as a character to be exclusive to the male player instead of Shepard-sexual.

I would like to see the Mass Effect 3 romances (bi/gay/straight elements) applied to DA3. 
I wasn't a big fan of the DA2 approach.

I guess different strokes for different folks. ME and DA are very different games despite some similarity. They have more empahsize on romance with DA as opposed to certain cutscenes in ME . In DA, we can woo them by giving them gifts, flirting with your LIs, as well as a friendly meelee to know how much they like you. In Mass Effect, I'm not a fan of Steve at all, so if Kaidan wasn't romanceable, I would be very disappointed and my Shepard would have been forever alone. In ME 3, the straight options are so many compared to the gay options, so the gaymers often get the short end in choosing romance. I hope that DA3 would allow us to choose romance instead of gender-check.

[Battlebloodmage]

Parmida wrote...

motomotogirl wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

Aveline isn't a romance option period so it's not the same kind of thing as not being able to romance someone who is an option b/c of a gender check.

Alistair is a better example  I've never been able to romance him because I just *can't* play as a female character for some reason. 

Me too!

I used a mod to romance Alistair, but when he keeps referring to me as a girl, I say f it, I'll romance Morrigan. Hopefully, that won't happen in DA3, and they would allow us to romance Cullen as males.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Xilizhra wrote...

Leave straight characters straight.

Cullen's never said he doesn't like men. He can't be conclusively assumed to be straight. It's entirely possible that he just never liked the male mage PC that way.

Unless stated otherwise he's assumed straight because that's the norm.
Also, if the devs wanted him to be BI they would have hinted at it by now.

The "unless it's specificly denied" argument is pointless because it can be used ot justify every crappy decision in existnece. Every single one. It's as useless as "a wizzard did it".

[Lotion Soronarr]

Xilizhra wrote...
Perhaps, but it'll ****** off a great deal of fans. Having him be bisexual will please more than it annoys, and I suspect a lot of the ones who would have been annoyed left due to DA2 already. Quite frankly, your demographic isn't worth appeasing.

Quite frankly your isn't worth appeasing either.

[Mr.House]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Leave straight characters straight.

Cullen's never said he doesn't like men. He can't be conclusively assumed to be straight. It's entirely possible that he just never liked the male mage PC that way.

Unless stated otherwise he's assumed straight because that's the norm.
Also, if the devs wanted him to be BI they would have hinted at it by now.

The "unless it's specificly denied" argument is pointless because it can be used ot justify every crappy decision in existnece. Every single one. It's as useless as "a wizzard did it".

Just because you assume something, it does not mean it is true.

[MorningBird]

You know, I hear a lot of people make this suggestion, 'have straight, gay, and bi LI's' by way of solution, and while I wouldn't actually take issue with this (two each is fair, right? *nudge nudge*) if that's the direction BW wanted to take romances, I'm not sure what kind of influence that would have over the development of other parts of the game (time, money etc...)

Plus, I am fearful of the inevitable wangst machine that will rear its ugly head when people start realizing, "I can't romance my favorite character because they're straight/gay."



Then the unsatisfying 'make so and so straight/gay' mods with crop up, and everyone will collectively start scratching  their heads and wonder why everyone wasn't made accessible to PCs of both genders straight from the very beginning.

Modifié par MorningBird, 21 septembre 2012 - 06:44 .

[Battlebloodmage]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Leave straight characters straight.

Cullen's never said he doesn't like men. He can't be conclusively assumed to be straight. It's entirely possible that he just never liked the male mage PC that way.

Unless stated otherwise he's assumed straight because that's the norm.
Also, if the devs wanted him to be BI they would have hinted at it by now.

The "unless it's specificly denied" argument is pointless because it can be used ot justify every crappy decision in existnece. Every single one. It's as useless as "a wizzard did it".

Which norm? Society norm? This is a game, and the person who decides that are the ones who are making the game. They are the ones setting the norms for the game. The "assumed straight" argument could also be used for when you say "specifically denied" is pointless.

[bleetman]

MorningBird wrote...

Then the unsatisfying 'make so and so straight/gay' mods with crop up, and everyone will collectively start scratching  their heads and wonder why everyone wasn't made accessible to PCs of both genders straight from the very beginning.

Because apparently, more than two bisexuals in a single city state at once is "unrealistic".

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Unless stated otherwise he's assumed straight because that's the norm.

So have him state otherwise. Problem solved. Immersion retained. Consistency established. Yadda yadda, etc.

Hey wait a minute.

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

The "unless it's specificly denied" argument is pointless because it can be used ot justify every crappy decision in existnece. Every single one. It's as useless as "a wizzard did it".

Ah, double standards. We meet again.

So, we're allowed to assume heterosexuality on his part on the basis that he's never said otherwise. However, others aren't allowed to suggest that maybe we shouldn't just assume that simply on the basis he never said otherwise, because reasons. I see.

Modifié par bleetman, 21 septembre 2012 - 06:51 .

[Battlebloodmage]

MorningBird wrote...

You know, I hear a lot of people make this suggestion, 'have straight, gay, and bi LI's' by way of solution, and while I wouldn't actually take issue with this (two each is fair, right? *nudge nudge*) if that's the direction BW wanted to take romances, I'm not sure what kind of influence that would have over the development of other parts of the game (time, money etc...)

Plus, I am fearful of the inevitable wangst machine that will rear its ugly head when people start realizing, "I can't romance my favorite character because they're straight/gay."



Then the unsatisfying 'make so and so straight/gay' mods with crop up, and everyone will collectively start scratching  their heads and wonder why everyone wasn't made accessible to PCs of both genders straight from the very beginning.

Standing ovation. :happy:

[DiscoSludge]

I'm going to ignore all the debates, slip in here, and say that yes, Cullen would be a great LI for both genders.